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CORONAVIRUS > Privacy, censorship, legal, financial and human rights ramifications of Coronavirus measures

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message 1: by [deleted user] (new)

Discusses the related consequences of Coronavirus. Post your thoughts?


message 2: by [deleted user] (new)

UK's Emergency Bill in response to COVID-19

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa...


message 3: by [deleted user] (new)

Ep 63- The Cogs in the Coronavirus Response

https://open.spotify.com/episode/7Gan...


message 4: by [deleted user] (new)

Jim Rickards Says We Are Uncomfortably Close to Ice-Nine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-g1D...


message 5: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 10923 comments The economic factor is another aspect that must be considered. Heard one economist say that we are 30-45 days away from reaching same economic or financial levels as The Great Depression! Additionally, last night Australian Prime Minister Scott Morrison said expect a lockdown for at least 6 months to get on top of this. In the US today I heard the prediction of 18 months of those conditions. With the sort of bankruptcies, medical insurance collapses, house evictions and homelessness that would come from entering another economic Depression caused by lockdown, I wonder if that would be worse than the virus? There may need to be a balance? And at some point there may need to be some form of debate? So far I see zero debate...

For example, if this virus occurred in 1934 straight after the Great Depression ended, would politicians and citizens be so willing to lockdown an entire economy? Are we apathetic to what harm can come with massive economic collapse?

And by the way, the unemployment rate during that Depression was 25%...Think that sort of economic disaster won't lead to untold deaths, increased crime, sickness, suicides, etc etc?


message 6: by Victor (new)

Victor Tan | 4 comments For one thing, the fact that a large number of people will be unemployed as a result of COVID-19 social distancing means that generally speaking, a large number of businesses are going to be with markedly decreased revenues for a long while, which means that a large number of people will become desperate as time passes by and if the pandemic continues, which will pressure businesses to lay off workers in the event that they cannot adapt.

Add that to the fact that governments have been releasing prisoners from jails (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-can...)
with the intent of stemming the coronavirus pandemic but probably with the unintended consequence of heightening social unrest exacerbated not only by the fact that these people have actually committed crimes in the past, but also are unlikely to be able to find employment in view of the current situation, and you've got a recipe for a particularly potent cocktail of social unrest and a hotbed of crime, for which our existing social safety net(s) are woefully unprepared.

Given the fact that soup kitchens are shutting down and healthcare systems are already being overwhelmed worldwide, this means that the number of desperate people on the street will increase. Because desperate people will do anything to survive, so this probably means that we'll have to watch ourselves on the streets.


message 7: by [deleted user] (last edited Mar 22, 2020 09:44PM) (new)

James wrote: "The economic factor is another aspect that must be considered. Heard one economist say that we are 30-45 days away from reaching same economic or financial levels as The Great Depression! Additiona..."

Victor wrote: "For one thing, the fact that a large number of people will be unemployed as a result of COVID-19 social distancing means that generally speaking, a large number of businesses are going to be with m..."

Good points, Victor. You would require military intervention at that point and have martial law. Hopefully your in a community where people band together and unify and won't tolerate that sorta thing too .


message 8: by [deleted user] (last edited Mar 22, 2020 09:47PM) (new)

The way this is unfolding, resembles the plot from Planet of the Apes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgHAT...


message 9: by [deleted user] (new)

ZigZag wrote: "The way this is unfolding, resembles the plot from Planet of the Apes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgHAT..."



message 10: by Victor (new)

Victor Tan | 4 comments COVID-19 is a little bit like an exam for each country that it hits, wherein each country's national public health administration, civil society, culture, and economy is going to be tested, and wherein the results of each country can impact the results of the others (because of the possibility of cross-border infections); additionally, it is a show of how reliant we ultimately are on each other as a society and as a world.

Countries that are capable of flattening the curve and saving their citizens are not out of the woods so long as there are cases in other countries (seeing as there have been some cases in which COVID-19 has re-infected people who allegedly recovered from it), and from an epidemiology perspective, it is better for now that we suffer through the consequences of lockdown and take care of things within our own borders, although the mental consequences of lockdown over a long period of time are not entirely clear, and it is unclear that long-term compliance will be possible without drastic action domestically (see China - Imagine that each of our countries is likely to have to go through a similar experience if we are to stem COVID-19, although whether or not China has indeed managed to stem COVID-19 is something that we are basically taking on faith if we accept their statistics as given - I don't), which may lead to the chilling effects and climates of fear that have already been brought about by lockdown orders worldwide and the ways in which police have sought to enforce or interpret them, although social media shows that people do take it into their own hands to enforce a sense of civic consciousness to prevent others from spreading the virus, which may interestingly enough help to foster a greater sense of civic consciousness amongst certain groups of people.

