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The Underground Girls of Kabul - Discussion Thread 1

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message 1: by Matt (new)

Matt (mlabrake) | 95 comments Mod
Please note there are 3 threads available with different questions in each. Feel free to participate in one, two, or all of the threads. Each will stimulate a different kind of conversation!

Remember, if you have questions for the author, submit them in the “Ask Jenny Nordberg” thread to be asked at the live event on May 5th.


Thread 1

1) Although Afghanistan and its conflicts have been well-covered, the book offers a different entry point into the lives of people there. Before reading this book what (if anything) did you know about Afghanistan? What did you find surprising about the country and its history in reading this book?

2) After reading the book, does the practice of bacha posh make sense to you, or is it entirely foreign? How would you explain why this happens?

3) The author outlines a pervasive culture of violence and extreme segregation. Which part of the story, if any, made you angry? Why?


message 2: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 5 comments I have heard very limited things regarding Afghanistan. Mostly what was covered in the beginning of the book, such as it being the number one place to live and the most dangerous place to be a woman in the world. It intrigued me that in 2015 this was still the case, yet all I would hear in the American media was all about bombings and terrorists. In this book, I actually was able to meet or read about people and more specifically, women that live in this seemingly infamous yet mysterious society. I feel more inspired by these women that are loyal to their country, that takes a lot of courage and makes you want to know if there is more to Afghanistan than is portrayed to us in our media platforms. I could see no other way of having a taste of freedom without being beaten or murdered than being a batcha posh. In society where women's freedoms are so completely limited, staying at home almost all day, you have a lot of time to get creative and that was the result being locked away and hidden.


message 3: by Nancy (new)

Nancy | 5 comments Hi everyone!

1)I knew quite a bit about the wars that have plagued Afghanistan. It saddens me that the people of Afghanistan have suffered year after year, decade after decade, at the hands of other countries/idealogies. I remember the very first book I read about the people of Afghanistan was 'The Kite Runner' which provided insight into their culture, and gave (to me) insight as to how they have struggled, but also showed they are good people stuck in what seems like a never-ending life of war and desperation. GofA did the same...gives insight as to what ordinary people are dealing with, external pressures, internal cultural 'rules'. Stories like GofA brings forth the humanity of these people, something we can relate to, despite the vast differences between our governments and cultures.

2) I'm not surprised by bocha posh, Afghanistan is not the only country where sons are 'preferred.' Is it sad? Sure...but based on their culture, I can see how having a son means securing your own future as you age. China does the same thing...boys are preferred. And let's face it, even in America, a boy is a blessing to many because it means the family name (aka legacy) carries on. But I will say dressing your daughter up as a boy and everyone going along with the masquerade is very strange to me. They honestly prefer to pretend due to their cultural beliefs? I think it's time they revisit some of these antiquated beliefs and value each person for who they are.

3) There's lots about the story that makes me angry. Wars, children suffering, lack of respect for women, families fleeing violence, lack of education, poverty, warlords, Taliban, burkas, double standards... Wouldn't it be great if it were women who lift this country out of the cycle of violence and antiquated cultures?


message 4: by Jessica (last edited Apr 26, 2015 01:11PM) (new)

Jessica (librarygeek611) Much like Nancy, I read the Kite Runner and it was my first experience other than the American media to what women (and men and children) experience in Afghanistan. It was eye opening and interesting to see how years of a certain dogma can create a system that escalates into extremism like the type experienced there. I also see differences among areas, certain families and neighborhoods which reminds you that you can't generalize about any country or people. I'm saddened by the way the media and others who are not informed group everyone in countries like Afghanistan together without understanding their contexts or realizing that many people want a certain level of change to what goes on.

I am only in section 2 of the book but so far, the concept of bacha posh makes sense to me within the context of the patriarchal culture but at the same time as a woman and feminist, I can't even begin to understand it. I put myself in the situation and imagine my father telling me that my brother was more important than I was. And that I'm nothing but a womb to produce more men. It definitely made me angry. And to combine that emotionally scarring concept with the violence and sexual abuse that can go on, it's a very disturbing concept to me.

I agree, Nancy, that even in America we face that idea that boys are sometimes elevated because they carry on the legacy of a last name. I do see a trend of women (although I'm not one of them, haha) that are choosing to keep their last name after marriage and finding ways to deal with that if they decide to have children. I think women are seeing the idea of being "given" to their husband as an antiquated idea - even if it has the best intentions. So maybe as Western countries change that idea, there may be a shift globally for other cultures as well.

I also agree regarding the "masquerade". It was odd to me that in a culture that was so strict about so many doctrines that they would be ok with simply overlooking a girl trying to be a boy. To me that would be out of line for a woman to attempt to be someone "above her". Like I said, I have more of the book to read so I'm curious how they continue to explain that.


message 5: by Christine (new)

Christine | 4 comments Before reading this book, I had an idea of Afghanistan. The book really put things more into perspective for me. It really opened my eyes up a great deal. What I found most surprising is how its embarrassing for women to bear children that are female. I find it odd because aren't women necessary to reproduce, just as much as men? The face that women are shamed due to that I find extremely surprising. I can admit most of what I have known about Afghanistan has been through media portrayal. The media can often spin things in their favor...I think the book provided me with a more in depth perspective on the country and the true realities Afghan women face.

The practice of batcha posh makes a lot more sense to me now. I think this hastens because women are so desperate to be accepted and receive what little praise they can gain. They rather create a boy than not have one at all. I think for Afghan women this spares them embarrassment and shame; even if it is only temporary.

I am still reading the book, but I definitely have been angered by how Afghan women are treated. They are subjected too very extreme repercussions if they date "fall out of line." The fact that even daydreaming is seen as a form of temptation is crazy too me. At the same time it is a system that has been around in their country for years. It is their culture and the everyday norm within Afghan society. While I highly disagree with it, I still am curious to learn and even know more about it. Very anxious to get through the rest of the book, and to read "Kite runner." I have heard the book mentioned several times in the discussion. Definitely a future read on my list!


message 6: by Shelly (new)

Shelly Bennett | 6 comments Jessica wrote: "I have heard very limited things regarding Afghanistan. Mostly what was covered in the beginning of the book, such as it being the number one place to live and the most dangerous place to be a woma..."

Jessica wrote: "I have heard very limited things regarding Afghanistan. Mostly what was covered in the beginning of the book, such as it being the number one place to live and the most dangerous place to be a woma..."

