Outlander Series discussion

122 views
miscellaneous > frank (Spoilers for all books)

Comments Showing 1-30 of 30 (30 new)    post a comment »
dateDown arrow    newest »

message 1: by Pat (new)

Pat Cocivera | 5 comments well I have a strike and being computer illiterate can't figure out how to put a spoiler tag so somebody please email me and tell me how to do this so I can post my question. thankyou
patc4040@aol.com


message 2: by Diane (new)

Diane | 1356 comments Go to discussions and in the general discussion topic is a thread named "How To" it explains it there in detail.


message 3: by Pat (new)

Pat Cocivera | 5 comments Diane I did and I read it twice and it went right over my head. Thank you, I will read it again. But joining a group and getting a strike from the first word I type in doesn't make me feel very welcomed


message 4: by Diane (new)

Diane | 1356 comments Pat I am sorry you do not feel welcome - I am not sure what the comment was that caused a strike. There are threads here that are open to spoilers if you would like to comment there you won't have to worry. We try to keep certain threads spoiler free so our members who have not read the entire series will not have anything ruined for them. I don't think I could explain how to spoiler tag any clearer than what is in the how to thread.Sorry.


message 5: by Wendy F, biblioholic (new)

Wendy F (blessedwannab) | 3151 comments Pat, you do not have a strike. You didn't post anything that is a spoiler.

There is a simple solution here. I have marked this thread as 'spoilers for all books' and put it in the appropriate folder.

Now you can feel free to say anything you want to and not use a spoiler tag.

We aren't mean, we are trying to protect ALL fans of the series (both television and book) not just the ones who have read all of them.


message 6: by Pat (new)

Pat Cocivera | 5 comments Thank you Wendy. Now I feel foolish. Looking at series and knowing that Frank was an excellent historian did he figure out when he did his research that Claire and Brianna would be going back. In another group it had been mentioned he knew because he talk Brianna to shoot and use a bow. But reading the first 3 books for so many times the only thing he did was to put up a grave stone. But watching the series and listening to others who hadn't read the book made me wonderful. I just was wondering if someone else has thought about this. Thank you


message 7: by Wendy F, biblioholic (new)

Wendy F (blessedwannab) | 3151 comments I don't know if he found out for sure, or that he was capable of believing in magic. But I am pretty sure that he did some research and found that a lot of what Claire had told him turned out to be true. I know he did find Jamie in his research. He found enough to at least do things like teach Bree to shoot, and give her skills that would have helped her in the past.


message 8: by Pat (new)

Pat Cocivera | 5 comments Thank you Wendy our little group consists of real old ladies, all of us are over 65 and have been reading the books since they first came out. The Starz series have been making us question a lot more things. The outlandish companion is our Bible but I thought I could get more ideas about things if I joined this group. thank you for your help. I will check back


message 9: by Vanessa Eden (new)

Vanessa  Eden Patton (vanessaeden) | 549 comments I think pat could be referring to the strike as the first strike that everyone has as stated in the description of the group ...where it says "there is a three strike rule...consider this your first strike."


message 10: by Vanessa Eden (new)

Vanessa  Eden Patton (vanessaeden) | 549 comments I don't know if it's just me but I like the Frank in the TV show more than the Frank in the book. Frank on TV was written to be secure than Frank in the book. Then again I find Tobias very attractive, he is no Sam but he sure ain't bad. Lol.


message 11: by Dee (new)

Dee (austhokie) | 1124 comments i think that is because the TV show is trying to show Frank's POV, whereas the Outlander is only Claire's


message 12: by Wendy F, biblioholic (new)

Wendy F (blessedwannab) | 3151 comments I always liked Frank, but I agree with Dee. I do think that the television show is trying to show us what DG implied in her writings. I always believed Frank was a good man, because Claire loved him. So the show is showing us how he is a good man. And Tobias is doing a great job.


message 13: by Pat (new)

Pat Cocivera | 5 comments Vanessa Eden wrote: "I think pat could be referring to the strike as the first strike that everyone has as stated in the description of the group ...where it says "there is a three strike rule...consider this your firs..." yes vanessa thats what I saw, it was a little unsettling that I messed up first thing...thanks


message 14: by Vanessa Eden (new)

Vanessa  Eden Patton (vanessaeden) | 549 comments I'm sorry that made you feel unwelcome. I hate for new members to feel that way. Overall this is a good group to discuss outlander. I hope you find it to be so aswell.


message 15: by Wendy F, biblioholic (new)

Wendy F (blessedwannab) | 3151 comments It's not that anyone who joins has 'messed up'. It's that stating the rules serves as a first warning.

