The Trench discussion

30 views
gaza

Comments Showing 1-41 of 41 (41 new)    post a comment »
dateDown arrow    newest »

message 1: by Varmint (last edited Jan 03, 2009 08:03PM) (new)

Varmint | 208 comments Who at FOX decided it was a good idea to let geraldo rivera do live play by play of the invasion?


i generally support israel if this fight. but i wonder what their endgame is. how do they define victory? kill a few terrorists? take some territory? topple the hamas government? all this will do is kick the problem a few years down the road.

anyone have any ideas.


message 2: by Not Bill (new)

Not Bill | 467 comments heh...all that money that arab govts illegally donated to Obama has been wasted. Now, they're pissed that he hasn't come out on their side. Problem for them is that he's not president yet. They shot their wad early, as it typical when it comes to paleos desire to kill jooos.

Israel is dead serious this time, and that's good news. They've bisected gaza. The top Hamas honcho is holed up in the basement of Shifa hospital, where apparently Hamas keeps most of their rockets as well.

I'm hoping that Hamas is declared an illegal entity and dismantled piecemeal. Unfortunately, too much of the paleo population are little more than brainwashed canonfodder. They'll get their ass kicked, lick their wounds, and will be back to doing what they always do in less than a year.

I too don't see an end to the paleo situation that doesn't include scorched earth.


message 3: by Varmint (new)

Varmint | 208 comments
"Now some fresh pickings from the Political Grapevine:

Mum's the Word

President-elect Obama is catching heat from the left over his refusal to condemn the violence in Gaza. Mr. Obama said today he is being briefed on the situation, but that there is only one sitting president at a time.

Jodi Evans — co-founder of the liberal anti-war group Code Pink — told the OpEd News yesterday she is "disgusted that Obama didn't make a statement. He's had an opinion about everything else. This is an atrocity and if he doesn't call it an atrocity, it's shameful."

Meanwhile, a new Rasmussen Reports Poll indicates 62% of Republicans surveyed support Israel's decision to take military action against the Palestinians. Just 31% of Democrats agreeing with Israel's move."


http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,4...




vicki jean, come january 2012, if humanity has been exterminated in the apocalypse, i'll owe you a beer.

i see the israeli's problem. they can't simply kill everyone in hamas. they need to leave someone alive to negotiate with. either that, or set fatah back up in charge.




message 4: by Not Bill (last edited Jan 06, 2009 08:40AM) (new)

Not Bill | 467 comments I think the idea is to get Fatah in charge of all palestinian terreritories. Notice, no rockets coming from West Bank. Abbas is pushing for international peacekeepers. I'm not sure that's a wise move for Israel. The paleos need to step up themselves and stop looking to others to do what they should be doing themselves - which is what they always do.

On Code Pink, some of my blogger cohorts were there to counter protest in San Francisco, and things got a little ugly. I'm sure Zombie was there. I'll see if I can get the link, she always has good pics. I couldn't make it as I was hosting a holiday soiree.

Here's the link to Zombie's report.
http://www.zombietime.com/zomblog/

She wasn't able to make it either, but did download some raw footage from the local news station KTVU. Check it out to get a good taste of what Hope and Change looks like in SF.


message 5: by Varmint (new)

Varmint | 208 comments you know that zombie is female? is she hot?

amazing how one blogger does the job two local papers and 4 tv stations should be doing.


message 6: by Not Bill (new)

Not Bill | 467 comments Zombie is known to be female... and even that took some time to uncover. I have only ever corresponded electronically. It's probably best that way as she's able to move amongst the heathen with such ease - wouldn't want to blow her cover.

And, not so much amazing as sad and appalling. 2008 was truly the year that journalism died. Worse, there is practically no media left to hold Obama to account should things turn truly shitty, as they're expected to.


Servius  Heiner  | 360 comments Mod
Your telling me!?!

I returned from my sabbatical to find Israel was kicking ass again... the only thing the news was "saying" was how horrible the israelis are acting. ugh! bullshit. I don't even care anymore, I hope son of abraham gives them a proper stomping this time around. The way I see it the U.N. and the E.U. can go pound sand. If Imadinnerjacket doesn't have to listen then I don't think Israel should have too. And HELLO "war crime" chanters, they are terrorists they hide in hospitals and schools and churches so that's where you have to kill them, get over it.


Servius  Heiner  | 360 comments Mod
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,4...

