Urban Fantasy discussion

129 views
OTHER TOPICS > Question for Writers

Comments Showing 1-50 of 51 (51 new)    post a comment »
« previous 1

message 1: by Jessie (new)

Jessie (jessiekowski) | 20 comments I've only just started writing my first novel, and I've got a couple of questions on how to keep it organized. I've just been typing it all into Microsoft Word, but I've run into two issues. The first is that I sometimes jump around, which means I have a bunch of scattered documents. The second is that when I do write in the correct order, the document gets so big that it's hard to navigate.

I'd just like to know what methods of writing other people have, or if anyone at all has a suggestion.

Thank you!


message 2: by Charles (new)

Charles Verhey (charlesverhey) | 11 comments Every writer has his or her own style of writing. Some start from the beginning and just write, others put everything on index cards first then shuffle and write in pieces. You'll have to find a style that works best for you, and the only way to really do that is practice and experience.

But if you're looking for a writing tool better than Word, might I suggest my favorite - Scrivener.

http://www.literatureandlatte.com/scr...

It's so much better than Word because it's designed specifically for writers, has all the tools you need to keep yourself organized, and is flexible to bend to your writing style rather than you having to change your writing style to fit a software program. I've tried out about a dozen other "writing programs for authors" and nothing even comes close. I love it. You might too.


message 3: by Susan (last edited Aug 11, 2012 08:42AM) (new)

Susan Stec (thegratefulundead) | 95 comments Jessie, it's difficult to stay organized sometimes and can be overwhelming. More importantly each change creates a domino effect and you will end up with a big mess sooner than later. LOL Been there.
Okay, first things first. I strongly recommend you back up all your files on an external hard drive. I also recommend you create one folder for each book which includes everything; research doc's, pictures, notes, everything.

Next suggestion would be to write the whole story THEN go in and make changes. If this doesn't work for you, try an outline or summary. An outline doesn't work for me because my characters always lead my writing. What I mean is, I just write and the story goes where they take it. I start with two things: A plot (which often changes before I'm a third of the way through the book), and an ending (which never changes). I basically head toward the ending and what happens in between is always a surprise. However, many of my fellow writers find outlines extremely helpful.

As far as jumping around and the scattered documents, I keep everything in one document (except for research), but title each chapter. I use a song or a quote or a brief summary (which I later take out) so I know what the chapter is about. It's easier to find what you're looking for and easier later to move them around in the full MS. But once again, any changes, even minor ones, can reach back and bite you in the butt later.

Hope that helps.
Susan


message 4: by Jessie (new)

Jessie (jessiekowski) | 20 comments Charles wrote: "Every writer has his or her own style of writing. Some start from the beginning and just write, others put everything on index cards first then shuffle and write in pieces. You'll have to find a ..."

I read all the reviews for different writing software, and according to those, I ended up with Write Way. That was a mistake. It has all the typing capabilities of Notepad. But I'll definitely check this one out. It's nice to hear about a product directly from someone.


message 5: by Jessie (new)

Jessie (jessiekowski) | 20 comments Davi wrote: "I don't know about anyone else, but I make two drafts before I hand it to an editor. In the first draft, I just start telling the story, regardless of how lengthy it can get. The second draft is wh..."

I do the exact same thing with the two drafts, but what medium do you use? Do you just type 100 pages into Word, or what?


message 6: by Jessie (new)

Jessie (jessiekowski) | 20 comments Susan wrote: "Jessie, it's difficult to stay organized sometimes and can be overwhelming. More importantly each change creates a domino effect and you will end up with a big mess sooner than later. LOL Been ther..."

That was a huge help! I've only ever written short stories before, which are pretty straight forward, so when I decided on this novel, I thought I'd just sit down and write it, beginning to end. But I guess first I had to learn more about my characters, so I just wrote scenes I thought they might be involved in, and those told me who my characters really were. And of course, the plot has changed quite a few times, too.


message 7: by Rob (new)

Rob Osterman (robosterman) | 5 comments My first novel I sat down and I wrote, beginning to end, single pass. I had a rough idea of some "scenes" but I wrote in a fairly linear fashion. Then I went back and added a few new scenes, and cut a few but really did not change the over arcing stories.