Hi Jessica; Not only is the male child preferred. Some of the horrors I heard about the way the men of this country treat their women are horrendous. Not only do they treat them like funk, they burn them, bruise them and who knows what else. I have a younger cousin who has been in the military for some time. He went to Afghanistan in 2002 and he actually saw women with dog collars on and tied up like animals.


message 7: by Mancy (new)

Mancy Rivera | 2 comments Before reading this book I have never heard of it. I dont have too much knowledge about life in afghanistan. The practice of Bacha posh does not make sense, i understand why they do it but i think its inhumane of them to even practice such thing. I feel they are stripping the chosen female of her identity.It brings confusion and shame to be something your not. It happens because the families that dont have boys are known as weak and they become easy targets but i feel that its still not right.i am currently still reading the book but i can say that from what i read already it makes me angry that the women in that culture are treated with such abuse.


message 8: by MT (new)

MT (mtregan) Like others, my first exposure to Afghanistan in literature was through The Kite Runner, which focused on a much different aspect of Afghan culture and the status of ethnic minorities. Other than that, if I'm being honest, my only other exposure to Afghan history was through Billy Joel's 'We Didn't Start the Fire': "Ayatollahs in Iran / Russians in Afghanistan." But I've always been fascinated by Middle Eastern/Central Asian politics and culture.

I'm only about halfway through the book and perhaps Nordberg gets to it eventually, but I am having a hard time with her portrayal of bacha posh. The subtitle of the book implies that there is some kind of "resistance" or rebellion in the act of girls dressing as boys, but repeatedly we are told instead that these girls don't have a choice, that while there may be some advantage in having lived as a boy in childhood, ultimately it is not an act of empowerment as much as a "symptom of a societal ill" (paraphrasing, but this comes up several times). In fact it is implied that this practice can even "cause" something like a "gender identity disorder"! Overall from what I have read so far, I believe bacha posh is a necessary part of the culture and that it affords women a fluidity and freedom that they wouldn't otherwise have. I was intrigued and inspired by the notion that gender identity in childhood is not as "fixed," important, or set in stone to Afghans as it may be to us in the West (where often the first question to a parent holding an infant is "Oh, is it a boy or a girl?").

Anger was not one of my first responses to this book. I think for the most part Nordberg does a good job of remaining reasonably objective in her presentation of Afghan culture: we aren't led through repeated horrifying, detail-laden examples of the evils of Afghan men/patriarchy and the plight of all Afghan women. I admired that Nordberg avoided painting in broad strokes and really tried to pull out different stories about different types of women. She shines a light on women's efforts to empower themselves (Azita's story, the cross dressing "uncle" who has a special status in "his" village, the "lady doctor" who specializes in "son making," etc.). I thought it was fascinating to read several times about women's skepticism of the effectiveness of foreign aid and intervention. I think it would be easy for the book to become an ethnocentric, overly emotional propaganda piece, but I think it's much more intelligently written and has really grabbed my attention. (That said, I wish the author would stick to a tighter narrative. I'm finding that it meanders somewhat.)


message 9: by Matt (new)

Matt (mlabrake) | 95 comments Mod
I agree with many that much of what we know about Afghanistan is through the media’s portrayal, which focuses on our conflicts with the Taliban. It’s really eye-opening to read about the internal struggle faced by Afghan women, and population as a whole.

Nancy, I really like how you describe the Afghan population as “good people stuck in a never-ending life of war and desperation.” It really makes me count my blessings to have been born in a country with the freedoms we have here.

Jessica, thanks for bringing up this idea of generalization. We are often quick to stereotype certain groups of people based on location, culture, ethnicity, gender, sexual orientation, etc. The media makes this population out to be anti-American terrorists, and this book really sheds light on how the majority of Afghans are just normal people, many of whom would probably move elsewhere if given the choice.

Christine, I am also amazed at how badly women are treated in this culture. As you say “the fact that daydreaming is seen as a form of temptation”, punishable by physical abuse or even death, is insane.

Shelly, it must be crazy to hear these stories from your cousin from his experiences in 2002. Many who have witnessed those horrors first-hand can’t even talk about it.

Matthew, I agree that it seems bacha posh is a necessary part of the culture. However, I definitely believe a family would be rebelling against their upbringing and societal beliefs by condoning it. As the book continues, it shows examples of grown women choosing to continue to live as bacha posh long into their adult lives. The author does an excellent job of summing up her thoughts on these practices towards the end of the book. She says “bacha posh is both historical and present day rejection of patriarchy by those who refuse to accept the ruling order for themselves and their daughters.” I’d be curious to see if your thoughts change as you read further.


message 10: by Eric (new)

Eric Alicea | 4 comments Eric Alicea
Feminist Thought tues/ thurs
1) Before reading the book I have been to Afghanistan and understand that it has been ravaged with conflict for generations. Some of the people that I met there were living in the most remote places in the mountains under the impression that the Russians were still there until they met US forces. So there were no surprises concerning the average person’s education and medical aid. However I did find it surprising pertaining to the ideal of having a son it of utmost importance. Not only as a married woman’s obligation but the social impact that it would have on the family.

2) The practice of bacha posh does make sense to me not only for its ideal of securing or increasing social status for the family, but to secure and protect the other women in the family. In Afghanistan there is little to no law and many people will view a group of women as weak and attempt to take advantage when the husband is not present. Many families going as far as marring first cousins to keep property and assets within the family. The idea of having a bacha posh has economic advantages as well since they are able to be outside and work. Which in many cases a bacha posh working is a necessity in order for the family to have the most basic amenities during conflict.

3) I would have to say that no part of the story made me angry. Most likely because the world can be a very cruel place. Should it be like this were women can be beaten by their husbands for not giving birth to a son? I don’t think so. However in Afghanistan there are other issues that need to be resolved such as the literacy rate, education, and structuring of the economy. Am I trying to give precedence of one over another? Absolutely not. What I am trying to say is that the Afghans have lived this way for maybe thousands of years and have a long way to go in there ideals on segregation and violence against women


message 11: by Eric (new)

Eric Alicea | 4 comments Christine i agree that the batcha posh idea does have to deal with acceptance not only as a wife but in there society as well. A batch posh is only utilized to fill a temporary void of a son at the very least until one is born. This seems to be in order to protect the family from social slander that the man is weak and the wife is no good. in this case a batcha posh can solidify a families social standing within there community.


