Clean Reads for Mormon Teenagers discussion

note: This topic has been closed to new comments.
Archives > Standards

Comments Showing 1-50 of 117 (117 new)    post a comment »
« previous 1 3

message 1: by Camilla (new)

Camilla | 31 comments My dad and I were kind of complaining on how "For the Strength of Youth" needed to be updated. Especially the Media section.

Anyway, my family got this book for Christmas that is called "Why?" It's on LDS standards and for all the teens that want to know "why" we have the standards that we have.

This book is basically another version of For The Strength of Youth but much more updated and modern. It has interactive stuff, an internet line, stories, comparisons, percentages, surveys, etc...

All you need to know about the church's standards are in Why?. Check it out!

message 2: by Halley (new)

Halley (jacketgirl) | 103 comments I love "Why?" it's such a good book!

message 3: by Camilla (new)

Camilla | 31 comments I love it too! In fact, I just read a part of it not even 5 minutes ago!

message 4: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
I'll definitely check it out! :)

message 5: by Laura (new)

Laura | 365 comments i will to

message 6: by Camilla (new)

Camilla | 31 comments You should read it; sooo good!

message 7: by Laura (new)

Laura | 365 comments all right

☼☺Caylpso☼☺ (oceangirl300) | 259 comments I've read it 5 times at least.

message 9: by Camilla (new)

Camilla | 31 comments Nice!

☼☺Caylpso☼☺ (oceangirl300) | 259 comments Camilla wrote: "Nice!"


message 11: by Hope (new)

 Hope | 265 comments I've never heard of it before, I'll have to look for it. Thanks!

message 12: by Lindsey (new)

Lindsey | 774 comments I saw it in a catalog a couple weeks ago.

☼☺Caylpso☼☺ (oceangirl300) | 259 comments What ?

message 14: by Lindsey (new)

Lindsey | 774 comments It's a book called 'Why?' and it's about standards.

☼☺Caylpso☼☺ (oceangirl300) | 259 comments ¿?¿???????

message 16: by Lindsey (new)

Lindsey | 774 comments Look at the first post in this topic ( :

message 17: by Rachael (new)

Rachael I've never heard of this before either. Does it have anything that specifically says we can't drink caffeine because I know of someone who thinks that it's okay even though the prophet said that it isn't.

message 18: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
I drink caffeine. It's not a "don't do it" type thing - it's a recommendation. Caffeine in moderation isn't necessarily a bad thing. Plus, it helps my headaches, so I kind of need it.

message 19: by [deleted user] (new)

I've always heard that we shouldn't drink coffee or caffeinated tea. There's caffeine in stuff like chocolate and Dr. Pepper, and I can have that. My brother drank half an energy drink, which he swore he'd only do in stay-up-late emergencies.

☼☺Caylpso☼☺ (oceangirl300) | 259 comments It still the same.Its bad even for an emergency . Thats what my mom says.

message 21: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
It's not bad in moderation. The church doesn't recommend drinking it, especially since it can become a daily habit (which can be considered an addiction - I'm not entirely sure if you CAN become addicted to caffeine, though) but in moderation I say it's fine. Plus, it has its medical uses, like I said.

☼☺Caylpso☼☺ (oceangirl300) | 259 comments Addiction are bad , so its bad all the way around it.

message 23: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
Not if you don't get addicted... You can become addicted to anything, so should we avoid everything???

message 24: by Lindsey (new)

Lindsey | 774 comments You can become addicted to anything? I've never heard of that. (not saying it is not true, it totally could be, I am just not aware that that is the case) I do know people who say they are addicted to caffeinated root beer and Cola though. It is not the best choice but in moderation it is not going to hurt you (if you are in a normal condition.

Plus once you have taken in something and are addicted it's not really like you can change the addiction. I mean you can ignore it and it might go away, and you don't have to give in to the addiction, but you can't just choose not to be addicted once you have injested something. I heard a true story of a man who when he learned of the gospel he quite smoking right away and never picked up a cigarette again, but he was still addicted to it and had the temptation his whole life of wanting it everyday, he just never gave in. I don't know about using it as medicine, I'm sure you know more about it than I do if you take it for headaches.