Financially speaking, on a macro level, the impact is going to affect most businesses negatively in the long run (tourism, air travel are basically quite screwed at the moment), though staple food businesses are likely to flourish and naturally, the medical industry is likely to do quite well off the pandemic, even if it must be a terrifying experience for workers to show up at the office each day.

In the short term, however, industries that require workers to be in close contact with one another and favor industries where this may be desirable, but is not an explicit requirement. For instance, the current state of lockdown means that a lot of (construction) projects that were slated to be completed will probably have to be postponed because work cannot be executed.

On a micro level, the workers who need to perform this work cannot go out, and frankly there are many more groups of people who are gonna be affected, to the extent that I'm not even completely sure what I should mention next; generally speaking, the gym trainers that work at the gyms that so many of us love are going to end up without incomes.

Nonetheless, all these people will probably need money to meet obligations, debts (house payments etc) or just to eat, and will therefore seek pay from their employers - Richer companies will probably be able to afford to provide this safety net to their employees, but on the ground you can see that certain shops (Like SF Boba Guys) may not actually reopen after the shutdowns and either won't/can't provide this safety net or will just go out of business.

In the long run, even businesses that currently have work from home arrangements or offer technological solutions will suffer in the event that consumer spending power significantly drops across the board in the event that they are unable to adapt, and the stability of their daily existence will probably be threatened if crimes transpire or increase in frequency on the streets; borrowers may find it hard to repay loans if there is no revenue, and this is likely to cause further, more unpredictable consequences down the line.

Whatever it is, let's please all do our part and stay home to delay the spread of the virus as much as we can and pray either to a deity, to the universe, to technology, to our ancestors, or to Edward Snowden that either all of this is going to end soon or that we as a society will develop the collective strength to forge a new normal through this ordeal.


message 11: by Victor (last edited Mar 22, 2020 10:20PM) (new)

Victor Tan | 4 comments ZigZag wrote: "James wrote: "The economic factor is another aspect that must be considered. Heard one economist say that we are 30-45 days away from reaching same economic or financial levels as The Great Depress..."

Thanks, ZigZag - I live in Malaysia, which went under lockdown since March 18th, and have been staying at home for the past few days. We hope that civil society will keep itself healthy and that generally speaking, people will not fall into desperation - However, given the recent antics of my country's government the vast majority of the people have either no trust or little prospect of trust in the current administration; though lockdown is probably the right strategy at this stage, and though the government has a range of opportunities to earn the people's trust as a result of this crisis, statements from the individuals who are ostensibly responsible for handling our public health (ahem, our minister on warm water killing COVID, lol) continue to carry notes of ridiculousness that probably leave those of you out there who take the time to read news about our country wondering if these people learned about public health in banana trees.

Religious services at most churches have been stopped, and mosques have also brought an end to Friday prayers, though some hard-headed people maintain that they have an explicit, all-encompassing need to gather together to meet in order to do a service to God...

My immediate question upon considering this is why it is that people feel that any God would be less glorified because His adherents do not choose to meet one another or any more glorified simply because they choose to, yet some people in my community continue to emphasize the necessity of such gatherings in the name of higher spiritual truth.

I repose in a hope in better things, though I continue to mentally prepare for the worst.


message 12: by [deleted user] (last edited Mar 22, 2020 10:37PM) (new)

Victor wrote: "COVID-19 is a little bit like an exam for each country that it hits, wherein each country's national public health administration, civil society, culture, and economy is going to be tested, and whe..."

We can pull through if World Leaders don't take advantage of this from a geopolitical or 'realpolitik' view or exacerbate the situation, i.e. disrupt supply chains, foster internal discord via the chaos, encourage further economic damage via bad decision making and all the rest.

Micro level, we can use social media for good, i.e. helping folk, stopping idiots and criminals taking advantage, citizen journalism and so on, setting an example globally regardless (Chinese, Russian, European, British or American, etc) that others follow and that hopefully spreads faster than COVID-19 can.

