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message 1: by Donna (new)

Donna  (ncdonnas) I really loved Anne Rice's Vampire Chronicles as well as her series that began with Witching Hour. I thought her very public "conversion to Christianity so I can no longer write dark fantasy" thing was a bit strange but now her public and over dramatic "I quit Christianity in the name of Christ" is even more strange. Although I hope this means she'll get back to the dark fantasy writing style that I loved so much from her. Plus, I have to say, it was pretty funny (to me anyway) What do you think?

http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vid...


message 2: by Amanda (new)

Amanda M. Lyons (amandamlyons) I don't get any of it. I loved all of her books before the Jesus books and I tried to read them but...I just can't :(


message 3: by Caity (new)

Caity (adivineeternity) Ooh, it's good to see that someone enjoyed the Mayfair Witches books. I have the first, which I bought for just over $2.50, and the third, which I picked up for free at a bookcrossing station, and the second is on its way.


message 4: by Amanda (new)

Amanda M. Lyons (amandamlyons) They're just as good as the vamps :)I love her other non series books as well. Servant of the Bones was awesome!


message 5: by Jason (new)

Jason (darkfiction) | 3204 comments I was a big fan of both series, too. I'm not sure if I'd still like them, today. I know that I hated the last two books she did before the Jesus books. Blackwood Farm and Blood Canticle (I think).

They both read, IMO, like she was simply doing it to fulfill a contract or something.

I haven't even bothered with the Jesus books. I hope that she returns to dark fantasy as well.


message 6: by Aloha (new)

Aloha | 940 comments The audio for The Vampire Lestat sounds like it's going to be really good. I'm thinking of listening either to that or The Lovely Bones in my drive today.


message 7: by Tressa (new)

Tressa  (moanalisa) I don't think Rice will be doing any more Jesus books from now on.


message 8: by Amanda (new)

Amanda M. Lyons (amandamlyons) Jason wrote: "I was a big fan of both series, too. I'm not sure if I'd still like them, today. I know that I hated the last two books she did before the Jesus books. Blackwood Farm and [book:Blood C..."

Yeah I was bummed out by those books. Especially Blackwood Farm where she tried to tie off the witches series too :(


message 9: by Jason (new)

Jason (darkfiction) | 3204 comments Tressa wrote: "I don't think Rice will be doing any more Jesus books from now on."

I think you might be right! LOL. But who knows with her? Maybe she'll become a Buddhist and write Buddha books now.


message 10: by Jason (new)

Jason (darkfiction) | 3204 comments Amanda wrote: "Jason wrote: "I was a big fan of both series, too. I'm not sure if I'd still like them, today. I know that I hated the last two books she did before the Jesus books. Blackwood Farm and..."

The one I really hated was the very last book. I think it's Blood Canticle. And I hated it for this reason:

###SPOILER###

When Lestat goes to the Cuban jungle and slaughtered all those drug cartel people and warlords or whatever, it just seemed ridiculous to me. Don't get me wrong, I could see Lestat doing such a thing, for sure, but I was not expecting the Arnold Schwarzenegger version of Lestat. I almost threw the book across the room. LOL


message 11: by Jason (new)

Jason (darkfiction) | 3204 comments Aloha wrote: "The audio for The Vampire Lestat sounds like it's going to be really good. I'm thinking of listening either to that or The Lovely Bones in my drive today."

This might be a great way to find out if I still enjoy the series. Thanks for the idea, Aloha!


message 12: by Jackie (last edited Oct 14, 2010 05:28AM) (new)

Jackie (thelastwolf) | 857 comments The early Vampire Chronicles were good. The Witching Hour was great but the rest of the series went downhill.
Blackwood Farm and Violin sucked too. Sometimes an author should just know when to quit. The Jesus shit was over the top, though. Like, really? You think your fan base wants to read that? She lost me for good. I'll never buy or read anything new by her.