I looked this up on and found this link.

I really like it, I think it gives more clarification on the subject. I also think with coke it has to do with good better and best. I don't think it is the best thing to do to drink caffeinated pops but it is not horrible. I think if it is on a regular consistant basis than it could be an addiction which is then bad. So to stay away from it completely would be the best,- so you don't get an addiction- but this is all just my opinion ( :

message 25: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (last edited May 27, 2010 11:54AM) (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
Well, I was in a rush, so I worded that incorrectly :) I meant that you can become addicted to a lot of things (but that depends on how you would define an addiction, within itself) because plenty of things can be addictive. Like chocolate. I've known of people who have literally become addicted to chocolate and had a physical reaction when they went a day or two without it.

My mom's a convert and she was an alcoholic and smoked cigarettes a lot, but when she joined the church she stopped. But still, alcohol and cigarettes usually smell very appealing to her. But like Lindsay said, it's your choice to act upon that addiction - your don't have a choice in the addiction once you've placed it inside of you and your body has that addictive reaction.

I have alcoholism, cigarette/smoking addiction, drug addiction, and sex addiction in my life and whenever I pass someone smoking, or drinking it smells fantastic. However, it's my choice to have/take any of those once, but after that it's physically something I cannot control. I can control whether or not I feed that addiction, but the addiction itself is something I can't control.

However, like I said, this all depends on how you would define addiction. Would you define it as a habitual thing, or as something that you have a physical need/reaction to/for?

message 26: by Rachael (new)

Rachael I just want to say a little thing, chocolate doesn't have caffeine in it. My Mom got a degree in dietetics or something like that, I forget. Anyway, she said that it is a cousin to caffeine that doesn't have the addictive properties. I think its called theobromine or something. Just saying, I know you can get maybe get addicted to chocolate without the caffeine but it isn't actually caffeine.

message 27: by Rachael (new)

Rachael The problem that I have is that President Hinckley was asked on Larry King Live if Mormons drink caffeine and he said no. In my seminary room we have a sign that says "When the prophet speaks, the debate is over." So I think that since the Prophet said not to drink it that we shouldn't. I guess if you absolutely have to for medicinal purposes it is okay but otherwise I'm kind of frustrated that so many Mormons think it is okay when President Hinckley said that we shouldn't because whatever he says comes from the Savior.

message 28: by Rachael (new)

Rachael Lindsey that is a very good article, I totally agree.

message 29: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
I think it depends on the chocolate and the ingredients used to create it.

Cocoa beans
Cocoa beans undergo a process of drying and fermentation to develop the flavour and colour. The amount of caffeine in the beans varies with the type of beans and the degree of fermentation.

In an analysis of cocoa from various sources the following percentages of caffeine were found:

Percentage of Caffeine
Average (22 samples)



Cocoa powder
Cocoa powder contains caffeine. Depending on the degree of fermentation and the type of cocoa beans, the caffeine content will vary from 0.1-0.5%. In cocoa powders made from well fermented African cocoa beans the caffeine proportion is in general very low: 0.1% or less.

Levels of caffeine range from 2 to 23 milligrams in a typical 40 gram bar of milk chocolate and from 2 to 7 milligrams in a 227 gram glass of chocolate milk; both are the equivalent of that found in cups of decaffeinated coffee. A 28 gram piece of bittersweet (dark) chocolate contains from 5 to 35 milligrams of caffeine, still well under the approximately 75 milligrams of caffeine found in a 227 gram cup of instant coffee or the 140 milligrams found in the same amount of brewed coffee.

Cocoa butter
A study by Kiefer & Martin to determine the amounts of caffeine and theobromine in chocolate products found only small amounts of theobromine (0.008%) and caffeine (0.038%) in cocoa butter.

The cocoa manual. Cacao de Zaan, 1993, p 91-92)
Chocolate and health. A scientific overview for the health professional. Chocolate Manufacturers Association of the USA, 1997

Although, I do have to say that the information you gave is indeed very intriguing :) Thanks for sharing! I'm glad to know that, now!