Eric Alicea
Feminist Thought tues/ thurs


message 12: by Eric (new)

Eric Alicea | 4 comments Mancy

I'm not sure i agree that they are stripping the chosen girl of her identity. this chosen girl has the opportunity to experience life as a boy and all of the privileges that come with it.it will give her a better understanding of how there society works and to formulate her own opinion. If i am correct Azita was one and she became apart of Parliament in Afghanistan. I don't think she would of been able to accomplish this with out the understanding of how Afghan men operate.

Eric Alicea
Feminist Thought tues/ thurs


message 13: by Christine (new)

Christine | 4 comments Hi Matt!
Thanks for responding! I have thoroughly enjoyed reading everyone's comments and getting their perspectives on the book.


message 14: by Christine (new)

Christine | 4 comments Hello Eric,
I must say very good post. What an experience it must have been for you to visit Afghanistan and interact and engage with Afghan people first hand. I do understand the need for batcha posh because of the pressures women feel to uphold the family's social status. Although it can benefit a family socially I still find it sad. The fact the family has to go through such methods just to not be ostracized or ridiculed within their community is absurd to me.


message 15: by Klevis (new)

Klevis | 4 comments 1) Although Afghanistan and its conflicts have been well-covered, the book offers a different entry point into the lives of people there. Before reading this book what (if anything) did you know about Afghanistan? What did you find surprising about the country and its history in reading this book?
Afghanistan was created based in the Islam traditions and for more than three hundred years since its creation the state continues to protect and regulate its political and business regulations based solemnly on the religion. It is perceived as a collectivist culture where group goals have a higher priority than individualistic incentives. The book of Quran which is perceived as the sacred book in the history of Muslimism predicts several principles to follow and obey like economic equality, where rich people are required to assist the deprived people and jobs are offered based on family tiers rather than professional standing. Also the sacred book condemns adultery and because of that women are required to wear a veil or a scarf to cover their face and are supposed to be loyal and dedicate their entire time to the family.

2) After reading the book, does the practice of bacha posh make sense to you, or is it entirely foreign? How would you explain why this happens?
I never heard of the bacha posh practice before reading the book and I was very interested to learn about the tradition more. It sounds horrible to live in a society where women are treated as slaves while men get all the privileges, but it sounds even more horrible to be a woman and get raised as a man.

3) The author outlines a pervasive culture of violence and extreme segregation. Which part of the story, if any, made you angry? Why?
I think that I get angrier that Afghanistan and other countries around still treat women like something that can be transformed in anything they want to. I don’ t understand how parents can allow such a thing.


message 16: by Emerson (new)

Emerson Rosado | 4 comments Emerson Rosado
Feminist Thought tues/ thurs
1) I did not know that much about the wars that occurs in Afghanistan. It makes me feel very upset to know that people of Afghanistan have suffered for so long. Afghanistan's crossroads position in Central Asia has subjected it to constant invasion and conquest throughout its long recorded history. The history of Afghanistan is a history of war and conflict even up to present day. What I found surprising is that extended family households may contain three to four generations including the male head of family and his wife, his brothers, several sons and their families, cousins with their families, as well as all unmarried and widowed female, and elderly grandparents. These multigenerational units practice close economic cooperation and come together on all life-crisis occasions. This permits cohesive in-group solidarity to be maintain.

2) It was shocking for me to know about bacha posh. It is incredible how an old tradition in Afghanistan allows families without a son to transform one of their daughters into a boy. I cannot imagine how these little girls spend their adolescence dressed as boys, assuming all the responsibilities of a son and being accord all the privileges of being male. However, the girls can only be bacha posh for a few years after puberty; they must revert to wearing the burqa, marry, and live a normal woman life.

3) Several parts of the story make me angry. However, the part that annoys me the most is that women have to wear burkas. I do not understand why women have to wear a loose garment covering the entire body and having a veiled opening for the eyes. I can assure everybody that has to be uncomfortable to wear that kind of attire in the summer.


message 17: by Emerson (new)

Emerson Rosado | 4 comments Hello Christine,
I want to let you know that your post is very interesting and offer a lot of information about the book. I also want to add that the hidden practice of bringing up a young girl as a boy involves altering her physical appearance and giving her a male name. I know that there are no official statistics, but most Afghans will know at least one bacha posh in their family or community.


message 18: by Emerson (new)

Emerson Rosado | 4 comments Hello Eric,
I agree with you in the fact that, the Afghanistan population has some issues to solve. Education is a big issue for Afghanistan. It is incredible how not some many decades ago schools existed, but whether or not a child attended school was completely up to his or her family. Some families thought that education was important and made sacrifices to secure their children’s education, including sending them away to relatives if local schooling was not available. Other families provided religious training for their sons. Some families simply did not send their children to school.

Emerson Rosado
Feminist Thought


message 19: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 5 comments Shelly wrote: "Jessica wrote: "I have heard very limited things regarding Afghanistan. Mostly what was covered in the beginning of the book, such as it being the number one place to live and the most dangerous pl..."

Shelly, wow. Words cannot even describe how that makes me feel, and it is only all the more angering because many people in this country (America) don't think this issue is still a problem. I recently had an experience with another female that was shaming other women for what they were doing, and kept saying they way she was raised she was taught to always put the 'man' first, but why can't it just be equal? I see who this things are menial compared to the extremities of Afghanistan but why is it so hard to accept there is also a problem in gender in even the most developed countries. There was a really great part in the book that spoke about all the aid from foreigners Afghanistan would receive and it was mostly geared toward the women, the ones that have basically no say or input in their society. I think something that we are starting to look at and what is making a greater impact are campaigns like 'HeForShe' where we include both genders into the conversation because as Emma Watson said in her U.N. speech, it isn't just a female issue it's also most certainly a male issue as well. In a country where male input is so important, it only makes sense to start educating them and involving them into the conversation. Maybe then, something can change.


message 20: by Anayzah (new)

Anayzah Thomas | 2 comments Hello, everyone!

1) The only thing I knew about Afghanistan are the things talked about on the news during the war: eliminating the threat of terrorism. After reading the book, however, the condition of the country shocked and horrified me. The foreign aid that was wasted on "eliminating" terrorism could have been put to better use liberating Afghan women who have been forced into impossible situations. The fact that until this very day, in 2015, that young women are still see as bargaining chips, walking incubators and simple servants is absolutely disgusting.

2) The practice of bacha posh makes complete sense to me. Necessity is the mother of innovation. It is not a permanent solution, though. I agree with Azita in the book: it is merely a symptom of the crippling patriarchal system.

