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Joy Division and then New Order were ships that needed captains, but our captains kept on dying on us.
(I have a ritual with my lawyer, Stephen Lea – lovely man. He shows me a piece of paper. I read it, say, ‘What fucking idiot would sign something like that, Stephen?’ He turns it over and says... ‘It’s you again, Hooky!’)
I’m not being big-headed; I’m happy to say if a song is bad. I’ve done a few bad songs in my time. But there weren’t any in Joy Division. Even the shit ones were pretty good.
Our image was a kind of anti-image, about anonymity and being chilly and grey and buttoned-up against the cold.
Rob’s response was, ‘Right, you two. You don’t speak. At all. Just sit there and look menacing.’ He didn’t do it to create a mystique around the band but because he thought we were a couple of cretins. The result was that it created a mystique around the band. Absolute genius.
Not that I’d change anything, mind you. I’d stop Ian hanging himself, obviously. But otherwise I really wouldn’t change anything.
So we insulated ourselves against it by being awkward bastards right from the beginning of any interview. ‘Tell us about your new album.’ ‘No.’ I used to love that. I once did an interview with John Peel’s producer, John Waters. It was for the first Peel session and he said, ‘So, tell us how the session’s going?’ ‘It’s all right.’ And he went, ‘Oh right. Would you like to tell us about your plans?’ ‘No.’ ‘Oh, right.’
Rob was following me and Twinny going, ‘Don’t you nick anything. Don’t you fucking nick anything, you pair of bastards.’
They did a short interview with Tony and Steve. Me and Barney wanted to appear but Rob wouldn’t let us. The words ‘two thick bastards’ were used.
I think the Buzzcocks thought of us as their rough cousins, to whom they couldn’t say no in case they caused trouble, which we were a bit, I suppose.
