Goodreads Librarians Group discussion
Questions (not edit requests)
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Is a quotation a synopsis?
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Dodo wrote: "Is a quotation a synopsis/description? Matter is, many a book here boasts a quotation, usually copied from the cover or the dust-jacket, where the description/synopsis should be. Those seem to be m..."I know quoted praises/reviews/promotions/events aren't allowed in book descriptions on goodreads.
I know that book-in-hand material visible on book jackets, book covers and copyright-pages can be used in goodreads book data.
Depending on what is being quoted from book jacket it may or may not be appropriate/allowed in book description. It should be appropriate for a book synopsis to go in book description field, even if not a very complete or a very useful one.
I think staff would need to see an example of quotation you think may not belong before they could rule.
D.A — not one more promotion on my feed drowning out my friends puh-leeeeeese!!!! wrote: "Depending on what is being quoted from book jacket it may or may not be appropriate/allowed in book description."What I mean is excerpts, sometimes full passages from books in question. Have been stumbling upon them time and again...
I cannot quite remember which books those are, but I`ll try to rummage and, if I succeed, come back with some links.
I don't think excerpts are allowed in book synopsis (sometimes a line or two gets quoted within an actual synopsis to explain the plot or character situation which is okay).Now that you've posted here, a librarian or goodreads staff will come along to handle that linked book and give you more of an official answer than I can.
I'd wait for some more librarians to offer a consensus or for staff (Rivka) to rule. Or send that link to site support to ask about policy directly (email support@goodreads.com or use the contact form under the help screens).
D.A — not one more promotion on my feed drowning out my friends puh-leeeeeese!!!! wrote: " oops, I just saw you were a librarian asking.":D
I`m an inexperienced librarian, as yet, so I think I`d better ask...
I suppose, as a librarian, I could remove "descriptions" of that kind and replace them by synopses of my own. But I`m kinda uneasy... See, for fear lest I make my synopsis a review (which seems to be not allowed), I make mine as short as possible, just essential info. I would not want to make things worse instead of making them better, and I`m not quite sure a dry sentence or two is always better than an excerpt which, after all, might be informative...
Dodo wrote: "...and I`m not quite sure a dry sentence or two is always better than an excerpt which, after all, might be informative......"Is there a reason you would not just replace it with the wording in book description from another edition like the synopsis showing on edition at https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/7..., this one at https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1... ? or the simpler variation at https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2... (which I think just roughly translates to "This first novel by Joanna Chmielewska is an adventure where the illegal gambling den is accidentally taken by another person. As a result of this confusion the just dying man entrusts valuable clue to find the treasure ..." I'm obviously not real fluent in these languages.)
There's nothing wrong with a book having no description if there is no description/synopsis from an acceptable data source. Acceptable data sources do include other editions of the book or book-in-hand so if you have/have-read the book and (more rarely) can write a couple of neutral (non-reviewing, non-rating) dry sentences summarizing plot or subject matter of book--I think that is okay but not encouraged or preferred or even a part of usual librarian edits and definitely a last resort used only when no other descriptions available and you are very sure of your dry description.
I completely understand why you question removing the excerpt and would want to wait until a consensus or more formal staff ruling is given. Of course no one wants to lose, delete or wipe out existing data like that excerpt (not really a place to move it to unless quoting in your own review of the book).
D.A — not one more promotion on my feed drowning out my friends puh-leeeeeese!!!! wrote: "Is there a reason you would not just replace it with the wording in book description from another edition /.../?"There is. What I offer must be either my own text or none.
And thanks, D.A!
My approach to book descriptions has generally been to copy the blurb from the corresponding edition, verbatim. (Although I sometimes proofread it first. :D) If it contains excerpts (or is just an excerpt), then so be it: this is the way, I tell myself, the publisher/author wanted to present it.Is there any GR librarian policy about that?
Mod
rivka wrote: "Excerpts are ok as part of the book description."I mean, is an excerpt OK as the total of a description?
Mod
rivka wrote: "It's generally better than nothing. Better to have a synopsis as well, but sometimes we don't have one."Thank you!
It leads to my further question. If I stumble upon a book with a "quote synopsis" in a language other than EN, and the book is a book I have read and therefore could offer a synopsis, which would be preferable:
Removing the excerpt altogether and replacing that with a laconic synopsis in EN
or
Adding a short synopsis in EN to the excerpt, whatever language that might have been written in?
Or would it be best to leave it well alone?
Thanks!
I'd say if the excerpt is in the edition's language, leave it.
lethe wrote: "I'd say if the excerpt is in the edition's language, leave it."Somehow, it seems to me there`s little point in submitting non-EN descriptions to a site where English is the Lingua Franca. I might be wrong, of course.
And of course I only mean excerpts written in languages I can read, including my native Lithuanian.
The non-EN books are generally read by non-EN people, so it's a courtesy to them to have the synopsis in the actual language.
Dodo wrote: "Somehow, it seems to me there`s little point in submitting non-EN descriptions to a site where English is the Lingua Franca. I might be wrong, of course."When I see a description in a language other than the edition language, I try to find one that matches the edition language - after all, the title is in the edition language. And that is even when I've seen a French description for a German language edition, not just English description for other languages.
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "lethe wrote: "Somehow, it seems to me there`s little point in submitting non-EN descriptions to a site where English is the Lingua Franca. I might be wrong, of course." "For the record, that was not my quote :)
lethe wrote: "For the record, that was not my quote :) "Corrected!
