Clockwork Princess
discussion
*SPOILER* THE ENDING FOR CP
I think Tessa was in love with both of them, but different parts. With Will it was his way with words, their connection was founded and built on the words of others. They knew each other through characters.But with Jem, Tessa loved his kindness, his music and his strength.
Will knew Tessa's mind, but Jem knew her soul.
@Beverly i too was happy with the book and i love will i love his character so much. I was happy that he got to live a long and happy life to be with the women he loved and have kids and grandchildren. But i hated reading of his death i hated it so much i was tempted just to stop reading and not go on..i just didnt like knowing that he was gone and that jem and tessa are together. i love jem to but i dont know right know i picture them together somewhere while i know that will is dead and that breaks my heart. but it was a fitting end to this amaazing story i will always love Willam Herondale for he is the character i loved best.
I don't fancy the idea of Tessa with Jem after she had lived with Will. I know it is for the fans' sake, but the Epilogue is way too much.
Nurlely wrote: "I don't fancy the idea of Tessa with Jem after she had lived with Will. I know it is for the fans' sake, but the Epilogue is way too much."Same. It makes her love for Will seem cheap.
Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Nurlely wrote: "I don't fancy the idea of Tessa with Jem after she had lived with Will. I know it is for the fans' sake, but the Epilogue is way too much."Same. It makes her love for Will seem ch..."
Totally agree!!!
Jade wrote: "I think Tessa was in love with both of them, but different parts. With Will it was his way with words, their connection was founded and built on the words of others. They knew each other through ch..."Gimme a break. No one knows anyone's soul. I don't care what kind of powers you have, you can't know that unless you ARE the person.
I don't find the idea of someone being equally in love with two people to be romantic. I don't care if that happens to some people or not. It will never happen to me.
Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Same. It makes her love for Will seem cheap. "I think the Epilogue is such an anti-climax to the awesome story.
Is there any part that explained about how Jem got rid of his stitched mouth? He seems to still bear marks on his face but has no weird lips (if those stitches were removed from him when his being as a silent brother was stripped from him).
Not that I'm aware of. Probably had something to do with him needing to be able to kiss Tessa, but didn't have to be explained b/c everyone would be too happy to care (or not).
Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "I don't find the idea of someone being equally in love with two people to be romantic. I don't care if that happens to some people or not. It will never happen to me."I consider it more as a disaster than romantic.
And I agree with the cheap one.
agreed i wish i had stopped before the epilouge that way i can imagine that will and tessa had a happy and long life...i dont want to read about one of my beloved characters dying
Nurlely wrote: "Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "I don't find the idea of someone being equally in love with two people to be romantic. I don't care if that happens to some people or not. It will never happen ..."Seriously! It's not fair to the other people, either. If you really love someone, how can you do that to them?
I get that she loved them both, but I am not okay with her having a go at both of them. it seems weird and it feels wrong.. to me.
She had her cake and she ate it! I'm sorry but real life does not happen like that. In life they are hard choices to make and obviously she didn't. I don't think she even had to choose, Jem is gone so she goes to Will. Will is gone so now she hops happily to Jem! Eeww! Talk about sharing is caring!
Astoria Malfoy wrote: "I get that she loved them both, but I am not okay with her having a go at both of them. it seems weird and it feels wrong.. to me."Thank you! I'm not impressed with Cassie for doing this. Love triangles are bad enough without the girl getting BOTH guys.
CynthiaElle wrote: "agreed i wish i had stopped before the epilouge that way i can imagine that will and tessa had a happy and long life...i dont want to read about one of my beloved characters dying"Indeed. I feel the Epilogue is unnecessary. The story is way better without it.
If the recent day is important to relate the story to TMI, then just leave Jem as a silent brother.
Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Thank you! I'm not impressed with Cassie for doing this. Love triangles are bad enough without the girl getting BOTH guys. "
Money talks? If Jem's fans are happy, then they will buy the book. I think Cassie forgets something about the moral she sends her fans by adding such an ending.
Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Astoria Malfoy wrote: "I get that she loved them both, but I am not okay with her having a go at both of them. it seems weird and it feels wrong.. to me."Thank you! I'm not impressed with Cassie ..."