I have The Feast of All Saints on my shelf for about 4 years now, eventually I'll get to it. Anyone read it? How is it?


message 13: by Lori (new)

Lori (barfield) | 49 comments What i don't get is, Why did she ever come out like that in the first place? And now she's doing it again only backwards. Why? To most people Religion is a sacred thing, you share with others who believe as you do. In doing this she's just as bad as say George Clooney when he's out there spitting out all that hot air about politics. Just write vampire books and be quite.


message 14: by Jackie (last edited Oct 14, 2010 05:26AM) (new)

Jackie (thelastwolf) | 857 comments I think Rice wrecked her career with that move. She should have done like you say, shut up and keep writig vampire books. Personally, I don't care what anyone's beliefs are. As long as they don't hurt me or mine.
These celebrities crack me up, as if they're somebody and their opinions are more valid than anyone else's. But here's the funny part to me, with the actors and politics; they're paid to lie, that's their job: to pretend and they're good at it. So why the hell would I listen to a word they say? People really are stupid.


message 15: by Lori (new)

Lori (barfield) | 49 comments CAN I GET AN AMEN SISTER!!!


message 16: by Jason (new)

Jason (darkfiction) | 3204 comments I wonder what Anne Rice will write now that's she's again left the church. Maybe she should write about a woman who doesn't know where she stands. LOL


message 17: by Jackie (last edited Sep 19, 2010 09:45AM) (new)

Jackie (thelastwolf) | 857 comments Jason,
At least she'd write what she knows, hahahaha


message 18: by Jason (new)

Jason (darkfiction) | 3204 comments Very true! LOL


message 19: by Brainycat (last edited Sep 20, 2010 08:31PM) (new)

Brainycat | 70 comments What I can't believe is that she thought (according to an interview on NPR I heard) she would be able to influence the catholic church "from inside". She stated she left when she realized the catholic hierarchy wasn't going to change it's position on homosexuality*. I'm not sure if her story means she has delusions of grandeur, she's wildly uninformed or she's giving us some kind of lame cop-out. Either way I've lost respect for her as a public figure.

*insert pedophile priest joke here


message 20: by Jackie (new)

Jackie (thelastwolf) | 857 comments From what I understand, when her husband died is when she went back to the church. I can understand wanting/needing to believe in something that says Hey, your husband is alive in heaven. Where she F'd up was by putting it into her professional life.

What is it with modern Americans; they feel compelled to make private issues very public, ie. religion and politics. Don't they know that no one cares what they think? LOL


message 21: by Jason (new)

Jason (darkfiction) | 3204 comments I agree with both Brainycat and Jackie. I think that it's also possible that Anne Rice is completely insane! I stopped reading her when she put out her Jesus books. I have no plans on going back, unless what she writes about now sounds interesting.


message 22: by Jackie (last edited Oct 14, 2010 05:29AM) (new)

Jackie (thelastwolf) | 857 comments That's when I dropped her too.
But here's what really pissed me off:
The advertisement for that first Jesus book made it sound like an completely different and unique book, something about Jesus cursing a child and the child dies. So I thought, interesting, the flip side of what we'd heard about Jesus. But the book proved to be nothing of the sort. And her foreword just made me realize she's like every other zealot: pathological and illogical.
So she faked me out and I learned my lesson; she'll never fool me again. I'll never buy any of her books ever.


message 23: by Amanda (new)

Amanda M. Lyons (amandamlyons) Jackie wrote: "The early Vampire Chronicles were good. The Witching Hour was gread but the rest of the series went downhill.
Blackwood Farm and Violin sucked too. Sometimes an author should just know when to..."


Feast of All Saints is excellent as are pretty much most of the books preceding Blood Canticle. It's a historical novel dealing with quadroons (people with about one quarter African blood or passing as such) in New Orleans. It offers pretty much everything I enjoyed about her passionate characters, real history and an interesting look into the way others once lived.


message 24: by Jackie (new)

Jackie (thelastwolf) | 857 comments Amanda wrote: It offers pretty much everything I enjoyed about her passionate characters, real history and an interesting look into the way others once lived.

Maybe it'll be worth my time, then. I really enjoyed some of Rice's characters, I hope that'll happen with Feast. I don't know when I'll get to it but you're response kept me from giving it away.


message 25: by Amanda (new)

Amanda M. Lyons (amandamlyons) Jackie wrote: "Amanda wrote: It offers pretty much everything I enjoyed about her passionate characters, real history and an interesting look into the way others once lived.

Maybe it'll be worth my time, then...."


