Petition to change Monthy Selection rules about disqualification.

[Clay]

I almost posted the below in this month's Montly Nomination thread, but decided not to clutter it up and so decided to create a new topic for specific discussion.

Greg wrote: "JSWolf wrote: "Can't we make it just six months instead? "

I might have nominated this book myself -- but I do think a 12 month break between authors is a good idea. It helps keep the nominations..."

I agree with this...for the most part...but I would like to request that restrictions be genre specific.
For example....we just read Elizabeth Moon's Paksenarrion book for this month's Fantasy read.

That should disqualify her for further Fantasy nominations....but should it also disqualify her SF books?

Her Vatta's War series or Serrano series would fit perfectly in a vote for books with a galactic empire theme.

SO, in short, I would like to suggest that the rules for nomination disqualifications be altered to be genre specific.

An author that has been selected in Fantasy SHOULD be disqualified for 12 months...in the fantasy genre...but not in the Science Fiction genre.

Just my thoughts for consideration.

[Clay]

Thought I should put a qualifier in here.

I put this up for thoughtful discussion.

I personally think it would be wrong to change the rules in mid-nomination process. (thus the current nominations would not be impacted in the slightest.)

But I thought it would be good to discuss BEFORE the NEXT nomination cycle.

[[deleted user]]

Yeah, if we did change, I would be for July ....

I'm not opposed to changing it to being genre specific as I already have the authors broken down on my spreadsheet that way. It would just require a re-sorting on the post with the list.

That said, I personally like having 24 authors to work around instead of 12. It makes it harder for me to select a book to nominate at times ....

[[deleted user]]

I'm misapplying Occam's Razor bit, but whatever restriction policy is easiest to maintain and enforce is probably the best.

[Charles]

Firstly, I don't have any huge issue with either staying with the current "rule" or changing it. That being said, for now, we're talking 12 months, 2 authors per month, for a total of 24 authors a year. Now, if the issue is that by saying we cannot read the same author twice in a one-year period means we cannot find 23 other books worth reading that year -- well, I find that a bit discouraging. If it means some readers only want to read a handful of favorite authors, that's a bit discouraging, too. Lastly, if we make it by genre, it gives authors who either often cross genres or often write in the gray area between genres an unfair advantage of sorts -- not that in the big scheme of things they probably would ever notice. :-)

So, I guess if there is, in fact, a lot of anguish out there about having to wait a whole 12 months to renominate and author, I'd somewhat prefer reducing the time limit, but not making it genre-specific. But in the end, I'm fine where we are for now. (Besides, I guess I'm old enough now where "a whole 12 months" isn't all that much any more.)

[Clay]

You make good points, Charles, however, I do believe the other side of coin is that, by doing things this way, we unnecessarily restrict ourselves.

Let's use my example from the first post (I am NOT pushing Elizabeth Moon LOL just using her as an example).

Here we have a writer that produces books in both categories. She has two series that would fit perfectly with the current SF theme...but she is disqualified...because of a FANTASY story...not a SF story. Had she been selected within the last 12 months (and yes, I still agree that 12 Months is a good time) in the SF genre, it would be one thing....but we are talking two separate realms here...Fantasy and Science Fiction.

By opening it up, I do not see that we decrease the number of authors that can be nominated, but increase the number that can be nominated. They would still have to go through the same process of nomination, second, voting, and run off.

By opening it up, I think we would have less of an impact than we would if we reduced the time to 6 months.

Again, just to clarify, I will not whine if it stays the same as it is...I just thought it something to discuss. I really don't think it right to disqualify an author in both genres because he/she has been selected in one...but that is my personal preference.

I'll live if it is not changed :) but we would never know if we didn't discuss it :)

[Charles]

Just because I love playing Devil's Advocate: while we increase the number of authors that can be nominated in any given semi-monthly poll, overall, we also increase the chance that we reduce the variety and number of total authors we read here. Which one outweighs the other? I figure that's pretty much a matter of opinion, though my personal opinion is I'd like to try more authors, but again, not a big deal, since my track record shows I have no problem not reading selected books that don't interest me. ;-)

Of course, I'd put this all aside if we could instead find a way to nominate more new books that I haven't read before -- and hopefully books that will make us think and incite meaningful discussions, since I don't really need a book club to help me choose books to read. I'm more interested in the discussion aspect of a book club, not the "let's all read the same book" aspect. :-)

[Clay]

Charles wrote: "but again, not a big deal, since my track record shows I have no problem not reading selected books that don't interest me. ;-)"

LOL Good point!

Also in agreement about the discussion of books. AND perhaps we should think of a NEW category as well. New Releases? Only Books released within the last 12 months of the date of the poll? And here, again, the restrictions would be only for authors selected for this category within the last 12 months?

[[deleted user]]

Clay wrote: "AND perhaps we should think of a NEW category as well. New Releases? Only Books released within the last 12 months of the date of the poll?"

In July 2012 our Science Fiction Theme was The 2010s. That was 31 months worth of titles, but there is no reason you can't suggest "New Releases" as a new theme.

If there is strong support splitting the author restrictions by genre, I guess I don't mind. I tend to skip the fantasy nominations anyway, so I probably wouldn't be reading two books by the same author.

I suppose it comes down to preferences. I notice some readers binge on authors, reading five or six titles in a row. I very rarely read more than two or three books by the same author in a twelve month period.

[[deleted user]]

New Releases were last in a themed Poll for the Dec. 2012 fantasy Theme. I doublechecked before adding it to my theme list ...

[[deleted user]]

Greg wrote: "I notice some readers binge on authors, reading five or six titles in a row. I very rarely read more than two or three books by the same author in a twelve month period. "

I usually only to that when I read a series and then I still try to read something in between each book. I'm on my third Elizabeth Moon book this month - I just got sucked into this Months story of Paksennarion.

[Clay]

Geoffrey wrote: "I usually only to that when I read a series and then I still try to read something in between each book. I'm on my third Elizabeth Moon book this month - I just got sucked into this Months story of Paksennarion."

I will read the series....but then, I don't look at it as "an author" but as a complete story. If the next "story" I read is by that author or another doesn't matter. Is the story good? If so, I'll read it, if not, then not. Good example would be this month's SF read. I would sit down and devour Stirling's Drakas series but because I could not get into Dies the Fire, I will give the Emberverse series a pass.

Sigh...and the new releases poll was before my time LOL.

[Donna]

I like the 12 month policy and that it includes both genres. I like the diversity it creates in what we read.

[Robin]

I use this forum as a guide to find new-to-me authors, of which there are so very many. I can binge on the ones I like on my own time. So I like the delay before a new author can be chosen.

Y'all have led me to find some great authors, thank you, and I think the new proposed rule will cause fewer authors to be introduced.

[Clay]

LOL guess I am in the minority. (smiles and bows to the audience)

At least it was good for discussion :)

[Donna]

This is a good discussion. The group has only had this rule in place for a few months so it's good to have feedback.

[Bigal-sa]

I like Charles's reasoning here. There must be many authors out there that have books that are readable rather than a select few...