Fantasy Book Club Series discussion
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Traitor's Knot
Wars of Light and Shadow
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Traitor’s Knot: Secrets of the F7 continuing to be revealed - *SPOILERS*
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Interesting, John. I have been unable to suss out Davien's motivations, but I think part of it lies in the short story, Child of Prophecy, about the price being too high - the people who die or go crazy when exposed to the Paravians too many. I wonder if he's saying Humans will always fail or if he's saying the system is too precarious to succeed.
Good spotting, John! (on Davien's motivation for breaking silence) -- which was oh so subtle an inference in the actual sequence shown in the prior volume.Also nice call on which quotes to pull to highlight the issues between the Fellowship and Davien.
Sandra raises some cogent points: feel free to keep on speculating!
There's a conversation between Davien and Arithon near the beginning of the book, in the chapter 'Wakening' that I think has many clues. I read it yesterday and realized that I hadn't understood it, so went back to read it again. A) if I knew before that Davien had opposed the compact to allow mankind to come down to Athera.
B) Arithon saw that Davien wished to guard against the horrid consequences if the compact broke down. The historian's version and Davien's version appear to diverge.
C) it was the drake's binding that kept the sorcerers from going mad when they first encountered the Paravians.
D) Davien insists it was not the centaur guardian that gave Arithon the grace to forgive himself, but that it was within Arithon himself. He then announces that Arithon is his fit weapon, to champion the cause of humanity.
Arithon is horrified as the curse still has hold on him. Davien insists that all he need do is live his life and rely on the consequences, either way.
Arithon then descends into his mage sight and sees that either he accept the mantle of rule or mankind is doomed. Davien says the sorcerers have no choice and have not the means to break the binding of the drakes. He does not answer when Arithon asks if they would try.
I have outlined this passage as I understand it. Am I right? Anyone have any other interpretations?
This would seem to explain your question, John about how Arithon entered into the business with the necromancers without a safety net.
And it seems to imply, in connection with your above quote of the scene between Sethvir and Davien, that even if Arithon does accept the mantle and rule, mankind has little chance of survival.
Actually, I am continuing my reread and in the scene between Sethvir and Davien it seems to me that what Davien is saying is that the system is what's unstable. He supports the compact and the return of the Paravians, but he's 'created' a tool - Arithon - who he hopes will be able to manage the salvation of what is important - mankind and the Paravians.Or at least that was my impression while reading it yesterday.
Also, it is quite clear that Davien wants to save both mankind and Athera.
What do you make of this passage?Sethvir (to Davien): "Would you abandon the grace of the mystery that gave us our release and redemption?"
Davien; "Would? Or Could?" "The question beckons, Sethvir, does it not? Can you say in the depths of your tormented dreams you have not pursued the temptation? To just walk away? Cross Fate's Wheel and be done? Leave Athera's fate to fall or to languish - why not let the flow of the mysteries fail? Death is the mask that drives the illusion. Why not let the darkness unveil its own light, and resurrect the its next hope of salvation?"
Sethvir: "Ciladis could not."
"Would you finally tear us asunder, Davien, and seal this planet's entropic destruction?"
Yes. Very interesting indeed. But he is also torn as he cares.Since the Fellowship are trapped in their 'bargain' with the drakes, I can imagine that it gets pretty damn tiresome. The eons they have been living, it must be hard not to get tired to death of mankind and their petty to downright evil squabbles. I thought about living 500 years when both princes drank from Davien's fountain. I can't imagine living that long - watching those you love age and die, loss after loss after loss. I've considered that with vampire stories I've read - what it would be like to live forever. Gah. I don't think I'd like it at all, atal.
Jon wrote: "From my status update yesterday on the Appeal chapter set: Query: Was the original binding made by the drakes done against the free will choice of the Seven? And, irony or ironies, were they th..."
Are you asking the author or the group at large, to speculate?
Janny wrote: "Are you asking the author or the group at large, to speculate?"Either, both. :)
Jon wrote: "Janny wrote: "Are you asking the author or the group at large, to speculate?"Either, both. :)"
The oversimplified answer: no, they were not taken against their will.
All the layers and levels of that event are very likely to come out in the main story as it continues to unfold.
Janny wrote: "All the layers and levels of that event are very likely to come out in the main story as it continues to unfold. "Any more tidbits in Stormed Fortress? I'm dreading reading the last published novel as I won't have any new 'answers' until November! :)
Jon wrote: "Janny wrote: "All the layers and levels of that event are very likely to come out in the main story as it continues to unfold. "Any more tidbits in Stormed Fortress? I'm dreading reading the last..."
Stormed Fortress is huge - grin. Yes, you will learn a lot more about the F7 there.
Note: Stormed Fortress is an Arc finale - it will cap off and tie many threads and deliver things you cannot imagine. I don't leave cliff hangers, ever, and the pause point (as an arc ending) will be comfortable.
Initiate's Trial is an arc start; it will stage for a new level, entirely. However, unlike Fugitive Prince, it will NOT gear back in pace; the series entire is past tipping point.
Convergency and pacing will only pick up. But still, no cliff hangers, there will always be that climactic peak and pause point.
There are sneak previews posted on the Paravia site, and speculation aplenty. For me, I fear the time till Oct. 27th will fly past, as I finish the artwork and start the next volume.
* “You have not abandoned your care,” Sethvir added. Or why else did you break your sealed silence in Kewar? Why, on the very moment that Lysaer s’Illessid first let his blood with a tainted bone knife?” (339) So we have that question answered about what triggered Davien's renewed activity in the world.
* We continue to get answers and hints at answers about Davien's disagreement with the Fellowship. From the conversation between Davien and Sethvir:
“A double jeopardy throw,” pronounced Davien. “Let’s see which priority rules your choice this time. Our binding made under the will of the dragons to preserve the mysteries for Paravian survival, or else the bleeding-heart clemency that gave rise to the threat allowed in the compact.”
Ingrained beyond words, the contention that had chafed to unreconciled argument, then the wounding fracture that had rocked the world to the brink of disaster. […]
“We both care,” admitted the renegade Sorceror, first to snap off that locked stare. “But we do not agree.” Restless as a wind-driven leaf that crossed and recrossed the smooth floor, Davien paced. “Not over the risk of a human presence kept within bounds through your vaunted charters. We’ve been through this before. Shall I try again? Your system of clan intercession, based in a law administered by the high kingships, is unstable. I have no desire to labor for ages, with failure the axe blade poised over my neck.” (340)
In other words, Davien would apparently agree that "No man may serve two masters," that their binding by the drakes to preserve the conditions necessary for Paravian survival are at odds with the allowance of the human refugees settling on Athera. Humans, Davien seems to be believe, regardless of the attempted safeguards, will always fail in the end.
I'm sure there's more to say here, but I'll leave that for another post (or even other posters).