Vorkisigan 1 -- Shards of Honor

[Lee at ReadWriteWish]

But at the same time there were the darker subjects like the hell-of-war and all the rape, torture, and paranoia (that psychiatrist!) that goes with it! And they didn't seem too jarring, even though very different."

LMB certainly included a lot of issues that are still topical today.

[Oleksandr, a.k.a. Acorn]

Nick wrote: "It's wonderful to see a character who is intelligent, capable, moral - all without being a Mary-Sue.."

I fully agree! Add to that not-a-teen character, for they are all over the place

[Nick]

Oleksandr wrote: "I checked reviews of the people I follow and saw that some reviewers see Bujold's writing as insensitive, which surprised me. I fully support her boldness in depicting grey areas."

I've just done the same and I must agree with you!

I don't want to pick on any particular reviewer, but I hate it when people say that rape is a cheap contrivance to threaten a female character. She's a combatant in a war! It would be unrealistic not to acknowledge that rape happens a lot during war.
Also we don't see anybody get raped (which I also think is good, no need to dwell on the details) but women are not the only people who have been raped 'off-stage' in this book.

I see a lot of people up-thread saying that Seargent Bothari is an interesting character. Do you think he's responsible for his actions? I really agree with Cordelia: there were two victims in the room. Seems to me like he's a victim of mental abuse. And presumably would've been shot for mutiny had he disobeyed a direct order!

[Kalin]

Rape is not inherently a cheap contrivance but, honestly, it felt like that to me in this book. Back in the fall we read Okorafor's Who Fears Death, which had a lot of sexual violence throughout the story, and was treated differently, with what I felt was more depth (and pain -- it wasn't easy to read). I can see why Bujold would have taken some criticism, since the primary scene where rape was the danger faced by the protagonist had an undertone of "how's she going to get out of this predicament?" and I'm not sure we are as readers are really led to believe we're about to witness our hero explicitly violated in front of our eyes.

[Nick]

Kalin wrote: "sexual violence throughout the story, and was treated differently, with what I felt was more depth (and pain -- it wasn't easy to read)."

Hmm, I wonder if that's the crux of it? Rape in fiction ought to be painful to the reader, to be sure that we're treating it with appropriate gravitas?

Cordelia suffers plenty emotionally and psychologically after she escapes from her near miss, and the other victims have more serious consequences, so I didn't feel like it was treated lightly. It felt like rape was given the same level of serious consideration as the other horrors of war.

Kalin wrote: " the primary scene where rape was the danger faced by the protagonist had an undertone of "how's she going to get out of this predicament?" and I'm not sure we are as readers are really led to believe we're about to witness our hero explicitly violated in front of our eyes."
Yes, I agree! I did not believe Cordelia would be seriously hurt, anymore than I thought she would die while being fired at with plasma arcs, or get mind-raped by the Betan psychologists. This is very much the kind of book where I feel how will they get there not will they make it.

[Joe]

I think that the depiction of rape in the book was essential to the story that was being told... Bothari is one of the better characters I've read.. he's a walking example of the horrors of war.. both the things he's done and the things done to him.

I think his story has plenty of gravitas.

There's certainly nothing that glorifies any crimes (especially considering future events).

Sometimes people write stuff in review more because they know it'll draw responses than because it makes sense.

[Nick]

Joe wrote: "Sometimes people write stuff in review more because they know it'll draw responses than because it makes sense."

Seems a bit uncharitable - I think the people who object to the rape scene in this book are sincere.

But I think you've hit on an important point - that scene is much more about Bothari than Cordelia isn't it? It ties up with what Kalin said above - we never really feel like Cordelia is truly at risk in this scene.

So if one is thinking of sexist tropes in fiction, it can look a lot like a female character being menaced with rape for titillation. But from another perspective, the threat to Cordelia was just the plot device to get our POV character into the room so we could see Bothari's story.

[Eva]

Both getting her into the room, and turning the situation around and saving Bothari (literally and spiritually), forging an important bond and dog-like loyalty that will continue to ripple throughout the whole series.

