Morales 2341 Spring 2015 Class MW discussion

Flannery O'Connor
This topic is about Flannery O'Connor
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Race, Class, and Culture > More O'Connor- Revelations

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message 1: by Lillian (new)

Lillian Morales (LillianMorales) | 46 comments Mod
What are the similarities between "A Good Man is Hard to Find" and "Revelations?" What do we learn about O"Conner as writer through these 2 stories?


message 2: by Suzette (last edited Apr 21, 2015 05:09PM) (new)

Suzette Sanchez (slelysanchez) | 53 comments Similarites in between "A Goodman is Hard to Find" and "Revelations" are violence, the grandmother and Mrs Turpin are both women who live to criticize other people. They both feel that they are superior women & carry an odd sense of pride. They have confidence. They seem to be the most non-religous women,(they don't seem to by any means live the way a religous women should, or at least think like a religous woman. but when it comes to them being challenged, they turn to god. They both take great pleasure in their depravity, thinking themselves to be "good" people until they are brought to the startling reality of their own horror.
About O'Conner, she uses religion. She uses religion to show that it is more powerful than selfish people hold themselves to be. she describes the way people dress and uses that to categorize class. She expressed in the stories the need for grace.
“the Church is the only thing that is going to make the terrible world we are coming to endurable”


message 3: by Shanda (new)

Shanda Brunson | 64 comments In both stories the central character are older southern women that are set in their idealogical ways of thinking. They are both judgmental and look down upon people. Both women put people put people in social classes and looked down upon them. O'Connor as a writer is true to her southern roots she brings to light how important church is to the south. She also brings up social class that was very relevant in the south especially in the 50's and 60's. O'Connor lived this life so I feel she saw these injustices that happened so she writes about them. Whether we like it or not this behavior still happens maybe not as severe as it did in the 1960's but there are still places in the good ole south that are not as accepting as the rest of the world. O'Connor brings social class, race, and cultures to the forefront with her writings.


message 4: by Marielena (new)

Marielena Franco | 43 comments The similarities between “A good man is hard to find” and “Revelations” are based on religion, how both of the main characters in both of O” Conner’s stories are into religion. Just as in a good man is hard to find” the main character, which is the grandmother, bases everything and calls upon God for every occasion and pretends to be a saint, and the same happens in “Revelation” with Mrs. Turpin. Both of the main characters in this two stories are very into them self’s and judge every one else on how they look and what their attitude is towards life, but never look at what they themselves do wrong. Social class seems to be a huge issue in both of these stories because of the years both of these stories happen. In the story of “Revelation” Mrs. Turpin is criticizing everyone in the waiting room and butting everyone into categories with out even knowing the people in the room personally basing her opinion on physical appearances. In the stories “ A good man is hard to find” the situation is quite the same because the grandmother is criticizing her own family on there personal appearance and she contradicts her self with her believes in the way she thinks of her own family. What I learned from O” Conner id this two stories is that maybe she is likes to write about inequality and how people judge upon physical appearance and maybe that was how things worked when she was young


message 5: by Luis (new)

Luis Gonzalez | 71 comments O’Conner’s short stories, “A Good Man Is Hard to Find” and “The Revelations”, have several similarities. The two stories have a strong willed female as their central character who have an exalted view of themselves. Both stories take place in the “bible belt”, so naturally both women have a strong view of religion. The grandmother like Mrs. Turpin, have a straight and narrow way of looking at people. They believe that people should act and think just like they do since they are “true” Christians. Those who do not dress or act like they do, are frowned upon by these women. Both have their faults, and are not aware of these faults until the end of the story. From these two stories, I have gathered that O’Conner believes that religion plays a large part in southern life. Religion like many other things can be construed to a certain type of thought when it concerns certain subjects. For example, in “The Revelations”, Mrs. Turpin has many outdated views of blacks and people who do not act “proper”. It is only after she is struck in the head by a book titled “Human Development” and told that she should return to hell, that she begins to question her train of thought, and whether it is righteous or not. O’Conner makes it a point that the south must let go of certain outdated modes of thinking and reassess how religion plays a part in their lives.


message 6: by Amber (new)

