Capture (The Flesh Cartel #1) Capture discussion


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message 1: by Heidi (last edited Sep 23, 2012 08:22PM) (new) - added it

Heidi Belleau Want to ask and answer spoiler-y questions about The Flesh Cartel? Do it here!

Haven't read the book and have a question? Ask it!

Read the book and have an answer? Share your expertise.

Just want to talk about spoilery stuff in general? Yep, here's your place.

If you have a question for Rachel and I specifically, give us a shoutout (starting your post with "Hey R/H!" or tagging us using the "add author" link above both work fine). We'll answer questions directed to us this way, but otherwise we'll keep our noses out of conversations here, so feel free to use this space however you need.

We may or may not drop a few tidbits about upcoming episodes and seasons. ;)


message 2: by Heidi (last edited Sep 23, 2012 08:29PM) (new) - added it

Heidi Belleau And to start us off with a bit of torture, last night Rachel and I finished the first draft of Season 2 of Flesh Cartel.

Wanna know the last two words of that document?

(view spoiler)


Sun Heidi wrote: "Wanna know the last two words of that document? (view spoiler)"

Oh god, oh god...please tell me that's a good interpretation and not a twisted one...please!!!!

They've already been through so much...I wonder how much more they can take...I need a happy ending...I'd settle for a happy'ish ending.


Sun I have to say that I kept reading through this book thinking about you guys (Rachel/Heidi), "they won't go there" or "they won't take it THAT far"...

but ya did.

How could you?!!!!!

Couldn't you just take the easy, generic way out where Dougie finds a hidden gun under the seat of the van and just shoots all the bad guys before they can hurt him? HA!


message 5: by Rachel (new) - added it

Rachel Haimowitz Susan wrote: "I have to say that I kept reading through this book thinking about you guys (Rachel/Heidi), "they won't go there" or "they won't take it THAT far"...

but ya did.

How could you?!!!!!

Couldn't you..."


LOL, that would have ended the story awfully fast :-p


message 6: by Rachel (new) - added it

Rachel Haimowitz Susan wrote: "Heidi wrote: "Wanna know the last two words of that document? [spoilers removed]"

Oh god, oh god...please tell me that's a good interpretation and not a twisted one...please!!!!

They've already b..."


If you reeeeeeally want to know how we envision the end of the series, I'll drop some vague generalities under a spoiler cut ;)


Sun Rachel wrote: "If you reeeeeeally want to know how we envision the end of the series, I'll drop some vague generalities under a spoiler cut ;) ..."

I think that might be necessary for my sanity at this point. I ended this book in a dark place and needed a bubble bath and some Julie Andrews singing "My Favorite Things" to settle me...ok, not really. More like a glass of whiskey and some bad reality tv...but good enough. :)


Sun I also think its odd that so many people are thinking this is a BDSM book. I see it called that in discussion threads and its so far from it...


message 9: by Rachel (last edited Sep 23, 2012 08:53PM) (new) - added it

Rachel Haimowitz Susan wrote: "Rachel wrote: "If you reeeeeeally want to know how we envision the end of the series, I'll drop some vague generalities under a spoiler cut ;) ..."

I think that might be necessary for my sanity at..."


LOL, ok. So, AT THE END OF SEASON 4 (though it might be season 5, depending on how things shape up, because Season 2 ended at an earlier point than we'd initially expected), (view spoiler)

Better? :)


message 10: by Rachel (new) - added it

Rachel Haimowitz Susan wrote: "I also think its odd that so many people are thinking this is a BDSM book. I see it called that in discussion threads and its so far from it..."

Yeah, there is nothing even remotely BDSM about this. It's not SSC, it's not RACK, it's not anything but a psychological thriller about sexual slavery. I think there are maybe some misconceptions about BDSM, and so everything that uses its trappings (a story with whips or chains or even real power imbalance instead of consensual power exchange) tends to get lumped in there. Plus--and I saw this happen with disconcerting frequency with Anchored, which is also not even remotely a BDSM book--those folks will shelve it as BDSM and use the word BDSM when discussing it, and that causes others to erroneously assume that's how the publisher and author are selling it. So it ends up sort of being a big misconception cycle that feeds itself, and it's not really even like the author or publisher can step in and say something to correct the misconception at its source, because you don't ever want to create a situation where a reader feels uncomfortable expressing their opinions. So you just sort of have to let it be and do your very best to make it clear in your own spaces and in your own available ways that it's not BDSM.