For my current project I'm still trying to do a linear write-through. I am also doing, as you noted, the character vinettes but I'm not making those scenes part of the story. Instead I'm writing them as individual short stories to be enjoyed on their own either as free website offerings, as bonus material in the eBook edition, or whatever.

For writing I almost work exclusively in Google Documents. You can do a 'backup' to a local hard drive whenever you feel you need to and you can get to your files anytime and anywhere there's an internet connection. I can also 'share' the files with Beta Readers and my editor (great guy; I am happy to share his email) and they can make comments right in the file so I don't play the "Version dance"


message 8: by J.P. (new)

J.P. McLean (jpmclean) I, too, am a new writer and struggle with these same issues. Much of the advice I've read here rings true to me - especially that everyone has a different way of writing.

The first book I wrote was the most cumbersome in terms of keeping it organized because I hadn't yet settled in. I hadn't yet decided if an outline would work for me and how to deal with all the budding story ideas. Now I have a much better idea of how I write and how to keep myself organized.

Like Susan, I back everything up. I open a folder for each book and keep everything in there. Each piece of research gets its own document so I can find it quickly.

I also keep two other handy documents. One is a list of the characters and places. It includes their names, physical descriptions, personality and quirks. The other document is a time-line. It's not the book's timeline, but a calendar timeline for the story. This document became necessary for me because my books, like a lot of others, don't start at the beginning. I needed a reference to be sure that events were reasonably timed. For example, if character A gets a black eye on Jan 1, I want to be sure when I mention the injury again on Jan 4, that the stage of healing is consistent with when the injury occurred. This document can also tweak setting because it's a calender so you can use the seasons to add description to your story e.g. hot, cold, rainy, sunny.

These are a few of the things that helped me. Good luck.


message 9: by Jessie (new)

Jessie (jessiekowski) | 20 comments Rob wrote: "My first novel I sat down and I wrote, beginning to end, single pass. I had a rough idea of some "scenes" but I wrote in a fairly linear fashion. Then I went back and added a few new scenes, and ..."

Most of my vignettes won't be used in the final product, either, but I think I'll keep up the practice in later books. It's incredibly helpful.

About your editor, I would absolutely love his information and to talk to you more about this.

Thank you!


message 10: by Nakeesha (new)

Nakeesha (ninkey) Charles wrote: "Every writer has his or her own style of writing. Some start from the beginning and just write, others put everything on index cards first then shuffle and write in pieces. You'll have to find a ..."

I highly recommend Scrivener. Its AWEsome!


message 11: by Rob (new)

Rob Osterman (robosterman) | 5 comments "One is a list of the characters and places. It includes their names, physical descriptions, personality and quirks. "

I'm doing that too for Mind the Thorns. Actually as I introduce and describe characters I copy and paste those descriptions into another file so I can look it up again. The downside of writing as readers want you to write is that you can't plan TOO far in advance.


message 12: by Susan (new)

Susan Stec (thegratefulundead) | 95 comments J.P. wrote: "I, too, am a new writer and struggle with these same issues. Much of the advice I've read here rings true to me - especially that everyone has a different way of writing.

The first book I wrote..."

Yes, J.P. I do keep a list taped next to my computer screen with character's names, descriptions and other comments. Also a hand written book with funny lines for some of the characters; names, random thoughts, or story ideas also go into the spiral notebook. The sections are labeled with tabs. It sits by my computer.

Time lines? Oh God, what a horror for me no matter what the purpose. I think my characters meet with my muse nightly in order to totally destroy any written guidelines I've established.
My first attempt at writing was horrible!--140,000 words of crap that I finally whittled down to just over 70,000. But I learned a lot in those two years–writing and editing, and cutting, querying, then rewriting and requerying, and then editing again. Then you get it out there and you end up with the editor's edits to deal with. LOLOL The process is much easier now that I have mastered my 'own style of writing' as Charles mentioned.
Susan


message 13: by Susan (last edited Aug 11, 2012 10:38AM) (new)

Susan Stec (thegratefulundead) | 95 comments Jessie wrote: "Rob wrote: "My first novel I sat down and I wrote, beginning to end, single pass. I had a rough idea of some "scenes" but I wrote in a fairly linear fashion. Then I went back and added a few new ..."

