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message 1: by Sally, la reina (last edited Feb 14, 2011 12:40PM) (new)

Sally (mrsnolte) | 17322 comments Mod
http://www.npr.org/2011/02/14/1336292...

This article got me thinking. Why are modern parents such wussies? Why are the kids so much in control? For instance, the way my friends' kids eat. Horrific power struggles! Annoying as hell. I don't want to hear about how many bites of which food it takes to be able to leave the table. What an annoying and arbitrary lesson to learn.
The larger question at issue, however, is what is this doing to our society? Are teenagers poised to take over as confident and in control? Or are they completely mindnless youTube robots unable to think for themselves? In a book I'm reading the author says that our current educational system prepares kids to take tests, not to think critically for themselves. The carrot to entice the donkey has become the entire end goal, it would seem.


For what/where do I place blame? I want to blame someone. Is it the baby boomer generation who spoiled the entire current child-bearing population rotten? Or their parents, the Depression and Greatest Generation grandparents?

Imho, that is. What do you think?


message 2: by Dr. Detroit (new)

Dr. Detroit | 6019 comments I found myself wondering the same thing Saturday night as one by one, each of my kids ambled into the kitchen, stared at the open refrigerator for a good ten minutes before wandering back to the computer like zombies.


message 3: by Ken (new)

Ken (playjerist) | 721 comments “Why do we have to have all these kids?”

-George Bailey, It’s a Wonderful Life


message 4: by Rebecca (new)

Rebecca White (rebecca_white) | 1028 comments The boomer's kids are mostly grown up. It's the ones after them!


message 5: by Helena (new)

Helena | 1058 comments I’m fairly strict with my daughter. I don’t know if it’s my parenting, her nature or a combination of the two, but she eats what I put in front of her with minimal complaining. We eat together at the dinner table and she’s not allowed to leave until most of her food is eaten. I think as far as the picky eating goes, I’ve noticed with many of my friends they’re constantly giving their child snacks to keep them occupied. Why would they eat dinner if they’re not really hungry? My daughter gets snacks, of course, but not close to meal times.

As for parenting in general- there’s a lot of peer pressure out there from other parents. Like I said, I’m fairly strict. I expect my daughter to behave a certain way and if she doesn’t there are consequences. I’ve had other parents look at me disapprovingly when my daughter is sent to her room or scolded for poor behaviour. If I was a more easily influenced person or placed more weight on what people thought of me, I might bow to that pressure and try to conform to their ideals. I’m somewhat old school, not as strict as my parents were, but I try to instil respect for others, honesty, and kindness. I try, but she’s only four... it might all backfire on me.


message 6: by Sally, la reina (new)

Sally (mrsnolte) | 17322 comments Mod
What goes after boomers? My parents were boomers. Am I grown up? I am! I'm grown up and having babies on my own. That's what I meant!
I'm Gen x/y cusp.


message 7: by Sally, la reina (new)

Sally (mrsnolte) | 17322 comments Mod
"get some fruit from the bowl" is an awesome alternative. Sounds a lot like how I was raised.


message 8: by RandomAnthony (last edited Feb 14, 2011 12:59PM) (new)

RandomAnthony | 14536 comments Honestly, I think most interactions and conversations surrounding raising children have an element of "please God, I hope I'm doing it right" and it's easy to criticize others' decisions related to raising children in a way to rationalize and feel better about our own. I've done it. But I think it's important to acknowledge that there are many "right" ways to raise kids and what's going to work for one kid or family may not work for another, but that doesn't mean that it's not working for the first family, if, uh, that sentence makes sense. Kids from families with reasonably "loose" parenting turn out pretty well, and kids from reasonably "strict" parenting scenarios may turn out well, too. Sometimes I'm strict with my kids, sometimes I'm not...they seem to be ok for now...I can't say I have the answers, but I'm doing the best I can.


message 9: by Brittomart (new)

Brittomart My parents indulged the hell out of me.


message 10: by Sally, la reina (new)

Sally (mrsnolte) | 17322 comments Mod
Didn't mean to poke a sensitive subject, friend, if I did. I totally get the hope I'm doing ok part.

Also, I've thought of you in the past two nights up with Leah when Sweeter is doing his pretend not to hear her thing.


message 11: by Jim (new)

Jim | 6485 comments We always tell our kids, this is what were having for supper, if you don't want it feel free to make your own. 95% of the time they eat what we make.


message 12: by RandomAnthony (new)

RandomAnthony | 14536 comments In a book I'm reading the author says that our current educational system prepares kids to take tests, not to think critically for themselves.