Sun Rachel wrote: "LOL, ok. So, AT THE END OF SEASON 4..."

*deep sigh* Thank you. I can actually rest now.

When you mean "seasons", are those each book? I need to brace myself for how much hurt I have to go through to get to the end...

ha!


message 12: by Rachel (new) - added it

Rachel Haimowitz Susan wrote: "Rachel wrote: "LOL, ok. So, AT THE END OF SEASON 4..."

*deep sigh* Thank you. I can actually rest now.

When you mean "seasons", are those each book? I need to brace myself for how much hurt I hav..."


A "season" is essentially a full book's worth of material, with complete, distinct plot and character arcs. So FC is essentially shaping up to be either a four- or a five-book series. Each season is then broken down into episodes of around 18,000 words each (five of the first six are looking to be right around that length). For more info on the setup, you can check out the Serial FAQ on the Riptide site, though we're happy to keep answering questions here, too :)


message 13: by Heidi (new) - added it

Heidi Belleau Seasons are multiple 15-20k books long. So this season is two books, next season is four books, and we're not sure about the other seasons yet because we're still writing. ;)

But yeah, we're planning on this being a pretty long series.


Sun Heidi wrote: "But yeah, we're planning on this being a pretty long series..."

So what you're both saying is that this series is your own form of drawn-out torture...gee thanks. :)


message 15: by Rachel (new) - added it

Rachel Haimowitz Susan wrote: "Heidi wrote: "But yeah, we're planning on this being a pretty long series..."

So what you're both saying is that this series is your own form of drawn-out torture...gee thanks. :)"


Ahahaha yes >:D


Evaine I think a lot of people shelve the book, or describe the book as BDSM because they don't have a better reference. I really didn't and originally shelved it as BDSM even though what happens in Book 1 is SO very far from anything BDSM. I think, also, my hope is that there will be some kind of positive ending somewhere that embodies the BDSM aspects in their proper light.

But after reading some of the reviews and this thread, I've removed it from the BDSM shelf and created the psycho-sexual thriller shelf. :)


Riptide Publishing Evaine wrote: "I think a lot of people shelve the book, or describe the book as BDSM because they don't have a better reference. I really didn't and originally shelved it as BDSM even though what happens in Book..."

The frame-of-reference observation is a good point--I hadn't thought of that.

And LOL, the world needs more psychosexual thriller shelves :D


Jo * Smut-Dickted * I shelved it as capture/dubcon/slave as that is where it fits for me...though we are reading it as a Buddy Read in the BDSM Group -- we do often read this theme...but it is probably better classed differently. Much like erotica tends to get dumped to erotic romance although the two are not the same either!


Lisa Arbitrary - AttentionIsArbitrary M/M Blog Is book 2 really not going to be released until January? Or do I have that wrong?

I LOVE DOUGIE. I didn't say that in my review, but just had to put it out there.

I'm still pretty ticked about Amazon banning this book. Even more so after reading it. It is intense but how could a story like this be told with any less brutality and realism? It needs to be raw. Duh! Anyways, I think you should both be pretty proud to have a book banned, I mean, that's kind of cool, isn't it?

Lastly, I'm off to create a psycho-sexual shelf (I love that). If it is mis-classed as a BDSM book that just means it will draw readers who may not have found it otherwise. That's a win!


message 20: by Riptide Publishing (last edited Oct 06, 2012 01:26PM) (new) - added it

Riptide Publishing LisaT - We Are Qhuay! wrote: "Is book 2 really not going to be released until January? Or do I have that wrong?

I LOVE DOUGIE. I didn't say that in my review, but just had to put it out there.

I'm still pretty ticked about Am..."


Episode 2 comes out on November 5. Then we take a one-month hiatus, and Episode 3 (the first episode of Season 2) starts on January 7. Season 2 runs for four episodes, and they release the first Monday of every month.

And aww, Dougie will appreciate your love; he's hungry for it, the poor dear.