But it is up to us as a collective, as much as it is our leaders, not to allow this to spiral into greater calamity.


message 13: by Victor (new)

Victor Tan | 4 comments Bad as it sounds, I am a firm believer in self-interest and I have little faith in human altruism to the extent that it inhibits the attainment of personal goals or group goals (our own families, our own countries to the exclusion of other families who are not our friends, or countries that are not our own or that we have no friends in, especially if helping them results in significant harm to ourselves) though as it stands, my claim about how it is in the best interest of other countries to help to stem COVID-19 stands, although this is a coordination problem on a grand scale.

Certainly it is a coordination problem that the current global lockdown appears to be resolving on a macro scale on the surface and that governments like the UK only began to bring efforts to bear on when they themselves began to suffer (total self-interest right there, lol) - Not capable on my part of understanding how everything is playing out/not my span of control.

Yeah, the individual is way more important than you think. If you, in your personal capacity, were to catch COVID, that would increase the probability that it would spread to someone you know, who in turn might spread it to someone I know and hence eventually through the course of time spread it to me - Hence it is in my interest that you not catch COVID or, for that matter, that your country's healthcare system not be overwhelmed in such a way that either you or anyone else in your immediate vicinity catch COVID, as the number of people infected ends up multiplying the number of potential infection opportunities.


message 14: by [deleted user] (last edited Mar 22, 2020 11:02PM) (new)

Victor wrote: "Bad as it sounds, I am a firm believer in self-interest and I have little faith in human altruism to the extent that it inhibits the attainment of personal goals or group goals (our own families, o..."

Sure, I understand the self-interest part and also the natural survival instinct we have built in. And, if your sick, then how do you expect to help others(other than isolate)?

But some people have shown an over-ride, a strong sense of natural law, that compels them to to extraordinary bravery and lengths that by-passes this self preservation.

Take all those WW2 heros(unheard or under appreciated ones) like Irena Sendler.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irena_S...

Those are the types that see the 'big picture' and need to stop cascading events that could bring us all down in the end.

We're interlocked economically via globalism to a great extent and if there's any victory to be had by exploiting the situation, it'll be Pyrrhic for them at best regardless what side.


message 15: by [deleted user] (new)

US successfully tests nuclear-capable hypersonic missile

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...


message 16: by [deleted user] (new)

Russia to base hypersonic tracking radar in middle of NATO turf

https://www.stripes.com/news/europe/r...


message 17: by [deleted user] (new)

Taiwan Says It Warned WHO About Coronavirus In December, But Its Warnings Were Ignored

https://dailycaller.com/2020/03/20/wh...


message 18: by [deleted user] (new)

MACRO ANALYTICS - 01-30-20 - Emerging Era of Global Conflict - Part III

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4AGc...


message 19: by [deleted user] (new)

Chinese tycoon Ren Zhiqiang goes missing after criticising Beijing’s response to coronavirus outbreak

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/polit...


message 20: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 10923 comments More And More Experts Discuss The Strategy For #COVEXIT https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BgTH...


message 21: by [deleted user] (last edited Mar 26, 2020 09:24AM) (new)

Three Seas Initiative summit postponed to October due to coronavirus

QUOTE:"The spread of coronavirus shows us that countries must be able to work together," she said. "Investments in the Three Seas region will be more important than ever once the crisis has abated. Developing infrastructure in the transport and energy sectors and implementing the full potential of digital solutions will be of critical value in achieving new economic growth," Kaljulaid added."

https://news.err.ee/1068651/three-sea...



message 22: by [deleted user] (last edited Mar 26, 2020 09:50AM) (new)

ZigZag wrote: "Three Seas Initiative summit postponed to October due to coronavirus

"The spread of coronavirus shows us that countries must be able to work together," she said. "Investments in the Three Seas reg..."


Coronavirus has shown various 'threat multiplier' capabilities(beyond its viral component), one of them being the increasing of geopolitical instability which could have the potential in the readdressing of power(depending how it plays out?).

With that in mind, could powers in The East(Russia and China) concoct their own type of '3 Seas Initiative' as a counter in the wake of COVID-19s response?

The Three Seas Initiative consists currently of Poland, Croatia, Czech Republic, Hungary, Romania, Slovakia, Bulgaria, Estonia, Lithuania, Austria, Latvia, and Slovenia.