It's one of my favorite one book pieces from her. I'm glad I helped you make a decision!

Which books are your favorites? I was always a big fan of the Mayfair Witches and the earlier Vampire Chronicles but also enjoyed books like The Servant of the Bones.

I can also recommend her sister Alice Borchardt at least as far as wonderful historical books. Unfortunately she passed away a few years ago so there wont be anything new from her.

I think losing her big sister along with her husband and the diabetic coma that nearly killed her knocked her mind out of whack. I still hope she'll come back to writing the fiction I enjoyed but I'm not holding out any hopes after all this craziness over religion.


message 26: by Jackie (new)

Jackie (thelastwolf) | 857 comments The early Vampire Chronicles, The Witching Hour are my favorites.

I read The Dragon Queen, The Raven Warrior, The Silver Wolf, Night of the Wolf and The Wolf King by Alice Borchardt. They were OK but a bit unnecessarily long winded.


message 27: by Amanda (new)

Amanda M. Lyons (amandamlyons) Jackie wrote: "The early Vampire Chronicles, The Witching Hour are my favorites.

I read The Dragon Queen, The Raven Warrior, The Silver Wolf, [book:Night of the Wolf|2..."


Her better books are actually Devoted and Beguiled the first two she ever published.


message 28: by Jackie (new)

Jackie (thelastwolf) | 857 comments Good to know. If I ever see them at a sale, I'll pick them up.


message 29: by JoLene (new)

JoLene (trvl2mtns) Rice was one of my fav authors back in the day when she started Vampire Chronicles and the Mayfair witch series. Besides the first two in the series, I thought that Memnoch the Devil was very interesting. I think that's where I stopped reading.

Rice's public return to the church was not actually "out of character" for her (not that I'm defending her). While writing the Vampire Chronicles, she was also very public about how the character of Lestat and the idea of being immortal was heavily influenced by the death of her daughter (at age 4 or something). I lived in New Orleans where Rice lived for many years so maybe that is why I heard about it, but I know that she often talked about it.


message 30: by [deleted user] (new)

I'm honestly just confused as to why there's even a thread dedicated to Anne Rice. She doesn't write fantasy novels. I mean in what sense would any of her vamp novels be considered part of the fantasy genre as opposed to gothic horror? The closest subset I could see her even being faintly associated with would be urban fantasy and even then I don't think it's a fair association. Don't get me wrong, I used to be a fan of her early novels but still it makes as much sense to discuss Anne Rice in a fantasy group as it would a Reagan biography *shrugs*


message 31: by Jason (new)

Jason (darkfiction) | 3204 comments Interesting point. I think that her books might fit in here because Rice was one of the first to write about the monsters as the protagonist. Her vampire series is so popular that it helped spark energy into the paranormal romance genre, which is, I think, a big part of urban fantasy.


message 32: by [deleted user] (new)

I can see your point but there's such a fine line between urban fantasy and paranormal romance. For example, Kim Harrison's The Hollows series falls into urban fantasy while Charlaine Harris' Southern Vampire novels fall into paranormal romance/mystery fiction. Rice's vampire series did indeed help get the proverbial ball rolling but she's a self described author of gothic horror and more recently christian fiction. *shrugs* Eh. Nitpicky, I know. I'm a bit ocd, what can I say.


message 33: by JoLene (new)

JoLene (trvl2mtns) I guess that I always thought that gothic horror is a sub-genre of fantasy.


message 34: by [deleted user] (last edited Jan 10, 2011 10:28PM) (new)

No ma'am. Gothic horror is just another reference to Gothic fiction. Horror is the genre and gothic the subgenre. It's generally depicted as a combination of horror and romance but has no connection to the fantasy genre. *sigh* Lord, novels these days just tend to run over multiple genre's and when one doesn't fit exactly a new subset suddenly arises to add to the confusion. Yay, English :)


message 35: by JoLene (new)

JoLene (trvl2mtns) I guess because at the bookstore, fantasy and science fiction are in one section and horror is there too, I assumed that it was considered part of the uber- definition of fantasy. However, I do realize that this is a flawed system since many authors actually write books for mulitple genres but at the bookstore, they usually only have one home (example, Stephen Lawhead).


