Should crime fiction be "safe"? > Likes and Comments

I hear a lot about making certain genres "safe." Since crime itself is not a safe thing, how can crime fiction be "safe"?

As a reader and writer, I don't like safe crime fiction. There are certain topics I don't like to read about or write about, but that's a personal preference. I like getting into the mind of killers, thieves, b ad guys, and the characters that work diligently to stop them. That's fun.

Bobby

Good points, Bobby!

I'm not even sure what safe Crime fiction means... Like Encyclopedia Brown safe? I suppose there's a place for that. But, I'm not very much interested in that... not anymore.

You make it safe with trigger locks, safe words, and kneepads.

Anthony wrote: "You make it safe with trigger locks, safe words, and kneepads."

Oh, I'm sure that's not the direction the 'safe' crowd is interested in!

(Of course, they're not REALLY interested in making crime fiction 'safe,' they just use the zeitgeist to [try to] eliminate competition without actually having to compete; Like a wanna-be blues guitarist going into a club in the early 1950s and, before playing a single note on the guitar, accusing Muddy Waters of being a communist and hoping old Mr. Waters will apologize for having done nothing wrong and leave the stage without challenging them to a six-string duel that would expose their lack of talent)

Big difference between intending offense, and just taking offense. Just because someone takes offense doesn't mean the person who said/did something should have to apologize.

Also, it SUCKS that Ralph Macchio used classical music to beat Steve Vai, who could play circles around Vivaldi.

I agree on both comments. Crossroads is quite an artifact.

I don’t even know what “unsafe fiction” would be. The book rapes your asshole? Kills your mother? You read it, and you die?

Alec wrote: "I hear a lot about making certain genres "safe." Since crime itself is not a safe thing, how can crime fiction be "safe"?"

I don't think the context here is "safe" as in the characters are safe from harm, which, as you questioned, would be ludicrous. An oxymoron.
This is about censorship. It's about a faction of the writing community imposing their values through social media pressure. It's about blackballing authors who don't conform to an ever-changing set of rules expressed at hashtags. It's about creating enough fear from blowback that agents and publishers become increasing risk averse.
Could a 40-year-old Elmore Leonard get an agent today? What about James Ellroy? Would they be welcome at Boucheron? If invited to speak on a panel, would there be a boycott?

You're correct. The backlash to this Salem reboot can't being soon enough.

Sebastian wrote: "I don’t even know what “unsafe fiction” would be. The book rapes your asshole? Kills your mother? You read it, and you die?"

Exactly. I guess if a book is really heavy and you leave it on the high shelf and it falls on your head, that's a risk.

This morning I read that there's some outrage about a pilot signing off with "Let's Go Brandon," even though the outraged merrily said "Fuck Trump" constantly for four years with a giggle.

That's kind of what I think about seeing the tweets from the "writing community" sometimes (although I avoid most of them now). They want to dictate what's "acceptable" naughty or criminal behavior according to a narrow checklist of political and cultural values. And they obviously know one of the best ways of doing that it to grab hold of language and force us to bend with it.

Anyway, I don't want to shut down discussion, debate, words and phrasings, situations, etc in crime fiction from all sides of the political divide. I just care if it's a good story with characters I care about. Happy to read about things that challenge me.

Agree with you completely, Neil. I find it absolutely confounding that writers—people who 'create'—are explicitly trying to shut down free expression and thought. Makes zero sense. The immature conflation of content with intent is a basic mistake in analysis and thought. But worse is their assertion that anybody who may not adhere to their strict, religious bindings of 'new' language and rigid political ideals is an evil person to be canceled...I wonder where or it this'll stop because it seems to be multiplying. And, yeah, social media seems to be the main conduit for this multiplying set of religion-like behaviors.

Sounds like all of us are on the same page.

Did any of you read THIS today? I can't make out if it's serious or parody. It's almost like she's saying that if she followed all the woke rules, she wouldn't have had much of a novel. But she seems serious. Huh? https://crimereads.com/a-crime-noveli...

I don't know...Seems serious to me—like truly asking for forgiveness? But still trying to sell the book? I mean...It's available in multiple territories and languages so...If it means that much to you—pull the book and un-publish it? Give all your royalties to those you deem injured by your story?

I mean, it's like a checklist. Every possible thing that makes up the story is "problematic"? That why I wonder if it's an elaborate joke.

I had this book on my wishlist until I read this.

Anthony wrote: "Did any of you read THIS today? I can't make out if it's serious or parody. It's almost like she's saying that if she followed all the woke rules, she wouldn't have had much of a novel. But she see..."

