Terminalcoffee discussion
Rants / Debates (Serious)
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should schools punish kids for off-campus behavior?
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(Also, Larry was in close proximity last night to Jon Bon Jovi. It's true.)
What happens off campus, stays off campus (I'm writing this from a Las Vegas hotel room).There can be exceptions for those who commit violent crimes, as they present a danger to other students, but little things like partying or smoking pot should be handled by parents, not school boards.
i totally agree with phil. i have a strong opinion on this. there are incidents around here recently where students were involved in dumb things on the way to and from school that were severely punished by the school. that is a gray area with me. if they are on school grounds that of course they have the right to punish the students but i dunno. i just don't like where this is going. you usually can't undo things like this and they only go father and farther. my kids have never gotten an any trouble at all with the police or really anyone (18,24 and 26 now) and i am blessed but i would like to think that i could handle this at home and wouldn't need the school to suspend my child, kick him off the baseball team or not let him graduate because of something that happened away from school. too much intrusion on the part of the school/government into home life for me
I agree with Kevin, there is a line between school intervention and parent intervention for instance drugs, fights off campus, stuff online etc. parents take care of that. in school fights, dealing drugs in school, both should help. No school should discipline a student without at least notifying the parents often because only parents can discipline their kids
Dario wrote: "only parents can discipline their kids. "If only they would. I mean, in what household does a kid learn that urinating and defecating all over someone else's personal property is even remotely OK? I'm not saying it's acceptable for schools to disciple off-campus behaviors buy my God, someone ought to step up.
I don't accept that. What has school to do with the life of students, if they aren't at school? I think this violates the rights of children and teenagers.
I'm going to have to disagree on some level. While the normal experience for us would lead us to believe the school needs to stay out of it, what about the kids who are having to parent themselves because their parents are completely uninvolved in their lives? It happens more often than you'd think, especially in inner city areas. They tend to act out in class and on campus... and it can be disruptive to the teachers as well as to the other students.
That's completely unfair to the students who really do want to learn and go to a good college...
And well, if the parents don't care, I'd have to think that on some level the kids who need the school, the teachers, the school counselors and staff to show that they care and intervene on occasion would appreciate that SOMEONE cares.
Don't get me wrong, I don't think that the school ALWAYS needs to get involved, and I definitely don't think that this is a black and white sort of issue... there are definitely grey areas that need to be considered.
I didn't read the article. I was actually thinking more of like kids selling drugs in the school zone, but off campus... or contributing to the delinquency of another student. Bun absolutely makes a valid point with signing the contract that outlines rules and regulations. My cousin's cheerleading squad won at nationals. The parents brought the girls back to the room, and they all celebrated with champagne. No one left the room. They stayed under adult supervision... just celebrating together. Well, one of the girls reported this to a parent and... blah, blah, blah... word got back to the school, and they title was taken away from the squad because the school rules (and competition rules) clearly stated that drinking was not allowed. Period. The girls were also disciplined with in school suspension.
In this particular case, I'd think the adult chaperones should've used better judgment. I mean, I know my mom had to sign all the paperwork I signed when I was involved in school extracurricular activities.
I agree with Phil. I had to deal with something similar my junior year of high school. I was a straight A and pretty straight laced student. I didn't drink but once in high school and it was certainly my last. Typical Friday night party. I had one beer, my best friend got trashed. I drove, wasn't drunk in the least as it took me hours to drink the beer. But my dumbass friend thought it was amusing to keep hitting my caution light. Cop saw, pulled me over, and even though I was fine to drive, I wasn't 21. When the school got wind of it, they tried to suspend me for two weeks and send me to alternative school with the crack heads. I was the salutatorian for Christ's sake! I had never even had a detention. How would ruining my transcripts and sending me to school with dregs improve my life? Seems to me that those who belong in alternative type schools are going to wind up there with or without these policies and that they aren’t helping anyone turn their life around.
Knarik wrote: "I don't accept that. What has school to do with the life of students, if they aren't at school? I think this violates the rights of children and teenagers."