I think a good editor is the most important thing you can do for your finished novel--for me a lesson just learned. I myself can never see all the errors in my own work. I'm too close to my characters. But finding the right editor is a personal thing. One who is excellent with another's work may not be with yours. I think this is somewhat genre related, but also what is comfortable for each writer.
Susan


message 14: by Armand (new)

Armand (armand-i) | 43 comments One thing that has worked for me is to write the first draft until it's done (as many others have suggested- this seems to be key, even if there are all kinds of plot holes) then go through and read the whole thing in (roughly) chronological order, making edits as I go.

Then I pull it apart and do a third revision where I follow each major character's story individually (this won't work if your story only follows one person or is in person). Following each character in print- from start to finish- really lets you fine-tune their story line and fill in any plot holes (and add a nice dash of continuity)

As I go through each redraft, I have two other documents. One is a list of names, places and specific events. It usually simple stuff like: "Joe Smith- speaks Russian, guy on boat" or whatever, but very handy if you have a large cast. It could also be a key detail: "Lost key is brass, called "Key of Areon""

The second document is what I call me BTI list- BTI is Big Ticket Items- which is my slang for stuff that I want to double check or change or add across the entire draft, but it's something that I can fix autonomously, and therefore handled better as a separate task. . I usually tackle the BTI items after the draft has ended.

If that doesn't make sense, here's an example, as I was going through the third draft of my novel, I wrote (on the BTI list)- "Make weather consistent"- when I wrote my first draft, I had no idea what time of year it was, but by my third draft, I wanted the first half of the novel to take place in the early fall. So, after I finished the third draft for plot, errors etc, I quickly went through and either a) changed descriptions to match early fall in New England or b) added details that fit the time of year (for example, added a description of someone wearing a sweater or a description of someone turning up the heat in their car).

I find that keeping a BTI list llows me to draft faster because I can focus more on language and smoothing out the plot, knowing that I can fix a lot of technical details in fast passes later.

Also, in my opinion, generally keep your chapter short 6-12 pages.

Finally, I want to add that I was terrified of novel writing when I first started and I used to keep all kinds of notes (at one point I tried making a synopsis for each chapter right after I wrote it) but in the end, simply working on it a lot trumped everything else. After a while, the novel is like a house you live in and you start to remember a lot of it without trying hard.

OK- one last idea- as you write your novel, start writing your agent query letter and a one paragraph and one-two page synopsis too. I found that it took me a very long time (and tons of redrafts) to get a query letter and synopsis that I felt both honestly represented my book as well as making it sound interesting to agents and publishers.

The other nice thing about creating a synopsis from the get go is that it forces you to reckon with what your story and conflict is really about. Clever writing won't save you there. At the end of the day, you'll be forced to clearly explain what's at stake for your protagonist.

sorry for typos- it's late!


message 15: by Armand (new)

Armand (armand-i) | 43 comments actually, I echoed some of the stuff noted above- sorry for redundancy.


message 16: by Jenny (new)

Jenny | 20 comments Like a number of others mentioned here when I'm writing on my novel I do the entire first draft first. Tried outline but doesn't really work for me. I write with a partner and we do a lot of talking about how we want the direction to go. Not really an outline per say but we are writing a series and we have lots of information for the rest of the books.
We also have a huge cast of characters, at this point every time we add another character we outline alot of things for them from height, weight, hair colour, etc, to what their job is, favorite drink, favorite junk food, to things that happened in the past that may effect their actions within their novel. We have been using word, but honsetly it is frustrating with the grammer correction stuff. Seeing the for Scrivener, it looks very interesting, we will have to check it out.
We are working to get our first novel editted for publishing. What we did was write the whole thing, we had already discussed alot of what where we wanted to go with the novel. then I start writing and the characters always tell me where they want to go. I've tried to make them work for what I want and it never works. They dicate where they want to go not the other way around.
I also keep everything for each story in a file folder, then each time we make major changes we make a new file and number them. It's not great but so far it seems to be working at least until we figure another way that's better. Don't think I really gave you any real help, but wish you the best with your writing.


message 17: by Chris (new)

Chris Ward (chriswardfictionwriter) | 3 comments Just write it in Word and use an Excel spreadsheet to keep a note of all the chapters, the word count of each, the characters involved in each, etc. No need for any complicated programs. People used to just write with a pen and paper. Simple is often best.