Amber Gonzalez (amberglz) | 29 comments "A Good Man is Hard to Find" and "Revelations" by O'Connor display violence in both short stories. The grandmother and Mrs. Turpin display similarities when it comes to their attitudes, the women display themselves superior and a need to impress and judge others. O'Connor also tied in religion to both short stories, both women seek guidance from God when their in trouble. In these short stories you can sense O'Connor's ties with her religious background and her southern roots and how she portrayed the south at time with the racism and categorization.


message 7: by Monique (new)

Monique Freitag | 53 comments The stories “A Good Man is Hard to Find” and “Revelations” by Flannery O’Conner both consist of ladies who think highly of themselves and look down on others but also are consumed with religion is some way. The ladies actions both have a negative outcome. The grandmother in “A Good Man is Hard to Find” considers herself as a ‘lady’ and dresses as such with fancier clothes than the usual people in her surroundings. She is kind of a snob but when faced with death, she turns to religion in a last attempt to save herself. In “Revelations”, Mrs. Turpin is a tremendously judgmental being who sees others as white trash and is also racist with thoughts ‘to send all black people back to Africa’. All her negative opinions upset the wrong person which resulted in a book being thrown at her and then being attacked. In the wake of all these, Mrs. Turpin turned to God and asked why she received this messaged when other ‘trash’ deserved it. They both turned to religion in some sense and both are just terrible people. I think maybe O’Conner saw the bad in the majority of ladies that were in her time.


message 8: by Maritza (new)

Maritza Cruz | 23 comments The similarities between “A Good Man is Hard to find” and “Revelations” are about two women that always have something to say. The Grandmother talks a lot, and has always opinion about her family whether they are interested or not. She doesn’t really find her faith until she faced her death at the hands of the Misfit. In the other had Mrs. Turpin also talks a lot and criticizes African Americans, she has to talk about everyone and everything. For Mrs. Turpin she begins to doubt her faith until Mary Grace becomes violent and start saying bad things to her. “Go back to hell where you came from, you old wart hog.” Both women see themselves as Christians. Flannery O’Conner is an author that writes about religion themes, and how strongly she presents it on her stories.


message 9: by Victoria (new)

Victoria Leal | 47 comments Both old woman in the short stories are extremely judgmental and think highly of themselves. They are strong woman but see objects and appearance to define someone. In their eyes the people who don't dress nice and act a certain way are beneath them. Mrs. Turpin believes that those people are not going to Heaven because of those reasons. It is not until the end of the story that both woman realize how close minded and unthoughtful they are. What I have realized about O'connor is how she displays religion a main part in these two stories, how strong willed these woman seem to be, and how the time during when there was still slavery. I believe she is showing us inside stories of how the old south use to be.


message 10: by Hilda (last edited Apr 22, 2015 05:47PM) (new)

Hilda Aguilar | 54 comments “A Good Man is Hard to Find” and "Revelations" by O'Conner both have similar characters that are judgmental. The grandmother in "AGood Man is Hard to Find" criticizes her surroundings and considers herself a lady. She uses her "morals" as her defense to not get killed. She also uses religion but then questions herself.  "Maybe He didn't raise the dead," the old lady mumbled. As for Mrs. Turpin  in "Revelations" she also criticizes her surroundings in the doctor's office. She thinks of herself of higher standards than the people around her.  When Mrs. Turpin asks, "What you got to say to me?" to Mary Grace and Mary Grace responds, "Go back to hell where you came from, you old wart hog."  She questions why she had to be told that if other people were "below" her.


message 11: by Kirsten (last edited Apr 22, 2015 11:40AM) (new)

Kirsten Nelson | 62 comments The similarities in "A Good Man is Hard to Find" and "Revelations" by Flannery O'Conner is that both stories are very judgmental in appearance. In the story in "A Good Man is Hard to Find" the grandma judges everyone's appearance and acts. At one point, the grandma even brings religious reasons to save her own life. Just like "In a Good Man is Hard to Find" the exact same thing happens in "Revelations." The main character, Mrs. Turpin, judges the mom's, children, and the doctor in the office. In addition, she brings religious aspects into play by repeatedly thanking Jesus every night for not making her black and trashy. I believe Flannery O'Conner's main characters in these two stories think high of themselves and that is why they put other people down.


message 12: by Pearl (last edited Apr 22, 2015 11:40AM) (new)