How does Israel’s refusal to the cease fire make Israel responsible for the blood shed? It seems to me that Hamas started this, and Israel intends to finish it. I see nothing wrong with that anywhere.


http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,4...

I think people need to look past the civilian casualties. They are not targets, but they allow the militants to operate among them. If they want peace, they should assist the IDF by revealing the locations of these militants before they launch rockets. If Israel is able to engage the militants face to face instead of via artillery counter batteries then the civilians would be “safer”. Out side of that, I think these two articles show that the IDF is running a successful campaign.



message 9: by Varmint (new)

Varmint | 208 comments today i read that bush refused to give the israelis bunker busters. apparently he thinks he has other means (sabotage) of stopping the iranian nuke program.

would still feel more comfortable if they had one.


message 10: by Varmint (new)

Varmint | 208 comments read it in the new york times.

in my fantasy, bush gave the israelis bunker busters, mid air refueling capabiity, and a MOAB for the hell of it. maybe the report was just a misdirection to screw with the mullahs.

but probably not.


Servius  Heiner  | 360 comments Mod
Das ist kaput!


message 12: by Varmint (new)

Varmint | 208 comments no, just woke up.





is there some crisis? or just fallout from the election? there's some third party guy i know very little about. have heard creepy things though.





message 13: by Varmint (new)

Varmint | 208 comments "Right-wing parties -- including Netanyahu's Likud Party -- appear to have won a clear majority of 65 seats in the 120-seat parliament, which would give Netanyahu the upper hand in forming the next government.

However, with 99 percent of the votes counted, Livni's centrist Kadima Party had 28 seats, while Likud had 27. Those results could change by a seat or two -- enough to alter the outcome -- when soldiers' votes are tallied Thursday evening.

The winner of the election wasn't clear in part because Livni could try to form a coalition with hawkish parties. It appeared ultranationalist Avigdor Lieberman, who based his campaign on denying citizenship to Israeli Arabs he considers disloyal, could single-handedly determine the country's next leader with his decision of whom to join.

He declared after the vote that he spoken to both Livni and Netanyahu and told them he could be persuaded to join either one, but he added that he wanted a "nationalist right-wing government."




pulled this off some news site. normally the words "nationalist right wing government" give me a warm fuzzy feeling. but denying citizenship to arabs is a little unsettling.


am out at the coffee shop trying to wake up. will watch the reports tonight. work is weird right now. am almost nocturnal.


message 14: by Not Bill (new)

Not Bill | 467 comments Varmint, denying 'certain' Arabs citizenship might seem draconion by Western standards, but considering that pretty much the entire Muslim ( not just Arab) world is united in their desire to see Israel vaporized, well I can find some room for understanding.

Vicki Jean - the Paleos are beyond help. That's sad because there are many who desire peace. However, not enough and their leadership is beyond reprehensible. Their youth are brought up to desire death in the pursuit of the destruction of Israel. Death is the only thing the will realize.



Servius  Heiner  | 360 comments Mod
You know I had to dig deep yesterday to find that story. It's funny if a Muslim kills someone (honor killing) it is completely ignored, but if you me anyone kills someone it is all over the news for weeks, and even months if the court case gets dragged out.


message 16: by Stephanie (new)

Stephanie (zeldazonk) I saw the be-heading story on the news a few days ago, there wasn't all that much said, but am very disturbed. I don't know where justice has really gone in our country. It's sick that a has been pop star that beats up his gal pal gets more air time than an actual human being getting her head cut off by her obsurd husband.

*I found this lil group off of Vicki Jean's profile
*I am a (closet) conservative in a lefty world :(


Servius  Heiner  | 360 comments Mod
I caught a bit of Hannity the other day, or was it O'rielly? Anyway the topic was Ayn Rand's Atlas Shrugged; and how the world she painted 54 years ago, is here. I urge all to read some of her books. If they grip your intestines and give you the feeling that someone just kicked you in the junk/bleeder then you know you are a conservative minded person. On the other hand, if you think the main characters are in-human then you are decidedly a liberal. Read on.


message 18: by Varmint (new)

Varmint | 208 comments not bill,

israel has the moral high ground. no matter what some might say. but little things like stripping the rights of citizenship from citizens would be a hard blow against that idea. i support them because they are a free western democracy in a very ugly region. the idea of a "jewish state" has always been troubling.



much of atlas shrugged is spent describing the political maneuvering at the end of capitalism. i am listening to the same half baked rationalizations come out of the mouth of the obama administration as in her book. one of the things that stuck me was her portrayal of business leaders collaborating with the take over because they some some momentary advantage.


message 19: by Not Bill (new)

Not Bill | 467 comments I hear you Varmint and agree with your point. My qualification was "certain Arab individuals". Not even Netanyahu would go so far as to strip all Arab Israelis of citizenship. It's the great moral hammer that they hold over the rest of the Arab/Muslim world.

