City of Lost Souls (The Mortal Instruments, #5) City of Lost Souls discussion


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Who felt sorry for Sebastian Morgenstern Briefly??

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message 1: by Reepa (last edited Jun 03, 2012 02:42PM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Reepa Who had a soft spot for Sebastian before he showed his true colours????


At first when he spoke to Jocelyn I felt sorry for him because he knew that she hated him, which was really unreasonable as he was still her child, Valentine could have made the choice of putting demon blood in Jace instead of Sebastian and it wasn't entirely his fault... As the story developed I thought maybe just maybe Sebastian isn't all that evil and that Jace's blood had changed him.... BUT OH MY GOD the dude was really and truly demented he's so pyscotic... But I must admit his threat to the New York Institute was pretty cool... He seems to be a worthy Villian someone I'd compare with Voldemort... I didnt find Valentine scary at all just a bit creepy.


Samantha Me...a bit. When he talks sometimes he seems so lonely and he didn't put demon blood in himself so I occasionally feel a tad sorry. But then Jace talks and I totally forget about Sebastian. :)


Areefa That's exactly what i thought as well, i actually felt sorry for the guy and thought he could be given a second chance (especially when he sed he didn't want to kill Max) and thought he cared for clary in a brotherly way even though i did find it a bit creepy the way he hugged her...but he is sooo messed up he actually wants to be with his own sister! even Jace and Isabella thought the idea of them being together was wrong and they aren't even related but Sebastian actually thought it was acceptable! He really needs to see a specialist and get himself checked cuz he is not normal.
Yh he is definitely a good villain better than what his father but there is no way that he can turn good with everything that he done and he would need to die in the end cuz after the way he behaved with clary and for controlling jace and making him hate himself he cant be forgiven


Krissy Tolstrup I feel bad for saying this, but at one stage I was excited for his parts, I was almost crushing on him. Then I finished the book. I'm all better.


♥ Alexia -Team Malec ♥ I Felt so sorry for him and continued to-until the last page of the book (With the angel wings and all,) and I'm like- "NO! Sebastian, you have crossed the line. this is unacceptable!" But i still think that we have to feel a bit sorry for him, he didn't choose to have demon blood. if he was born human-well, Nephilim he would have never chosen this for himself-he didn't choose his past and I-personally would rather die than have his life.

-So in total-I am disappointed in him but feels he needs a little pity-for all that that's happened to him.


Juhi I really did feel bad for him. I mean he didn't choose to have Demon blood in him. And all he wanted was love. Valentine wasn't the most loving father and his mother hated him. I really felt sorry fir him until the end.


Reepa Samantha wrote: "Me...a bit. When he talks sometimes he seems so lonely and he didn't put demon blood in himself so I occasionally feel a tad sorry. But then Jace talks and I totally forget about Sebastian. :)"

Thats what I thought, he seems to be too lonely. The part when Clary asked him "who do you belong to" I felt really bad on him because he didnt have anything to say to that... but then obvioulsy we realised who he really wanted to belong eww.


Reepa Areefa wrote: "That's exactly what i thought as well, i actually felt sorry for the guy and thought he could be given a second chance (especially when he sed he didn't want to kill Max) and thought he cared for c..."

Did you read the extract where it tells you how he killed the real Sebastian Verlac, he killed him in cold blood honestly there was no remorse... I think he killed Max on purpose and he lied to Clary saying it was an accident... You have to admit though he was a convincing liar lol


Deanna Krissy wrote: "I feel bad for saying this, but at one stage I was excited for his parts, I was almost crushing on him. Then I finished the book. I'm all better."

Hahah me too :'), but then I realised how creepy he is.....


Krissy Tolstrup Deanna wrote: "Krissy wrote: "I feel bad for saying this, but at one stage I was excited for his parts, I was almost crushing on him. Then I finished the book. I'm all better."

Hahah me too :'), but then I reali..."



He killed me, I died when he revealed his creepiness.