As for planning, I tend to plan three or four chapters ahead, but even then thats just a couple of lines of what I want to happen in each one. When I wrote Tube Riders I probably got up to about 100k words bofore I even had an idea of the end, but it was easy to write because I always knew what was supposed to happen in the next 10k or so. It gets easier with practice. My first two or three novels were written freeform and they're all over the place.


message 18: by Scott (new)

Scott Moon (scottmoon) | 44 comments I usually start writing without an outline, though I have written a couple of novels where I did a scene by scene outline in Excel first. I used a separate Excel tab for characters, another for research, and so on. I try to write a one sentence story description, a one paragraph description, and the detailed scene outline. Sometimes I write the entire manuscript and the read it as I identify each scene and place them in a spreadsheet.

All of the other posters have some great ideas and I may look into Scrivner; it looks interesting. However, I use Word to format documents for Kindle, so I will probably stick with that.

Like others in this post, I have copied everything about one character into a separate document and found this a useful exercise.

The spreadsheet and/ or written notes really help, but after awhile, the big issues come easier during each revision.

Good luck with your novel.


message 19: by Michelle (new)

Michelle | 1 comments I am also a new writer, and I have some experience attempting to use tabbed documents in Word for my first novel. This was too cumbersome and clunky for me.
Luckily found Scrivener was discussed widely among writers forums, so I looked into it. It is such a great value for what it offers- check out the tutorial videos. It's very easy to use. My fave features: separate folders within the same "file" for characters, places, research, etc., the fact that you can embed links to your other notes within in any of your notes- helps keep track of foreshadowing, etc.
But then again I am one for organization and outlines. To each their own!
Good luck with finding what works for you.


message 20: by Tyhitia (last edited Aug 29, 2012 10:37AM) (new)

Tyhitia | 40 comments Hi Jesse,

Every writer has their own process, so you will eventually find what works best for you. I've written a lot in Word and haven't had any problems.

For me, I get the bones (1st draft) of the story out first. I print it out because I catch things I wouldn't by reading it on my computer. I take notes as I go along about plot holes, major issues, etc. Then I go back and write the 2nd draft, correcting the major problems.

Honestly, any published writer/author can tell you that you will write the same novel/story SEVERAL times before you even send it to your beta readers, much less an agent.

My friend Kalayna Price has her revision process listed on her blog and it's worked for me, although I altered it a bit. The process starts with the 2nd draft because the 1st draft is just the bones. But check it out if you'd like:

http://kalayna.blogspot.com/2009/12/r...

http://kalayna.blogspot.com/2009/12/r...

http://kalayna.blogspot.com/2009/12/r...

I may have added a bit more than you asked, but I'm sure it'll help down the road! ;)


message 21: by Kevin (last edited Aug 30, 2012 05:25AM) (new)

Kevin (kevinhallock) | 36 comments I always create an outline first, even for short stories. It helps me frame the story arcs, characters. For a novel, I often end up writing additional character-focused stories so I can understand them better, but usually after the first draft of the novel is finished. I always write too little, so my first draft is usually half the length of the final draft, so I continue to revise (six times for my first novel) until I think it's ready to take to the editorial stage.

PS - I do everything in MS Word.


message 22: by Jessie (new)

Jessie (jessiekowski) | 20 comments Armand wrote: "One thing that has worked for me is to write the first draft until it's done (as many others have suggested- this seems to be key, even if there are all kinds of plot holes) then go through and rea..."