3) There were a few times that I have to put the book down, I was so angry. I don't even know where to begin. The forced marriage of teenage girls to men, some nearly 20 years their senior, the necessity of sons as a means of status, the "burden" women bring to society. I think what made me the most angry is the shame women have for just being women there. Not only do the men keep them down, the women do it as well. They are taught from an early age that the sole purpose in life is to marry and have sons.They can never travel alone, play outside, making their own money, be educated, things I was encouraged to do here and it truly breaks my heart.

Anayzah Thomas
Feminist Thought


message 21: by Emasia (new)

Emasia Craig | 3 comments 1.) The only thing I knew about Afghanistan would be war. I never did much research on how they live, what the women go through or how set back they are from America. I found it very interesting that women still have to hide themselves to better a man. I learned society in Afghanistan was not ready to accept women for who they are.
2.) After reading this book bacha posh makes perfect sense to me. In order for a woman to bring her family honor or have a better life she has to have the life of a man. If I had to sum up why they do it. I would say they do it so they do not have to live the life of the women before them. At first I was shocked because I do not hear women becoming men unless they want too.
3.) I can honestly say nothing in the book made me feel angry. It made me think how blessed I am to have the freedoms I do. I do not have to feel the pressure to have a son or be scared my husband might kill me if I do not. I have the option to have an education and better myself as of other women do not. I thought not being paid equally as a man was the worst but this book taught me I have much to be grateful for and in time it’ll come.


message 22: by Luciana (last edited May 04, 2015 04:10PM) (new)

Luciana Leobino | 4 comments Feminist Thoughts Tues/Thurs
1) To be completely honest, the only thing I actually knew about Afghanistan was that they were at war with the United States. This all started after the September 11th, 2001 attack, and it has continued until this day. Also, Ossama Bin Laden established a base in Afghanistan, he declared the war with the U.S, and initiated a series of bombings and related attacks.

Since I wasn’t aware of what happens or has happened in Afghanistan, I was very intrigued to learn with an insight about what the daily life of the Afghan people go through, along with their struggles and pressures. Their internal cultural “rules” affect them deeply because they’re many that doesn’t allow people to do much. This book have brought me to an understanding about their society, and how there is many things that we relate to as well.

2) Growing up in a country that is very open, and being ok in not having a son, Bacha posh is entirely foreign to me. I understand that it is a cultural thing to do, but it takes away the daughter’s identity away from her. She might get more freedoms such as attending school, working, and escorting “her” sisters to school, but it is taking away from who she is. It is basically saying that she is not good enough and that God (or Allah) made a mistake when she was born. This only happens because the name of the family must keep on, and a man has much more freedom. The family might need workers, and women aren’t allowed to work, they must be housewives.

3) Altogether this book and its stories have made me very angry, because I am not for wars or any type of violence. Also, women suffer so much in Afghanistan because they’re almost bullied into doing things they don’t want. There is so much violence going on along with poverty.


message 23: by Victoria (new)

Victoria Wilks | 3 comments Hello Eric,
Thank you for clarifying the practice of bacha posh from a different point of view. As I was reading it made me angry knowing that parents actually dressed their daughter up as a boy. I cannot even imagine how it would feel like to be a girl and have my parents treat me as if I was their son. Although it seems partially selfish that a family’s little girl must grow up as a boy in order to prevent the family from being embarrassed and shamed for not having a son.

Victoria Wilks
Feminist Thought


message 24: by Sean (new)

Sean Smith | 4 comments 1) Before reading this book and before my current class Feminist Thought my professor Dr. Szalai showed us a documentary on women's education around the world and one of the ones I remember most is about Afghanistan women. In the documentary we follow an Afghan girl who has struggles in her life since she was born. Her mother cried over the fact that she gave birth to a girl and at a young age of 13-14 she married her cousin and had a child. This life style was what I expected of this book but I didn't expect to read about the bacha posh.

2) Even reading about the bacha posh I still feel I could never understand the struggles these girls face in their lives unless I was to live my life like theirs. Jenny Nordberg earned the trust of these families to learn that they have a daughter who acts like a boy. She experienced girls living through this and she likely doesn't feel foreign compared to me but even after reading this one can only imagine how these girls feel about their entire lives as Afghan women.

3) The segregation and the differences on how girls and boys are treated can make anyone angry. But I find the idea that this society decides exactly how your life is lived from the day you are born. The parents decide who among their daughters will live as boys and even if they are supposed to be treated as boys there are still so many things in their society that just controls their lives. Just the idea of not having any control of your life or how their existence as girls is denied is what makes me the most angry.


message 25: by Rosa (new)

Rosa Marquez | 2 comments Rosa Marquez
Feminist Thought: Woodland Park Tuesday/Thursday

Before reading this book I have made a lot of research of women from Afghanistan. I've made a lot of research on how women live and what was considered “normal” for them. What I came across during my research wasn’t so different from what I’ve read in the book. In the book families were embarrassed to give birth to girls and females were always looked down upon, however, for men it was entirely different. In Afghanistan women cannot be independent because they always need a man to stand by her throughout everything she has to do. After reading this book I cannot fathom how girls in that country can deal with their families being ashamed of who they are that they would have to go through a complete sex change to be considered normal. This is what completely upsets me throughout the entire book, knowing how these women do not have any independence in their life and always have to depend on a man to get through one simple task through the day.


message 26: by Arielkys (new)

Arielkys Morel | 6 comments Arielkys Morel
Feminist Thought tues/ thurs
1) Before reading this book, I thought I knew quite a lot about Afghanistan, but I was seriously wrong. I knew about the series of wars and conflicts inflicted in the Middle East and I also knew about AL-Qaeda and how they rule with an iron fist. I can admitted after reading this book how upset I was to know that people of Afghanistan have suffered for so long. Afghanistan's geological position has caused that country to be subjected to multiply invasion throughout its extended existence. Afghanistan has been part of vicious cycle of wars and conflict that till this days is still occurring. What I found most surprising after reading the book was, the level of oppressing and abuse, females in Afghanistan have to withstand throughout their lives. Women have little to no rights and are consider a second class citizen. Society sees then as inferior and in many cases they are seen as a burden. In this society females must be extremely careful of what they wear, their gestures and not to attract too much attention. The level of fear and oppressing which they have to deal on a daily basis is incredible and despite that, many women in this society strive to move forward and do their best in a society that is constantly trying to bring them down.

