The Sword and Laser discussion
There's no E in Reading!
date
newest »
newest »
What an entertaining load of crap. Look, if I could somehow have the memory of having read the book implanted in my brain without ever having gone through the action of reading the book, that would count for me. It's getting the story into your head that matters, not how you do it.Now we're getting into the tactile sensation of touching the pages? I got tired of the argument when it was "ebooks are not real books because they don't have the book smell" argument. I have anosmia, so the smell of things has never been a factor. I love my kid without ever getting a whiff of that magic baby smell and I enjoy reading without smelling musty paper. I think I'll get by without the sensation of rubbing my fingertips over pulped wood of varying quality.
Meanwhile, Slate, let's ignore the irony of reprinting an article about reading digital words not being important on your website.
Clickbait, the lowest and most boring form of trolling.
Its not reading if you can't use a chisel and hammer. Nothing compares to breathing rock dust. Paperbacks? How much memorable physical effort is there in lick and flip?And I don't buy the feel and smell of paper deal anyway. I use paper to wipe my backside regularly. Are you telling me if I use a bidet instead I'll forget how to take a dump? And all the good feelings I get usually come before the wiping. None of it feels or smells too hot though...apparently.
Sean wrote: "Clickbait, the lowest and most boring form of trolling."thats what I was thinking.
So, since it was published in an online outlet and I read it on my computer or phone, does that mean I didn't really read the article and any click-through doesn't count?
terpkristin wrote: "So, since it was published in an online outlet and I read it on my computer or phone, does that mean I didn't really read the article and any click-through doesn't count?"That's exactly right!! Lol
But... but... but... there's an E in reading. It's right after the R and before the A. Otherwise it would be rading.
I still prefer regular books myself, but I would never say that someone that reads e books isn't reading at all.
Nick wrote: "This some how feels relevant.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkQke..."
I do like horrible histories. :)
And I'm really glad that I read (correction: did not read) that article, because I used to think that reading was all about getting the words someone else composed into my brain via any means available, and mistakenly believed that emails on my computer, online articles, e-books, and even far off sign posts and notice boards could all be read, but now I understand that only by holding an actual physical book and caressing the pages am I actually reading. And the next time I have an eye exam and the optician asks me to read the chart over there...well, I'll obviously go over to the chart and give it a good stroke; I wouldn't want to hinter the tactile experience of reading by doing otherwise. Thank goodness I've been saved!
Hmmm, sounds like all those folks that said electric guitars aren't real instruments, and all those people that say hip hop isn't real music, and all those fools who want to take Merica back to the "good old days" when men were men, and women were women, and racism, sexism, and religious intolerance where totes cool if you were white, male, and christian. I quote Jon Stewart when I say to Andrew Piper, "You're old". And I don't even have an e-book!
As Goodreads usually counts e-books as having zero pages, someone must agree with them :)
AndrewP wrote: "As Goodreads usually counts e-books as having zero pages, someone must agree with them :)"Just like a lot of kindle books don't have page numbers.
Tamahome wrote: "AndrewP wrote: "As Goodreads usually counts e-books as having zero pages, someone must agree with them :)"Just like a lot of kindle books don't have page numbers."
But they have percentages, and time left to finish, and whispersync.
David Sven wrote: "But they have percentages, and time left to finish, and whispersync..."Time left? I haven't noticed that in the ios app.
Tamahome wrote: "David Sven wrote: "But they have percentages, and time left to finish, and whispersync..."Time left? I haven't noticed that in the ios app."
That's on the Paperwhite that I don't know I'm getting for Christmas. I'm not sure why they can't do the same for the app.
Haven't we had this conversation with the whole, "Are audiobooks reading?" and we pretty much said yes, right? E-Books are reading. There isn't that much to it. I'm taking words written and understanding them. That's reading. It doesn't matter if someone is speaking the words to me, or if I'm reading on an LCD, it's reading. Therefore, you READ this comment.
