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Rosicrucians: Their Rites and Mysteries
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NEW WORLD ORDER > Who were/are the Rosicrucians?

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message 1: by James, Group Founder (new) - added it

James Morcan | 11246 comments Anybody know much about them?


message 2: by Jim (new)

Jim (jimliedeka) I have read some stuff but don't consider myself any kind of expert. As for the original Rosicrucians, the ones who put out the manifestoes in the 17th century, I think they may have been early surrealists.

Modern Rosicrucians are all over the map. There are esoteric Christian groups, Masonic groups, and initiatory groups.

I was in San Jose for a few days for training several years back. I wish I would have made the effort to check out the AMORC's museum.


message 3: by James, Group Founder (new) - added it

James Morcan | 11246 comments Jim wrote: "I have read some stuff but don't consider myself any kind of expert. As for the original Rosicrucians, the ones who put out the manifestoes in the 17th century, I think they may have been early su..."

I've studied them a bit but don't know that much about them. Interested to learn what others know.

Here's a book I plan to read:

The Rosicrucians: Their Rites and Mysteries

Rosicrucians Their Rites and Mysteries by Hargrave Jennings


message 4: by Jim (new)

Jim (jimliedeka) There are also a few chapters about Rosicrucianism in Manly P. Hall's The Secret Teaching of All Ages.

The Jennings book seems to be well respected. The quality of research into religious studies was probably better in the 19th century than the 20th.

I would still take anything about the Rosicrucians with a grain of salt. I think of them like the Illuminati. Lots of people claim to be part of or descended from the original group but most are just bluffing.

That said, the ideas in Jennings and Hall are probably worth reading for their own sake.


message 5: by Laureen (new)

Laureen (laureenandersonswfcomau) | 478 comments I don't believes be it is helpful to select out organizations that study ancient sages of all belief systems. Modern day so-called religions do need to be questioned as there is huge amounts of money involved.

Those who practice the ancient belief systems will find that they have the broadest and most rational interpretations of what life on earth and in the Universe is most likely about. E.g. Mysticism is about taking responsibility for our own happiness, learning to love ourselves as we carry esoteric energy or life force within and means that we are perfect within and if we can change our perception that we are flawed beyond saving (as in overcoming a feeling of lacking in respect or love from those around us which causes us to believe we are inferior in some way).

I believe, as I have said before, that if we wish to change the world, then we need to change ourselves first. Of course, everybody will change in their own good time and so we will always have conflict in the life we live, but we can attempt seriously to set an example. For a start we can try to stop blaming those around us for our unhappiness.


message 6: by James, Group Founder (new) - added it

James Morcan | 11246 comments Jim wrote: "I would still take anything about the Rosicrucians with a grain of salt. I think of them like the Illuminati. Lots of people claim to be part of or descended from the original group but most are just bluffing.
..."


So the Rosicrucians, in your opinion, are similar to the Illuminati myth where various organizations are claiming or being called descendants of the original group but have no evidence to back that up?


message 7: by Jim (new)

Jim (jimliedeka) That's my take. The AMORC claims to be descended from The Great White Brotherhood that was active in ancient Egypt. I haven't been able to find any evidence for such an organization. That doesn't mean they aren't trying to preserve as much esoteric knowledge as they can.

If there are any uninterrupted threads of wisdom tradition in the modern world, I don't know which ones they are. Everybody claims a pedigree. If there is anything like that, my bet would be on somewhere in India or possibly the middle east.

That said, wisdom traditions do manage to pop up from time to time in strange places. Robert Bauval and Graham Hancock talk about that in The Master Game.

I strongly suspect groups like the AMORC are descended from the Renaissance revival of alchemy and Hermetism. Hermetism itself comes from Egypt early in the common era and may have preserved some older traditions, if filtered through Hellenic thought.


message 8: by James, Group Founder (new) - added it

James Morcan | 11246 comments Jim wrote: "If there are any uninterrupted threads of wisdom tradition in the modern world, I don't know which ones they are. Everybody claims a pedigree. If there is anything like that, my bet would be on somewhere in India or possibly the middle east.
..."


I agree.
Possibly Tibet and surrounds could hold some uninterrupted traditions from the Ancients as well. But like you, I've seen or read of nothing in the West that indicates any mystery schools of our era hold original knowledge from thousands of years ago.
So much has been lost unfortunately and most of the time I suspect it's just a trendy marketing ploy to say "we descend from the great _________(insert ancient organization here)________".


message 9: by Jim (new)

Jim (jimliedeka) Now that I think about it, I wouldn't rule out China. The Taoists know/knew some interesting things. I think feng shui, like astrology alchemy, etc., is the remnant of some ancient science/technology that people no longer understand. Actually, I would put qigong (of which feng shui is a part) in that category. There's an obvious yogic influence but there's also a lot that's unique to China.

I agree about the marketing angle.


Harry Whitewolf | 1745 comments I'm currently reading Rosicrucians: Their Rites and Mysteries (published 1870) and I've just come across this passage which states that Rosicrucians and the Illuminati are basically the same:

"...the doctrine of the Fire-Philosophers, and of the Rosicrucians, or Illuminati...taught (that) all knowable things were evolved out of fire."


For a good layman's history/overview beliefs book on Rosicrucianism, Rosicrucians: The History, Mythology and Rituals of an Occult Order is a good one, but if you want to go further down the Hermetic rabbit hole of old truths, I certainly recommend the former.


message 11: by Jim (new)

Jim (jimliedeka) Sounds Heraclitian


message 12: by James, Group Founder (last edited Jun 09, 2015 10:57PM) (new) - added it

James Morcan | 11246 comments Funny how that quote about the Rosicrucians mentions all things evolving out of fire...