2) When I first heard of bocha posh, I thought it was extremely weird practice and I did not understand the reason for which a female would dress and act like a man. But as I continue to read about various families and their reasons, I understand the motive for such outrageous practices. Growing up in a country that pride itself in its freedom, Bacha posh is completely foreign to me. Even though I understand the struggle of being a female in a society that sees you inferior in every single way, it also worries me that Bocha Posh to an extended takes away the daughter’s identity away from them. Bocha Posh exchanges freedom, which allows the females to attend to school, go outside and socialized but in return I believe it takes away from the female identity, which they no longer want to be original gender.

3) Several parts of the story made me extremely angry to an extended to that I had to stop reading, but if I had to choose I would say what made me the angriest was oppression of women. In that society not only are females second class citizens but also are view as burden to their families. Man from a young age, are thought to citizens women by the way that they dress and behave and women themselves instead of empowering one another, also judge one another extremely harshly.


message 27: by Kevin (last edited May 04, 2015 09:15PM) (new)

Kevin | 4 comments 1) In the world of being a Muslim, I understand how difficult that religion could be to believe in. In Afghanistan I understand that, compared to the rights here in America, the country seems to be unfair for the population of females. In the Muslim world females are denied basic human rights. Any aspect of rights you could think of that is equally enforced in the states, doesn't apply to the Country of Afghanistan. From diver licenses, to divorce. There isn't an more unfair country to lacks rights that is equally enforced upon both genders than Afghanistan. According to the NY post, the United Nations saved the children of Afghanistan and the Thompson Reuters Foundation have ranked the country of Afghanistan the worst place in the world to be a women, mother, a child, and a newborn. The average life expectancy for women is the age of 44. There is a belief in Afghanistan, "Killing for 'Honour'", that if you cheat you are to be killed for purported sexual misconduct. Human trafficking is still to be an issue, and suggesting the sale of women into marriage where high bride prices are given to the father of the bride. These are some of the facts that I've known about Afghanistan before reading the book.

2) “Bacha posh” is the term for a girl who is dressed up, and disguised as, a boy. These children are part of a hidden practice in which parents disguise their daughters as sons. Instead of wearing a headscarf, and a skirt or a dress, a little girl will get a short haircut and a pair of pants, and she’ll be sent off into the world as one of the boys. The bacha posh look like boys, they learn to behave like boys, and to those around them who don’t know, they are Afghan boys. Afghanistan is a terrible country to be living in, upon the female gender. Life as female is simply unfair there. You get treated differently, unfair, and as a female you are not to be taken seriously. All of that just because your a female, something that you have absolute no control of becoming. This is without a doubt a foreign subject of matter because here in the states, both genders have equal rights that are strictly enforced. Unfortunately, for the females of Afghanistan, they have never witnessed what it feels like to have equal rights.

3) The segregation and the differences on how males and females are treated can make anyone angry. I believe in equal rights because you have no control over what gender you're going to come to be. Therefore I find the whole dilemma about females not having the same rights males quite preposterous. But in the US, at least, I believe that in our society is the determining factor of exactly how your life is lived from the day you are born. The parents base your offspring upon how todays society wants everyone to be. They decide if you want to be Bisexual, homosexual, straight, etc. Just the fact of not having control of your life in Afghanistan over something you have absolute no control of determining what gender you're going to turn out to be or how their existence as girls is denied is what upsets me.

Kevin Ortiz
HUM 325
Tuesday and Thursday Woodland Park


message 28: by Arielkys (new)

Arielkys Morel | 6 comments wrote Emasia "I can honestly say nothing in the book made me feel angry. It made me think how blessed I am to have the freedoms I do."

I completely agree with you, after reading this book I felt extremely lucky to be born in a society which encourage women to pursuit a higher education and allow to them to have the freedom to make their own decisions. In the other hand, the book made me feel frustrated and sad, that many Afghanistan females do not get to experience what is like not to be suppress.


message 29: by Arielkys (new)

Arielkys Morel | 6 comments wrote by Kevin "There isn't an more unfair country to lacks rights that is equally enforced upon both genders than Afghanistan... The average life expectancy for women is the age of 44."

Before reading this book I probably would have made the case for another country to take the title as the worst country to be born a female, but after reading this book and reading the cold heart facts, I sadly agree. Females have little to no rights in Afghanistan, an animal in many cases are treated better than them. The fact that the life expectancy is so low in Afghanistan is no big surprise to me, when a system so unjust is still in place.


message 30: by Edina (new)

Edina Szalai | 1 comments Hi Sean,

The documentary you mentioned is called Girls Rising and it provides a fascinating overview of the challenges young girls face in different parts of the world if they desire to receive an education.


message 31: by Matt (last edited May 05, 2015 04:40PM) (new)

Matt (mlabrake) | 95 comments Mod
Lillian, we have this DVD available for loan at our NYC Campus Library - Find it by clicking here!


message 32: by Jackie (new)

Jackie | 1 comments Thread 1

1) Although Afghanistan and its conflicts have been well-covered, the book offers a different entry point into the lives of people there. Before reading this book what (if anything) did you know about Afghanistan? What did you find surprising about the country and its history in reading this book?
Before listening to this book, I must say I didn't know much about Afghanistan besides whatever I've ever learned on the news. Honestly the country really only reminds me of war and a strict culture. I wasn't surprise to hear about the issues among women but didn't realize the extent of their oppression, either. Being a westerner my entire life kind of blind folds me to world issues and sometimes it is hard to believe that these things still occur. The most shocking thing for me to learn was about how women loss everything when they divorce, including her children. They basically become marginalized.

2) After reading the book, does the practice of bacha posh make sense to you, or is it entirely foreign? How would you explain why this happens?
I totally comprehend the practice of bacha posh. If I were in their shoes I would probably become one too or at least hoped my parents decided that for me at birth. My concern is each transition from girl to boy back to girl, and how the gender role can become confusing. This practice became a clever way for families to bring up honor for their families. It seems like the bacha posh doesn't know any different living as a boy isn't' as hard until puberty. It empowers the girl to become a fighter and persevere as a woman.


3) The author outlines a pervasive culture of violence and extreme segregation. Which part of the story, if any, made you angry? Why?
All the stories were touching and stirred emotion. Learning about the unjust ways of some cultures is very demeaning and almost incomprehensible. I really felt bad for the women whose husband left her and used a word three times (can't remember the word) to announce he wanted a divorce. She was left all alone with her child and in denial. She felt as if she had failed as a women. Which is a terrible thing for a women to feel just because she couldn't bear a son.
Jackie Diaz
Feminist Thought
HUM 365 Woodland Pk


message 33: by Victoria (new)

Victoria Wilks | 3 comments Hello Christine,
I’ve been aware of violence by men towards women in certain Middle Eastern countries, but not to the extent you have mentioned. I think it is absolutely baffling that even in the 21st century, women are faced with such severe mistreatment and abuse.