Ayn Rand and George Orwell. It's all coming to pass. However, we do have recourse. There is already a groundswell of backlash against the dhimmicrat overreach. As long as we are consistent on message it will get through. I love the "Tea Party" movement that is already underway. Brilliant. Accurate and with important historical context. More! FasterD!


message 20: by Not Bill (last edited Feb 24, 2009 09:28AM) (new)

Not Bill | 467 comments Hey- Obama is giving Gaza a billion $ to "rebuild" crap that's never been built in the first place and will only get "blowed up" within a month of being built. And lemme guess, for this they're supposed to love us. ugh.


message 21: by Jerrod (new)

Jerrod (liquidazrael) I suppose he doesn't remember what they did to the greenhouses that Israel constructed in Gaza do they? Oh yeah, the destroyed them and looted them, little alone that they were cutting edge, could feed their people, etc.


message 22: by Not Bill (new)

Not Bill | 467 comments Doesn't know - or doesn't care. You see, he's The One, the Messiah. He'll succeed where the last 4 adminstrations failed. Not.


message 23: by Jerrod (new)

Jerrod (liquidazrael) I thought that the messiah's ears would be smaller. I wonder if this is what it felt like in Germany when Hitler was a rising star?


Servius  Heiner  | 360 comments Mod
Hitler was a very conservative leader actually.

He just had that one tincy little flaw; sure it was a doozy but...


Servius  Heiner  | 360 comments Mod
Oh sure, Rusty, I'm trying to be all light hearted and shit and then you have to go mention the "O" guy. Great, just great...





Servius  Heiner  | 360 comments Mod
I actually have the sound track!

"Cause' it's spring time for Hitler and Germany!"


message 27: by Stephanie (new)

Stephanie (zeldazonk) Crazy Clinton got back from her middle east stint, promised 900 million to Gaza, as long as it doesn't go to Hamas, of course. Is there something wrong about funding terrorist organizations that our government is supposedly against?.... or is it just me? I don't understand


Servius  Heiner  | 360 comments Mod
apparently...

Also what was she doing in the Israel this week? Isn't there to be a change in government there in a couple of weeks? What point is there to push her agenda with the current command, when it is gone in 2-3 weeks. And my last Hillary dig, she steam rolled down that hall (sorry no video clip) with the israel PM trailing and "trying" to keep up. WTF ok great start at statesmanship, Billory, push your agenda down a foreign leaders throat (even though you know you two are on opposite sides of the political pendulum) and then walk through his house like your some mover in shaker. HA! everyone knows your just the looser that wanted to be president.


message 29: by Jerrod (new)

Jerrod (liquidazrael) Clinton's been neutered, she's just trying to gain some power she lost when she teamed up with Magic Negro. Great thing is, that if Obama really eats it, we'll kill two traitors with one Administration.


Servius  Heiner  | 360 comments Mod
<>

If??? If??? He already is screwing the pooch.


message 31: by Not Bill (new)

Not Bill | 467 comments Gawd - Hillary in Israel. Did anyone else hear the circus music? ....bunch of frikkin' clowns.


message 32: by [deleted user] (new)

"If??? If??? He already is screwing the pooch."

Of course if the particular pooch you're discussing is the middle east, then that pooch has been being screwed for quite a while now.

Look man, I'll be the first to admit that Israel is THE most important military ally we've got going in the mideast right now, but this move of theirs? It's like when you take a friend to a party & they get all drunk & you have to apologize & promise the host they'll never hear their name again. Does Israel have enough going in a historical conflict to claim provocation? Sure, but following that logic you'd have to concede that the Palestinian forces can easily make the same claim (or at least they sure can now). Frankly, it doesn't look like Israel's really achieved ANYTHING permanent in terms of a military victory at this point, due to the fact that they're claiming that they need to do this to prevent future terrorist attacks and inciting a whole new wave of future terrorists by their actions.