That's a good way to sell books and get headlines...but, nah, I tune that shit out. How could a reasonable author generalize like that? Horseshit. The "educational system", if you will, isn't monochromatic, and terms like "think critically" are notoriously hard to define and/or assess.


message 13: by Sally, la reina (new)

Sally (mrsnolte) | 17322 comments Mod
I learned to cook as a teenager because of that. It felt good to me then and retrospectively it still does, to be able to be independent. But as a kid I just didn't second guess my mom. Her word was law.


message 14: by RandomAnthony (new)

RandomAnthony | 14536 comments No, no, I'm fine, Sally, I don't mean to sound critical of you, either...


message 15: by Sally, la reina (new)

Sally (mrsnolte) | 17322 comments Mod
**hugs**


message 16: by Sally, la reina (new)

Sally (mrsnolte) | 17322 comments Mod
RandomAnthony wrote:

"That's a good way to sell books and get headlines..."


Nice perspective. I forget and take the principal's word as gospel and read all that they suggest.


message 17: by RandomAnthony (new)

RandomAnthony | 14536 comments I also think all of us at parents will have moments, whether at dinner or otherwise, where we will not be proud of ourselves...I'm not saying that bad parenting doesn't exist, but after a couple decades in schools I think kids are, luckily, often resilient in ways I admire and didn't expect.


message 18: by Helena (new)

Helena | 1058 comments RandomAnthony wrote: "Honestly, I think most interactions and conversations surrounding raising children have an element of "please God, I hope I'm doing it right" and it's easy to criticize others' decisions related to..."

“Please God, I hope I’m doing it right” and “please don’t let me screw her up too badly” is most often what goes through my mind. I figured that I turned out ok (well I’m not a criminal or anything) so I try to follow my parent’s example a bit...


message 19: by RandomAnthony (new)

RandomAnthony | 14536 comments I agree with Buns in that predictability and trust are huge. I don't think any parent can be entirely predictable, because people aren't predictable. Parents can't be superhuman. But if the kids trust that even if you screw up once in a while that this particular scenario is an anomaly then you're probably in a good place. It's kind of like when a teacher sets a guideline and then realizes said guideline doesn't work...changing the guideline may be inconsistent, but staying with a stupid guideline is just, well, stupid.


message 20: by Suefly (new)

Suefly | 620 comments Ken wrote: "“Why do we have to have all these kids?”

-George Bailey, It’s a Wonderful Life"


I love this.


Lyzzibug ~Still Breathing~ (lyzzibug) | 708 comments Could it be that the new generation of kids live with the mindset of Entitlement. The generation before was all about the hardwork and getting their kids what they didn't have themselves, so now kids have no ambition to work for what they want.


message 22: by Brittomart (last edited Feb 14, 2011 02:13PM) (new)

Brittomart Hey, I have ambition...I think.


message 23: by Rebecca (new)

Rebecca White (rebecca_white) | 1028 comments I once knew somebody who said her parents never said anything about "liking" or "not liking" food. It just wasn't referred to. No doubt they did have preferences, but they didn't talk about it. If you wanted some, you'd take it, if you didn't, you didn't. I thought that was brilliant.

I get impatient with people who say "my kids won't eat..." They eat what they're exposed to, that's the way it works. With few exceptions, you like what you know.


Lyzzibug ~Still Breathing~ (lyzzibug) | 708 comments I agree with that Rebecca.

I tend to cook the same things over and over again. Whenever we eat out I always get the same thing. Never really have the earge to try anything new.


message 25: by Lobstergirl, el principe (new)

Lobstergirl | 24154 comments Mod
The food battles among young kids today drive me nuts. I know a girl who is underweight because she only eats 3 different things. I know people where you have to get any dish you're bringing over pre-approved to make sure they can eat it - not because of allergies or anything legitimate, but because their kids just won't eat certain things. In my house growing up, if you didn't eat what was put in front of you, you didn't eat. I really don't see what's wrong with that policy.


Stacia (the 2010 club) (stacia_r) Lobstergirl wrote: " In my house growing up, if you didn't eat what was put in front of you, you didn't eat. I really don't see what's wrong with that policy..."