Well here is what the school district that my son has done, all for activities not during school time, but in relation to a school activity.
Homecoming week has since I can remember here to be a somewhat big deal. At night during the week before the Homecoming game the kids would go out TPing. The problem being that it had to escalate. It went from TPing to TPing and egging to TPing, egging and paintballing. Some to houses some to cars. The TPing I didn't really mind, and if I remember I will post pictures when I get home of what they did to our house one night. It was thorough , and I told my daughter the next day to honestly congratulate whoever did it because if was masterful.
The point being that the non school time activities of kids that were never caught reflected poorly in the minds of the school board on the school district, so they cancelled Homecoming for four years, no game no dance nothing. This just happens to be the four years my son is attending high school. So through no fault of their class they will never get to experience homecoming. Is it fair? Probably not.
It's not like TPing doesn't happen at other times either, but it did escalate during homecoming week. This year I only remember seeing one house TPed all fall, so I guess they are getting the results they wanted.
Well here is what the school district that my son has done, all for activities not during school time, but in relation to a school activity.
Homecoming week has since I can remember here to be a somewhat big deal. At night during the week before the Homecoming game the kids would go out TPing. The problem being that it had to escalate. It went from TPing to TPing and egging to TPing, egging and paintballing. Some to houses some to cars. The TPing I didn't really mind, and if I remember I will post pictures when I get home of what they did to our house one night. It was thorough , and I told my daughter the next day to honestly congratulate whoever did it because if was masterful.
The point being that the non school time activities of kids that were never caught reflected poorly in the minds of the school board on the school district, so they cancelled Homecoming for four years, no game no dance nothing. This just happens to be the four years my son is attending high school. So through no fault of their class they will never get to experience homecoming. Is it fair? Probably not.
It's not like TPing doesn't happen at other times either, but it did escalate during homecoming week. This year I only remember seeing one house TPed all fall, so I guess they are getting the results they wanted.
Heather wrote: "I agree with Phil. I had to deal with something similar my junior year of high school. I was a straight A and pretty straight laced student. I didn't drink but once in high school and it was cert..."
Yeah, that was a bit of an overreaction Heather. My daughter got an under age drinking ticket while in school, and didn't even get an after school. She went to a student run court, and got her ticket expunged by doing the volunteer work that they assigned her. She actually really liked working at the community center, and did so for the rest of her high school career.
Yeah, that was a bit of an overreaction Heather. My daughter got an under age drinking ticket while in school, and didn't even get an after school. She went to a student run court, and got her ticket expunged by doing the volunteer work that they assigned her. She actually really liked working at the community center, and did so for the rest of her high school career.
The funny thing with me is that the court system completely threw it out. I had never done anything before, and I kept a drunk friend of the road. I never even had to go to court, there isn't even a record of it. But I had to go through some big school to do with the school board, missed two weeks of school, and nearly got expelled. WTF?
not to be off topic but now I kinda want to see the TP'ed house...But yeah there was this kid "Jefferey" in one of my classes who texted students who had been picking on him that he was going to kill them and he got suspended for several weeks though when he got back he seemed normal
at least my school cracks down on stuff... However they seem to be beating around the bush so to speak: they nail some kid for texting but not for more serious crimes like drugs or fights soooooo....... its not the best but its better than some.
I teach in an inner-city middle school so I probably have a different point of view than many of you. As a teacher, I'm told that schools are considered custodially responsible for what kids do from the time they leave school until they arrive home. Kids walking home from school trashing a neighborhood house? We get the call. Fight/assault on the way home from school? We're told to handle that as well...and what about when it's a crime where there's a victim (theft/assault) who is a student, and the crime is committed by another student? What are your thoughts about a situation like that?
Interesting topic!
I have a hard time with this...code of conduct or not...but I do kind of understand why basketball players could get in trouble with the team if they're caught drinking in the season...so I don't know where to draw the line. What do you think?
(Take that, Larry Jones! Posting enough for you yet, Omaha?)