AndrewP wrote: "As Goodreads usually counts e-books as having zero pages, someone must agree with them :)"Let's not say they have zero pages. Let's say they have flexible pagination.
if it's only got one very long page, it's basically a scroll again which means by the article's logic that eReader are superior to books because of reasons.
Tamahome wrote: "David Sven wrote: "But they have percentages, and time left to finish, and whispersync..."Time left? I haven't noticed that in the ios app."
The paperwhite has that, and maybe the Fire too, but the apps don't. The apps don't even support collections, which is a pain in the arse when you have hundreds of books on it. Shame, cos with a little bit of effort on the catalogue and organising end, kindle for iPad would be the best damn reading app out there (IMHO)
But to suggest it isn't Reading (which is a very pleasant town, btw - lots of nice cafes and bookshops. And just up the road from Slough, which Tom has finally got the hang of pronouncing. Maybe he should try Reading next! Hint: sounds like red ing. Ahem, I digress) is clearly ludicrous. What's special about words on paper compared to words anywhere else? NOTHING!
they don't have pagenumbers?my sony reader has actually. they're based on the smallest letter size. if you enlarge it you can just be in between pages or 3 'times' on page 7 for instance.
i think it's an ok solution, i like having some kind of numbering to see how much i've read.
hm, I do have a few ebooks on my Kindle that do have page numbers as well as percent. I honestly don't mind this. I love my simple Kindle for the fact that it's simple. Sure some things could be better but I don't have that with a book either so I'm totally fine. I can't read on ipad or any tablet. Too many distractions for my ADD brain.
Percentages work fine for me. Even with DTBs I've always thought in terms of a third through, halfway etc, and never by page reference. I don't think I've consciously even looked at a page number since I left school. And they're not particularly useful as a measure for how long a book is either. As John Scalzi said (paraphrased, probably) on his podcast interview, 'All my books come out at 320 pages. It doesn't matter if I turn in 80,000 or 120,000 words, my publisher will tweak the font to make it come out to 320 pages. because it's a nice size and it looks good when they're all in a row.'
AndrewP wrote: "As Goodreads usually counts e-books as having zero pages, someone must agree with them :)"They probably didn't realize that Nook books all have page numbers. I'm looking at one of the books right now and at the bottom I see 110 of 980. So not only the current page number provided, but also total page count for the book.
Jonathan wrote: "They probably didn't realize that Nook books all have page numbers. I'm looking at one of ..."Yeah and the Nook Books seem to adjust the page numbers to the size of the text too as noted above. So if I increase the Text size then I just read what is numbered as page 3 for 2 clicks of the page forward button instead of 1. I don't know what the page number corresponds to but I would assume that it is a previous version of the book in hardback form.
In goodreads currently reading section you can click on the little '%' sign, or the 'page # of #' and toggle between them. However, sometimes if you have 'page # of #' selected, it puts them into your statistics as 0 pages. Now that Kindle now adds page numbers this should not happen so often. Perhaps it's something to do with the fact that Amazon doesn't let Goodreads use their website data.The lack of accurate page numbers makes e-books pretty useless for some academic uses. Sure, everyone can download a copy of Frankenstein for free, but reading assignments need to have accurate, and consistent, page numbers.
Richardya wrote: "The original poster has a valid point, if kids learn to read on Kindles and iPads, do they really know how to read? I wonder."I wonder if 1200 years ago people said, "ifpeoplelearntoreadwithspacesbetweenwordsdotheyreallyknowhowtoread?"
AndrewP wrote: "The lack of accurate page numbers makes e-books pretty useless for some academic uses. Sure, everyone can download a copy of Frankenstein for free, but reading assignments need to have accurate, and consistent, page numbers."I've referenced kindle books before without any trouble. I just noted that it was a kindle edition and then wrote down the location number, which means whatever font size or device the reader chooses to use, they should be able to locate the exact point I am referencing. I've never had any negative feedback from referencing in this way, even from tutors who mark severely when it comes to references, so I assume that this is the correct way to go about it.