Wow. I already have an exact folder and process for every single document you mentioned. Awesome.


message 23: by Michelle (new)

Michelle Scott (michellescottfiction) | 721 comments Mod
As everyone has already said, writers have a variety of ways to keep themselves organized. I like to put every chapter into a separate document so that I am not struggling with a huge document.

Also, whatever you do, *be sure to backup your work*!! I can't tell you the number of times I've lost work because it didn't save properly. I like to keep every week in its own folder. That way, if I accidentally delete something in a document, I have the previous week's writing to restore the deletion.

Best of luck! :)


message 24: by Ms. Nikki (last edited Sep 10, 2012 05:05PM) (new)

Ms. Nikki (miznikki) | 54 comments I have some questions. I am writing my first book and scenes of my characters just come to me. I write them down, but when I try to make them cohesive I get stuck. It's like I just fade to black and appear somewhere else. Is there a lesson to help me with this? Is there some way to practice? Also, I know I need an ending, but my mind just won't let me do it. I blank out. Part of the problem might be that I want to write a trilogy and don't quit grasp what I need to do to accomplish this. I tried to make an outline and wasted 3 hrs researching. I felt like I was in high school again. Also, is there a word count to try and read each day? Any suggestions would be great as this is a huge deal to me.


message 25: by Michelle (new)

Michelle Scott (michellescottfiction) | 721 comments Mod
Nikki wrote: "I have some questions. I am writing my first book and scenes of my characters just come to me. I write them down, but when I try to make them cohesive I get stuck. It's like I just fade to black a..."

First off, congrats on starting a book!! I find starting a new project can be frightening, and I've been doing it for a while, lol.

First off, don't ever think of spending time on your book as 'wasting' time! Even if you are doing something like research for an outline, you are thinking about your story, and that's a good thing. There is no direct route from A to B when writing a book. It's more like detour after detour after detour!

Endings...don't worry about the ending (yet). Let your story breathe. Let your characters off their leashes and explore your world a little. Believe me, every story I write ends up as one thing and turns out to be something else. It happens to *every* writer! After you write the rough draft you will edit, edit, edit! Editing is the time for you to make sure your story and characters cohesive.

Writing a trilogy...that is very ambitious. If you think your plot is simply too complex for a single book, then a trilogy might be the answer. But, for now, try to focus on book one without worrying about the others. The key is to not let yourself become overwhelmed.

Finally, about the daily word count...I think it's good to try and write every day, but only you can come up with a personal writing challenge. Personally, I log hours rather than words. I try to write about 4 -6 hours a day (8+ if I am lucky), but I've been writing for about 25 years. Back when I was staring off, I'd try for an hour or two every other day. Some days would be more, and some less.


Let me recommend a couple of amazing books for you. These books have given me a lot of wonderful advice about writing.



Writing to Sell by Scott Meredith Writing the Breakout Novel by Donald Maass


message 26: by Ms. Nikki (new)

Ms. Nikki (miznikki) | 54 comments Thanks you so much, Michelle L. Sometimes it's easy to get sidetracked and forget what's important. I'll be sure to check out your recs.


message 27: by Michelle (new)

Michelle Scott (michellescottfiction) | 721 comments Mod
Nikki wrote: "Thanks you so much, Michelle L. Sometimes it's easy to get sidetracked and forget what's important. I'll be sure to check out your recs."

Best of luck!


message 28: by Ms. Nikki (new)

Ms. Nikki (miznikki) | 54 comments Thanks :)


message 29: by D.C. (new)

D.C. Farmer (dcfarmer) | 5 comments Jesse,

Practical help.

A great way to keep organised and not be overwhelmed is with Scrivener. This is by far and away the best software there is (IMHO) and I would now not be without it. It lets you write by scene and chapter if you want. It saves everything automatically too. I would also recommend David Hewson's book--writing a novel with scrivener--he has a brilliant template which is my starting point for everything.