It may seem mean, or unwelcoming, but a good majority of us were here when members were leaving left and right because of uncontrolled spoilers. We had to get tougher about it. That's all. The rules serve as a first warning.

Perhaps we should change the wording.


message 16: by Carol (new)

Carol | 193 comments I think that frank on tv is really a characterization from all the books. Therefore, he is more 'fleshed out' as a character than in the outlander book alone. In the book, when Claire leaves Frank to go find the flower on the fairy hill, we don't hear his voice for the rest of the book. We next meet him in Dragonfly in Amber.


message 17: by Dee (new)

Dee (austhokie) | 1124 comments Diana has said that just because he wasn't mentioned didn't mean he didn't have a story - she said that early on - and showing him makes more sense to me because we see Claire wanting to get back to him/her time - needed more story as to why


message 18: by Diane (new)

Diane | 1356 comments I think The Frank line in the TV show is one of the best changes they made to the Series. From every thing I read that DG has said about Frank, even before the TV series came out, this seems closer to the Frank she envisioned but didn't fully express in the book.


message 19: by Vanessa Eden (new)

Vanessa  Eden Patton (vanessaeden) | 549 comments Yea I agree Diane; I am glad we got to see Frank again when Claire went through the stones. I think that seeing him while she was gone and all he went through was moving and the scene where Claire and frank could hear each other through the stones was one of my favorite scenes...among others.


message 20: by Arlene (new)

Arlene | 255 comments I also got a much more favorable impression of Frank from the TV series. However, I have been reading the books again, and got angry with him for his actions right before he died. He wanted to just take Bree with him with no regard to Claire. That's hard to overlook, even if he felt betrayed by Claire.


message 21: by Brizo (new)

Brizo (brizosdream) | 320 comments Frank in the book did a lot of not very thoughtful things. He didn't believe her when she 1st came back. Then when he did find evidence of Jamie's existence he didn't tell her. He cheated on her with other women. He treated her badly, perhaps to get back at her. But that last thing he did to want go off with Bree and his mistress was just the culmination of his disregard for her feelings. I felt sad for Claire having to be with him all those years.

I think Ron Moore expanded his role to give Tobias more screen time. After all he had him under contract for 5 years so he has to do something with the Frank character to warrant his paying him a salary for 5 years. If he didn't expand Frank their isn't much in season 2 of the book version but perhaps a few flashbacks.


message 22: by Arlene (last edited Jul 14, 2015 12:38PM) (new)

Arlene | 255 comments Frank was a human being. Yes he cheated on Claire, but Bree was proof in his face every day that Claire had done the same to him. When they met she was 19 and he was 31. Usually a relationship like that is based on a "Father Knows Best" scenario. When Claire returned from WWII, she had certainly gained a lot of independence and maturity. Frank totally loved Bree, and for every thoughtless thing he did to Claire, he poured in love into Bree. Even the shooting lessons and horseback riding lessons showed his concern for whatever might happen. He had an idea she'd go through the stones to meet Jamie and wanted her to be prepared. Even taking her back to England. I don't agree with his reasoning, but he thought he was protecting Bree from her mother's too liberal attitudes and wanted to keep her free from what to him was distasteful company


message 23: by Mrsbooks (last edited Jul 14, 2015 04:13PM) (new)

Mrsbooks | 397 comments When I read the scene when Frank tells Claire he's taking off with Bree, I always get this vibe that he's trying to "escape" with Bree. There were many reasons to finally end their relationship. But, I don't know.... It feels to me like something more is going on. I've often felt when reading the books that Frank didn't really believe Claire. It's quite a crazy story really, even though he did some research and found things to support her story. There is always doubt when one isn't presented with solid proof (Like when Jamie was able to witness Claire disappearing).

During this scene Frank seems almost paranoid to get Bree away. I've often wondered if Frank found something that solidified the truth of Claire's story just before he died. Maybe he found Claire and Bree somewhere in history and was afraid Claire would take Bree away from him so he was trying to take Bree away before that could happen?

