Mockingjay (The Hunger Games, #3) Mockingjay discussion

Gale and Peeta changed too much.

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Whitney I think that the author changed Peeta and Gale's personality too much in this book. Peeta became harsh and intense, Gale became kind of evil and twisted. They're barely the same people. I didn't like it.

Lea (Peeta's #1 Fangirl!) Well, Peeta was hijacked which he couldn't control. SO, he was very cold-hearted and not Peeta-ish..But he came back!!! (thank goodness <3) And Gale..He changed but I don't think it was a nessesarily bad way. He did what he could to win the war..And it wasn't his fault that Prim died...He was just using tatics...I know that..well it is confusing. But Gale isn't evil. Sure peoplpe were gonna die, but for a cause..

Kirby I think lea's right about peeta, he definitely had to be changed after the hijacking. and maybe gale was really changed by the bombing of district 12- maybe more so than a lot of others b/c, while he saved some, he failed to save the majority, and he probably felt it was his responsibility (since he obviously had the capability to rescue). also, maybe we just didn't really know gale very well until this book?

Lea (Peeta's #1 Fangirl!) Well Gale ISN'T evil and twisted...Not at all...And I know we only got to know Gale in this book,but he was never evil or twisted.

Kirby no, I wasn't saying he was evil and twisted...I'm just saying that the seemingly easy going guy of the first book may have been destroyed by his feeling culpable for both the deaths of the bombing of d12 and those of the final bombing. I would have to say afterward that he was...kind of callous, at the least...

Lea (Peeta's #1 Fangirl!) What does callous mean? And yes, Gale probably felt that way :(

Kirby callous can mean hardened and thickened, or having calluses (like the places you get from playing guitar, or walking barefoot), or emotionless. I don't think that gale ended up emotionless- I think he was really hurt by what happened to prim, and how things ended up w/ katniss- but I do think he had to become hardened and thickened- to sorta keep the pain out. I'd also say that katniss was callous by the end- and hers was maybe even leaning toward the "emotionless" definition...

I don't mean to sound pretentious- I just love words!

Kirby oh, may have done it again! I mean to say that I'm not trying to make myself sound more important than I am by using big words...I just love trying to find EXACTLY the right one.

Lea (Peeta's #1 Fangirl!) Oh, okay..Yes, after everything they just blocked stuff out....DO you think Katniss was happy at the end?

Kirby well, I think she probably ended up as happy as she could possibly be after everything she'd been through. but I don't know if I could call her truly happy- she just sounded sorta hollow in the epilogue. but, I think it helped her to have children (I don't agree w/ those who say peeta forced it on her- I think he knew they both needed it), and it's not like I think she never laughed again- it just probably wasn't very often.

do you think she was happy?

message 11: by [deleted user] (new)

Considering the circumstances they were in, and the torture Peeta went through, I thought it was rather realistic. Anyways, Gale had always hated the Capitol. In Mockingjay, he just had the tools to prove it.

Lea (Peeta's #1 Fangirl!) Kirby wrote: "well, I think she probably ended up as happy as she could possibly be after everything she'd been through. but I don't know if I could call her truly happy- she just sounded sorta hollow in the ep..."

I agree with everything you said...I think she was happy. However, in the epilogue..I didn't like it becuase she didn't seem happy. And said it for me!

Whitney I meant that although the author said she was happy, Katniss didn't seem very happy at the end. We never got to see how much of Peeta really came back. I meant to say that Gale was a harder person (yes from losing his family) but from the way he said things made it seem like he enjoyed killing and comdemning innocent people. For me it just doesn't suit his character. I miss the protective, honest, polite hunter and the soft, sensitive, smooth boy with the bread.

Lea (Peeta's #1 Fangirl!) Um..When did Gale loose his family? Did you mean PEETA?

Whitney Ugh. I got my words mixed up. Yes, when Peeta lost his family and Gale couldn't help everybody. Thanks

Kirby yeah, I debated w/ myself as to whether peeta had it worse b/c he lost his entire family but fortunately hadn't been there to witness it, or gale b/c although he saved his family, he had to see the rest of the people die and feel responsible for not saving them all...I decided that gale had it worse, mostly b/c peeta didn't seem that close to his family (except maybe his dad? but he never mentions any of them, does he?)...