Oh, and by the way, I am a very basic outliner who vomits up the first draft by illegible hand with a fine tipped pen on lined paper. Then it all goes in to scrivener a chunk at a time. That first draft on scrivener is where the real work begins---but the rewriting is all fun compared with the handwritten FIRST DRAFT!!!! aaargh.

best of luck,

DCF


message 30: by Yzabel (new)

Yzabel Ginsberg (yzabelginsberg) | 28 comments Speaking of Scrivener (which I absolutely dig, especially for the project I've been working on in the past months), if any of you has taken part in, and won, NaNoWriMo in 2011, Scriv's price is cut by 50% for you until the end of the month, if I remember well. That's how I got my own copy this year.


message 31: by Ms. Nikki (new)

Ms. Nikki (miznikki) | 54 comments Great suggestions. I'm test driving Scrivener now and it is very helpful after you get through all the tutorials. I love the push-pin board :)


message 32: by GhostlyAspect (new)

GhostlyAspect | 1 comments Great information! Thank you! :)


message 33: by Ms. Nikki (new)

Ms. Nikki (miznikki) | 54 comments Has anyone ever had a problem writing 1st person and not being able to distance yourself from your character/s?


message 34: by Michelle (new)

Michelle Scott (michellescottfiction) | 721 comments Mod
Nikki wrote: "Has anyone ever had a problem writing 1st person and not being able to distance yourself from your character/s?"

The biggest problem I have with first person is getting rid of all the extraneous 'I's'. For example, "I thought..." or "I saw..." The temptation is to narrate every move the character makes.


message 35: by Ms. Nikki (new)

Ms. Nikki (miznikki) | 54 comments Michelle L. wrote: "Nikki wrote: "Has anyone ever had a problem writing 1st person and not being able to distance yourself from your character/s?"

The biggest problem I have with first person is getting rid of all th..."


Definitely. I usually end up with lots of fragmented sentences. Good thing she's hip and there's action. And she talks to herself.
Instead of, "I breathe and turn the corner." it's "You can do it. Just breathe and turn the corner."


message 36: by Michelle (new)

Michelle Scott (michellescottfiction) | 721 comments Mod
Nikki wrote: "Michelle L. wrote: "Nikki wrote: "Has anyone ever had a problem writing 1st person and not being able to distance yourself from your character/s?"

The biggest problem I have with first person is g..."


Exactly! Those sentence fragments disturb me because I'm a grammar teacher, but I grit my teeth and do it anyway!


message 37: by Gordon (new)

Gordon Gross | 2 comments As all before me have said, everybody's different. If you're having trouble navigating a big file because you work on chapter 4, then 17, then 11... then make chapter bunches. 1-4, 5-8, etc. That'll let you work on segments of your book, and you can stuff them into the main book document as you finish the segments and tie them together.

I use Word (or OfficeLibre)so it doesn't do fancy writer stuff like Scrivener, but so far I haven't needed them. I do have quite a few Word docs for outlines, sentence or idea collections (that haven't fit in so far but are too good to delete) and the like. I'm sure it would drive some non-ADD people batty, but it works for me.

Do what works for you. Just as there's no correct way to grade poetry, there's no correct method to work through the drafts of your novel. If one big doc messes you up and causes you to lose your train of thought, then break it up. If you don't like having a bunch of stuff in various Word docs, then invest in Scrivener.

It's your brain, and your work. I wouldn't tell a painter how to store and distribute their brushes and paints while they work - your method of attacking the canvas is yours.

Just find a method that allows you to get out of your own way and put the best work on screen that you can.

~G


message 38: by Annetta (new)

Annetta Ribken (msnetta) | 5 comments Gordon's 100% correct. There's no one "right way" or "wrong way" to write a book. There's only YOUR way. The trouble is finding THE way which works the best for you.

I've tried index cards, post-it notes, mind maps, different software, you name it. What works for me is having a black notebook devoted to the current story. I'm a pantser by nature, but if you're writing an epic story or a series, it's really easy to get off track.

So, I have the end game in sight. I use plot points (nothing too detailed) anywhere from two to four chapters ahead, always keeping basic story structure in mind, then pantser my way from plot point to plot point. It works pretty well for me, but again, you have to find the way that works the best for your brain.