But even Tylenol Ultra has caffeine in it ( because caffeine helps shrink the blood vessels in your head, which swell, causing the headache. That's the good thing about caffeine. I have headaches a LOT, especially with allergy season, so caffeine helps my headaches.

☼☺Caylpso☼☺ (oceangirl300) | 259 comments You know they that caffine helps with stuuf but its not ture at all . They are lairs . It will only ruin your body.

message 31: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
Do you have proof that it isn't true? It helps me in loads of ways. I'm kind of walking proof that caffeine can help in one way or another, because it helps me with my headaches :) It's scientifically proven that caffeine shrinks swollen blood vessels in the brain, which is what causes headaches in the first place.

a N d i E {o,o}  (thelolaizer) i don't drink coffee, alcohol, etc.

message 33: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
I don't either. I can only imagine how gross they taste :/ But to me they generally smell good, unfortunately! Specifically coffee. It reminds me of when I'd spend the night at my grandparents' house and my grandma would make some at 5AM :) Good times. I miss being young! Haha.

☼☺Caylpso☼☺ (oceangirl300) | 259 comments Well my mom wrote an article about this and I think you should read it .Heres what she said :

What’s Wrong with Cola
Written by Shiloah Baker
Friday, 09 January 2009 09:05

I grew up in a home that was strict with healthy living and eating. We rarely ate out, rarely had soda and when we did it never contained caffeine. We were all extremely healthy as children.
Over the last two years my soda consumption (especially of Coke) increased and my health decreased. I began to notice in the past year that every time I had caffeine I would break out in a terrible rash and later shakes. Since getting pregnant with my seventh baby I noticed it even more drastically. I don’t drink sodas as often when pregnant, but every time I did I would itch all over my body severely for four days! It was then that I decided to go cold turkey on the sodas and caffeine and to follow the council of our church leaders to not consume caffeine.
In the article You Are What You Drink , it states, “CHICAGO - A study says teenage girls who drink soda are far more likely to break a bone. The study was based on questionnaires filled out by 460 ninth- and tenth-grade girls in a Boston-area high school.
The risk of broken bones was three times greater for girls who drank carbonated beverages in general. These beverages included non-cola drinks like ginger ale. The risk was five times greater for active girls who drank colas…..
“Now, let's take a look at what happens to our bodies when we fill them up with soda pop.
First off, you already know that we're dehydrating our bodies if we consume soda pop without taking in enough water to counter the effects of the caffeine. But secondly, and most importantly, look at the pH of Coca-Cola. It is decidedly acidic. Now, doctors recommend what for heartburn? Something your body needs anyway? Tums? What is in Tums? Calcium?
Calcium buffers acidity. Many people with heartburn find relief by taking only calcium tablets.
When the body becomes acidic, it goes to the Calcium Stores and borrows a little to return the body back to normal. Homeostasis, the body’s ability/tendency to maintain equilibrium, is maintained by buffering the acid with calcium, and the left over calcium is sent to the kidneys to be washed away.”
My friend Dawn and I are going through a “break away from soda” learning period. She is far more addicted, but at first we thought my body was far more affected by it. As she is coming off this “drug”- so to speak- she is realizing how many symptoms her body was actually going through too!
In the article: “Colas and Sugar” found at, Marian Butler, is a Missionary Health Specialist for the LDS Church. Her job is to keep people healthy during unusual circumstances.
“When I went in to visit one mission, the mission president was a Coke drinker. Because of this, he didn't make any suggestions to the missionaries along this line. Many of the local missionaries thought that drinking pop or Coke Cola was better than water because it was bottled.

You can put a huge dose of typhoid in a bottle of Coca Cola and in 24 hours it will be sterile because all the junk in Coke will kill almost anything. And that's a test that has been conducted….”