Victoria Wilks
Feminist Thought


message 34: by Daniela (last edited May 06, 2015 07:04PM) (new)

Daniela Colon | 4 comments 1)Before reading this book I knew that Afghanistan is a country where people follow and respect their customs and religious believes. In this country most if not all women are dominated by men who dictate what has to be done. Women have to obey and be submissive to satisfy their husbands and society expectations. I found surprising that these women have not protested to make their rights count. Another thing that surprised me was the fact that women were not fully accomplished until they have a son. The history of Afghanistan make me angry because women are treated as objects who have to clean and take care of kids and husband. These women don’t have rights. They don’t choose the husband, on the opposite they are assigned a husband. Love is not a priority, it is not even important to love. For this reason, I imagine how miserable these women can feel and I also wonder if they are so used to this treatment that they see it as normal.


2)The practice of Bacha Posh makes sense to me in a society were only men are important, only men receive education priority. In a family where there is a boy and a girl all the money for education will go to the son. If there is some money left it will go to the girl’s education. Being a Bacha Posh is a good thing for these girls because they dress like boys, but they also get all the privileges that boys receive such as better education, better treatment, and less restrictions. Being a girl is so much harder because that means that you are weak, dependent, and less important than a boy. Therefore, many girls who were Bacha Posh during their early lives did not want to go back to be a woman.


3)One of the parts that make me angry is where the book (pg. 43) mentions a girl whose name means “naqis-ul-aql” stupid by birth and born with lack of wisdom. Even with the name I can perceive the difference, the verbal abuse to stigmatize this girl. Another part that makes me very angry is where it explains how raped girls are considered impure and are forced to marry the criminal. Also the criminal does receive any punishment for his act. This is cruel, inhumane, and heartbreaking. I would never think that this kind of act is still permitted and ignored by supposedly intelligent men who know about justice, human’s rights and common sense. Unfortunately, it does not matter how men act in this patriarchal system, they will always be excused and unpunished.

Daniela Colon
Feminist Thought
Woodland Park


message 35: by JilliannePangaro (new)

JilliannePangaro | 2 comments 1.) Before reading this book I knew very little about Afghanistan. Although I did know that there have been many generations of conflicts and war fair I did not know the depth of how poorly treated women are in this country. This book really brought you into the lives of the Afghanistan people, mainly the suffrage of being a female. It did not surprise me that they lowered the image of Afghanistan women considering they make them conceal their entire bodies with cloth. However, what did surprise me is how seriously disrespected and poorly treated they are even after obeying and doing what they are told to do. With great deal the men of this country praise women when a male is born, with celebrations and parties, but when a female produces another female she is nothing but the devil and treated poorly, beaten repeatedly all because of the female off spring. This puts a great deal of pressure not only on the pregnant women but, on the entire family for not living up to the social standards of the importance of male offspring.
2.) I understand what Bacha Posh is, however it is a shame that families have to go through this just to gain any kind of social acceptance per say for their daughter. Although Bacha posh “dressed up as a boy” really doesn’t seem ideal to most people, in a sense it gives females a little bit more freedom in Afghanistan to attend school, going outside, and the ability to work. Again, it is a shame that women must act a specific way and hold the same responsibilities as a man to have any kind of respect in this country. Just a few months after a female goes through puberty, she is expected to go back to a “female” and continue the traditional ways of getting married and reverting back to wearing her burqa and the life style of an Afghan women.
3.) To be honest I would have to say majority of the book I was having mixed emotions between sad and angry. It made me so angry to read the brutality against women and the way they must live their lives day in and day out being a slave to their own husband or just any man in general. The world is a very cruel place, but in no way in any country should it be okay for a husband to beat their wife for producing a female offspring. Especially when the male is the dominate in determining the sex of the baby. It’s really sad to read about all the suffering children, uneducated individuals, families in hiding for safety, fleeing violence, wars, poverty and the double standards of living the men of this country want. At the end of the book I couldn’t help getting all chocked up knowing how inspiriting Jenny Nordberg was to express in words the real suffrage of women in this country and the experiences she has encountered during her travels; hope that one day it will come to an end.

Jillianne Pangaro
HUM325 - WP


message 36: by Daniela (new)

Daniela Colon | 4 comments Rosa wrote: "Rosa Marquez
Feminist Thought: Woodland Park Tuesday/Thursday

Before reading this book I have made a lot of research of women from Afghanistan. I've made a lot of research on how women live and wh..."


Hello Rosa, I can feel what you are saying because I felt the same way when I was reading the book. How it is possible that when a girl was born the mother was sad because a boy would have been the best for the family name a society expectations. This is what is called lack of knowledge or just ignorance. Weren’t these girls humans just as the boys? How it is possible that they had to dress like men to be consider better and have better treatment. Even though I see this society as ignorant, I see these girls who were Bacha Posh as brave, strong and intelligent. They did not have other choice than being a boy and enjoy of the privileges while the boy's image lasted.

Daniela Colon
Feminist Thought
Woodland Park


message 37: by Daniela (new)

Daniela Alarcon | 4 comments Daniela Alarcon
Feminist Thought WDK
Tues/Thurs

1.) Before I read the book I knew some information about Afghanistan's culture. For example, I knew that Afghan women would never be treasured in their society. In this culture, women do not have a say in anything. They must ask a man for permission before doing something. After reading the book I learned that Afghanistan is worse than I thought. Women do not have a say in even the clothes they wear. They are not permitted to wear anything colorful because they would be considered a "whore". Another thing I have just learned is that a man, if he can afford it, can have another wife if his first wife can not give him a son. He is also the only one that can grant a divorce even if his wife is the one that wants it. Divorce rarely occurs because the children will automatically go to the husband.

2.) The practice of "bacha posh" now makes sense to me for the fact that their culture looks down on women. Women are not permitted to do anything a man can do. It is very limited for a woman to do things. Women are not even allowed to question a man and his decision on anything. Bach Posh is a chance for women to see the other side of life, such as having a little taste of freedom. This can be confusing for the child when they hit puberty. In that culture they do not have a conversation about puberty because they think their is no reason to do so. The problem is that when these girls are growing up believing they are men and this happens, they think something is wrong. This can cause difficulty for them to understand who they really are. But if they were raised as a girl their whole life, they would not have an outlook on how life should be for everyone.