I also find using a style sheet to keep track of characters, locations, etc. to be really helpful, especially in a longer work. That way you don't have to search the manuscript on how you spelled names, etc. It's also a great tool to share with your editor.

Confession: I'm addicted to yellow legal pads.


message 39: by Tanjlisa (new)

Tanjlisa Marie (tanjlisamarie) | 5 comments It was very interesting reading how other writers write. I write straight through so these other methods are foreign to me. I do bounce around computers though so I know what you mean about trying to figure out which document you used last. I use MS Word and what I do is put the date in the header (make sure it doesn't update automatically). This way I know which version of the document I updated most recently. Hope that helps.


message 40: by Penny (new)

Penny Greenhorn Nikki wrote: "I have some questions. I am writing my first book and scenes of my characters just come to me. I write them down, but when I try to make them cohesive I get stuck. It's like I just fade to black a..."

This is probably the most annoying advice ever, but I suggest you read more. If you think your novel would make a successful trilogy, then think of your favorite trilogies, think of what worked or maybe didn't work in those books. The internet is a great tool, goodreads in particular is amazing, but the best place to look is in a book. Just read more.
(Please don't punch me in the face, I know my advice doesn't qualify as particularly insightful.)


message 41: by Ms. Nikki (new)

Ms. Nikki (miznikki) | 54 comments No, Penny. I was told the same thing a couple of times now. I have taken a time out from writing (hit a brick wall with reinforced steel) and studying to really examine the intricacies of a trilogy. When I read, I don't necessarily remember unless it catches my attention. I'm also finding it hard to have my characters talk to each other when they are in groups (they are sorta on a crime fighting team so it's unavoidable). It feels forced and one C is left floundering. It is also a pet peeve of mine when writers become too wordy. I'm not a chatty Cathy, more of a get to the point and move on type of person, and I think it is really having an adverse effect on my writing. There is a method to my madness. I just haven't found it yet. Read more it is! Thank you for all your suggestions :)


message 42: by Kevin (new)

Kevin (kevinhallock) | 36 comments Hi Nikki,

I've found reading plays helps me improve the dialogue in my stories.

As for aiming for writing a trillogy, I've learned to be open to discovering how long the story wishes to be. I originally intended to write a pair of novels as part of the same story arc. I thought it might be bigger than that, perhaps a trilogy, but I wasn't sure. To my surprise, I've discovered a short story, a novella, and an additional novel. So my initial plan has blossomed into three novels with several supporting stories. I don't really know how far it will go, but it'll be fun finding out.


message 43: by Michelle (new)

Michelle Scott (michellescottfiction) | 721 comments Mod
I've been struggling with finding a satisfying ending to my current WIP for quite a while now. And I've been writing in first person which really complicates things since the MC constantly needs to be the center of drama so that the readers have all the 'clues' they need to point them towards the conclusion of the book.

I swear, writing is like herding cats.


message 44: by Jaga (new)

Jaga (jagasun) | 2 comments Speaking as someone who has long sought the Holy Grail of the proper word processor setup that would satisfy both my own methods of writing as well as the technological demands of converting it to various formats, I can tell you that you will sadly probably not soon find any one great end-all-be-all solution.

I have tried Scrivener as the best of the script/manuscript-specific applications. The drawback there is that you will spend a lot of time tweaking the conversion templates if you expect to use the export-to tool in it to send it out to editors/agents who prefer doc/docx format. Scrivener SAYS its default templates already meet manuscript format requirements, but my experience is they don't. Little things like line spacing and page numbering will need a ton of little tweaks by you to get it just-so. You could easily frustrate yourself by spending more time fixing templates and correcting formatting than writing.

As to Microsoft Word and the issue with navigating an ever-larger manuscript...with all due respect, I wouldn't entirely go by one of the earlier contributors' suggestion that "chapters should be 6-12 pages" anyway. Chapters like anything else in a book should be however long they have to be to suit what you're writing if you're writing true to your style and story.

Word has the advantages of being pretty universally accepted and recognized, at the very least by many programs that you might have to convert the format over to something else like PDF and hope to maintain the same general layout of the text.

