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message 1: by Terry (last edited Mar 25, 2020 03:42AM) (new)

Terry This may all be a hoax and here's why. The numbers make NO sense.

https://www.statnews.com/2020/03/17/a...


message 2: by Doug (new)

Doug Trani This is a well-reasoned article by a professor at Stanford University that addresses the need for more data, which could be obtained through more testing. Almost everyone agrees that more testing is needed. However, nowhere in the article did I see Ioannidis state that the numbers make "No sense", nor does he refer to the pandemic as a hoax. Just to be clear, both conclusions appear to be your spin on the article. Harari also made a point of the trillions and trillions of opportunities this virus has for mutation, something that was not addressed in the article you posted by Ioannidis. The more people who are infected, the greater the probability that an even more virulent strain of the virus will evolve. That could prove catastrophic. This is an interesting article, Terry, and I am glad you posted it. It might help a lot of people take a deep breath and calm down. However, this pandemic is not a hoax and there is a lot we can do to mitigate the extent of the crisis by working cooperatively with medical and scientific experts in other countries around the world.


message 3: by Terry (last edited Mar 26, 2020 12:11PM) (new)

Terry Doug

Thanks so much for your feedback.

For the sake of good order, I said that it' may be- a hoax but it is impossible to determine without reliable facts and data rather than speculation and hearsay,

Second, it may be a matter of semantics but without reliable data then no decision anyone makes can make sense - that's the implicit argument.

At the end of the day, what the professor is saying is - that only problem with common sense is = it is just not so common


message 4: by Oliver (new)

Oliver Well said. It's interesting to see the contrast between those calling for greater global collaboration - as you have - versus those calling for greater isolation (in the more populist corners of various Western countries). I believe that global institutions like the WHO can play an important role in leading a global "what did we learn?" analysis for whenever the next pandemic happens. Suspect it'll highlight how lack of communication and collaboration is where the greatest mistakes happened in the current crisis.


message 5: by Terry (new)

Terry Oliver wrote: "Well said. It's interesting to see the contrast between those calling for greater global collaboration - as you have - versus those calling for greater isolation (in the more populist corners of va..."

Don't expect the WHO or by other global institutions to solve this problem and here's why.

Ignoring the immediate concerns of the current virus, albeit others should also follow long-term - both the current and future viruses can be clearly tied to the core issues we face.

https://youtu.be/Fqw-9yMV0sI

Overpopulation

Biosphere destruction

Resource depletion

Climate change


These can then be connected back to Adam Smith's - Wealth of Nations https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ The_Wealth_of_Nations and its premise that an Invisible Hand can guide infinite economic growth in the finite context of this planet. Economics, since inception, thus chose to ignore physics, nature and the impact of exponentials. As we know, infinite exponential industrial growth is unsustainable because at the end of the day - Nature Bats Last. - and we are running out of time.
https://www.resilience.org/stories/co...

A study by MIT in 1972 affirms that we ultimately face Limits to Growth and we are on target with their models.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lim...

In the end, economists are madmen believing that their abstractions can overcome the laws of physics, mathematics, and nature. Utterly insane. But still, I believe we are not evil and it is not really our fault - as we are just simply acting in accordance with the laws of the universe - as Paul Chefurka points out in his blog post - Paradise Lost.
http://endofenergy.blogspot.com/2014/...

I make reference to Chris Clugston's recent book - BLIP - that pretty much summarizes our predicament and also acts to affirm MIT's Limits to Growth models. https://youtu.be/cdXdaIsfio8%20-

Meaning we need a new paradigm in Economics based on the constraints of physics, nature, and exponentials. whereby, it focuses solely on the - WEALTH OF PLANETS - without the absurd national interest of an "Invisible Hand" and similar economic abstractions invented and applied, since Adam Smith's original work.

Collectively these economic abstractions and constructs have set the stage - for not only, the destructive 200 Years Industrial Age, but also the possible near-term extinction of our species.


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