I also use my kindle to read pdf files, since I hate reading from the computer, can carry the kindle to classes easily, and once you have a kindle, using it in this way is far cheaper than having to print off every document.
I've also found the kindle wonderful for when I need to highlight or make notes on books I'm reading, since the very idea of marking an actual book makes me feel ill.
To me, the kindle is wonderful for academic use, and I wouldn't like to study without one.
Richardya wrote: "I never realized how handsome Clint Eastwood was before this worthy thread, I am not afraid to say it, he is a handsome man. "you're welcome.
I wrote my graduate thesis referencing multiple kindle books, if you copy and paste the text from the highlights on kindle.amazon.com you even get the annotation put in for you. There is now a standard for annotating them using the kindle location. Most newer kindle books have page numbers but not all devices support them. The Kindle keyboard, kindle, kindle touch, android app, and probably others all have them. The original fire didn't and I'm not sure why.
The time to read and X-ray amazon seems to be keeping only on the higher end kindles perhaps to encourage purchasing them rather than just using the app.
I've read about 100 kindle books in the past 2 years, it's sad to think that there is someone who would think that I haven't read anything.
I'm sure I'll get in trouble for this, but I'm still not convinced on audiobooks. I don't consider the act of listening to an audiobook to be reading it, but once I've finished one I'm still fine with saying I've read it since there's no other good way to refer to it. I think I prefer listened over read for audiobooks. Do we need a new verb eread to read electronically, although then pretty soon very few people will actually be reading and everyone will be ereading and listening.
Shaina wrote: "I wrote my graduate thesis referencing multiple kindle books, if you copy and paste the text from the highlights on kindle.amazon.com you even get the annotation put in for you. "I've not heard about the ability to get highlights from kindle to computer, so I never tried to copy paste. I've tried to find out how on amazon.co.uk, and I can't find the way to (if there is one for us guys) Does anyone know if it's possible in the uk, and if so, how? I think a list of notes all neatly together and reference on my computer would be wonderful for essay writing etc.
I agree with you that listening is different from reading, and I too might still say 'read' instead of 'listened to' once I've finished an audiobook, because the way we use 'read' is often synonymous with 'completed'. I don't think it really matters which way you consume books though.
Ruth wrote: "Shaina wrote: "I wrote my graduate thesis referencing multiple kindle books, if you copy and paste the text from the highlights on kindle.amazon.com you even get the annotation put in for you. " "Do you have an equivalent of kindle.amazon.com? It's kind of weird and unnecessary most of the time, it tracks what kindle books you've read and are currently reading and lets you rate them and stuff.
I think the copy and pasting with annotations may have been actually copy pasting from the cloud reader app or the kindle pc app. I don't remember any more. The kindle pc app I think also lets you search through highlights.
I may be wrong, but I don't think there is an equivalent. There is a 'manage your kindle' section on the uk website, but this doesn't seem to have quotations anywhere. I've just tried on the pc app, and there was a section listed to see highlights, but none of mine showed up there. Could be I'm missing something/ doing something wrong.
I shall experiment when I get home on that! I know my mother is using Kindle versions to cite in the degree she's doing at the moment...Oh and: http://booksprung.com/how-to-cite-a-k...
I love reading books be they paper or digital. When I asked for a paperwhite for Christmas, my family was surprised because I am somebody who loves the feel and smell of a good paper book. I told them that would never change but that digital books sounded interesting to me both as a technology and the convenience factor. Now I can keep my physical books (as one of my friends calls them) at home and carry this instead. More room in my bag makes my a happy chick cause my back doesn't yell at me as much.So it doesn't matter to me which way you do it, it's still reading. I still feel the same emotions and enjoy stories just as much.
Now I gotta wait till tomorrow or Tuesday to use my new device...which is torture :)
Ill be sure to do this next time im at the library