If you're having issues navigating a growing manuscript, you could indeed try saving each chapter as a separate .doc file in a master folder for the whole book (basically doing in files what Scrivener does in sub-sections of one file). This is also handy if you use a tool like Jutoh to later convert your manuscript to Kindle format (the Kindle converter for InDesign and online are nightmares of ruined formatting if you just use them 'out of the box' on your manuscript-- I have found that saving each chapter as a doc file, then importing to Jutoh, saves me having to manually re-format all my text all over again before Kindle release).

Microsoft Word is a perfectly good program and I would recommend it for most word processing/writing needs. Handwritten novels are romantic, if you have the time and energy to subsequently transcribe your own handwritten pages (most of us don't). I write everything in Word and haven't had any real complaints about the basic doc/docx format, I save page templates for my most common story formats (Novel and Short Story, all ready to go in my Gallery) to save a lot of time.

You can use things like Scrivener if your work method allows for a rather tough learning curve of its eccentricities to get them to work right, but anything you save in using a very specific and proprietary-format setup like that may be lost when you have to then submit it to the rest of the publishing world in its own commonly-accepted formats. MIght as well work in Word if most of the time you're going to be asked to convert it to Word format anyway.


message 45: by Matthew (new)

Matthew Bryant (mattbryantdfw) Michelle L. wrote: "I've been struggling with finding a satisfying ending to my current WIP for quite a while now. And I've been writing in first person which really complicates things since the MC constantly needs t..."

Endings are the hardest. What works best for me is to put it down and focus on something else for a week or so. REALLY hard to do because you want to taste that finish line, but this often leads to lines like: "Then evil got its ass kicked and Angela went out for frozen yogurt."

That Eureka moment is out there somewhere, but your creative side may be gasping for breath.

Oh yeah, and going for walks around the neighborhood help to. Good chance to isolate yourself from distractions. ;)


message 46: by Michelle (new)

Michelle Scott (michellescottfiction) | 721 comments Mod
Matthew wrote: "Michelle L. wrote: "I've been struggling with finding a satisfying ending to my current WIP for quite a while now. And I've been writing in first person which really complicates things since the M..."

Lol. Thanks for the suggestions, Matthew. I finally did find my ending! The frozen yogurt thing, though, does have it's appeal...


message 47: by Peter (new)

Peter King (piwakawaka) | 4 comments I've tried all sorts of tools, including Scrivener (which only came out on Windows half way through my project). I wrote most of my 630,000 words on a Mobile phone using Word and storing chapters as RTF. Edit was mostly in word, though frankly it sucks. Project tracking in Excel.

It amazes me how poor writing software actually is. You really want a database driven system with annotations (some generated automatically like recognising speech marks). Also although I didn't use it I think Abiword is better than Word in many respects. It has writing oriented tools like revisions and annotations. What I'd still like is to be able to track dialects across different characters. But nothing does that.


message 48: by A.R. (new)

A.R. Williams (arwilliams) | 4 comments Scrivener, Scrivener, Scrivener...


message 49: by Matthew (new)

Matthew Bryant (mattbryantdfw) *Looks to stacks of composition books* I'm so outclassed here...


message 50: by M.R. (new)

M.R. Forbes (mrforbes) | 1 comments I'll throw in my vote for Google Documents (now called Google Drive) ..

First - it's online, and stored on Google's servers, which means the odds of anything I write ever getting lost in a hard drive crash or some other catastrophe is slim to none.

Second - You have the option to also store your docs offline, so if you head out to a coffee shop to write and their wi-fi is less than operational, you can still work and sync up the next time you have an internet connection

Third - It's available EVERYWHERE. You can even edit your documents on your iPhone or Android phone.. tablets, computers, etc...

Fourth - You can export as a word document.

Fifth - Revision history .. yes, it keeps a revision history. Saved me once when I deleted a few pages, then decided I wanted them back :)

I do all of my writing in google drive, for everything.. whether its prose, notes, outlines, since I have it with me all the time, I can always take a minute to add a thought, write a note, read and edit a page or two...

But then, I'm a total nerd :) YMMV.


« previous 1
back to top