Re: the banning, we're not so thrilled ourselves. Honestly it's mostly just very frustrating because they have hundreds and hundreds of books with titles like "Forced Alien Breeding" that are ten pages long--no story, pure concentrated rape-and-violence wank material (not that there's anything wrong with that; I love me some wank material)--and yet OURS gets banned? I seriously don't even know where to begin with that. And unfortunately, Amazon is responsible for about 80% of the M/M market, which means the book is basically dead in the water. Lots of folks are talking about the banning, but the book isn't actually selling very much because we've lost 80% of our sales and nearly all of our discoverability. And I get the feeling that a ton of folks who might really want to buy the book simply won't because they don't know how to get a non-Amazon purchase onto their Kindle :(

True re: the misclassification, but unfortunately, that also sets up certain expectations, and some people might get really upset.

ETA: This is Rachel. I keep forgetting to log into my own account :-p


Sun Well, I'm buying all my Riptide books directly from the publisher. (Plus you get them a couple days early when released!)

It's not much of a statement, but it's mine to make! :)


Riptide Publishing Susan wrote: "Well, I'm buying all my Riptide books directly from the publisher. (Plus you get them a couple days early when released!)

It's not much of a statement, but it's mine to make! :)"


And we love you for it! :D


Lisa Arbitrary - AttentionIsArbitrary M/M Blog Ah, I was looking at Season 2 rather than Episode 2, wasn't I? I get it now.

Something about this statement makes me really sad...puppet-master:

"And aww, Dougie will appreciate your love; he's hungry for it, the poor dear."

Errrgh, there couldn't be anything easier than ordering and d/ling from Riptide. Does Amazon have a policy for what they base banning a book on? I'd be curious to see that. Still, I'll do my part to spread the word, little as that is. Best of luck with sales. :)


Riptide Publishing LisaT - We Are Qhuay! wrote: "Ah, I was looking at Season 2 rather than Episode 2, wasn't I? I get it now.

Something about this statement makes me really sad...puppet-master:

"And aww, Dougie will appreciate your love; he's h..."


No, Amazon doesn't really have a policy. Jane Davitt did a post about it here where the policy is detailed and we posted the email exchange with them so far: http://janedavitt.livejournal.com/199...

We're glad you find it so easy to order from us :D But your average Kindle owner has never gotten a book from anywhere but Amazon and has never tried. Once you learn, it's super-easy (and even learning's pretty quick), but I totally understand the technology-paralysis that makes learning seem daunting even if it turns out not to be in the end. We're actually doing a little bit about how to sideload your e-reader in our newsletter this week.

Thanks so much for spreading the word--every signal boost helps, and we appreciate it TONS :D


BookAddict  ✒ La Crimson Femme As a reader who reads BDSM from time to time, the reason why I classify it as BDSM is because it plays on the BDSM fantasy side of BDSM. It has very little to do with any of the lifestyle BDSM. Just like most of the romance books I read have nothing to do with RL romance. :)


There are several authors who write in this vein and it's usually found outside of the States. It's hard to come buy and when I find a book which is well written, a plot, character development and extreme BDSM fantasies, I'm a happy camper.

As a completely side note... um, most of the BDSM free story sites have stories lines like this one. Actually, almost all the stories are this way. Very few are indicative of the BDSM subculture of lifestyle. This is purely written for us deviants to get off.


Riptide Publishing ♆ BookAddict wrote: "As a reader who reads BDSM from time to time, the reason why I classify it as BDSM is because it plays on the BDSM fantasy side of BDSM. It has very little to do with any of the lifestyle BDSM. J..."

Heh, fair enough. I definitely look at it as as much of a "BDSM fantasy" ("I" being Rachel who's forgotten to log into her own account again) as it is a psychological thriller/horror. As an author of this piece, my first interest and service is to the character journeys and the tension, but there's no denying the pervy sadist Dom side of me isn't having a blast :) It's a tricky balance though, because pervy-sadist!me is all "Yay, let's choke Mat with a belt while he gets forcibly DPd!" while the Srs Writer side of me is all scolding and stern-faced "No! There's no reason to dwell on that; move on and keep focused on your thriller." So pervy-sadist!me only gets to come out and play when it really serves to move the story forward. In my head, though? It's aaaaaaall there ;-)