I confess she bored the tits off me and I fell asleep while reading her list.
I further confess that I'd rather pour bleach in my eyes than read the book mentioned.
I confess that I think it's all an elaborate sales schtick
I also confess that maybe 85% of the crimereads articles in their regular newsletter don't really interest me.
I further confess that I'm feeling grumpy today.

Anthony wrote: "I mean, it's like a checklist. Every possible thing that makes up the story is "problematic"? That why I wonder if it's an elaborate joke.

I had this book on my wishlist until I read this."

Hear hear!

Anthony wrote: "Did any of you read THIS today? I can't make out if it's serious or parody. It's almost like she's saying that if she followed all the woke rules, she wouldn't have had much of a novel. But she see..."

That has to be satire. I can't believe she's being serious.

I confess... I couldn't make it through her whole essay

Alec wrote: "Sebastian wrote: "I don’t even know what “unsafe fiction” would be. The book rapes your asshole? Kills your mother? You read it, and you die?"

Exactly. I guess if a book is really heavy and you le..."

I lost three cousins that way. Libraries are very dangerous right below coal mines.

It's a no-so-funny thing, the descriptive elements of crime mysteries. I don't care much for the harsh details of some writers and, in fact, I avoid many popular authors who use that gimmick for that very reason.... the same as I avoid the erotic scenes that describe what goes on under the sheets.
I get it. He raped and killed my mother, all I got to see was her moldering corpse.
I don't need any more details. I get it and I am pissed off and want to find the bad guy and do what needs to be done.
I don't sanitize my work. Believe me when I say, gruesome can be found in what I write but there are lines I prefer not to cross for any number of reasons, not the least of which is that those descriptive elements, 'unthinkable gore' negatively effects the human spirit, leaving an indelible print on the brain that this is somehow okay.
I want my work to be vastly entertaining. I've found ways to write my stories of crime and murder without the blow, by blow details of the brain matter, pieces of the skull and hair in the pool of blood. Some readers and writers think those element are necessary to a good story but not this author.
I think the heart pounding in the chest, the threat of what is about to happen, the floorboard that creaks at exactly the wrong moment, the deranged antagonist that's creeping up behind the protagonist all go to create enough tension to drive the story without the gore.

James wrote: "Alec wrote: "Sebastian wrote: "I don’t even know what “unsafe fiction” would be. The book rapes your asshole? Kills your mother? You read it, and you die?"

Exactly. I guess if a book is really hea..."

These things aren't talked about on the news and I wonder why...

Don wrote: "Could a 40-year-old Elmore Leonard get an agent today? What about James Ellroy? Would they be welcome at Boucheron? If invited to speak on a panel, would there be a boycott?"

Hell no on both accounts. Are you kidding? They would have blown into into slut shameness over Rum Punch, accusing Leonard of being a misogynist. His books would be as infamous as The Confederacy Of Dunces.

Anthony wrote: "Did any of you read THIS today? I can't make out if it's serious or parody. It's almost like she's saying that if she followed all the woke rules, she wouldn't have had much of a novel. But she see..."

I confess I didn't read it until November 11.
I confess that it bored me to fucking tears.
I confess that this is the type of woke Karenesque writer that I would never know about unless you guys told me about it.
I confess that I love everything this chick hates.
I confess that it's female writers like her that give female writers like me a bad name after overexplaining her decisions about "Tropes".

I confess this chick is going to hate me when my novel comes out.

Tia wrote: "Anthony wrote: "Did any of you read THIS today? I can't make out if it's serious or parody. It's almost like she's saying that if she followed all the woke rules, she wouldn't have had much of a no..."

Let's make sure she gets a copy of your book.

Alec wrote: "Tia wrote: "Anthony wrote: "Did any of you read THIS today? I can't make out if it's serious or parody. It's almost like she's saying that if she followed all the woke rules, she wouldn't have had ..."

I confess this gives me a considerable amount of joy thinking about it.

Hello everyone, please be kind to me:

At the risk of being cancelled, blacklisted, talked about in dark corners (please don't): is 'safe' another word for 'inclusive enough' 'diverse enough' 'progressive enough'?

Is that one of the reasons why some author's decide to self-publish?

I'm told that nowadays, publishers, the film set, the tv crews, insist on levering in a gay/lesbian angle to a true story from years gone by that in truth had no such entanglements. If the word entanglement offends, I'm so, so, sorry: I believe democracy insists on my ability to use the words I believe are appropriate and be 'safe' in accepting the risk of it causing offence.

ABSOLUTELY NOT!! I want the grit, I want the violence, I want the spicy scenes.