I have a friend who at great risk to himself managed to get inside (undercover) a reasonably high-level Eyes Wide Shut-style ceremony of some unknown secret society. He said the attendees were mostly politicians and financial elites.

Anyway, the focal point of the ceremony was a small controlled fire within the building out of which rose a "spirit being" as he termed it. Now I have no idea if that entity could have been mechanical or illusory or what, but just thought I'd share in case anyone else knows further info on this subject of fire beings...To all intents and purposes it apparently looked like a spirit being rising up out of the fire...

My friend's testimonial about this experience of going in undercover to the event and seeing this fire ceremony was recorded in a video interview and last I saw it's still up on YouTube.


Harry Whitewolf | 1745 comments James Morcan wrote: "Funny how that quote about the Rosicrucians mentions all things evolving out of fire...

I have a friend who at great risk to himself managed to get inside (undercover) a reasonably high-level Eyes..."


That's very interesting mate!

And for The Rosicrucians, like other secret orders of ancient religions, Fire is at the very core of their beliefs. Everything of matter came from fire. Everything is Fire. We are Fire.

Which I've been thinking a lot about lately in context to the Sun always being the 'thing/God' that was worshiped the most; but that it may be truer to say ancient 'religions' weren't worshiping the sun as such, but rather its content of fire.


message 14: by James, Group Founder (new) - added it

James Morcan | 11246 comments That could be a valid observation about the sun being viewed as fire by the ancients.


message 15: by Jim (new)

Jim (jimliedeka) I think that may be backwards. The sun was important first. Fire was associated with the sun so also important. I know fire is important in it's own right. It was used by humans since before Homo Sapiens.

The sun is important, not only for it's relation to the seasons, but as an objectification of light which represents the light of illumination. It's been argued that sun worship traces back to Atlantis and is central in all the civilizations that followed.


message 17: by Feliks (new)

Feliks (dzerzhinsky) It's a way to get out of work by claiming a non-calendar religious holiday.


message 18: by Lance, Group Founder (new)

Lance Morcan | 2824 comments NEWSWEEK: SHADOWS IN THE SHADOWS: THE ROSICRUCIANS, A FAKE SECRET SOCIETY, HAD A REAL IMPACT ON THE WORLD http://www.newsweek.com/fake-secret-s...


message 20: by Tony (new)

Tony Sunderland | 311 comments I think that the Rosicrucians and Freemasonry were both born by the same belief; Hatred of the Roman Catholic Church, During the 16th and17th centuries, the formation or rebirth of secret societies that embraced ancient philosophies and ritual practices occurred. The Rosicrucian movement of the early seventeenth century called for a universal brotherhood of man. This was formally expressed in the publication of three manifestos between 1614 and 1617. Although this movement was highly secretive and very selective, its enduring idea of the sanctity of man and the natural universe as a mystical and even magical creation, gained traction in a world infused with new scientific truths. The manifestos combined Hermeticism, Jewish Kabbalah and even alchemy into a radical vision of the world to come. The holy grail of this age was the possibility of joining the spiritual with material reality. As Frances Yates expresses in her book, The Rosicrucian Enlightenment;

‘The most striking aspect of the Rosicrucian movement is the one to which the title of this book gives expression, its insistence on a coming Enlightenment. The world, nearing its end, is to receive a new illumination in which the advances in knowledge made in the preceding age of the Renaissance will be immensely expanded. New discoveries are at hand, a new age is dawning. And this illumination shines inward as well as outward; it is an inward spiritual illumination revealing to man new possibilities in himself, teaching him to understand his own dignity and worth and the part he is called upon to play in the divine scheme’.

Many of the higher ideals of Freemasonry appear to have been sourced in the spiritual ideals of Rosicrucian philosophy. Speculative Freemasonry had found a new foundation stone embedded in the illumination of a new world order, which was independent of the dogmatic rule of the Catholic Church. For the Freemason fraternity, Science, religion and philosophy were part of a sacred vision under the divine, Grand Architect of the Universe. These teachings were embraced by the Freemasons in the eighteenth century as a way of seeking gnosis and illumination. This was the enduring legacy of the Rosicrucian movement to the Masonic brotherhood. Recognition of this would later be reflected in the eighteenth degree of Scottish Rite Freemasonry. This level of membership is known as the Knight of the Rose Croix. A member at this level pledges to build a special Temple to God inside themselves. As Yates expresses;

‘The Rosicrucian movement is aware that large new revelations of knowledge are at hand, that man is about to arrive at another stage of advance, far beyond that already achieved. This sense of standing on tiptoe in expectation of new knowledge is most characteristic of the Rosicrucian outlook. And the Rosicrucians, who know that they hold in their hands potentialities for great advance, are concerned to integrate these into a religious philosophy. Hence the Rosicrucian alchemy expresses both the scientific outlook, penetrating into new worlds of discovery, and also an attitude of religious expectation, of penetrating into new fields of religious experience’.


message 22: by Irene (new)

Irene (reniemarie) | 96 comments James wrote: "Anybody know much about them?"

Tracey Twyman did a lot of interviews on her research into them. There was much knowledge about them within her books and magazine articles as well. She knew she was going to be killed. If you watched her videos shortly before her murder she proclaimed that she was being stalked harassed and threatened constantly and she said she was afraid for her life. She was only 39 years old I believe. A genius really and that's probably why they got her. She was just outting it all and was well educated and believable in her assertions and always backed her research.


message 23: by James, Group Founder (new) - added it

James Morcan | 11246 comments I still have to check out Tracey Twyman's work. Thanks for the heads up, Irene.


message 24: by James, Group Founder (new) - added it


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