Mod
Agreed.
lethe wrote: "The non-EN books are generally read by non-EN people, so it's a courtesy to them to have the synopsis in the actual language."Mmm... the way I see it, non-EN readers do better searching for books written in non-EN languages elsewhere. Like, I go to a Lithuanian reader site to look for books in LT, as there are more books in LT to be found there than here. Russian, likewise. Polish, too. And so on.
The purpose (well, one of the purposes) of Goodreads, from my point of view, is help in navigating around the ocean of books written also in languages I cannot read, which means I need a description (and, if possible, reviews) in a language I can read. I suspect there are many users needing precisely that. And as each and every of us cannot expect to get everything in our respective tongues, it has to be a Lingua Franca, which, in this case and site, is English...
Then I can check if a particular book I might be interested into has been translated into a language I can reed. But, say, an Arabic description of an Arabic book can help me none.
Dodo wrote: "Mmm... the way I see it, non-EN readers do better searching for books written in non-EN languages elsewhere. Like, I go to a Lithuanian reader site to look for books in LT, as there are more books in LT to be found there than here. Russian, likewise. Polish, too. And so on."This has gotten way beyond the typical thread in the librarian group. As to search I'll just say that GR has been making inroads to improve it. GR doesn't have every book in every language ever published, though that is a goal and books get added every day. Finally, as an English-only person, I appreciate the diversity here and am glad non-English language members can find things in their own language.
Dodo wrote: "Then I can check if a particular book I might be interested into has been translated into a language I can reed. But, say, an Arabic description of an Arabic book can help me none."No, but the book may have editions added in languages you can read. What is the point of having a description in English if the book has never been translated?
GR wants to be a site for readers all over the world. Not everyone is fluent in English. I agree with Elizabeth, I appreciate the diversity here. And lots of people are working to add books, including non-EN, to the database. When I first became a member, there were hardly any Dutch books to be found, but GR has grown so much in the mean time. And I wouldn't know a Dutch reader site that is comparable to GR.
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: " as an English-only person, I appreciate the diversity here and am glad non-English language members can find things in their own language."I do understand that and I do appreciate that.
But what about this: there are quite a few Lithuanian (Polish, Russian, etc) books presented here, and some of those are great books, and some of the great ones have been translated into English. How do you know one of those might be a book you might want to read if the descriptions are all in Lithuanian (Polish, Russian, etc)?
Not to mention descriptions in specific languages cannot really help the specific language speakers as long as the site is not localized. But that`s a topic for another thread.
Dodo wrote: "How do you know one of those might be a book you might want to read if the descriptions are all in Lithuanian (Polish, Russian, etc)?"The English language edition should have an English description, the French language edition should have a French description, the Russian language editions should have a Russian description. The books should have the description in the edition language. How hard is that?
On the settings page on your profile is an option to specify a language. At the present time only English, French, Spanish, German, and Italian are in the options. Next to the Language is a (?) with this explanation:Goodreads is just starting to add support for languages other than English. We plan to grow our international support in the future — but for now these are the only languages where anything is available, and even for these languages only a few things are available, such as month names in forms.
Elizabeth (Alaska) wrote: "...The English language edition should have an English description, the French language edition should have a French description, the Russian language editions should have a Russian description. The books should have the description in the edition language. How hard is that?..."I agree.
I wasn't clear in my previous post asking about just re-using the description from another edition.
I should have phrased that as why not use an appropriate language translation of the description on another edition. That is, if French, Spanish and Dutch editions had good descriptions but the German and English editions did not -- can't you just translate French/Spanish/Dutch synopsis into English/German and use rather than writing your own synopsis for a book? (assuming fluent enough to do so or asking a librarian fluent in those languages to help do so).
It's a different story if none of the editions have a decent description or if all had same blurb/excerpt from book jacket/cover material. But if there are good descriptions ... can't they be translated and used?
Dodo wrote: "Elizabeth, I have compared books, and I`m nearly sure you would really like this: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/6...For all I know, it might have been translated into EN. I cannot b..."
There is no English language edition on Goodreads, nor can I find one on Worldcat, so I think it has not been translated. If it were, the English language edition would have an English language description.
Dodo wrote: "Elizabeth, I have compared books, and I`m nearly sure you would really like this: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/6...For all I know, it might have been translated into EN. I cannot be sure, of course.
Does the description help you figure out if the book is a book you would want to read or not?
Here`s something that might: http://readaholicme.weebly.com/lit-li..."
As I said before, what is the point?? Most books are NEVER translated into English. What good does it do to know all of the wonderful books you'll never be able to read?
Fortunately, enough is published in English that Elizabeth will never run out of books to read if she lives to be 120.
ETA: "Unfortunately, only about 3% of all books published in the United States are works in translation. That is why we have chosen the name Three Percent for this site. And that 3% figure includes all books in translation—in terms of literary fiction and poetry, the number is actually closer to 0.7%. While that figure obviously represents more books than any one person could read in a year, it's hardly an impressive number." (http://www.rochester.edu/College/tran...)
lethe wrote: "Most books are NEVER translated into English."A pity, really.
lethe wrote: "Fortunately, enough is published in English that Elizabeth will never run out of books to read if she lives to be 120."Ha! And I probably already have enough on my wish list to last beyond my life expectancy. Not that that keeps me from adding more. ;-)
Is a quotation synopsis enough?