Could an eastern counter emerge consisting of Maldova, Turkey, Kaliningrad(Russia), Italy and Serbia?

The consequences of COVID-19 has saw Italy and Serbia fall into a more eastern orbit, due to the alleged failures by the EU and West in their handling of the crisis.

Depending on how this plays-out, Spain may also look to the east.

If so, this could essentially provide an eastern power counter presence in every major water around or in proximity of Europe(especially for Russia).

China would have influence in-land via the BRI.

The battlefield that creates a multipolar World and Cold War 2.0 might be Europe once again and Coronavirus the catalyst that facilitated it?


message 23: by [deleted user] (new)

Xi calls for coordinated response to coronavirus at G-20 meeting

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/27/xi-ca...


message 24: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 10923 comments ZigZag wrote: "Xi calls for coordinated response to coronavirus at G-20 meeting

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/27/xi-ca..."


Xi...Your New WORLD LEADER...THE world leader!


message 25: by [deleted user] (new)

How Indian firms have de-risked from China

https://www.livemint.com/news/india/h...


message 26: by [deleted user] (new)

Bitcoin: A Global Port in a Market Storm?

https://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-a-gl...


message 27: by [deleted user] (last edited Mar 27, 2020 03:21AM) (new)

James wrote: "ZigZag wrote: "Xi calls for coordinated response to coronavirus at G-20 meeting

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/27/xi-ca..."

Xi...Y..."


There won't be a world to lead for Xi or anyone else, if it and any cascading event(s) get out of hand . . . .


message 28: by [deleted user] (last edited Mar 27, 2020 03:27AM) (new)

ZigZag wrote: "James wrote: "ZigZag wrote: "Xi calls for coordinated response to coronavirus at G-20 meeting

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/27/xi-ca......"


If it keeps up, Xi might end having to look for Ceasar(maybe replace said pissed off super evolved monkey here with a bat)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uLP5b...


message 29: by [deleted user] (new)

ZigZag wrote: "ZigZag wrote: "James wrote: "ZigZag wrote: "Xi calls for coordinated response to coronavirus at G-20 meeting

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/27/xi-ca......"


And it's not gonna be the Adam West version if that's what your hoping for

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLZQ3...


message 30: by [deleted user] (last edited Mar 27, 2020 03:58AM) (new)

ZigZag wrote: "ZigZag wrote: "ZigZag wrote: "James wrote: "ZigZag wrote: "Xi calls for coordinated response to coronavirus at G-20 meeting

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/27/xi-ca......"


Judging by that super-hero costume, we could see how bats could have immunity to virsues. Even COVID-19 would probably dodge being seen as part of a body wearing that.

Must be the worst ever costume created in television? Terrible, even by 60s standards.


message 31: by [deleted user] (new)

Verily's COVID-19 Screening Website Leaves Privacy Questions Unanswered

https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2020/03...


message 32: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 10923 comments The Real Pandemic Danger Is Social Collapse https://countercurrents.org/2020/03/t...

The economic repercussions of the novel coronavirus pandemic must not be understood as an ordinary problem that macroeconomics can solve or alleviate. Rather, the world could be witnessing a fundamental shift in the very nature of the global economy.


message 33: by [deleted user] (new)

The Realignment Ep. 30: The Geopolitics of the Coronavirus

https://www.hudson.org/research/15858...


message 34: by [deleted user] (new)

The two economic stages of coronavirus

https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...


message 35: by [deleted user] (new)

Essential Geopolitics: Coronavirus in Africa

https://worldview.stratfor.com/articl...


message 36: by [deleted user] (new)

Is COVID-19 a Geopolitical Game-Changer?

https://www.institutmontaigne.org/en/...


message 37: by [deleted user] (last edited Mar 29, 2020 04:51AM) (new)

ZigZag wrote: "Is COVID-19 a Geopolitical Game-Changer?

https://www.institutmontaigne.org/en/..."


QUOTE: The full economic, cyclical and structural effects are not quite visible yet, but, in any case, they will be gigantic. It would therefore be risky to put forward at this time a general theory of the geopolitics of the pandemic. Ought we not however begin to think of the possible impacts the virus will have on international politics?


message 38: by [deleted user] (last edited Mar 29, 2020 05:09AM) (new)

ZigZag wrote: "ZigZag wrote: "Is COVID-19 a Geopolitical Game-Changer?

https://www.institutmontaigne.org/en/..."