BookAddict  ✒ La Crimson Femme Riptide Publishing wrote: "Heh, fair enough. I definitely look at it as as much of a "BDSM fantasy" ("I" being Rachel who's forgotten to log into her own account again) as it is a psychological thriller/horror. As an author of this piece, my first interest and service is to the character journeys and the tension, but there's no denying the pervy sadist Dom side of me isn't having a blast :) It's a tricky balance though, because pervy-sadist!me is all "Yay, let's choke Mat with a belt while he gets forcibly DPd!" while the Srs Writer side of me is all scolding and stern-faced "No! There's no reason to dwell on that; move on and keep focused on your thriller." So pervy-sadist!me only gets to come out and play when it really serves to move the story forward. In my head, though? It's aaaaaaall there ;-) "

lol - pervy-sadist you... hmm, I think I'm in love with pervy-sadist you. Forced DPd? Woohoo!


message 28: by Rachel (new) - added it

Rachel Haimowitz ♆ BookAddict wrote: "lol - pervy-sadist you... hmm, I think I'm in love with pervy-sadist you. Forced DPd? Woohoo! "

LOL :D Man, you are gonna LOVE Episode 6. I'm . . . just gonna leave it at that :-p


BookAddict  ✒ La Crimson Femme Rachel wrote: "♆ BookAddict wrote: "lol - pervy-sadist you... hmm, I think I'm in love with pervy-sadist you. Forced DPd? Woohoo! "

LOL :D Man, you are gonna LOVE Episode 6. I'm . . . just gonna leave it at that..."


*blink blink* Aw, woman, you leave me hanging like this? That is 5 bloody episodes away! *pout*


message 30: by Rachel (new) - added it

Rachel Haimowitz ♆ BookAddict wrote: "Rachel wrote: "♆ BookAddict wrote: "lol - pervy-sadist you... hmm, I think I'm in love with pervy-sadist you. Forced DPd? Woohoo! "

LOL :D Man, you are gonna LOVE Episode 6. I'm . . . just gonna l..."


I *am* a sadist, remember? >;D


BookAddict  ✒ La Crimson Femme Rachel wrote:
I *am* a sadist, remember? >;D

"♆ BookAddict wrote: *blink blink* Aw, woman, you leave me hanging like this? That is 5 bloody episodes away! *pout* "







Lisa Arbitrary - AttentionIsArbitrary M/M Blog Riptide Publishing wrote: "No, Amazon doesn't really have a policy."

I'd say Amazon has no policy. It's at best ridiculous.

Their content guidelines include these words:

--Offensive material. What we deem offensive is probably about what you would expect.

I don't see anything in their guidelines that would prohibit this book, especially when compared to what else they sell. Just crazy.

Okay, I'll move on and just agree with BookAddict, " That is 5 bloody episodes away! *pout*"

0_o


Emily so I was going to wait to buy this until the second one is released in November. Can you purchase a kindle copy off of Ripetide?


BookAddict  ✒ La Crimson Femme Emily wrote: "so I was going to wait to buy this until the second one is released in November. Can you purchase a kindle copy off of Ripetide?"

Yup. I purchase books off of Riptide easily for my Kindle.


Evaine Here's how, from Riptide's latest newsletter:

"Not sure how to upload the books you purchase onsite to your reading device? Want to read The Flesh Cartel on your Kindle but have never shopped outside Amazon?

It's easy to send books purchased directly from Riptide to your reading device, we promise! You can transfer ebook files via your computer (read more about this in our FAQ for Readers section).

If you are a Kindle user, you can use the Send To Kindle app or email the .mobi file to your Kindle's email address! To find your Kindle's email address, grab your Kindle and hit the Home Button. From the Home screen, hit Menu and then select Settings. You should find "Device E-Mail" on that screen.

Have a new or different reader? No problem. Once you purchase a title onsite, you can download any of the ebook file formats from our site an unlimited number of times, so your book can be accessed across all platforms. "


message 36: by Rachel (new) - added it

Rachel Haimowitz ♆ BookAddict wrote: "Rachel wrote:
I *am* a sadist, remember? >;D

"♆ BookAddict wrote: *blink blink* Aw, woman, you leave me hanging like this? That is 5 bloody episodes away! *pout* "

LOL socute!

"



message 37: by Rachel (new) - added it

Rachel Haimowitz LisaT - We Are Qhuay! wrote: "Riptide Publishing wrote: "No, Amazon doesn't really have a policy."

I'd say Amazon has no policy. It's at best ridiculous.

Their content guidelines include these words:

--Offensive material. Wh..."


