19th Century Epic Romances discussion
19th Century Epic Romances
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Mr Rochester v.s. Mr Darcy: Which do you prefer and why?
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You might like to add Mr. Thornton (from "North and South" by Gaskell) to the list. These three are often compared - the fab trio.Since Austen doesn't let us know Darcy's thoughts, and the story is virtually all from Lizzie's POV, it's difficult to divine the degree of Darcy's passion and his angst in endeavoring to win her heart. That's what makes him rather bland, I suppose.
"Jane Eyre" sits on my shelf, untouched as of yet - so I can't speak in book terms about Rochester. All I know is that he appears to be a bit of a tortured soul. He has a lively past and has endured emotional anguish. He comes more alive and his attraction to Jane can be seen through his interations with her.
Thornton's angst and passion for Margaret Hale is beautifully described throughout Gaskell's book. He is a lonely soul, who has suffered a difficult past. He's never loved before and isn't looking for love when he is completely stuck by Margaret's intelligent, graceful, and self-confident bearing. He suffers over a year of angst in thinking his love will never be requited. I adore Thornton. He loves so completely, despite all the odds.
I have to say that Thornton is my favorite, as well. Am rereading N&S now and love how his thoughts about Margaret are described. Gaskell does a wonderful job.
I don't think there is any comparison, for several reasons. First of all, they are from different time periods in which male heros were attributed different qualities. Rochester's emotional turmoil is what is actually endearing him to the reader, as he is opposed to the other male characters who do not feel the passion. He suffers from his volatility. Mr. Darcy is a character who warms up to the passion of affection and it actually helps expand his understanding as a consequence. Also I agree, since Mr. Darcy is not a PoV character, only snippets of conversation help us understand him. To answer the original question the reader had, I think that adds to his appeal - added mystery.
It is one of the reasons my preferred Jane Austen hero is Capt. Wentworth - we get to learn a lot more about him!
As a last comparison comment, and this might count as *Spoiler* for the reader who had not read Jane Eyre - but Mr. Rochester is living a lie. The mistake Mr. Darcy makes is just to stop his friend from marrying a girl he believes is unsuitable and indifferent, which isn't dreadfully morally wrong. If you compare it to the mess Mr. Rochester gets Jane into... puhhlease. Again Regency vs Victorian values.
I have to say Mr. Darcy hands down. Though I loved Mr. Rochester in Jane Eyre (one of my favorite books). Mr. Thornton is also a good catch, but if I'm going strictly on character, it would have to be Mr. Darcy. The other 2 bring far too much drama to the table, and come with quite a bit of baggage. Though it is true we may not know all there is to know of Darcy, just as he is I would take him over the other two.
Mr Darcy! Although, he makes uncalled for judgements in the beginning of the story( believing Jane Bennet is too indifferent to marry Bingley), he eventually makes up for by taking care of Wickham and Lydia's wedding.
I like both, but like it was mentioned earlier, Rochester and Darcy came from very different times. As well as, Charlotte Bronte (or any of her sisters) and Jane Austen were very different authors. I like them both for different reasons. It kinda just depends on what you like.
I adore both men, but I agree Mr. Rochester is WAY more interesting. I am much more intrigued by him. He's so dark, enigmatic and altogether passionate. I suppose you could also describe Heathcliff this way but I'm not as much into him ;)
I definitely prefer Mr. Darcy. When I read (and saw) Jane Eyre, I certainly thought Mr. Rochester was intriguing, but he never appealed to me. He was just a crabby, average-looking, rich guy who always did whatever he wanted.I prefer Mr. Darcy because although he was a cold jerk to Elizabeth at first, it turned out to be more him trying to stay away from her because his aunt would not approve. Everything he does for Elizabeth though just proves that he really is a kind person. He just does not have the talent of conversing easily with people he has never met before.
Mr. Darcy > Mr. Rochester
Mr Rochester! No doubt! Mr Darcy is fascinating and handsome, but Edward Rochester has a deeper personality (which can be seen in his dialogues with Jane).