QUOTE: The full economic, cyclical and structural effects ar..."



It's in times like these you find out who is really who, deep down . . . .

Last post for a bit. Stay safe and best of luck in this nightmare Undergrounders.


message 39: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 10923 comments ZigZag wrote: "ZigZag wrote: "ZigZag wrote: "Is COVID-19 a Geopolitical Game-Changer?

https://www.institutmontaigne.org/en/..."

QUOTE: The full economic, cyclical and structu..."


Stay safe (from the virus and/or those patrolling things!)


message 40: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 10923 comments SNOWDEN: GOVERNMENTS WILL USE THE CORONAVIRUS TO SEIZE MORE POWER
https://futurism.com/the-byte/snowden...

“As authoritarianism spreads, as emergency laws proliferate, as we sacrifice our rights, we also sacrifice our capability to arrest the slide into a less liberal and less free world,” Snowden told Vice.


message 41: by Lance, Group Founder (new)

Lance Morcan | 2665 comments They (used to) say you can't put a price on human life. These days it seems you can...

https://www.livescience.com/15855-dol...

The above 2011 article from livescience.com seems especially relevant in 2020 whilst the world is in Coronavirus lockdown and we weigh up the importance of saving lives vs. saving jobs and $$$$$$$$$$...

"Putting a price on human life may seem callous, but for safety analysts, it's simply necessary. They judge whether a certain safety regulation would be cost-effective by comparing how much it would cost to implement with how many dollar's worth of human lives it's likely to save.

" 'You can't simply say that every life is infinitely valuable,' said John Mueller, a political scientist at Ohio State University... 'That's just not the way the world operates.'

"So in this monetized world we live in, what's the going rate? At least in the United States, 'the value of a statistical life turns out to be around $5 million,' Mueller told Life's Little Mysteries, a sister site to LiveScience."

So, fellow Undergrounders, can we put a price on human life and if so what value do YOU place on a human life?


message 42: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 10923 comments Lance wrote: " in Coronavirus lockdown and we weigh up the importance of saving lives vs. saving jobs and $$$$$$$$$$... ..."

but saving jobs = saving lives down the line
crash the economy with a long-term lockdown and a LOT of people will end up destitute, homeless, without medicine etc, which means many will die too.
So it's more assessing lives at front-end versus lives at the back-end.


message 43: by Lance, Group Founder (new)

Lance Morcan | 2665 comments James wrote: "Lance wrote: " in Coronavirus lockdown and we weigh up the importance of saving lives vs. saving jobs and $$$$$$$$$$... ..."

but saving jobs = saving lives down the line
crash the economy with a l..."


Yep I agree, but...

The question is how many lives are we prepared to sacrifice in the short term to keep an economy going or to kick-start an economy? How much value do we put on one human life and who among us is qualified to make that decision? It's a toughie.


message 44: by Lance, Group Founder (new)

Lance Morcan | 2665 comments Very interesting observing the differing and widely ranging measures countries are taking against COVID-19. It demonstrates that everyone is winging it and no-one knows for sure what the best defense is.

Here in NZ we took a hardline approach from the outset with a total lockdown (Level 4) imposed almost from day one – the polar opposite of the approach taken by some other nations including the US and UK. It has paid off with only 14 deaths so far and many or most of them elderly with underlying medical conditions.

Much interest at present in Sweden’s approach, which has been described in one media report as “A disaster waiting to happen or a bold, evidence-based response?”

The report reads: “(In Sweden) a high-stakes experiment in self-responsibility is underway. Stockholm's waterfront restaurants and bars are filled with people soaking up not just the sunshine, but an extraordinary degree of freedom.

“Along with restaurants, Sweden's schools remain open for all students under 16 years of age, and shops and gyms have kept trading during the coronavirus pandemic. Borders are functioning. Desks are still occupied in offices and gatherings of up to 50 people can go ahead.

“Sweden's 'light touch' response to the emergency has triggered fierce debate amongst the country's medical and scientific community.

“Opponents warn the unorthodox approach will end in disaster, while its biggest backers - including one of the world's most senior epidemiologists - argue it is a logical response to a pandemic that cannot be stopped, and will be vindicated with time….