Roselinta I felt so bad for him at one point and when he sounded like he was all lonely and like he cared for his little sister, I felt like I wanted to put my arms round him and give him a bear hug.

And then he... um... showed who he really (the 'YOU BELONG TO ME AND I BELONG TO YOU' part which was a lot creepy)and then I was like o_0. I felt really stupid for actually believing that he had a warm hearted side to him. But I feel so sad that he doesn't.

And Areefa: You are so right. He does need to see a specialist.


message 12: by Kate (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kate I maybe only felt sorry for him for about 5 seconds, but really the incestual undertones he gives off is just creepy and weird that and you know wanting to kill people all the time really makes me not like him. The thing is I don't hate him like other characters I mainly just want him gone because he's so delusional it's sad in itself.


percabeth i felt bad for him and i still do! i hate what valentine did to him! :( and i don't think he's delusional like valentine (he was OBSESSED of proving he was right to the clave) he's lonely but i think he knows what he's doing...whatever THAT is


Natalie I feel as though clare made us feel some sympathy for him, but revoked it at the end.


♥ Alexia -Team Malec ♥ I did, all Characters-as well as people have both good and bad inside of them.


message 16: by Kim (new) - rated it 5 stars

Kim I did feel sorry for him but only briefly before I realized he's really messed up inside. Gosh, the dude sexually harassed his own sister! That's just sick!


Reepa Natalie wrote: "I feel as though clare made us feel some sympathy for him, but revoked it at the end."

Your right, even right towards the end when the battle was over she remembers how Sebastian was really lonely??? I mean why would she care about that when she realised he's evil...


message 18: by Natalie (last edited Jun 08, 2012 10:24AM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

Natalie Afsana wrote: "Natalie wrote: "I feel as though clare made us feel some sympathy for him, but revoked it at the end."

Your right, even right towards the end when the battle was over she remembers how Sebastian w..."


The only thing that is keeping me from feeling completely sympathetic towards Sebast. is that hes a creep. He harassed his sister mentally, and physically, not to mention he has a sexual fantasy/obsession/attachment to clary. ick. But, nonetheless clare still managed for us to feel some pang of sadness for him; mostly because he's so twisted and lonely.


message 19: by Dia (new) - rated it 4 stars

Dia I did. And I still do. It's not his fault his father decided to add demon blood to his blood. When he was first born, his own mother didn't love him. And that was before he was old enough to do anything evil. I think that if he had a different upbringing, with a mother and father that loved him, maybe things would've turned out different for him.

While Jace was raised with the same father as sebastian, Valentine clearly treated Jace better. Sebastion had whip marks on his back, and Jace didn't. Jace has Maryse, Alec, Isabelle, Clary, Simon, and for a while he had Max. Sebastian had and still has no none.


Areefa What i dont get is Why would valentine give jace angel blood and give his own son demon blood, did he think demon blood would make Sebastian stronger? and why did he treat jace better? by teaching him languages and art and music he was making jace into the son that jocelyn would have always wanted and he should have known by making Sebastian a soldier she would always hate him.


percabeth valentine gave sebastian demon blood to make him stronger than the average shadowhunter but he realized he had a son who could nvr love him so he tried angel blood w/ jace but learned he was too 'soft' so he gave up on him. he taught both jace and sebastian how to speak other languages but i'm not sure if sebastian has any artistic talents cuz he didn't exactly clarify that...and valentine put his cause above everything else: his parabatai/best friend, kids, wife etc. so i dnt think he would stop and think what he's doing will affect his relationship w/ jocelyn. besides he already knew she was going to leave him eventually.


message 22: by Maya (new) - rated it 4 stars

Maya I had an "aww" moment for him when he and clary were talking and how he said that he really didnt want to kill Max and that maybe he just wanted a sister.BUT then he had to be that evil psychopath again. -.-
It was sad how he told Jocelyn that she couldve saved him from Valentine.