I think I would've been happier if she had just pick one, pleasing the fans isn't always what is best for the story. I liked the idea of Tessa having to choose, this way it felt so... sad and not really satisfying. It's like, last weekend they killed off half of my OTP in the series finale of my favorite tv show, and it sucked, but it was also so emotional and the impact was so beautiful, I am still crying about it.
Is Tessa gonna do the same when Jem dies? Jump to another friend of Jem and go see the world too?! Ugh I'm glad I didn't buy the book.
Nurlely wrote: "Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Thank you! I'm not impressed with Cassie for doing this. Love triangles are bad enough without the girl getting BOTH guys. "
Money talks? If Jem's fans are ha..."
I can't imagine writing a book for that reason. I write books for my characters, and want to stay true to them and do the best for them...anyone else feel like this? Oh, Cassie, Cassie.
Astoria Malfoy wrote: "Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Astoria Malfoy wrote: "I get that she loved them both, but I am not okay with her having a go at both of them. it seems weird and it feels wrong.. to me."Than..."
Yeah, I'm not a fan of tragedy but even I can see the (awful) beauty in it. There's no beauty in what Tessa did. (btw, off topic, but what show? i'm curious!)
Claudia wrote: "Is Tessa gonna do the same when Jem dies? Jump to another friend of Jem and go see the world too?! Ugh I'm glad I didn't buy the book."HAHAHAHA! Yes. I wouldn't put it past her. She'll get it on at Jem's funeral.
Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Yeah, I'm not a fan of tragedy but even I can see the (awful) beauty in it. There's no beauty in what Tessa did. (btw, off topic, but what show? i'm curious!) "I cursed JK Rowling for killing Sirius Black and then Dumbledore, but I love that she did that for the beauty of the story (although I still teary every time I read that parts). Rip off the Epilogue from Clockwork Princess to make it way better.
Yeah, like when I read the deaths in HP I felt really sad, but this book just makes me feel gross and disgusted and creeped out and angry more than sad.
Even though I don't feel bad for Tessa, it's kind of depressing that she had to watch Will die, have all these children with him, and then go off only to be with Jem and then have him die..like no matter what, in the end, she's going to be alone. And she is a HUGE part in creating the Shadowhunter bloodline. I mean the Herondales AND the Carstairs, right?
I'm not saying she shouldn't be with him, but eventually she'll end up alone again and that's just said..,
Chloé天才 Ƨнα∂σωнʋитɛяǤιяℓ ♉ wrote: "Jems lips were never stitched. He only had the scars on his cheeks. "All silent brothers do not speak because they are not supposed to. Their lips are stitched and faces are marked with runes (City of Bones).
I looked at City of Lost Souls again last night to see whether Brother Zachariah was an exceptional. But I came to nothing implied that he was any different from the other Silent Brothers except that he showed emotion where the others didn't.
I might have missed something there. Would you care submitting something that tells us that Jem was a far different silent brother?
I think a lot of you are being a bit harsh on Tessa. Back when both Jem and Will were alive, she loved them both. Maybe some people can do that, love two people equally, and maybe some can't.And think about Tessa, she is IMMORTAL. All she will do is watch those she love die, she has already lost Will, and now that Jem is mortal, his time is once again limited.
Jem is the only person left from the London institute (leaving out Magnus and Church here), the only one left who truly knows her. No one she meets in the modern world will ever be able to understand her like Jem. There are memories she can only share with him and nobody else, because they are all dead. Jem is the last piece of her past, her childhood. And since she did love him deeply then, and continued to do so, how can she not ask him to be part of her life again?
Besides, it made Jem happy as well, and that would have mattered a great deal to Tessa, possibly more than having someone to accompany her for a few decades.
Chloé天才 Ƨнα∂σωнʋитɛяǤιяℓ ♉ wrote: "Though Will died and that was heartbreaking and then Tessa ends up with Jem and that sounds wrong, but Will died like...crap, a long time ago, she has to move on and why not with Jem? Someone she c..."Who she never stopped loving? She was living a happy life with Will but never stopped loving Jem? Isn't that too much hormonal issue?
Chloé天才 Ƨнα∂σωнʋитɛяǤιяℓ ♉ wrote: "I don't think she'll have children with Jem since she doesn't want to go through watching her children die when she doesn't. "But she didn't mind watching Jem dies when she doesn't?