Yeah, no question about it, but also nothing we can do about it, alas :( Best thing is for people to just keep writing in to complain that the title is missing from their catalog and that their content policy is vague and arbitrary to the point of absurdity and they'll be shopping elsewhere until the issues are addressed. Hopefully that'll at least stop it from happening to anyone else, even if it never gets Flesh Cartel reinstated there.


message 38: by Rachel (new) - added it

Rachel Haimowitz Emily wrote: "so I was going to wait to buy this until the second one is released in November. Can you purchase a kindle copy off of Ripetide?"

Even better, you can purchase the whole season at a discount, here: http://www.riptidepublishing.com/titl...

Then just download the mobi file and follow the instructions Evaine so kindly posted. Amazon also has a help video that covers a couple different ways to get files onto your e-reader in their Kindle help section.


Emily Thank you everyone. I was a little nervous because i have never shopped outside of Amazon ;) I like the idea of purchasing the entire season at once. Thanks.


BookAddict  ✒ La Crimson Femme Emily wrote: "Thank you everyone. I was a little nervous because i have never shopped outside of Amazon ;) I like the idea of purchasing the entire season at once. Thanks."

Let me tell you about my little friend www.fictionwise.com and their lovely discounts. ^_^


Emily Rachel wrote: "Emily wrote: "so I was going to wait to buy this until the second one is released in November. Can you purchase a kindle copy off of Ripetide?"

Even better, you can purchase the whole season at a ..."


so you can purchase the entire season at once? So I can buy it and then load it in November when the last episode of the season comes out? and the same with season 2? I can buy it and then load it when the last episode comes out in April? How many seasons will there be?


message 42: by Heidi (new) - added it

Heidi Belleau Hi Emily! Yes, you can. When you're on the website looking at an episode, there will be a link to the season where you can buy both episodes at once. Once you subscribe to a season, you can download the episodes as they come out, or you can download them when they're all out already. They're available for download whenever you're ready.

As far as we've planned, there will be 5-6 seasons all in all. But that depends. :)


BookAddict  ✒ La Crimson Femme @ Rachel - regarding classification of BDSM Fantasy, here's a little post on it I totally forgot about. You should be able to access it as well as others in the group. Human trafficking Modern Day slavery is on GR. For those not in the group, it's reposted - ***HERE***.


message 44: by Rachel (new) - added it

Rachel Haimowitz ♆ BookAddict wrote: "@ Rachel - regarding classification of BDSM Fantasy, here's a little post on it I totally forgot about. You should be able to access it as well as others in the group. Human trafficking Modern Da..."

Man, that's a depressing thread, but a very interesting one. We did some research into this before writing FC because we did approach it from the angle of writing a horror/thriller (or more specifically, we knew some folks would read it as a horror/thriller, and others as an erotic fantasy) and we wanted a solid factual foundation in that regard (I mean, at least inasmuch as you reasonably can re: structure of the trafficking etc). But it really is depressing :(


BookAddict  ✒ La Crimson Femme Rachel wrote: "Man, that's a depressing thread, but a very interesting one. We did some research into this before writing FC because we did approach it from the angle of writing a horror/thriller (or more specifically, we knew some folks would read it as a horror/thriller, and others as an erotic fantasy) and we wanted a solid factual foundation in that regard (I mean, at least inasmuch as you reasonably can re: structure of the trafficking etc). But it really is depressing :( "

Rachel, it is. One of our mutual GR friends who is in the Navy and did post in that GR post said when out patrolling in the waters, they found human trafficking boats frequently. :(


message 46: by [deleted user] (new)

I am on Book Three and I am hoping things get better for the brothers. I think at this point I did not see BDSM but maybe a horror thrller. I like happy endings and I hope in March Book 6, I will read one there.


message 47: by Heidi (new) - added it

Heidi Belleau Thanks for commenting Ann!

I agree it's a horror thriller but from a very sexualized perspective. I find horror and suspense go really well with sex though (consider the sexual nature of the Alien series for example!), so it works out. :)

I can promise you an eventual not-unhappy conclusion, but probably not in March!


Emily I just finished book 4. So will there be 5 seasons then or 4? Dougie and Mat just break my heart, especially Mat :(


Riptide Publishing There will be five seasons. Season 3 is wrapped and in edits, and seasons 4 and 5 have been plotted out pretty carefully, but it's tough to say sometimes how long something will take, so no firm word yet on how many episodes will be in the last two seasons.


Emily oh cool thanks for the quick response. I am anxious and worried about Dougie and Mat :'( AHHHHHHHHHHHHHh


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