Pearl Pena | 74 comments Similarities between "A Good Man is Hard to Find" and "Revelations" is that both women that play the main characters are very judgemental and overall negative. Both women seem to look down on colored people or as they refer to them as “niggers.” They both seem to think highly of themselves or as if they are better than others. In Revelations Mrs. Turnpip constantly thinks negative thoughts in her mind and has a negative opinion towards the individuals in the doctor’s visit with detail. She criticizes almost everyone in the doctor’s office and both women seem to be very observing towards individuals. They are also hypocritical when it comes down to religion. It’s not until they find themselves in tough situations that they seem to turn towards religion. We can tell by the way both women refers to the negroes that these stories took place around the 50’s and 60’s and took place in the old South. Overall, what I learned about O"Conner as writer through these 2 stories is that she exhibits and presents religion as a major element.

“A final surge of fury shook her and she roared, “What do you think you are?”-Revelation by Flannery O’Connor


message 13: by Alicia (new)

Alicia | 56 comments The two short stories by Flannery O’Connor, “A Good Man is Hard to Find” and “Revelation” have many similarities. For example, the protagonist of the stories are females with strong personalities regarding religious believes. They both think they are good Christians, but they are very judgmental. There is also racism in both stories, both ladies think they are superior to the other individuals because of their socioeconomic status. They don’t see their faults until the end of the story. I learned that O’Connor uses a lot of symbolism in both stories to get the message to the reader. She wrote these stories are based on events that she saw because she grew around that time. O’Connor is that she is very religious and she definitely makes her point. She believes that religion should be first in our lives and that there is no superiority to God’s eyes, we all are the same.


message 14: by Yvonne (last edited Apr 22, 2015 02:14PM) (new)

Yvonne Torres | 72 comments In both “A Good Man is Hard To Find” and “Revelation” by Flannery O’Connor, we see two haughty women that have many things in common. Both of these women have “know it all” attitudes. Both the grandmother from the story “A Good Man is Hard to Find” and Mrs. Turpin have a very high self-esteem. They both carry themselves with that old fashioned mentality of acting like sophisticated women. Both are snobby, arrogant women that seem to have a bad case of mouth diarrhea as the saying goes. Their words are penetrated with filth; they drip in arrogance. In a turn of fate, they undergo an experience in which they learn some type of moral lesson, only that, the grandmother dies in the story “A Good Man Is Hard to Find” and Mrs. Turpin lives to see another day. Where to begin with Flanner O’Connor? Well now we can see why Flannery O’Connor’s work is considered Southern Gothic. The story “A Good Man is Hard To Find” shows the same style of writing but the story “Revelation” takes this style of writing to another level. The racism that we witness in her stories is so shocking. The characters in her stories are so grotesque that at times it’s hard to continue reading. Although you are so completely repulsed by the words her characters speak, you can’t seem to put her stories down. There’s nothing fancy about her stories. They are stories of ordinary people in ordinary settings, yet they still manage to be entertaining. I’ve learned throughout this course is that Flannery O’Connor is a writer you love to hate.

"Yes, and it takes all kinds to make the world go round…” Revelation by Flannery O’Connor


message 15: by Luis (new)

Luis Gonzalez | 71 comments Suzette wrote: "Similarites in between "A Goodman is Hard to Find" and "Revelations" are violence, the grandmother and Mrs Turpin are both women who live to criticize other people. They both feel that they are sup..."

It is true that both characters are religious and turn to god when they become involved in a difficult situation. They do view themselves as "saved" even though they are far from being perfect. I also agree that O'Conner, uses violence to get her point across.


message 16: by Shanda (new)

Shanda Brunson | 64 comments Alicia wrote: "The two short stories by Flannery O’Connor, “A Good Man is Hard to Find” and “Revelation” have many similarities. For example, the protagonist of the stories are females with strong personalities r..." I agree with you Alicia O'Connor definitely writes about religion. I also think because the author moved away from the south and was educated she was then able to see the injustices that the south put on people because of race, and class. Both stories were alike with the older woman and in the end justly so their fate being sown.


message 17: by Luis (new)

Luis Gonzalez | 71 comments Shanda wrote: "In both stories the central character are older southern women that are set in their idealogical ways of thinking. They are both judgmental and look down upon people. Both women put people put peop..."
I agree that religion is very important component in everyday life in the bible belt. I also agree that O'Conner is making a point that people should change their "old school" mentality since times have changed.


