Beta reader venting

[Daneyul]

This is the main Beta Reading group on GoodReads. Not the Main "Free" Beta Reading group. While I don't mind seeing threads created for both kinds, I certainly see a place for both types here.

With free beta readers, you can't insist on a timely response or have a say in the depth of feedback, and the results are going to be basically at the whim of the reader. Nothing wrong with that, but having a more formal option, where one can expect a timely response and be sure of receiving detailed comments, is well worth it for me. (And it's still an act of community service in my opinion--nobody's getting rich off producing detailed beta-reading reports at 1 or 2 cents a word.)

I would never charge for a beta read if all I did was offer a few paragraphs of comments (or less), but if I took days to produce a detailed report, chapter by chapter, I would certainly charge a minor fee.

[Martin]

Daneyul,

I've got great, but broad-brush critiques from beta readers. "The first xx chapters were great, but the pace slowed starting about yy. Can you shrink the section between yy and zz?" Stuff like that. Invaluable, for me, of course. And with a limited budget, incredibly valuable.

Now, can you give us a taste of how much more we might get if we engaged a reader, such as yourself? And go ahead and sell hard! Rules, schmools. We want to produce great novels. (Novels that sell well, too.)

[Daneyul]

Martin wrote: "Daneyul,

...Now, can you give us a taste of how much more we might get if we engaged a reader, such as yourself? And go ahead and sell hard! Rules, schmools. We want to produce great novels. (Novels that sell well, too.) "

Heh. Sorry to confuse, but I don't do beta reads for novels (done many for short stories, though--which of course are not for pay) so no sales pitch from me. I can see by the thoughtless wording of my comment it could be interpreted otherwise, but I was being hypothetical in terms of what I would do were I a beta reader--broad brush would be free, chapter by chapter detailed analysis over days-charged--and thus I have no problem with actual beta readers who charge but provide that extended service on a schedule.

[A.M.]

I used to beta read for a web-based service (it's defunct now, so I obviously don't anymore). It started out as a service for fan fiction writers, but they expanded it to accept original fiction. I met two people who are now really close friends, and we all ended up being published. They had a system in which rather than full manuscripts, we worked chapter by chapter. Now, because of the fan fiction angle, we did correct grammar/spelling/punctuation issues. But we also provided ongoing feedback. It does take longer (unless the beta is really quick), but it automatically gave us two readers for everything.

It's not necessarily the best or only way to get beta reading, but it worked well. The system here is different, and it was an adjustment, but I have definitely been pleased so far. I have to say, my experiences with people in this group have been AMAZING. My beta readers were hands-down the best I've ever had, and I had several really good experiences beta reading for others. I'm glad this group exists.

[Barbara]

At the moment I'm beta readig for Martin and I totally agree with Gretchen: It is a pleasure to work with him.
The book I got read like (or better) than most published "Proofread and edited" ones and he seems to be considering everything his readers tell him, even if it is only a ersonal opinion.

[BR]

Barbara wrote: "B.R. wrote: "Perhaps the mods of this group could contain the "professional" beta readers to a specific forum."

on another GR group the moderator made a post about paid services... Apparently post..."

Subject to the terms and conditions of this agreement, Goodreads grants you permission to use the Service for your personal, non-commercial purposes only. You agree not to engage in any of the following prohibited activities: ... (vii) using the Service for any commercial solicitation purposes;

[Daneyul]

B.R. wrote: "Barbara wrote: "Subject to the terms and conditions of this agreement, Goodreads grants you permission to use the Service for your personal, non-commercial purposes only. You agree not to engage in any of the following prohibited activities: ... (vii) using the Service for any commercial solicitation purposes; "

That is indeed in the ToS, but seeing as there are tons of posts throughout the site in which people offer editing, proofing, promotion, formatting, etc, I think it is most likely there to give them a hammer to use against spamming and inappropriate ads. Pertinent and low-key offerings of various author services are actually useful and something I think GR would be poorer without.

I do think such services offered shouldn't be spammed, and should be appropriate for the venue (offering Editing services in an Editing group for example). As such, I personally think offering paid betas is very useful and appropriate here in a group people come to to find beta readers. In fact I think it only gets a raised eyebrow and the ToS brought up (unlike the other services mentioned, which seem to be completely taken in stride) because there is a "free" alternative, whereas with most other services there's not. (I do admit I have seen some beta readers be coy about the fact that they charge in their response to beta-requests, which I don't like. The commercial aspect should always be upfront, none of this "Email me and we'll discuss" it stuff.)

I have no problem with "pro" reader listings being kept to a separate area from the free listings, but when I came here looking for a beta reader, I specifically wanted a paid one, and was very glad to see people offering them.