“…Nearly 1800 people have died in Sweden, making it the 14th worst affected country globally. Sweden's death rate is 156.45 per million compared to 62.84 in Denmark, 28.41 in Norway and 17.69 in Finland, which all have much more severe lockdowns. Its death toll is roughly three times the combined total of its Scandinavian neighbours.”

Read more at: https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/heal...

Sweden’s approach appears to rely on their developing herd immunity, which I personally lean toward. However, critics of that approach liken it to eugenics where the frail and elderly are sacrificed for “the greater good”.

Hard to know what’s best, isn’t it?
Que sera sera.

Stay safe everyone!


message 45: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 10923 comments A Covid tracking app is now available for download here in Australia! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NO9_6...

It's not mandatory, BUT you can see how this can become unofficially mandatory in that employers, restaurants, schools, supermarkets etc can insist you have it to enter their zones...

A Surveillance State?


message 46: by Daniel (new)

Daniel (itsdan) | 1 comments 1. What then happens to civil liberties, to privacy rights, to democracy?
- This is the real central question of this moment in history. Everyone is fearful, hopeless, and so worried about today that we have really stopped think about what would tomorrow look like as a result of the decision that we make today.
We Have seen in countries like Taiwan, Soutk Korea, and more western coutnries and US where has began as well, the tracking and monitoring of the whole human population through our phones. And it is, I think, something that should raise cause of concern, because when we talk about apps and I am sure we will, they're saying they are using it for contact tracing.
The app knows that person gets sick. Where did they go? Who may the come in contact precisely so they can produce this text messages. This approach does not work on pandemic scale.


message 47: by Lance, Group Founder (new)

Lance Morcan | 2665 comments 170 cybersecurity experts warn that British government’s contact tracing app could be used to surveil people even after coronavirus has gone https://www.businessinsider.nl/cybers...

177 cybersecurity and privacy experts have signed an open letter to the UK government asking it to ensure the contact tracing app it’s deploying to track the spread of coronavirus doesn’t then get used as a mass-surveillance tool.
The UK announced this week it was eschewing Apple and Google’s contact-tracing API to build its app, which will process users’ data centrally.
Experts warn this could create a database that could then be used to de-anonymize users.


message 48: by Trilce (new)

Trilce | 23 comments Lance wrote: "170 cybersecurity experts warn that British government’s contact tracing app could be used to surveil people even after coronavirus has gone https://www.businessinsider.nl/cybers...-..."

Using just an analogy, the viruses that weren't able to detect the best of the best up to date top anti-virus about 10-20 years ago, you can traced them today and quarantined. The vision today is a consent of what is going to be obvious.


message 49: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 10923 comments Chinese testing kit companies 'linked to serious human rights abuses' in China https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_6...

La Trobe University's James Leibold says there are "privacy collection" and human rights concerns surrounding the 10 million Chinese COVID-19 testing kits arriving in Australia.

The testing kits were part of a deal with Chinese company Beijing Genomics Institute (BGI) brokered by mining magnate Andrew 'Twiggy' Forrest, and require DNA samples in order for them to work.

The government sought high level security advice on whether the biometric information of Australians could be sent back to China.

Mr Siebold told Sky News host he doesn't know if his DNA samples - if he needed to use the testing kits - would "end up in Beijing in some police linked data base".

On top of the obvious privacy issues, Mr Siebold said there are ethical concerns relating to the two Chinese companies who have provided the machines used to test the data.

He said Beijing Genomic Institute and Thermo-Fisher Scientific are "liked to serious human rights abuses in China's western region of Xinjiang".

"There's a lack of full information at this stage".


message 50: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 10923 comments ‘Our understanding is grey’: Cambridge Analytica whistleblower on COVIDSafe app https://au.finance.yahoo.com/news/cov...

Brittany Kaiser blew the whistle on her former employer, Cambridge Analytica, after it was found to have harvested the personal data of millions of people’s Facebook profiles without their consent back in 2018.

Speaking about the government’s COVIDSafe app in Verizon Media’s Identity Decoded webinar on Thursday, Kaiser has said people ‘shouldn’t assume’ contact tracing apps are for the greater good.

Around 5 million Australians have downloaded the COVIDSafe tracing app, with the government urging at least 5 million more to do so for its use to be effective.

The government revealed the tracing app would store data with tech giant Amazon, with early reports suggesting this contract could mean Australian data would be made obtainable by US law enforcement under US legislation.


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