Classics and the Western Canon discussion
The Magic Mountain
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Week 1.3 - through One Word Too Many
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Zeke wrote: "Settembrini is established then (per @72 and @73) as an iconoclast. It must have pained him to be a patient at the sanitorium.It will be interesting to see whether/how Hans falls under his influe..."
The narrator says that Hans thought him a "wind-bag", so I don't foresee HC taking anything he has to say to heart. We'll see.
Don wrote: "Thorwald wrote: "Many put stress on the desease, on illness and death. Somehow I must have missed this topic while reading ... well, not factually of course, but for me it looks like decoration onl..."HC's response was interesting. He about laughed himself in half after he thought about the whole notion of the "half-lung" club. I recall earlier, when Joachim first told him how the bodies were carried out, how humorous he thought that was. There is a psychological term, and it is a symptom of schizophrenia, which covers such inappropriate responses to serious matters like death. I wonder with all of his experiences with the Dark Side of Life, if Hans is not a little mentally unstable when faced with the morbid subject?
Jonathan wrote: "...There is a psychological term, and it is a symptom of schizophrenia, which covers such inappropriate responses to serious matters like death. I wonder with all of his experiences with the Dark Side of Life, if Hans is not a little mentally unstable when faced with the morbid subject?..."This is one of those points where I am uncertain of the extent to which Mann is writing a parody, even an allegory, rather than or as well as the individual character of his "every man."
@96Jonathan wrote: "7 years, is this not a spoiler?.."Jonathan -- Eman had already duly chastised in Msg 5.
We all do read differently, especially well established classics which have been known at some level long before reading the original text -- even regardless of ever reading. For me, the comment was rather like saying the Inferno will be followed by Purgatorio and then Paradiso. To some extent, I was trained to take a look at the overall arc of a document before starting an actual detailed read (even though I don't always do such). Still, in hindsight, I perhaps can understand why others could reason differently.
Jonathan wrote: "I tend to agree with Hans Castorp. I think a person fighting for their next breath should have the inalienable right to kick, scream, and fight all that they want! "And with Dylan Thomas:
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
Chapter 3 - Respectability. I'm wondering what purpose the subject of the subheading serves. Is it because the narrator want to give us another example of HC's ambivalence or is it that wants to give us HC's view of what is proper and what isn't?Ch 3 - Breakfast. I'm struck by Mann's use of the word "it" when describing the illness of the Mexican lady's son. "Typhoid Fever" is even used in the same sentence (p39). Is it possible Behrens would misdiagnose an illness?
The story about the Mexican lady who is losing two sons to illness ("it), and her constant comment, "tous le deux" (which means 'both' according to an internet site) is sad and tells us of her grief, yet HC treats the comment with amusement and without compassion. Mann is telling us again about HC's inappropriate laugh. What does this mean? Then Mann goes on to tell us that HC finds the dressmaker "such a nondescript, insignificant creature", and how very annoyed he get at a door slamming. Supercilious seems like a good word to describe his thoughts!
Still at breakfast in comes Behrens. His diagnosis of HC as "totally anemic" without any type of blood work makes me wonder if he's a charleton. He seems a little too anxious to have more people under his care, which sort of ties in with Krokowski's earlier comment that he hadn't ever met a totally healthy person. Both of these gentlemen may be able to give lessons in marketing!
Teasing - Is Mann telling us the story about the young people who are members of the "Half Lung Club" and how one of them teases HC with the whistling to show us that even in the face of adversity there are patients who can find ways to laugh?
Viaticum - HC seems devoid of compassion when hearing the story about the young woman being given the sacraments for the dying, but I began to hold out some hope for him when he began talking about "a dying man having something nobler about him...", but then at the end of the sentence he begin that uncontrollable laughing again. What's going on with HC? I think it was Kathy that mentioned in an earlier message about this type of laughter being a symptom of schizophrenia. I don't know anything about that mental illness.
Throughout this book I often was unable to comfortably distinguish parody, humor, irony, and serious script. I came to feel this was deliberate, analogous to techniques used by Henry James to challenge the reader to make their own distinctions and do their own discernment.
Lily wrote: "Throughout this book I often was unable to comfortably distinguish parody, humor, irony, and serious script. I came to feel this was deliberate, analogous to techniques used by Henry James to chall..."Lily, thank you for your comment. I feel like I'm reading a mystery and need to be on the lookout for clues along the way.
Continued from above.Santana - HC is buying in to the suggestion that he is anemic and should adopt his cousin's "style of life", but Settembrini actually predicted this before HC spoke the words. Settembrini also knows that Behrens is a marketer - "I am the man who catches birds, am always merry, mark by words!" and later Settembrini says "Did the gentlemen know, by the way, that ehrens had been the inventor of the summer season" -- yes indeed, a business man who knows how the market his product. HC calls him "sarcastic" but Settembrini corrects him using the more honest word "malicious". He believes that malice is a virtue in that it is honest: "In my eyes it (malice) is the brightest sword that reason has against the powers of darkness and ugliness. Malice, sir, is the spirit of criticism, and criticism marks the origin of progress and enlightenment."
Then again, dr. B. may just have wanted to warn HC that he is prone to catch T..."
If he is not a Satanist, his idol is, so on that basis, I say, we should not trust him!