Will's death ripped her heart the most but she doesn't mind to go through it again?
Dang!
Take what you can I guess, Jem was going to die either way. Why not spend what time she had with him, enjoy his company and make him happy at the same time?And just because she loved Will and Jem at the same time, doesn't mean she has a hormonal issue. Maybe she just loves them for seperate things, and being parabatai and so close to each other, it might have been loving two halves of the whole
Keep everyone happy. Keep all the fans happy. No matter how weird it is to have a girl loves 2 boys and ends up with them. To say that she never stopped loving the other while being with another. Tessa's words in the Epilogue were not necessary. Saying it out loud makes her love to Will sounds cheap. Jem will still be happy without the drama she added at the end of the story.I love Cassie's books, but I think a happy end for all is not entirely necessary. The book is already perfect without having to read the Epilogue.
Some deaths are necessary. Some sadness is necessary, as long as it makes the story so awesome.
Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Astoria Malfoy Yeah, I'm not a fan of tragedy but even I can see the (awful) beauty in it. There's no beauty in what Tessa did. (btw, off topic, but what show? i'm curious!) ."Young Justice, I watched it with my younger sister and The Flash has always been a favorite hero of mine, and at the end Kid Flash ceases... and the show is cancelled so.... not good. here's a link, his other half's OTP's reaction was so heart wrenching. Way to end a season
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fv4jr... it made
Jade wrote: "I think a lot of you are being a bit harsh on Tessa. Back when both Jem and Will were alive, she loved them both. Maybe some people can do that, love two people equally, and maybe some can't.And t..."
But you know what, I can't relate to someone who puts herself before other people, because that is never something I will do.
Chloé天才 Ƨнα∂σωнʋитɛяǤιяℓ ♉ wrote: "Nurlely wrote: "Chloé天才 Ƨнα∂σωнʋитɛяǤιяℓ ♉ wrote: "Though Will died and that was heartbreaking and then Tessa ends up with Jem and that sounds wrong, but Will died like...crap, a long time ago, she..."Hello, she's been alive quite a while. I think she can find someone else other than Jem. I will never get behind a woman or a man who loves two people at once, and actually hooks up with both of them. Nope.
Chloé天才 Ƨнα∂σωнʋитɛяǤιяℓ ♉ wrote: "Because of the yin fen in his system, it wouldn't allow certain runes to be placed on him. So because the runes are powerful, it obviously made them stitch their eyes and mouths. So that's why Jem looks different from the other silent brothers and he doesn't have the stitching. "
I read about that in CP2. What I was implying is what I might have missed in City of Lost Souls. I could not recall anything else but emotion that makes Bro Zach any different than other silent brothers.
If his mouth was never stitched, why didn't he speak any words in CoLS? He 'speaks' with others mentally, like other silent brothers. Why did he act like a 'mute' when he can talk?
Everyone is different. Tessa is very powerful, and because of her power she has put so many people who care and love her in danger and caused their deaths. She probably has survivors guilt and doesn't want anyone else to be hurt if she can help it.
Nurlely wrote: "Keep everyone happy. Keep all the fans happy. No matter how weird it is to have a girl loves 2 boys and ends up with them. To say that she never stopped loving the other while being with another. T..."YES! I don't recall Will or Jem saying they loved anyone besides Tessa EVER. Which makes her love for them mean nothing. They only loved her. She couldn't give them that same courtesy.
Astoria Malfoy wrote: "Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Astoria Malfoy Yeah, I'm not a fan of tragedy but even I can see the (awful) beauty in it. There's no beauty in what Tessa did. (btw, off topic, but what show? ..."Aww. :'( Half an OTP dying is always so heartbreaking for both halves.
Chloé天才 Ƨнα∂σωнʋитɛяǤιяℓ ♉ wrote: ""Only in books" XD "
Hahahaha.... indeed.
But how the story was executed is what makes books awesome or less awesome or even awful.
CP2 would have been so awesome without the Epilogue.
Nurlely wrote: "Chloé天才 Ƨнα∂σωнʋитɛяǤιяℓ ♉ wrote: "Because of the yin fen in his system, it wouldn't allow certain runes to be placed on him. So because the runes are powerful, it obviously made them stitch their ..."Even if jem was stitched wouldn't there be runes like the iratze that would take away the scars and help him heal?