To clarify, Israel is making the kind of military strike that would work very well against a conventional opponent. But this situation isn't conventional at all.

10 bucks (or the equivalent in beer) says Israel is the victim of the first terrorist nuclear attack.

Timeline? I'll say 6 years. (8 max)








message 33: by Not Bill (new)

Not Bill | 467 comments Steve - your timeline is far too optimistic. Team Hillary has conceded we've lost on the diplo front. Obama got pwnd by Putin over the rediculous offer of trading our missile shield for their holp on Iran. There's only one hope left and that's Israel tells Obama to pound sand takes out Iran's nuclear program to the best of their ability. Natanyahu is up to that task. Noobama, not so much.


Servius  Heiner  | 360 comments Mod
Steve... I think Israel was doing just fine until international pressure shut them down. Of course military action hasn't been successful; every time we get them down we walk away. We really need to kill them, not beat them down.

Thought you folks would have learned that after Desert storm. These are not people that are interested in a peaceful resolution. They are out for blood. Israel has given concessions in the past and it just comes back to bite them in the ass.

They need to walk back across the street and beat bomb, and shoot the fight out of the other side for there to be any hopes of peace. And of course that won't happen as long as everyone in the west continues to ignoring Iran.

But ok, I'll play your ball game, what do you propose we negotiate on? What terms do you think would be sufficient to stop the up coming events?

Because I will tell you straight from the gate, I am only willing to give them muzzle flashes. They are the criminals here and I don't pay off crooks because they are tough nuts to crack.


message 35: by Jerrod (new)

Jerrod (liquidazrael) He may be screwing the pooch, but until 'the majority' see's it, it does the people who actually see the truth little good, hence, if he really screw's the pooch line. Because he'll really have to screw the pooch to make his disciples Judas his sorry ass.

Palestinians are a nomadic people that no one wants in there country, Egypt and Syria both promised land for their own country but eventually were denied. Hell they are like the Tyranids in Warhammer 40K, they consume and destroy any land they inhabit. I know its a cruel generalization, but history doesn't paint a picture of a society that actually wants to better themselves.


message 36: by Not Bill (last edited Mar 05, 2009 09:20AM) (new)

Not Bill | 467 comments Nick - spot on. The paleos are a psychotic society - literally poisoning the minds of their children almost from birth. The only thing keeping that cesspool aflost is the UN and our tax dollars. If this were taken away they'd implode within a year. They produce next to nothing for themselves except misery and death. Fine - I say let's give em more.

We've tried to negotiate. Clinton gave Arafat-head 97% of what he wanted in the pathectic 'roadmap' deal. The result? Arafat returns to ME and instigates the intifada. Been there, done that.

And on top of this, Obama is in Epic Fail mode with his appointing the Israel hating Saudi shill Freeman to Intelligence.

Israel had better wake up. Iran will have the bomb inside of 18 months and Obama won't do much more than vote "present"


message 37: by Not Bill (new)

Not Bill | 467 comments Oh - and I've got the feel good info for the day. Apparently Iran has enough material for 50 nuclear warheads. All thanks to the UN and EU. Israel needs to act and act soon. Otherwise, we just pack it in and bend over. Anyone willing to bet how Obama is gonna perform?


Servius  Heiner  | 360 comments Mod
I thought he already said how he was going to respond "If you[Iran:] launch a nuclear attack on Israel then our response will be nuclear."**


** not a direct quote but I couldn't find the actual quote; but that was pretty close, correct me if I am wrong.


message 39: by Not Bill (new)

Not Bill | 467 comments bwahaha - yer right Nick. His idea was to protect Israel with our nuclear umbrella. Kind of misses the point when you have a theocracy that is more than ready to commit national suicide in order to appease that imam currently residing in a well. In fact, Obama would be doing the mullah's bidding. What a noob.


message 40: by Varmint (new)

Varmint | 208 comments it's bad enough that obama wants to undo all the work put into creating a missle shield.

then he tries to start a negotiation with putin by offering to trade away something he's already made clear he is going to give up anyway.

this is the beginning of the era of the "too stupid too live" foreign policy.


Servius  Heiner  | 360 comments Mod
Naive diplomacy skills are more then just that, there dangerous. With a puff at the helm it is just inviting disaster.

Say what you will about President Bush's repore(sp? I fucking hate french words!) with the rest of the world, nobody made any silly attacks. I don't think we will be able to say the same thing in 4 years.


back to top