My 3 year old just won't eat then. He's gone days without eating but a bite or two of food if he doesn't like what's put out for him. It's not even a temper tantrum thing. He's very logical about it. He tries the food and if he doesn't like it, it just gets left behind and he goes back to playing.

He's actually lost significant weight in the past because of it, so unfortunately I am stuck having to do food sometimes that I don't always want to feed him (like PB&J which isn't the healthiest, but it's calories).


message 27: by Sally, la reina (new)

Sally (mrsnolte) | 17322 comments Mod
We went over to a couple's house for dinner. At the time they had a two year old. Another couple brought over a chicken and rice dish. The little girl wandered up to the table to see what we were eating. The mother said, oh, you won't like that. I'll make you some mac and cheese. Way to not even try with the kid.


message 28: by Lobstergirl, el principe (new)

Lobstergirl | 24154 comments Mod
Picky Eaters? They Get It From You

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/10/din...

I can't find the article, but I remember reading in the NYT that the conventional wisdom that you have to try several times to get kids to eat certain foods before giving up is wrong - you can get them to eat the foods, but you have to try tons more times, like 30-40 or something. But they will eventually eat them. I guess most parents just don't have the patience.


message 29: by [deleted user] (last edited Feb 14, 2011 04:24PM) (new)

We have always been in the habit of eating with the kids as much as possible. They eat what we eat. I have never really had any problems with my kids eating vegetables or fruit. Our meals initially were a bit lot on the boring side. Now my kids will eat anything. (We just have to be a bit lean on the chilli as my daughter is sensitive to it.) It does make eating out at restaurants expensive, my kids won’t eat anything off the ‘kids menu’.


message 30: by [deleted user] (new)

What is Friendly's? They eat any kinds of desserts. It's the 'chicken nuggets and chips' kind of meal they won't eat.


message 31: by Lobstergirl, el principe (new)

Lobstergirl | 24154 comments Mod
Gail "cyborg" wrote: "What is Friendly's? They eat any kinds of desserts. It's the 'chicken nuggets and chips' kind of meal they won't eat."

Wow! I don't even know any kids who won't eat chicken nuggets and chips. A lot of kids I know will ONLY eat chicken nuggets and chips.


message 32: by Helena (new)

Helena | 1058 comments Gail "cyborg" wrote: "What is Friendly's? They eat any kinds of desserts. It's the 'chicken nuggets and chips' kind of meal they won't eat."

My daughter is the same! It does get expensive in restaurants... on the plus side, I have lots of leftovers for lunch the next day :D


message 33: by Helena (new)

Helena | 1058 comments BunWat wrote: "I'm fortunate I guess to be part of a long line of fairly adventurous eaters. Funny thing though, one of the favorite meals for my niece and nephew when they visit is actually the dog food. Which..."

That beats McDonalds any day of the week, lucky dog too ;-)


message 34: by Phil (new)

Phil | 11629 comments Lobstergirl wrote: "Gail "cyborg" wrote: "What is Friendly's? They eat any kinds of desserts. It's the 'chicken nuggets and chips' kind of meal they won't eat."

Wow! I don't even know any kids who won't eat chicken n..."


My kid doesn't eat them. He has started eating some of the chips when they're ordered, but he'd prefer fruit.


message 35: by Lobstergirl, el principe (new)

Lobstergirl | 24154 comments Mod
I love vegetables, but often have to make myself buy fruit.


message 36: by Sally, la reina (new)

Sally (mrsnolte) | 17322 comments Mod
BunWat wrote: "I'm fortunate I guess to be part of a long line of fairly adventurous eaters. Funny thing though, one of the favorite meals for my niece and nephew when they visit is actually the dog food. Which..."

Do you have a recipe? I'd make that for Leah. She doesn't like red meat, but she'll devour chicken. And she already eats sweet potatoes and brown rice, so perfect.


message 37: by Sally, la reina (new)

Sally (mrsnolte) | 17322 comments Mod
Phil wrote: "Lobstergirl wrote: "Gail "cyborg" wrote: "What is Friendly's? They eat any kinds of desserts. It's the 'chicken nuggets and chips' kind of meal they won't eat."

I've never heard of Friendly's either.


message 38: by Lobstergirl, el principe (new)

Lobstergirl | 24154 comments Mod
Friendly's is only on the east coast. I can't say I've ever eaten thar, myself.