message 36: by [deleted user] (new)

I have a friend who is a huge science fiction fan. He's big into star trek and star wars movies and books (none of which I've ever seen or read) and we argue constantly about how science fiction and fantasy are grouped together in book stores and even online. I've always thought it an injustice to both genres that retailers and libraries alike often throw science fiction and fantasy novels together when (outside of a few cross genre novels like S.M. Stirling's) they really explore different areas of fiction and don't truly mesh. Lol...I swear this is like a bad itch that I've had for years that I will Never Ever get to scratch :) Stupid science fiction.


message 37: by Christine (new)

Christine I know this is going to start a big long debate because it has with my son over the last five years. He's a huge science fiction fan. I went back to school and got my degree not too long ago and one of the classes I took was a fantasy literature class. My professor had science fiction as a subgenre of fantasy. By his definition of high fantasy, it fit. I'm not completely convinced of this but it explains why these genres may be grouped together in stores and libraries.

Grant, as a young man who reads fantasy obviously, how have you NOT read or seen Star Wars or Star Trek?


message 38: by [deleted user] (new)

Lol...actually I tend to semi agree with your professor. I had a similar debate with one of my own professors years ago. He took the same stance as your professor and we both agreed that science fiction had derived from the fantasy genre as evidenced by their similarites in theme, plot and even setting (other worlds). I, however, argued that Science Fiction had grown over the years and had so many of it's own offshoots that while it derived from Fantasy it could no longer be associated as a subgenre of Fantasy and existed independently as it's own genre. It was a long debate. Heh...I also argued with my Art professor that post modernists all sucked and had the ability and vision of semi blind apes and that all poetry should freaking rhyme so I'm clearly not one who always argues the most popular of opinions ;)

As for Star Wars and Star Trek..well...it's just not my bag. I have tons of friends who are into those things but it's just never held an interest for me. I was fortunate enough to travel the world as a child and young man and to see many of the worlds historical sites...it left an indelible impression. I was the little boy that wanted to be a knight when he grew up...I just had the added bonus of getting pretend I was one while seeing Stonehenge and the Coliseum and the Mayan Temples. I've been a lost cause ever since and a hardcore Fantasy elitist. Don't get me wrong, I have no issue with science fiction or it's fans...I think the worlds big enough that everyone can have their loves and likes without my approval ;) I just simply have such a passion for Fantasy that other genre's tend to pale in comparison. Go figure.


message 39: by Christine (new)

Christine You are close in the position I have taken on Science Fiction and Fantasy. When I have a little more time I will dig out my notes so I can argue my point a little better. I also think that as technology has changed, so has Science Fiction. It has to stand on its own now. Like I said, this has been a long debate with my son and one that will be ongoing as the genres change.

Since Star Wars and Star Trek are so well known in popular culture, it is refreshing to find someone who has not watched them. I love both but not the type of fan that goes to conventions or dresses up as Princess Leia every Halloween. LOL. You are so lucky to have had the experience of travel in your early life and I can see where your interests would be elsewhere. You are right, the world is big enough for everyone to follow their own passions and that is what makes it an interesting world and that we can be different.


message 40: by [deleted user] (new)

That would be great. I'd love to hear your stance :)


message 41: by Christine (new)

Christine I am a relative newbie to Fantasy/Science Fiction so I might not be arguing this in the right way but here goes.

There are six motifs to high fantasy. They are:

1. magic
2. a hero's quest
3. a battle between good and evil
4. a suspended reality which usually involves a move to an alternate world.
5. special character types (ex. fairies, pixies, giants, vampires, etc)
6. special talisman or fantastic object

Right off the bat, most people say SF, no magic. True, but what is science without imagination and experimentation, isn't that a little like magic. All the other elements are in SF so I rest my case, making it an easy fit into the genre of Fantasy for me. However, SF has technology of some kind. It also has very clear moral points and most SF books deal with ecology. So does that keep them in Fantasy or move them into their own genre. I think the technology can be the thing that puts SF in its own genre especially as the world changes. Then there is a new term floating around called Speculative Fiction, which Margaret Atwood's Oryx and Crake and Year of the Flood has been put into. So where does that belong?


message 42: by [deleted user] (new)