Brother Zachariah also had a deep interest in the welfare of Jace I believe, or someone else of the TMI group, clearly because he knew their ancestor's personally.
Jade wrote: "Everyone is different. Tessa is very powerful, and because of her power she has put so many people who care and love her in danger and caused their deaths. She probably has survivors guilt and does..."What does her being powerful have to do with her being loose?
Jade wrote: "Everyone is different. Tessa is very powerful, and because of her power she has put so many people who care and love her in danger and caused their deaths. She probably has survivors guilt and does..."A martyr. And I thought I was reading YA novel... ;)
Chloé天才 Ƨнα∂σωнʋитɛяǤιяℓ ♉ wrote: "Jade wrote: "I think a lot of you are being a bit harsh on Tessa. Back when both Jem and Will were alive, she loved them both. Maybe some people can do that, love two people equally, and maybe some..."You don't have to know someone well. Like, am I required to date someone I knew when I was a kid? No. Don't feel the urge to date my bff from pre-school, either, no matter how much he 'knows' me.
Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Astoria Malfoy wrote: "Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Astoria Malfoy Yeah, I'm not a fan of tragedy but even I can see the (awful) beauty in it. There's no beauty in what Tessa did. (btw, off..."Well, it is a comic series, so maybe he is not dead. Maybe he is lost in the speed force... I can always hope.
My friend spoiled Clockwork Princess for me, like emailed me the ending, and said " just saving you money, I knew You'll hate it." she was right.
She isn't being loose...Just because she loves them both. I'm sure there are people who can love two people equally. Like it said in the book, between the three of them, there was never a lack of love. Will and Jem were so close, they reflected the best of each other, would it not be like loving one person who was two? (does that make sense? I feel ive argued this point before, and didnt want to be repeatitive)
Chloé天才 Ƨнα∂σωнʋитɛяǤιяℓ ♉ wrote: "Nurlely wrote: "Chloé天才 Ƨнα∂σωнʋитɛяǤιяℓ ♉ wrote: "Because of the yin fen in his system, it wouldn't allow certain runes to be placed on him. So because the runes are powerful, it obviously made th..."LMAO omg "Silent Bro" why is that so hilarious? 'Bro.'
Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Chloé天才 Ƨнα∂σωнʋитɛяǤιяℓ ♉ wrote: "Jade wrote: "I think a lot of you are being a bit harsh on Tessa. Back when both Jem and Will were alive, she loved them both. Maybe some people can do that, love..."Well, I'm going to bet you didn't go through life and death situations with them. Or break your own heart to save theirs?
Astoria Malfoy wrote: "Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Astoria Malfoy wrote: "Krista (One Love) (Critical) wrote: "Astoria Malfoy Yeah, I'm not a fan of tragedy but even I can see the (awful) beauty in it. There's n..."That's a good way to look at it. =)
Ohh, lucky you. None of my friends read!
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But I hate so much that we had to read about Will's death. I knew he would eventually die, but I did not want to read about it. I was so heartbroken, especially when it says that he smiled at Jem and then at Tessa and then he died. Oh god, I hate that so much, but he was happy and he lived a very happy life with the woman he loved. I just really didn't want to read about his death.
But I was happy that Jem gets to be with Tessa, too. He really loved her and he sacrificed a lot for her, having to endure over 100 years of watching her be with Will and then not being able to with her at all. So I'm glad he gets to be with her, but I don't think that Tessa will have children with him. I don't think she could go through the whole watching her kids die thing again.
But I feel like Jem got the better ending. I know he doesn't really, since his life will be much the same as Will's where he will grow old and eventually die, but we don't have to see his death. We get to think that he and Tessa are together somewhere right now, but we know that Will is dead.
I know that when I reread this book, I will skip the epilogue. I'm just going to stop reading when Will introduces Tessa to his parents. I love Jem, but I do not want to read about Will not being alive anymore. It kills me too much to even type it out.
Also, I would have been very satisfied as well if Tessa had chosen just Will. She loved Will throughout all three books and he loved her first, too. I felt like they had a deeper connection. It always felt to me like she was holding back with Jem and only marrying him out of obligation. CP2 convinced me of her feelings for him, but I still think she loved Will more. (hide spoiler)]