I think I ate at Carvel once.


message 39: by Sally, la reina (new)

Sally (mrsnolte) | 17322 comments Mod
I forget that Chicago is midwest and not east.


message 40: by Sally, la reina (new)

Sally (mrsnolte) | 17322 comments Mod
Lol. Unless I wanted to feed her for about six weeks on one pot full.


message 41: by Sally, la reina (new)

Sally (mrsnolte) | 17322 comments Mod
Awwww. I thought of you at the farmer's market yesterday. I was eyeballing the mushrooms, completely out of my league.


message 42: by Félix (last edited Feb 15, 2011 04:48AM) (new)

Félix (habitseven) My older brother's two children (boy & girl) are a mess. Both are now adult in age, but are completely unable/unwilling to do anything to support themselves. Fortunately/unfortunately they have trust funds that allow them to have very nice homes and cars without having to work ... for now. Heaven help them if the funds run dry.

My sister-in-law (with passive support of my brother) never made them do anything they didn't want to do. Every meal time was made up of three completely separate meals, two of which were the only things the kids would eat. They would just drop clothes and wet towels on the floor to be picked up by someone else. The never knew how to do any kind of homework for school on their own. "I don't understand this -- you do it." "Oh, okay."

The boy dropped out of HS his senior year, the girl made it to one semester of college. They both now live with their freeloading significant others, spending their lives online and playing games, with no signs of ever getting a job (neither having ever worked a day).

My s-i-l had a horrid childhood, I know. Her whack-job father and mother split when she was small (her mom left when her father was stationed overseas, leaving s-i-l to take care of her sibs and her dad). So she has completely over-compensated by never putting any demands on her kids for anything in terms of behavior. She needed counseling so badly.

It's all very sad. But my brother and his wife have no clue about what they have done -- though everyone else in the family can see it clearly. The boy will probably get caught up in some bad drug deal someday -- and the girl is 3 times normal weight because all she eats is junk food at 5 times normal amounts.


message 43: by Helena (new)

Helena | 1058 comments Larry wrote: "My older brother's two children (boy & girl) are a mess. Both are now adult in age, but are completely unable/unwilling to do anything to support themselves. Fortunately/unfortunately they have t..."

That’s very sad, Larry. I have a niece and nephew that are headed down the same road. Their parents both had fairly horrid childhoods and are overcompensating in the same ways. The rest of the family just tries to spend time with the kids as much as possible, and hopefully this will have a bit of a positive influence on them.


message 44: by Jim (new)

Jim | 6485 comments Yikes Larry, that is terrible.


message 45: by Félix (new)

Félix (habitseven) It really is.


message 46: by RandomAnthony (new)

RandomAnthony | 14536 comments Does anyone worry that complaining about "today's kids" is sort of a "this damn new generation" thing? Like we're all going to yell at kids to stay off of our lawns, so to speak? Are this generation's kids so different? I'm genuinely asking...I'm not saying by implication saying today's kids are different is wrong.


message 47: by Jim (new)

Jim | 6485 comments Sure todays kids are different, they are growing up in a different world. They have a completely different experience growing up than we did, not better not worse just different. The things they are exposed to are so different than what we had growing up that if there perspective and attitudes weren't different I would probably be scared.


message 48: by Kevin (new)

Kevin  (ksprink) | 11469 comments friendly's quiz - what do they call the things they put on top of ice cream?


message 49: by Félix (new)

Félix (habitseven) Kevin "El Liso Grande" wrote: "friendly's quiz - what do they call the things they put on top of ice cream?"

Jimmies.


message 50: by smetchie (new)

smetchie | 4034 comments I developed an immediate bias against the article in the first paragraph when I learned the author's son's name was "Fountain." I'm not proud of myself. I'm just letting you know. I hate articles about parenting most of the time for some reason or other. I'm trying so hard to do my best and not get caught up in all the "leading opinions." I have one daughter who's not picky, loves dinner and eats huge plate-fulls. I have another who would rather graze all day. She sits at the table with the rest of us but she'll only eat a small amount, even when it's her favorite. I could restrict her snacks so she was hungrier at dinner but I just don't see the point. (Her snacks are healthy) I love having dinner as a family and sometimes I get frustrated when I cook for an hour and she only eats 4 bites. But I just can't bring myself to fight with my kids about food. There are so many other things I care more about. They don't eat junk food and I introduce them to lots of different foods. I'm satisfied with that.

I'm with you Sally! I hate when we have people over who tell my kids they have to clean their plate and try to bargain with them about eating vegetables. I don't know if I'm just worn out or what but it's not important to me.


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