There's no question ;)
I always felt Rochester played with Jane's emotions (and head) too much...then there is that whole woman locked in his attic bit so it's Mr. Darcy for me. Even though he has the classic stiff upper lip, I think there is untapped passion waiting to be unleashed on his Elizabeth. That aside, I'm all for Mr. John Thornton from North and South...there is a man in need of love and affection. *swoon*Mr. John Thornton > Mr. Fitzwilliam Darcy > Mr. Edward Rochester
I think Darcy's attractive because he changes.Not easy to do.
Shelley
http://dustbowlstory.wordpress.com
I love them both awww but okay I'll go with my first classic man so its Mr. Darcy:) Mr. Thornton should be in the choices too. such a great man!;)
Darcy is who you're supposed to want. Rochester is the "bad boy" that you secretly really do want. Darcy is the guy you should want to marry. Rochester is the guy that you're willing to throw away all conventions for. (Well, maybe not Jane Eyre. She stuck to her guns.) Darcy is the merry-go-round. Rochester is the roller coaster through the haunted house.
Mocha Spresso wrote: "Darcy is who you're supposed to want. Rochester is the "bad boy" that you secretly really do want. Darcy is the guy you should want to marry. Rochester is the guy that you're willing to throw aw..."Well said Mocha!:)
Mr. Rochester. He's a tortured soul who has much more character than Mr. Darcy. Rochester is much more romantic
Rhonda wrote: "Mr. Rochester. He's a tortured soul who has much more character than Mr. Darcy. Rochester is much more romantic"I feel that way too. Darcy was just too perfect/ the good boy. While Rochester was the one with baggage.
Vasilena wrote: "I don't think there is any comparison, for several reasons. First of all, they are from different time periods in which male heros were attributed different qualities. Rochester's emotional turmoil..."I totally agree with you!
And Frederick is also one of my favorite characters ever !
I think Darcy has a better shot at sometimes being funny. Other than dependability, it's hard to think of something more important in a husband than a winning sense of humor?Shelley, http://dustbowlstory.wordpress.com
I used to prefer Rochester, because he was so snarky and all that banter between he and Jane made my heart giddy, but lately I've really started to resent his manipulations. I feel like they speak volumes of how little he truly understood Jane, and how unable he was to calculate the strength of her principles. And yeah, Darcy's bland in comparison, but I think the reason he's so popular and stood the test of time is because he undergoes a Significant Change in the novel, and all for the heroine. And all that self-less work he does in securing Lydia's safety is probably another bonus.
Rochester is much more demanding, while Darcy's content to wait for Lizzie to come to him. It might not seem so romantic, but it's much more appealing to me, especially when you consider how Bronte had to physically and mentally subjugate him before he could be deserving of Jane. By then, he's not the same Rochester anymore - he's neither snarky and fun, nor is he manipulative.
Darcy hands down. Though as already stated, regency period vs victorian gothic, is like apples and oranges. But there are basic differences in the men themselves. Darcy is at heart a caring, honest man, who thinks of others, ie... tenants, servants, Georgiana and even what he does with Bingley and Jane is because he cares about Bingley. Rochester on the other hand is secretive and dishonest. He is an almost bigot and lies to everyone.
Rochester is the spicy, exotic meal that keeps you up all night while Darcy is comfort food.
If we are going to debate Austen men then I have to say that my fav as a teen and even during my 20's and 30's was Darcy. But now in my 40's I have to say that Col. Brandon and Knightly are at the top of my list. They are both so caring, so protective. And they are both very secure in who they are... I think that is very sexy.
It's got to be Rochester for me. (Discounting the fact that if he loves Jane he'd find nothing to recommend me to him). He's almost vicious in his love for her. He's so moody, and so changeable, but it's all because of his past and his regrets.I love the way Jane can feel secure enough to speak openly to him, and even take him down a peg if need be. This is mentioned a bit during their engagement and I think its funny and adorable that Rochester is content to be managed by Jane.