Tania Samantha wrote: "Me...a bit. When he talks sometimes he seems so lonely and he didn't put demon blood in himself so I occasionally feel a tad sorry. But then Jace talks and I totally forget about Sebastian. :)"

yer i totally agree with u he is just a boy who has been used ..its not entirely his fault he was raised that way


Tania oh i do feel sorry for sebastian now and again because whenever he speaks it sounds so lonely ..he has never had anyone to love him only people pretending to love him and yet are using him ...and even his own mother resents him ..its all really sad


Reepa What really annoys me is that if Clary used the sword on Sebastion instead of Jace we might have been able to know if there is an inkling of good in Sebastion, as it did say that the sword would remove all thats evil in them, and if they dont have any good in them they would die... So yeah if clary didnt take the sword from Simon he might have used it on the right person.


Natalie Afsana wrote: "What really annoys me is that if Clary used the sword on Sebastion instead of Jace we might have been able to know if there is an inkling of good in Sebastion, as it did say that the sword would re..."

Have you considered that it could have caused an end to the series having Seb. gone? Perhaps Clare did that to continue her series?


Reepa Natalie wrote: Have you considered that it could have caused an end to the series having Seb. gone? Perhaps Clare did that to continue her series?"

I did consider that, but its still one of those annoying things that you can't help but wonder about... Believe me I was really happy when they couldn't find Sebastions body in City of Glass cause I hoped she'd carry on with the series... and it will be a very very sad day for all TMI fans when we get hold of the last and final book lool.


Natalie Afsana wrote: "and it will be a very very sad day for all TMI fans when we get hold of the last and final book ..."

I agree. I've enjoyed this series so much! Thank goodness we have TID and the other series shes comming out with to ease our desire for the shadow world! :)


Christy I felt bad for him. I kinda want him to switch sides.. I actually liked the NICE sebastain.. He needs to turn Nice and has his family but i LOVE jace and Simon!!!!!! Cant waot for the next book this 1 and the Infernal devices!!!-----


Jessica I didn't necessarily feel bad for him, but I feel, like Clary and Jace, that I understand him better. I see how his life was and I think it is sad how he has grown up and he feels lonely, but I don't feel bad for him because he could change his life around if he really wanted to.


Cassidy I did start to feel kind of bad for him. I started to grow to like him, and he reminded me a bit of Jace. But then it turned out that he was just acting. What made me regret feeling bad for him was when he started getting turned on by Clary...that was just creepy.


Stephanie I did very briefly...for those of you who have read/seen Lord of the Rings, Sebastian reminds me of Gollum/Smeagul. He has a charming side like Jace and then his dark and evil side. The charming side made me sympathetic, not wanting him to be killed like both Bilbo and Frodo pitied Smeagul and didn't kill him. But then he goes all "in-blood" and he was wrong all over again..


Reepa Its characters like Sebastion that really mess with your head, because its so much easier to hate somebody thats really evil e.g. Voldemort, but even Harry felt a slight twinge of sympathy for him when he found out about his childhood.... As for Sebastion I cant help but wonder if there might have been any truth about what he said about Max, that he didnt really want to kill him. And also it seemed to me that he might have cared about what Jace thought of him, like the part when he shouted with venom saying he hates him, Sebastion paled. But apart from all that I guess his evil side did triumph at the end the sicko!!!! lool


message 34: by [deleted user] (new)

yeah, hes the kind of bad guy that u cant help but like.


message 35: by Dee (new) - rated it 5 stars

Dee I knew he was lying the whole time, and was still psychotic...but I must admit I felt bad for him, only because I kept thinking about what he would have been like if he didn't have demon blood, and I was secretly hoping he was going to somehow turn good. But I'm pretty sure that's never going to happen, plus he is obviously an obsessive prick. LOVE this series!