message 18: by Shanda (new)

Shanda Brunson | 64 comments Luis wrote: "O’Conner’s short stories, “A Good Man Is Hard to Find” and “The Revelations”, have several similarities. The two stories have a strong willed female as their central character who have an exalted..." This is so true I thought it to be funny that the book that struck her was human development. This to me was saying you Mrs. Turpin need to develop as a human. As with the south she was stuck in her ways and thought she was right; as for her use with religion some people use religion to manipulate. As with all forms it is interpreted how people want to and use it to benefit them. I feel as both women did this for if they truly were good "Christian Ladies from the South" I say that with a hint of sarcasm they would not judge or condemn anyone for they would of loved and treated everyone with dignity and respect.


message 19: by Rosie (new)

Rosie Castillo | 61 comments In both short stories "A Good Man is Hard To Find" and "Revelation" by Flannery O'Conner is that both are very judgmental and criticizing. The grandmother in "A Good Man is Hard To Find" she is always criticizing. She never really cares about anyone else but herself. The grandmother is a very selfish person and she is manipulative, and tries to control others. At the end the grandmother turns to religion because The Misfit is going to murder her. As for Mrs. Turpin in "Revelation" she is also criticizing her surroundings. She judges everyone in the doctors office. She is also racist and she states, "to send all black people back to Africa." All this leads her to being attack. She also turns to religion. Both ladies seek to religion to safe themselves from the bad situation that they bring to themselves. I believe O'Conner writes to show the reader in perceiving religious, and issues that pertain to Southern Culture and its changing nature during O'Conner's era.


message 20: by Rosie (new)

Rosie Castillo | 61 comments Luis wrote: "O’Conner’s short stories, “A Good Man Is Hard to Find” and “The Revelations”, have several similarities. The two stories have a strong willed female as their central character who have an exalted..."

Luis I agree with you on that O'Conner believes that religion plays a large part in South life. Both ladies realize of their wrong doing until the end of the story and both seek for religion.


message 21: by Alicia (new)

Alicia | 56 comments Suzette wrote: "Similarites in between "A Goodman is Hard to Find" and "Revelations" are violence, the grandmother and Mrs Turpin are both women who live to criticize other people. They both feel that they are sup..."
I agree with you, the both ladies thought they were perfect and superior to others. O'Connor uses religion on both stories and she also uses symbolism. we are all equal to God.


message 22: by Alicia (new)

Alicia | 56 comments Victoria wrote: "Both old woman in the short stories are extremely judgmental and think highly of themselves. They are strong woman but see objects and appearance to define someone. In their eyes the people who don..."
Definitely, both ladies were judgmental and thought they were superior to the other individuals in the story. Who were they to judge, if the only one who can judge us is God. but then again society treat us by our appearance.


message 23: by Kirsten (new)

Kirsten Nelson | 62 comments Alicia wrote: "The two short stories by Flannery O’Connor, “A Good Man is Hard to Find” and “Revelation” have many similarities. For example, the protagonist of the stories are females with strong personalities r..."

I agree Alicia, shes takes religion too seriously to the point where she becomes very judgmental. Flannery's characters tend to put people down rather than lifting their spirits up.


message 24: by Pearl (new)

Pearl Pena | 74 comments Marielena wrote: "The similarities between “A good man is hard to find” and “Revelations” are based on religion, how both of the main characters in both of O” Conner’s stories are into religion. Just as in a good ma..."

Marielena, I agree with you that social class seems to play a major role with both of the main characters in these two stories. They both seem to be very judgmental and think highly of themselves.


message 25: by Pearl (new)

Pearl Pena | 74 comments Luis wrote: "O’Conner’s short stories, “A Good Man Is Hard to Find” and “The Revelations”, have several similarities. The two stories have a strong willed female as their central character who have an exalted..."

Luis, I agree with you that religion plays a major role in the southern life with both of the main characters in these two stories. I also believe that social class seems to impact on them as well towards how they view and judge others.


message 26: by Kirsten (new)

Kirsten Nelson | 62 comments Shanda wrote: "In both stories the central character are older southern women that are set in their idealogical ways of thinking. They are both judgmental and look down upon people. Both women put people put peop..."