I find D'arcy too easily embarrassed and arrogant. Even when he's supposedly opened himself up to loving Elizabeth, its practically on the condition that she understand how obnoxious her family is. I mean, they are a pretty terrible set, but come on. I just think of him as too proper, too conservative, too steadfast. If I were Lizzy I'd be spending all my time trying to set him off, which he would hate (much in the way D'arcy carries distaste for Lizzie's father for his apathetic relationship with mrs.bennet.)
*I'd still choose Professor Bhaer from Little Women over both of them.
Darcy is the dream man for all women, handsome rich, proud guy tamed by his love for you, who dose not fall for him?Rochester is your dark, mysterious byronic hero, I like him too, but I find him quite deceptive and rude.
Darcy for sure, he at lest does not have a crazy wife hidden anywhere
I agree with a lot of the comments about both men and I think to be fair it would all depend on the woman. Being an older woman I don't want a man I have to tame or take down a notch... I would prefer a man that is caring and considerate of me. In the last scene where they joke about what to call each other, that said it all.
I'd go for Mr. Rochester, despite being ugly, mysterious and rude but i like the way he loved jane as for Mr Darcy i find him too arrogant, even when he finaly confessed hi love for Lizzie it lacked the passion shown by Mr. Rochester.
I liked Mr Rochester at first since I am a fan of the Bronte Sisters. Whereas Jane Eyre immediately liked Mr Rochester, it took Elizabeth Bennett some time to warm up to Mr Darcy. Hence, the reader is swept off their feet with Mr Rochester, who turns out to be darker and "uglier", while Mr Darcy, in the end, turns out to be "nicer" and more romantic than Mr Rochester.
Jane Eyre and Pride and Prejudice are two of my favorite books and have been since I was little. I've read them countless times and am drawn to both me for different reasons. Darcy is subtle which I can see coming off as bland. Even though he has his mistaken judgments his love for Lizzie is passionate enough that against all his judgments he can't be without her. The book is all about the subtleties. Little gestures that seem silly to us now would be a big deal back then.
Mr Rochester on the other hand is a tornado of emotion. He sweeps everything out of the way and his relationship with Jane is wonderful because she is the only one to stand up to him.
They appeal to me similarly because in both relationships there is brutal honesty and very frank conversations. Of course there is some deception, but in general their interactions are not sugar coated.
Mr. Darcy is rich, handsome, witty and above all, moral and honest!This is how I feel about Mr. Rochester:
I understand he is a tortured soul, but I find Rochester to be vain and inconsiderate in his treatment of Jane after they first meet and I don't think he deserves her in the end, even though he realizes that later on.
I think he was cowardly and selfish - as if he said to himself, "Oh poor me, I was used by my family and hurt by someone I loved, so I'll take it out on the people who can least hurt me - Adele and Jane.
(view spoiler)
I agree with Theresa (a few comments up) regarding Col. Brandon. He's a true gentleman.
I sympathize greatly with Rochester. Darcy's life seems neat and tidy in comparison.Rochester is understandably bitter about life when he first meets Jane. His manner was blunt, but Jane seemed to respond to it well, so he continued to test her to see who she really was. He knew it would take a great deal to get a true confession of her feelings for him, so he resorted to bringing Blanche to the house - to gauge Jane's response.
And it worked! He got her to break out of her shell of closed emotions and let him know her heart.
I don't really blame him for grasping at the chance for happiness he saw. To tell Jane the whole truth would have been to scare her off, and her presence in his life was the only thing that made him feel alive and hopeful.
I think judging Rochester needs to be done carefully. One of Bronte's thrusts in writing seems to be to encourage her readers to consider the situations of each individual - their history and struggles - before relegating judgment on them. What each individual struggles with is the deeper issue.
I think Rochester was commendable for taking care of his wife, when he could have disposed of her (or his care-taking) in some manner if he had really wanted to. This is a woman who he was somewhat tricked into marrying. I think Bronte wants us to sympathize with both Jane and Rochester in their anguish over moral decisions. What would you do if your spouse was insane and then you met someone who lit your soul and seemed everything good and true?
I really love Rochester for his passion and his humor. He really wants to start life anew with Jane and put his past behind him. I think he is really good at heart, he's just had to travel a really rocky road.