Then again, I could be reading into nothing.


message 24: by Zoey (last edited Jul 14, 2015 05:31PM) (new)

Zoey  (rozannen) | 229 comments I agree with you Mrsbooks, I always thought there was some other reason behind Franks actions then as well. There is more to it, than just Frank suddenly deciding after 20 years he was leaving Claire & going back to the UK & taking Bree away from everything & everyone she knows IMHO. Was it to protect Bree from something? Did he maybe find something out about the Fraser prophecy??
I really believe that there is a lot more to what Franks knows & hopefully we will find out in the next book :)


message 25: by Lauren (last edited Jul 14, 2015 09:17PM) (new)

Lauren | 65 comments I'm just now finishing up Voyager. In my review of Dragonfly in Amber, I felt like I needed to hear more about Frank and Claire when she came back through the stones in 1948. Unfortunately, I had to wait until Voyager but then I still don't feel like I've gotten the full picture. Claire, in this aspect, is a very unreliable narrator. It's impossible for her to relate Frank's feelings other thank through her recounting of his actual words and actions. Frank doesn't have a voice or point of view.

So I completely agree with Zoey and Mrsbooks that Frank has more to tell us. According to the Outlander wiki (http://outlander.wikia.com/wiki/A_Lea...), the short story "A Leaf on the Wind of All Hallows" provides some closure to a plot line opened in An Echo In The Bone. I'm nowhere near that far in the series to even speculate.

On another note, I really like Tobias Menzies in the STARZ adaptation of the series. And the S1E8 storyline really fleshed Frank Randall out more as a character which I loved and felt did a few things for the overall story. One, it really highlighted the struggle Claire felt in that same episode when she discovered how close they were to Craigh Na Dun and wandered off. Yes, Claire was smitten with Jamie at that point, but she still had an intense desire to get home and we're able to empathize with her because we see the distress of Frank back in 1945. Second, it sets up the conflict Jamie and Claire have in S1E9 when he "punishes" Claire for disobedience that's resolved in S1E11 (when Claire reveals that she's traveled through time and Jamie expresses remorse for the punishment then takes her back to Craigh na Dun again). But most importantly, giving Frank more depth and development creates a stark contrast between him and Black Jack Randall. You have to have some sympathy and understanding for Frank in order to really feel the conflict and despair Claire experiences when choosing whether to stay or go. That separation between Frank and BJR really fuels the drama in the final two episodes of Season 1. It has a lasting impact into Season 2 of the show and into both Dragonfly and Voyager.


message 26: by Mary (new)

Mary (poetsdream) | 196 comments Lauren wrote: "I'm just now finishing up Voyager. In my review of Dragonfly in Amber, I felt like I needed to hear more about Frank and Claire when she came back through the stones in 1948. Unfortunately, I had t..."

Claire goes into it more in Drums of Autumn when she tells Jamie how he treated her after Bree was born. I found it supported what I though of Frank as being self centered and vengeful, but it also showed why Claire understood his behavior, and partially blamed the fact that she couldn't ever forget about Jamie or tell Frank a lie about it. She always told him the truth about how much she loved Jamie.


message 27: by Mary (new)

Mary (poetsdream) | 196 comments Zoey wrote: "I agree with you Mrsbooks, I always thought there was some other reason behind Franks actions then as well. There is more to it, than just Frank suddenly deciding after 20 years he was leaving Clai..."

Frank said what he did want Bree to sleep with a "nigger" like her mother did (how's that for nasty). Frank in this book is a creep, I don't know why Claire ever stayed with him with his repeated affairs, him never believing her. I would of left him long before that.


message 28: by Mary (new)

Mary (poetsdream) | 196 comments Diane wrote: "I think The Frank line in the TV show is one of the best changes they made to the Series. From every thing I read that DG has said about Frank, even before the TV series came out, this seems closer..."

I disagree, they added all this new stuff and they cut the most important parts of the books to add it. If Ron Moore is saying there is no time to put in the better ending of Season 1 the stuff in the caves under the abbey or the stuff with Father Ansome, well it's because he added all this crap stuff not in the books and just made the story not as effective or interesting as the books. IMHO


message 29: by Brizo (new)

Brizo (brizosdream) | 320 comments Mrsbooks wrote: "When I read the scene when Frank tells Claire he's taking off with Bree, I always get this vibe that he's trying to "escape" with Bree. There were many reasons to finally end their relationship. B..."

In a later book, I can't remember which one maybe MOBY but anyway (view spoiler)


message 30: by MichaelCollins (new)

MichaelCollins | 818 comments Yeah I remember that --(view spoiler)

But what he found in his research was never detailed which disappointed me and probably wuld have really added to the book. Its not like DG didn't have room lol


back to top