3.) To be honest the whole book pretty much enraged me to a certain point. But one part in particular made me actually have to put the book down for a few. In the beginning of the book i read that two men on motorbikes went to Azita's home and threw a hand made grenade in her backyard that exploded. Azita's daughter was playing in the backyard and the grenade almost hit her. How much hatred do you have to not even care of the woman's child! And to know that they tried to kill Azita because she worked in parliament. Another thing that enraged me was that women had to listen to everything her husband had to say and even if women were to work, the money is not fully hers. I am used to being very independent and I hate when people tell me what I can and can not do so this statement was something I could not understand.


message 38: by Daniela (new)

Daniela Alarcon | 4 comments Jackie wrote: "Thread 1

1) Although Afghanistan and its conflicts have been well-covered, the book offers a different entry point into the lives of people there. Before reading this book what (if anything) did y..."


Hello Jackie,

I can relate to what you are saying. Every time I listen to the news all I see are negative things like attacks or warlords. So we picture Afghanistan as an evil place that we never want to visit or hear about. I also can agree with you about a wife losing her children automatically if the husband and wife get a divorce. There is no trial of any sort just another reason why Afghan look down on women.

Daniela Alarcon
Feminist Thought WDK
Tues/Thurs


message 39: by Victoria (new)

Victoria Wilks | 3 comments Victoria Wilks
Feminist Thought

1) Before reading the book, I did not know anything about Afghanistan other than what is circulated throughout the media. To be completely honest, it wasn't something that i particularly cared about either because after hearing quite often of all the war and hardships I decided that I was lucky that I am not living there and that Afghanistan is not necessarily a place I would like to visit. After reading this book, it more deeply confirms that it is a much worse environment for women because of the lack of women’s rights. What surprised me the most was how women are shamed for giving birth to females; because without females there wouldn't be anyone to give birth to sons.

2) After reading the book, the practice of bacha posh makes some sense to me; however, it makes me angry knowing that parents dress a daughter up as a boy. It is difficult for me to fathom being a little girl having to grow up as someone I am not and then after hitting puberty having to adjust back to being a female. It is selfish that a family’s little girl must grow up as a boy in order to prevent the family from being embarrassed and shamed for not having a son. Not to mention that once the girl is going to be married off and is expected to be a female again, she will lose all the freedoms that she has experienced for many years growing up as a “male”.

3) I’d have to say that the inequality between the men and women in Afghanistan made me upset. What made me a little angry was how parents, in order to make themselves look good, completely alter the mind of one of their daughters and raise them as a male. Then years later they just decide that they will forget everything they know, including the freedoms they had as “male” and learn to act like a female would.


message 40: by Kristin (new)

Kristin | 4 comments Afghanistan is a country that the US has been involved with for a long time now so I have heard a lot about it through media coverage and I knew that it was a country where women weren’t treated as equals to men. I wasn’t surprised to find out that when women have children and don’t produce boys that they were ashamed but I was surprised that people would be accepting of the idea of a bacha posh. It doesn’t seem like something they would allow since the girls dressed as a boy is actually a boy.

The practice of bacha posh does make sense to me after reading this book because of the value the people of Afghanistan put on having a boy. If a woman wants to be accepted in her society she needs to have a boy so I could see where the idea of dressing up one of your girls as a boy to be accepted would come into play. I think that it is a sad thing that this is the way people have to go about being accepted in society but I do see how it would work.

There were so many things about this story that made me angry when it comes to the violence and segregation. One thing that made me angry was just the idea of bacha posh as a whole. The fact that they raise these girls as boys and then expect them to be able to go back to being a girl makes me extremely angry because it causes a lot of these girls to have gender identity problems from the rest of their lives. Another part of the story that made me angry was that since Azita was successful it made her husband feel lesser so he would beat her when he came home to assert his power above her.

Kristin Trainor
Feminist Thought


message 41: by Kristin (last edited May 08, 2015 10:13PM) (new)

Kristin | 4 comments Emerson wrote: "Emerson Rosado
Feminist Thought tues/ thurs
1) I did not know that much about the wars that occurs in Afghanistan. It makes me feel very upset to know that people of Afghanistan have suffered for ..."


Hi Emerson,

It also makes me upset that women in Afghanistan today still have to wear Burkas. The way women live in Afghanistan is restrictive so I see why they still have to wear them and I hope one day, women in Afghanistan and all over the world can dress and act how they would like to rather than be ruled by their husbands or their father.

Kristin Trainor
Feminist Thought


message 42: by Sean (new)

Sean Smith | 4 comments Eric the fact that you've been there means that like Jenny you can understand how these women feel and how their society works better then any of us. You experienced what their life is like which is something I've only experienced from reading books and articles. To me I still find things wrong in general with bacha posh, but I can understand why their society uses such a system and you probably have an even greater understanding of their culture.


message 43: by Michelle (new)

Michelle Benitez | 6 comments Michelle Benitez
Feminist Thought


Prior to reading this book, I knew a small amount of what occurs to women in Afghanistan. Whatever was covered in the news and occasionally stumbling upon an article online were the most information I have gathered on Afghanistan. I knew the county was in turmoil and women rights were not considered. Aside from the typical stereotypes of terrorists, reading the book gave me a different insight as to how some of the population in Afghanistan think.
It was surprising to me when I heard that women were looked down upon for having a female child as opposed to a male. It also fascinated me how women who conceive boys are praised and celebrated. So before birth, females are already in it's own detrimental category. What also intrigued me was the concept of how women cannot walk away from a marriage without going through this huge ordeal and men can easily with only words walk away from a marriage.

The practice of bacha posh is actually very understandable. These women live in a society where they have one specific role and have no equal rights against men. It is normal to feel like as a female, you are oppressed and do not want to grow up in a society where you are a target. It is similar to female politicians, they were suits so they are looked as dominant compared to wearing a dress even if it is appropriate. Showing femininity is weak.

Being that I am a woman, the entire rights women hold in Afghanistan is awful. What scares me is the rape situation. If a woman is raped, whether is is within the marriage or outside of the marriage, she is guilty for adultery and suspected of adultery for being with another man even if it was sex without consent. In the United States, a woman can freely testify against her rapist and get him punished but in Afghanistan that is not possible. Rape is such an emotional and mental scar, aside from physical. Assuming thousands of women get raped and none of them can voice it.


message 44: by Michelle (last edited May 09, 2015 09:32PM) (new)

Michelle Benitez | 6 comments Luciana wrote: "Feminist Thoughts Tues/Thurs
1) To be completely honest, the only thing I actually knew about Afghanistan was that they were at war with the United States. This all started after the September 11t..."