She goes on to tell of her experience interviewing all the missionaries in that zone. All of these young men, who normally should be in fantastic health, had one medical condition after another. This particular mission was located in the hottest mission on the earth. She found that most of them were drinking 3 liters- not of water- but of Coke a day! She shares with them this talk:
"All this talk about food is making me hungry. I'm starving. Do you mind if I just have a little snack? I'm starving and quite weak." So I get out my little bowl which is full of bran flakes. Then I say, "I always use a little sugar on my cereal, excuse me." Then I pull out the sugar bowl and I put one, two, three, four - and I count out loud - five six seven. When I'm finished there is a heap of sugar on top of it - seven teaspoons of sugar on top of my cereal.
"Oh Sister Butler," they all say.
So, I say, "Ok, would you like to eat this?"
To the last man, they say, "No, it's too much sugar."
So I trap them. "In each six ounce bottle of pop you will find seven tea spoons of sugar in it. Elder So and So is drinking three liters of Coke a day. That's something like 96 teaspoons of sugar a day and you are wondering why his body isn't functioning properly!"

Here she is only speaking of the amount of sugar in sodas!
According to the Body Ecology Diet site (Body Ecology Diet ), "One teaspoon of sugar is proven to wipe out the immune system…"

”We've formed an emotional attachment to sweets, but the average American has been consuming high, unhealthy levels of refined sugars (we call them carbs these days) and artificial sweeteners (like NutraSweet, Equal, Asulphame K and Splenda). The consequences of a high sugar diet include diabetes, weight gain, Candida and cravings for even more sugar.”

Not to mention the caffeine! I’m not going to get into caffeine in this article. We all know that it is a habit forming and addicting drug. Just as I want my children to stay away from drugs, I need to lead by example! Unfortunately, it was a hard and miserable lesson learned and my body has much recovering to do.
Back to Marian Butler‘s article, which is a fantastic closing for my own, she says, “I deal with the fact that the Word of Wisdom is a correct principle and that the Lord doesn't have to spell out caffeine, Coke, and all that stuff. It is a principle. We do everything we can to keep our body healthy. I think the major problem with Coke, though, is the caffeine. But the sugar is certainly right up there when you start drinking it in those amounts. The Lord didn't say Arsenic was against the Word of Wisdom. He didn't spell that out. And Arsenic isn't even habit forming. But it will kill you. So, this is an example of where the principle comes in. It's a principle with a promise. You abide by those principles, do everything you can to keep your body healthy, and you will be healthy.”

Related News Articles:

India Bans Colas Due To Pesticides

☼☺Caylpso☼☺ (oceangirl300) | 259 comments Jayda wrote: "I don't either. I can only imagine how gross they taste :/ But to me they generally smell good, unfortunately! Specifically coffee. It reminds me of when I'd spend the night at my grandparents' hou..."

Thats wrong !

message 36: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (last edited May 28, 2010 07:20AM) (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
I read your mom's article, and it was very interesting, and well written. The fact that those missionaries drank three liters of Coke a day is RIDICULOUS. I would NEVER drink that many a day! I drink tons of water all day long (so I don't get dehydrated - it's easier for me to do so than the average person because of my medical problems), and I try to keep my headaches in check to the point where I can just drink a Sprite instead of something with caffeine - but that doesn't mean that the caffeine doesn't help me physically.

My sister was born a few months premature. Doctors pump premature babies with caffeine daily because it helps develop their organs. So my sister would get at least one pump of caffeine a day into her IV because it helped sustain her life and helped her grow. Is that wrong, that it's helping sustain and grow a life? One of our friends had her baby three months early, I think, and they gave the baby three pumps of caffeine a day, which led to the growth and strength of the baby. I'm not saying that caffeine can't be bad - in moderation it isn't necessarily addictive. It definitely depends on your genes, and how much you take it, and whether or not you have addictive tendencies, specifically towards things such as caffeine. I don't drink caffeine every day - mostly just when I have a headache. I'm not addicted, and I'm nowhere near becoming addicted. I use it for a medical purpose - for my headaches, and when I'm throwing up.

Coca-Cola was actually created as a cough syrup for when you had problems with your throat, or when you were throwing up. Sure, some things have indeed been added over the years, but the basic formula, as far as I'm aware, is still the same.

message 37: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
I Love My Pic . Do You ? ( Calypso) wrote: "Jayda wrote: "I don't either. I can only imagine how gross they taste :/ But to me they generally smell good, unfortunately! Specifically coffee. It reminds me of when I'd spend the night at my gra..."