Lea (Peeta's #1 Fangirl!) Well he had two older brothers, a mother that beat(s) him, and a nice father. I find it neat that Peeta's way with words is all his own, because his father doesn't speak much. And I remeber Peeta talking to his father, just small talk, so I think they were a bit close.

message 18: by [Coco] (last edited Nov 07, 2011 02:38PM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

[Coco] Peeta had a tough life, although not in the same way as Katniss. Peeta never struggled for food, he ate the bad stuff. He never nearly died from hunger (before the games), he got beaten. At least Katniss' family loved her. And I'm not saying Peeta's family doesn't love him, they just show it differently. His life is totally different, and the same, in some ways, as Katniss's.

Gale is the same as he was in the first book- strongly opinionated and desperate for freedom. He in no way is cruel and evil.

Hannah Peeta changed because he was tourtued, Gale did because naturally people change when they exprience certain things like with Gale the fact that he didn't save all of his district and than the fact that he watched it burn down, though it does seem like gale does not mind going around and killing people or prim which is just sad, poor katniss she will never be happy,she probally has just suffered to much and seen to much for her ever to be compleatly happy again.

[Coco] It never says that Gale actually killed Prim.... Katniss just assumed it. Katniss will never be completely happy, but she'll try. She never goes down without a fight. :)

Mochaspresso Gale didn't kill Prim directly or intentionally. Gale and Beetee developed some of the bombs and the strategies for using them, but Coin was the one who actually ordered their use. I also don't think Gale knew that Prim and the children were going to be there. Coin is the one who orchestrated that.

Kirby but that was the design of the trap- in d13, gale was explaining how it was best used to endanger the young and weak so that you drew out the real targets...he intended it to be used exactly that way!

[Coco] Yes, but he never intended to use it on Prim or the other rebel doctors/nurses. He was just trying to win the war.

Kirby Coco wrote: "Yes, but he never intended to use it on Prim or the other rebel doctors/nurses. He was just trying to win the war."

well, even if they did blow up the WRONG children- in gale's view- he still intended to blow up children...I just have a hard time swallowing that, especially since all it did was end the war earlier- it's not even like they would have lost the war if they hadn't used the bombs...

Megan They changed SOOO much!!! I said this somwhere else. In the first book, it's like peeta is skipping around a meadow throwing flowers in the air. In book 1. in book 2, Peeta is throwing small rocks at pedestrians, and in book 3, hes throwing 30 foot poisonous snakes at innocent small children on a playground

message 26: by Elli (new)

Elli Peeta wasn't himself because he was hijacked and Gale wasn't evil.

Chris i fell in love with the old ways of them both... mostly peetah[:

Elizabeth Day No I think Gale stayed the same, but Peeta did change, and in a realistic way. The Capitol almost completely changed his mind and made him practically hate the love of his life. He is harsh and intense, and it is horribly sad, but that was realistic and what the Capitol would do. But he tried to get his old self back, and he did the best he could, because he will never really be the same again because of what the Capitol did. But he did get part of his old self back.

message 29: by Jaelle (last edited Mar 19, 2014 08:47PM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

Jaelle What happened to Gale is a very realistic depiction of what war stirs in people. Gale's hatred for the Capitol, while understandable, led him to some dark places, such a the strategy of the double-exploding bomb he created. That bomb was intended to kill innocent helpers as they rushed in to help the victims of the first blast. He stopped seeing any humanity in his opponents and saw them more like prey. In so doing, he lost some of his own humanity. He may not have been responsible for killing the children or Prim, but the mentality behind his weapons was too much for Katniss to bear. She said so herself in the end. She wanted to be done with revenge. I think one of the main points of the book is that war always has an element of self-righteousness to it, or "justification", or a cause, but that even when there seems to be such a clear line between villain and hero, it's very easy to become the monster you set out to destroy. That chilling point was brought home when Coin announced the plan for another Hunger Games with the Capitol's children.

message 30: by Jaelle (last edited Mar 19, 2014 06:24PM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

Jaelle I do believe that Katniss and Peeta found a type of joy, but their experience forever changed them. The peace of their current life would always be contrasted with the hell and sorrow they endured. I think they did the best they could to move on through the gift they had in each other. You can tell there is a deep gratitude in Katniss for Peeta. That is a type of joy! He was always the best choice for her but we got to see the development of that realization in Katniss herself.

Sweta Jaelle wrote: "What happened to Gale is a very realistic depiction of what war stirs in people. Gale's hatred for the Capitol, while understandable, led him to some dark places, such a the strategy of the double-..."

Well said..

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