Hmm..I don't agree with your motifs per se, as I feel that you could have a high fantasy novel that didn't contain all of your listed motifs. However, I do agree that Science Fiction has grown with technology and has become something that really holds very little resemblance to Fantasy and therefore must stand alone as its own genre. As for Speculative fiction...Ugh. I hate that there are new subgenres being thrown into the mix daily. I think all fantasy should be categorized in one of four categories. Epic Fantasy, High Fantasy, Low Fantasy, Urban Fantasy. I realize that Epic and High fantasy are synonymous however I've always felt that it was inherently wrong. I could explain that further but it would take more time than I have at the moment :) Yaaay work.


message 43: by Christine (new)

Christine Until I took that class, I was not aware that there was an academic definition of High Fantasy or any other kind of Fantasy. Let alone that motifs were involved, LOL. I do think that these elements are important to Fantasy of any kind. I want them in the books I read. I appreciate that authors are coming up with books that don't fit in any particular category. That their imagination pushes us to see this world and alternate worlds in new and exciting ways. I think Science Fiction does an amazing job of looking at the abuses of technology and our environment that could and have had disastrous consequences. In a lot of ways Fantasy and Science Fiction work as a conscious for our society. In both genres, good and evil are clearly defined and when times are tough, people escape to Fantasy/SF to see where those lines are clearly defined, because in the real world, there are no clear distinctions. There are some seriously messed up things going on now. Well I am not sure how I got from discussing the motifs of Fantasy to this but I appreciate you reading the ramblings of a fellow reader.


message 44: by [deleted user] (new)

*smiles* I'm enjoying it thoroughly and couldn't agree more with your last post. Don't stop on my account ;)


message 45: by Christine (new)

Christine You sure do get around! You are all over the place on GR! Good for you! I'm glad you're here.

What I forgot to ask you in my last post is, have you read Oryx and Crake and/or The Year of the Flood by Margaret Atwood? You seem to stick close to Fantasy. Just wondered if you wandered into "Speculative Fiction"?


message 46: by [deleted user] (new)

Lol...I don't believe in doing anything halfway ;) And I'm very glad to be here.

I've read both of the books in question actually and I think they're properly categorized as science fiction and that Ms. Atwood is just a bit full of herself to request that her novel be placed in it's very own category. When you're making up your own combinations of animals using genetic engineering in a post apocalyptic society using real and made up forms of technology....yyyyyeah that's scifi. :)


message 47: by Christine (new)

Christine I don't know if she gave herself the term or it was put there by booksellers or publishers. Knowing Margaret Atwood, she probably did it. I agree she is a bit full of herself but she does write a good cautionary tale(s). The whole time I was reading those books I didn't know if I was supposed to laugh or run and find a bunker somewhere and live out the rest of my days free from any societal influences. Did you know there is to be a third?


message 48: by [deleted user] (last edited Jan 12, 2011 02:56PM) (new)

Id read that though I dont really see where she'll be going with a third. If you enjoyed her books then I'd strongly recommend S.M. Stirling's Emberverse series. The novels tell the tale of a major catastrophic event which basically throws the modern world back to medieval technological levels. Combustible engines, explosives and even electricity simply no longer work. The laws of science have changed at the most fundamental levels. The novels follow the progress of man (specifically a few groups of people, both heroes and villians) from the moment of the change throughout the next few years which is really interesting because it paints a portrait of how various people cope with basically being thrown back to the dark ages. It's gritty and dark in many respects but there's also alot of hope in some of the characters and overall it's really interesting how he ties in popular fantasy themes to how a post apocalyptic world could survive and eventually even thrive :) I'd be glad to email you the epubs if you like.


message 49: by Christine (new)

Christine I read the first one, and possibly the second. I will have to check back in my book journals, my pre-Goodreads list of books read. The first book was compelling with airplanes dropping out of the sky, etc. And what I found refreshing in this type of book was the sense of hope. I see you felt the same way. It seems to be lacking in most of these post apocalyptic books/films of late. Could this be a reflection of real life? hmmmmm. Thanks for the offer of epubs but I am trying to get my TBR piles under control and not add to them. Maybe later?


message 50: by [deleted user] (new)

You got it


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