Reepa Deondra wrote: "I knew he was lying the whole time, and was still psychotic..."

you know the times he put his arms around Clary in the club and when she was coming out of his rooms, the times when she thought it was Jace holding her but it turned out be Sebastion, thats when I thought OKAAAY why is he holding her in that creepy way, but I just passed it off as "brotherly love" Lool


Cassandra **The Bibliophagist** There were subtle hints that he was lying...i could just tell


Areefa i hope he doesn't turn into a positive charcter cuz he is an amazing villain and even after the way he behaved with clary and for controlling jace i hated him but there is still a small part of me that likes him


Cynthia Cebrero I had for a short time but at the same time i still do i can't really blame him but I mostly blame Valentine because Jonathan seems to have humanity if he didnt have demon blood.


message 40: by Aden (new) - rated it 5 stars

Aden I was mad at joceline it wasn't even funny. and then Sebastion was all like crazy or something. So then I stopped feeling sorry for him that much. I still don't like joceline though.


message 41: by Caro (new) - rated it 5 stars

Caro Basurto Tania wrote: "oh i do feel sorry for sebastian now and again because whenever he speaks it sounds so lonely ..he has never had anyone to love him only people pretending to love him and yet are using him ...and e..."

OOH!! I KNOW!! I just keep thinking that the creepy part of him, wil be gone by now..
but believe me, everything Cassandra writes have one reason, I just think that if in the end Sebastian ends dying this books will be a waste of my time, I just hope that she writes a good ending(;
And I dont care about all your comments of hating him, because I think everyone deserves a second chance


Tania Caro wrote: "Tania wrote: "oh i do feel sorry for sebastian now and again because whenever he speaks it sounds so lonely ..he has never had anyone to love him only people pretending to love him and yet are usin..."

true true everyone deserves a second chance and its not his fault he didnt get a first choice in the begining evrything valentine desided for him


message 43: by Nia (new) - rated it 4 stars

Nia (Nia's Book Fort) I did for just a little bit. I loved the was Cassie wrote him and it just made him seem more and more misunderstood. Then he got all evil again but somehow I still managed to feel sorry for him.


Nicole Maybe for just like a second, then I was like no no no he is a demented, evil, crazy lunatic who wants his sister. Ewww I have a hard time feeling empathy for him.


Kasey yeah sort of in the middle i began to really like Sebastian and feel a kind of empathy for him. I also began to dislike Jace but once he became himself again for that short time i loved him again and hated Sebastian again, though i hate him with an understanding of who he is and why


Hannah sebastian is pure EVIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!I KNEW it on the inside but you just had to feel sorry for him a little bit. I mean, you could tell that he knew that everyone hated him, especially when Jace "came back" for those few minutes and told him that in reality, he hates Sebastian and he always will. But ew, he's like in love with clary, that's just so wrong.


message 47: by [deleted user] (new)

i don't necessarily think he is evil - yes he has done some evil things but from his perspective they are perfectly legitimate - because of what he is he doesn't have the same morals or viewpoints as normal people because he has never been taught them. i never really hated sebastian because of this- some people may have, but i always saw him as just misunderstood by those around him.


Apples I like Sebastian as a villain. He has a lot of depth, sometimes you think he's just pure EVIL at other times you think he's just a misunderstood.
I don't think he means to be evil or that he is actually, he just thinks what he's doing is right because that's how he was raised. I think the problem is that no one understands him and the differences make him distant, that and I don't think anyone has ever loved him.
And just because he has demon blood in him doesn't mean he can't feel. I mean he was clearly upset that Jocelyn left him, angry when Clary picks Jace over him and just think of all the love he must have for his kitten!


Taylor Aragon I really like Sebastian, even more so now that he's a villain. He's creepy and a total badass. CoLS was my favorite of all five books because Sebastian was so involved.


Apples Taylor wrote: "I really like Sebastian, even more so now that he's a villain. He's creepy and a total badass. CoLS was my favorite of all five books because Sebastian was so involved."

Mines too. I didn't like CoFA as much as the last three and wasn't sure if I was going to read CoLS. But then I heard Sebastian was back from the dead.
Oh gosh I can feel the judging eyes. Just keep in mind without the villains you wouldn't have the plot.


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