What's wrong?

message 38: by Rachael (last edited May 28, 2010 10:45AM) (new)

Rachael I know I'm a bit late in responding but...that's a little weird because I looked up chocolate on wikipedia and it only said about the theobromine, which as I said is a cousin to caffeine. Maybe they just called it caffeine because more people would recognize it and relate to it instead of just saying, what do I care what % of theobromine is in chocolate, I don't even know what that is?!

message 39: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
Hahahaha :) Your comment made me smile :)

No, there are certain cocoas that have actual caffeine in it, and others that have theobromine in it. It depends on where the chocolate factories buy their cocoa from. And sadly Wikipedia is not a reliable source for information - anyone can edit it :/

a N d i E {o,o}  (thelolaizer) Jayda wrote: "I don't either. I can only imagine how gross they taste :/ But to me they generally smell good, unfortunately! Specifically coffee. It reminds me of when I'd spend the night at my grandparents' hou..."

Well, lots of people like different smells of things, so I don't think its a bad thing if you like the smell of coffee as long as you don't drink it! :)

message 41: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (last edited May 29, 2010 07:41AM) (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
Yeah, I don't drink it :) I asked my mom what it tastes like, since she's a convert and she used to drink coffee and tea and alcohol all the time, and she said that it doesn't taste nearly as good as any of it smells :) Haha. I'd never try any of it, anyway. I have the genes to become addicted to such things! They just smell really good :) Haha.

Well... not tea. I hate the smell of tea! And the tastes isn't that good either. I only know that because one time Zaxby's gave me an iced tea with lemon in it instead of lemonade, so I took a sip and found out the hard way what it was. It was DISGUSTING. So you know I'll never be drinking that stuff :) Haha.

message 42: by Rachael (new)

Rachael Sometimes instead of being driven we'd have to walk a little ways to our school and there was this coffee/breakfast place and I remember thinking 'something smells really good.' It took me quite a few times of walking past it to finally figure out what it was I was smelling. Yeah, I wish that they would put restrictions on Wikipedia of who can edit what.

message 43: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
Haha. I love the smell of Starbucks, particularly :) They have one in the Target near our house and whenever I walk past it it's like heaven! Haha. But Starbuck's hot chocolate is AMAZING. I mean, no joke - that's some of the best hot chocolate I've ever had in my entire life.

Yeah, I wish that too :/

message 44: by Lindsey (last edited May 29, 2010 02:21PM) (new)

Lindsey | 774 comments I too am really late in responding, but I still want to xD Sorry I havn't been on in a couple days.

Rachael wrote: "The problem that I have is that President Hinckley was asked on Larry King Live if Mormons drink caffeine and he said no. In my seminary room we have a sign that says "When the prophet speaks, the..."

I really like this. I think it makes it simple and clear, good job ( : The Prophet said not to, the end. ( : I still don't think it is horrible to drink Cola but it is definitely BAD for your body (actually to clarify what was said earlier the worst thing in pops is the carbonation a.k.a. the bubbly stuff) likw in the article heavenly father doesn't need to make commands on every little thing, sometimes we just need to use the brains he gave us ( :

Yeah Jayda, like your friends with chocolate I have friends that got addicted to the caffeinated root beer (you can get it without caffeine as well) because they didn't realize it was in there, and just drank it all the time. I think it's a little funny, (I wouldn't if it had caused a lot of harm but it wasn't a really serious addiction just a little bit addicted) becasuse it just seems kinda funny that you can be addicted to pop but it is true! We have a bunch of girls in our ward who were a little addicted to root beer for a while lol

I like the Cocoa explaination as well, I think alot of people just don't pay attention to what the difference is, very intresting.

Calypso, your moms article is very good and very true, I wish more people understood how dangerous and unhealthy pop is. Sadly most of America dosn't and drinks it by the gallons ) : That is so good your mom realized what it was and had the strength to stop it. I am sure she is much more comfterble without those problems.

( Calypso) wrote: "You know they that caffine helps with stuuf but its not ture at all . They are lairs . It will only ruin your body."