I don't know Darcy well enough to even know whether I like him. Wealth doesn't make character, nor does personal appearance. A handsome man can be a bore in intellect and wit. But Darcy seems genuine and kind. But is he interesting? I don't know. Someone enlighten me.
Trudy wrote: "I sympathize greatly with Rochester. Darcy's life seems neat and tidy in comparison.Rochester is understandably bitter about life when he first meets Jane. His manner was blunt, but Jane seemed t..."
I think Darcy represents the ideal man(well, 19th century Englishman) - a rich, handsome, loving, loyal, articulate landowner.
Rochester represents the actual, flawed person whom you would still love, warts and all.
I personally prefer Darcy to Rochester because although he may have seemed snobbish and arrogant at first,I think he was actually a bit shy and reserved.
He had a lot of responsibility to handle at a young age and he took it very seriously. Because he was drawn out by Elizabeth Bennet, he became more compassionate by the end of "Pride & Prejudice".
The main reason I like his character better than Rochester was that Darcy was always noble and honest to a fault. He would have never played the mind games that Rochester did with Jane Eyre and he was not deceitful at all, in fact he was painfully honest and put others before himself.
Darcy could have very well used the situation with Lydia as a way to make Elizabeth marry him but he didn`t he helped Lydia without expecting anything in return I think that says a lot about what kind of man Darcy was. What do you think Rochester would have done in that situation?
Hmm....the underlying conditions of their developing relationships are so different, it's nearly impossible to swap positions. Darcy was rejected, and perhaps not expecting Lizzy to come around. Rochester suspected Jane had feelings for him.
If something outside his realm of influence were to cause Jane great distress, I think he's do whatever was in his power to alleviate her pain. But he may have hopes, too, that in doing so she would reveal more of her feelings.
Darcy would never have manipulated. I get that. Thornton never did, either.
Rochester wasn't as noble. But I still love him for his desperate trying to win Jane. He felt trapped, understandably so. I suppose to be noble he should have never revealed his passion and sent her away before he was tempted to try bigamy.
I always liked Rochester more. But that could be because I like Jane Eyre more than Pride and Prejudice.
I like Rochester better maybe because he was "abstractly beautiful" for me from his looks to his personality. He's a bad bad boy! And i have a soft heart for his likes hahahahaha!! But do i like him for myself? NO! He is and forever will be for Jane Eyre :-) Mainly because I've got hots for Thornton that I want him to be mine brrrrrr
Darcy all the way! I don't see him as bland or boring at all! Just because he doesn't talk at you like Rochester does all the time doesn't mean he isn't interesting. In fact, he always has the last word in conversations with Lizzy, and seems to be the only person who understands and likes her wit, and can respond to it with his own. And he respects her enough to take it to heart when she criticizes him, and to endeavour to change for her. I mean, come on, he went from unwilling to be civil to her, to marrying her despite her ruined family! That's a big leap. He grows as a person. Rochester stays the same, really, other than he's maimed in the end.
YAY! GO TEAM DARCY!!
A better question would be Rochester or Heathcliff ?
I was asking myself the same question, Teresa. Heathcliff is the sexiest of the three, and dark, dangerous, passionate, and vulnerable.
Heathcliff is too dark and damaged a soul forme; Rochester is the same flawed man at the
end of the novel as at the start; Darcy changes,
grows in his love, becomes truly noble. Yes, Darcy for this reader!
Trudy wrote: "You might like to add Mr. Thornton (from "North and South" by Gaskell) to the list. These three are often compared - the fab trio.Thank you, Trudy, for mentioning North and South. As a result of your post, I read the book. Previously I had been thinking of Heathcliff as a better choice than Darcy or Rochester. But Mr. Thornton is the best of all, by mile!
As for Rochester, he's quite intense and when reading his banter/dialogues with Jane Eyre, one gets what he is all about. And he is considered to be "an ugly man". Not only that but he is a Byronic hero, so that makes him more realistic.
I would therefore like to know what are people's perceptions of both heroes. Maybe I'm missing something with regards to Darcy. I'll also have to give North and South a try.