Hello Luciana,
It is hard to tie in religion with the way women are oppressed in Afghanistan. Most people in middle eastern countries practice Islam, which have high standards and morals so it is hard to connect the way society views women as a whole in this country compared to religious views. Indeed, you are correct. Bacha posh makes it seem like these girls should feel ashamed for being a woman, but in reality it is to protect them from this oppression.

Michelle Benitez
Feminist Though WPK


message 45: by Michelle (new)

Michelle Benitez | 6 comments Victoria wrote: "Victoria Wilks
Feminist Thought

1) Before reading the book, I did not know anything about Afghanistan other than what is circulated throughout the media. To be completely honest, it wasn't someth..."


Hello Victoria,
It is hard to decide how negative Bacha Posh is. When you sit there and analyze why they do it, the answer is quite clear. As U.S citizens, we have faced women rights issues, but in our time, it is nowhere near what is occurring in Afghanistan. Unfortunately, women do develop identity issues because they transform into a boy and then later again into a woman once puberty occurs. But the advantages of being a boy is more food, education, actual socialization with the world, and highly looked upon. Girls do not receive education which is very important in these developing countries.


message 46: by Janet (new)

Janet Castillo | 8 comments This book was very eye opening. We never think any other culture can be different than others. The only thing I knew about Afghanistan is that there were various wars that occurred there. Other than that I learned much about it while reading the book. Women weren’t treated equally as the man were. It’s so unfortunate because we females can do so much but we’re taken advantage of. In Afghanistan, if the parents didn’t bare a male son, they would make there last daughter a male. This effects the individual because they may get confused at some point. I never heard of anything like this until I read the book. Their culture is so different than ours. It’s so crazy to believe that the people living there know about it and they’re accepting of it. The daughters who become a male even want to stay a male because they know how much women suffer. This probably happens because in some cultures, man are said to be stronger than women. They don’t show there emotion towards anything and some people believe this makes them stronger. It made me upset that if women wanted a divorce, the male had to approve. The women would be judged but not the male. No matter what the male did, they would still be looked up too but not the women no matter how much she suffered. I’m very happy that this doesn’t happen here because women are treated equally to males. If they do want a divorce, they don’t have to ask for permission like they do in Afghanistan.

Janet Castillo
Feminist Thought
Woodland Park Campus


message 47: by Erika (new)

Erika | 1 comments Erika Moreno
Feminist Thought Tue/Thurs
Woodland Park Campus

Hello everyone,


Before listening to this book I knew the basic stuff about Afghanistan patriarchal society. Also, like many I knew what the media covers, which is mostly in regards to the war against the Taliban’s. Listening to this book has made me realized that afghan women are extremely oppressed and violated in every possible way. Is difficult for me to understand how giving birth to a baby girl means shame and embarrassment for a family. Even mother’s are unhappy with baby girls (this is something that really bothered me) because they are afraid their husband might divorce them if they don’t give birth to a baby boy. A baby girl is unwelcome and feeding a girl is not a priority. On the contrary, having a boy is a blessing and a joyful time for neighbors and family to gather and celebrate .Boys get to go out and play and enjoy their freedom. They have many privileges that girls are denied such as; have an education and being allowed to work. Girls are confined in their homes with their moms and sisters and cannot go outside without the company of a male family member. Afghan girls are thought from an early age that their destiny is to marry, serve their husbands and to reproduce. They are forced into marriages as soon as puberty hits and must obey their parent’s decisions. Most women are abuse by their husbands and are hopeless to their sad destiny.


I totally understand the practice of bacha posh. It gives the chosen daughter the opportunity to feel power, freedom and to have the privileges that women are denied in an ignorant and dysfunctional society. In most of the stories in the book being a bacha posh has made an impact in most of these girls. Some of them have been empowered to succeed, others have been allowed to stay as bacha posh and look after their parents and most of them have had no choice but to go back to being a woman. By the time puberty hits them they hate the idea of becoming a women because they have had the opportunity to understand that been a women in Afghanistan is a curse. One of the main reasons Afghan families practice bacha posh is because it is believed that dressing up a girl as boy is a lucky charm towards having a baby boy. I think this practice has a positive impact as well as a negative impact for the bacha posh. Having the privileges and the freedom that men are allow to have must be a wonderful experience but hitting puberty and having to go back as a week and submissive women must have some kind of psychological effect on these women.


I was very touched by every single story in this book but, I must say that Azita’s story was the one that touched me the most. She had been raised opposite to most afghan girls. She was born into a family that believed in the importance of education and so she had no doubts in her mind that she was going to have a higher education than many other girls and that she was not going to be forced into a marriage. Her life changed drastically after been forced into marriage with her illiterate cousin who by the way had another wife. At only 19 she had to marry and moved away from her family and into her husband family home. Her dreams of becoming a doctor were no longer possible. When she had her baby twins her mother in-law refused to give her milk to fee them because they were girls not boys. That one part of the story that stirred up my emotions was when her father came to visit her and she yield at him that he had done this to her for forcing her into this marriage. I felt as she had been betrayed by her father.


message 48: by Janet (new)

Janet Castillo | 8 comments Michelle Benitez,

You're right about rape being so awful in Afghanistan. Women already feel horrible being raped and will feel even worse knowing nothing will be done to the criminal who did this to her. Me being a female upsets me because sometimes we can't really protect ourselves. We're so lucky to be living in a culture where if something like this happens, the criminal is sent to jail.


message 49: by Janet (new)

Janet Castillo | 8 comments Michelle Benitez

You're right about rape being so awful in Afghanistan. Women already feel horrible being raped and will feel even worse knowing nothing will be done to the criminal who did this to her. Me being a female upsets me because sometimes we can't really protect ourselves. We're so lucky to be living in a culture where if something like this happens, the criminal is sent to jail.

Janet Castillo
Feminist Thought
Woodland Park


message 50: by Janet (new)

Janet Castillo | 8 comments Kristen,

It's unbelievable to think what these families do to there kids. One day they're born a female and the next they're males. I do believe at one point they will be confused of who they really are. But once they're a male some don't want to turn back a female because they see the way they are harshly treated.

Janet Castillo
Feminist Thought
Woodland Park


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