I think you are right, it will ruin your body. But taking one pop every once in a while will not ruin it very quickly it will just make you very unhealthy and will create medical problems like with those missionaries. Though slowly since not even that many people drink pop THAT excessivly.

That is very intresting about the babies Jayda I have ner heard of that, it is great that they were able to be helped. Do you know if it made them more prone to this kind of addiction? It would be neat to find out more about that because I would think after their bodies had been flooded with the caffeine they would start to react to it in some way at least. Or that they might have those addicitons to pop we were talking about. But maybe it works differently on babies. Hmmm.

Jayda wrote: "I Love My Pic . Do You ? ( Calypso) wrote: "Jayda wrote: "I don't either. I can only imagine how gross they taste :/ But to me they generally smell good, unfortunately! Specifically coffee. It remi..."

I don't know what she meant either. I don't see anything wrong...

Jayda said "Well... not tea. I hate the smell of tea! And the tastes isn't that good either. I only know that because one time Zaxby's gave me an iced tea with lemon in it instead of lemonade, so I took a sip and found out the hard way what it was. It was DISGUSTING. So you know I'll never be drinking that stuff :) Haha."

LOL that is really funny :D

Yeah it's really funny, alot of people like the smell of coacoa beans/coffee.My mom does. I think it's kinda funny she s like 'mmm it smells so good and I'm, like 'oooookay'. I don't like the smell of it but whatever. :D But like the rest she just thinks it smells good, she would never try any :D :o I have heard starbucks hot chocolate is amazing before, I'll have to try it sometime.

message 45: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
I don't think that there are that many side affects, if any, from pumping premature babies with caffeine. My sister isn't addicted to caffeine, and I don't think the three month early baby is, either. I haven't heard anything on that, but I haven't researched it much, either :)

The carbonation is what's bad for you? I thought it was the caffeine, sugar, and high fructose corn syrop... Very interesting!

I wonder how everyone defines addiction, though? Because everyone can define it differently, so I wonder how different all of our opinions are on what addiction actually is.

message 46: by Rachael (new)

Rachael I define addiction as something physical. Anyone can be "addicted" to anything physiologically but unless you actually have a physical setback if you are trying to stop then I think that is when you are truly addicted to something. After all, I drank a cup of Hot Cocoa everyday but then we were running out so I was stopping. And I wanted it real bad, but I could tell that it was just psychological and not physical so even though one could argue that I was "addicted" I wasn't really because it wasn't like I was having headaches or getting sick or whatever it is that people go through when they are trying to withdraw from something bad.

message 47: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
That's somewhat how I define addiction. I think it depends on the situation. Because based on that definition (which I do agree with) sexual addiction, video game addiction, and addictions like them don't exist... I'm not sure exactly how I would define it.

But I do agree - I think it's more of a physical reaction then anything that is how you should define addiction. All doctors and professionals would agree that unless you have a physical withdrawal, instead of a psychological want/need for that thing, that you're not addicted.

I mean, I text everyday, but I don't have a physical reaction if I can't. I want to, really badly, but that's because I like talking to my friends - not necessarily because I'm addicted to it :P Haha.

Good post, Rachael! :)

message 48: by Rachael (new)

Rachael Exactly. And thanks.

message 49: by Lindsey (new)

Lindsey | 774 comments Iv'e never really thought about it much, honestly xD I would have just defined it as when your brain is telling you that you really want something that you know is addictive such as caffeine or something you injest. I don't know if a small addiction (as I would think of it) like to hot choclate would give you a headache. I just do not have much knowledge on this ( : But one question I would have is what about pornography? The general authorities tell us all the time it is addicting but I don't think (not that I would know x)) it causes physical pain when trying to obstrain from it. Does anybody know about that?

message 50: by Jayda, Future NYT Bestseller! © (new)

Jayda | 2300 comments Mod
That's the problem I have with defining addiction, like I said in my post. Because if addiction is defined as something that gives you a physical reaction when you cannot have it, then things such as video game addiction, sex addiction, addiction to pornography and such don't exist...

That's actually a debate going on in the medical world right now - trying to define addiction...

« previous 1 3
back to top
This topic has been frozen by the moderator. No new comments can be posted.