I agree shanda. Social class still plays a big role in todays society.Judging people for their looks happens on a daily bases. O'conner didnt seem to mind exposing these factors in her writting.


message 27: by Hilda (last edited Apr 23, 2015 11:47AM) (new)

Hilda Aguilar | 54 comments Monique wrote: "The stories “A Good Man is Hard to Find” and “Revelations” by Flannery O’Conner both consist of ladies who think highly of themselves and look down on others but also are consumed with religion is ..."

I agree, both women were classifying people around them and have negative outcomes. They seemed to think they are above everyone else.


message 28: by Hilda (last edited Apr 23, 2015 11:51AM) (new)

Hilda Aguilar | 54 comments Rosie wrote: "In both short stories "A Good Man is Hard To Find" and "Revelation" by Flannery O'Conner is that both are very judgmental and criticizing. The grandmother in "A Good Man is Hard To Find" she is alw..."

The grandmother and Mrs. Turpin have the similarities of criticizing people but when it came down to a situation at the end they both sought for religion. By this you can tell that they were't good people like they thought they were.


message 29: by Yvonne (new)

Yvonne Torres | 72 comments Rosie wrote: "In both short stories "A Good Man is Hard To Find" and "Revelation" by Flannery O'Conner is that both are very judgmental and criticizing. The grandmother in "A Good Man is Hard To Find" she is alw..."

I agree with Rosie when she mentions that both the grandmother and Mrs. Turpin use religion to wiggle their way out of situations. It’s funny to me because they both seem to not have one religious bone in their bodies.


message 30: by Yvonne (new)

Yvonne Torres | 72 comments Pearl wrote: "Similarities between "A Good Man is Hard to Find" and "Revelations" is that both women that play the main characters are very judgemental and overall negative. Both women seem to look down on color..."

I agree with Pearl that Flannery O’Connor’s stories contain many racist comments. I agree that in each story both women are horribly racist.


message 31: by Rogerio (new)

Rogerio Ruiz | 39 comments In both stories the main character is a woman who is arrogant in her convictions of superiority. O'Connor's translates the swollen self-estimates of such people. The irony between what a person is and what the woman assumes herself to be is emphasized by such techniques as unflattering names or appearances. The grandmother insists on dressing carefully so that "in case of an accident anyone seeing her dead on the highway" would know she was a lady. Both stories contain violence, another motif often used by O'Connor to shock her characters and the reader into an epiphany. Mrs. Turpin is physically assaulted by Mary Grace, first by the book thrown at her and then by the girl's attempt to strangle her. The grandmother hears the gunshots that kill her family one by one prior to her brief epiphany before she is murdered too.


message 32: by Rogerio (new)

Rogerio Ruiz | 39 comments Yvonne wrote: "In both “A Good Man is Hard To Find” and “Revelation” by Flannery O’Connor, we see two haughty women that have many things in common. Both of these women have “know it all” attitudes. Both the gran..."

I like the way you compared both stories very subtle, they are in fact very stubborn and conceded. The attitude on both stories are the same they both learned an important lesson. The Grandmother definitely had the case of the mouth diarrhea. (Is there any medication for that?)


message 33: by Monique (new)

Monique Freitag | 53 comments Maritza wrote: "The similarities between “A Good Man is Hard to find” and “Revelations” are about two women that always have something to say. The Grandmother talks a lot, and has always opinion about her family w..."

O'Conner's stories do have religion present in a small way but in an impactful way as well. Both women were judgmental christians so maybe thats how she viewed all christians.


message 34: by Monique (new)

Monique Freitag | 53 comments Kirsten wrote: "The similarities in "A Good Man is Hard to Find" and "Revelations" by Flannery O'Conner is that both stories are very judgmental in appearance. In the story in "A Good Man is Hard to Find" the gran..."

I agree that both women see themselves as better than everyone else and practically think they are god's gift to the world.


message 35: by Suzette (new)

Suzette Sanchez (slelysanchez) | 53 comments Alicia wrote: "The two short stories by Flannery O’Connor, “A Good Man is Hard to Find” and “Revelation” have many similarities. For example, the protagonist of the stories are females with strong personalities r..."

Yes Alicia, both women felt that there poop didnt smell. They did think they were gods gift, but they had flaws.


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