July 2015- Kim by Rudyard Kipling

[Katy]

It has been so many years since I've last read Kim, & this has been a great discussion. I just may need to do a reread. Should have reread along with all of you.

[Roisin]

Read it again and post your comments. It would be interesting like Val did to hear your comments Kathy.

[Roisin]

Back to Val's comments. I take your points about Lurgan, yes he could be seen as just some stereotyped shifty Asian trader and some of the others could have been white characters and so on. I hadn't seen the lama quite in the way that you suggest, which is interesting because it has made me think differently about him. : ) The lama is a dominant character but to me he is just another superstitious, crazy man. Which is probably unfair. I don't think Kipling necessarily saw him the way that I do, but that his how he comes across to me, as a modern reader. The natives are steeped in superstition and strange notions about individuals and life that they have many assumptions about. The lama doesn't really challenge what is happening to Kim he supports it and funds his re-education. Nobody really challenges the British, yet there is a history of rebellion in India and the West Indies. The book did read a bit like a nice, comforting tale to tell British readers.

It is interesting what you say about Lurgan because identity does feature quite a lot throughout the story. Are people who they are and how they dress. Fascinating topic!

[Val]

Any unrest does seem to be coming from outside: Russia, a foreign cleric, independent states, etc., whereas in fact some of it was internal. This was not an unbiased view of colonial India, but it may have been truer at the time of writing than it was under company rule or in later years. Gandhi campaign (to give a famous example) was some years in the future.

I think Kipling intended us to see the lama as a genuine seeker after truth and perhaps all religious belief systems contain elements of superstition, which are stronger when the adherents are poorly educated. (The lama is highly educated about Buddhism, but not about much else.)

That is a good point about identity. Kim is often described as thinking and dreaming in Hindi (or Hindustani). People are to some extent identified by their clothing, they are projecting an image of themselves to others more than changing who they are. I think Kim changes depending on where he is and the company he is keeping, not with what he is wearing.

[Jennifer W]

I think Kim changes depending on where he is and the company he is keeping, not with what he is wearing.

For sure! A couple of times Mahbub tells him to stop praising Allah while he's wearing Hindi clothing!

[Roisin]

Val & Jennifer, well spotted about the clothes. Yes it does seem to depend upon who is around him.

[Pink]

I finally finished this today! It really was hard to get through, after some initial hope at the beginning. My favourite part of the story, was when Kim and his lama first set out on their journey, walking across lands, riding the train and meeting people. I liked how protective Kim was and I wanted to find out more about their relationship. I don't think I liked any of the spy sections, or any of the characters introduced in these parts. It's not that I despised the character for what they were doing, I just wasn't interested in reading this aspect. Quite a disappointment for me and overall I thought it was a poorly constructed book. I can see now why it was so difficult to classify as either adult fiction, an extended short story or a children's book. I'm not sure Kipling was much of a novel writer.

[Nigeyb]

^ No rating yet Pink? I'm predicting three stars which seems to be the most common rating of people in the discussion. Though your comments also hint at a the possibility of a two star rating.

#batedbreath

[Pink]

I'm a harsh rater, so definitely no higher than 2. I'll write a proper review with star ratings in the next couple of days :)

[Nigeyb]

I look forward to it

[Roisin]

It is a difficult book to classify in terms of an audience. I suspect he was trying write an adventure story of the empire aimed at adults and boys, (might be a massive assumption here : ), based on some of his own experiences and his love of the culture. However, that doesn't always make for a great book.