The rapes and their consequences (e.g. babies who grow into important characters), and the psychological damage caused, also continue to be addressed with gravitas throughout the series. All of these scenes become crucial character backstory later on and have long-term consequences that are explored (how do you live with crippling guilt and shame? how do you raise a child resulting from rape? when do you tell them? and so on).

A successful rape on Cordelia would not have fit the story and would have made her love story unconvincing (she'd have had to heal first, and couldn't just have run off to get married).

I usually have a lot of trouble with sexual violence used in some books like wallpaper or for shock-value, but here it's absolutely necessary to explore the very interesting dilemmas resulting from it later on, so I was totally fine with it. The series doesn't just use it as a "cool thing" or wallpaper-to-show-how-edgy-my-world-is. It stays with those characters, and we see them deal with what happened, build new lives, try to make amends, deal with self-hatred, all of it. I personally love that and think it makes the characters here so interesting, while still maintaining adventurous plot lines that don't become so dark that I can't read it anymore. For me, that seems ideal.

[Art, Stay home, stay safe.]

Oleksandr wrote: "I started it yesterday and it is interesting but so far SF element is on background and with slight changes it could be a fantasy or even a contemporary fiction."

Just started on this today and I see what you mean, Z.
Easy to read, easy to immerse into the universe. Seems like it's going to be a pleasant ride.

[Nick]

Eva wrote: "The rapes and their consequences (e.g. babies who grow into important characters), and the psychological damage caused, also continue to be addressed with gravitas throughout the series. All of these scenes become crucial character backstory later on and have long-term consequences that are explored."

I've just finished Barrayar and so far I think you are absolutely right in this analysis. The events of the earlier book are not forgotten.

[Oleksandr, a.k.a. Acorn]

Nick wrote: "I've just finished Barrayar and so far I think you are absolutely right in this analysis. The events of the earlier book are not forgotten."

There will be more in The Warrior's Apprentice

[Kat]

I joined this group quite recently, so I'll be trailing rather than joining this challenge. I thought this was extremely good for a first novel. It was a quick read for me--I finished it before I got the Apple receipt for the ebook! One of the things I liked is that one plot turn rapidly succeeded the next but without ever being repetitive. I'm someone who is bored bored bored by action movies, as one chase scene/shootout seems very much like the next to me--I'm not interested in the details that do differ.

I liked that the worldbuilding didn't overwhelm the plot or characters, but could have used a little more of it--something to look forward to, I guess. I enjoyed the romance as a vehicle for characterization--pretty much all the characterization came through romance in this novel. Not a criticism, but I wouldn't want every novel to be like that.

I had mixed feelings about how the issue of rape was handled. This is such difficult territory. But I admired LMB's exploration of other moral gray areas. Though honor is so important to Vorkosigan, he feels forced to act in dishonorable ways on more than one occasion. Cordelia, too, can't claim to be completely honorable--she certainly doesn't do her duty, which was surely to reveal everything she knew about Barrayaran hierarchy and war stratagems. Hence the Shards of Honor title--neat.

[Kateblue, 2nd star to the right and straight on til morning]

You still have a couple of weeks left in March to catch up . . . some of the books are quick to read. The book you just read is her first book ever. Just saying you might find later written books better. And they were not written chronologically.

And welcome.

[Lee at ReadWriteWish]

Kat wrote: "I joined this group quite recently, so I'll be trailing rather than joining this challenge. I thought this was extremely good for a first novel. It was a quick read for me--I finished it before I g..."

You make some excellent points, Kat. I would say that characterisation coming through the romance is an excellent example of LMB 'showing not telling' which is something that she really excels at, I think.

[Joe]

Welcome to the group, Kat! There's definitely not much romance in the next couple books.. that's specific to this one (and a bit in the next, I suppose). The world building does come along slowly, but it's picking up steam as it goes.

So far I'm quite happy I hopped aboard to read the series.

[Kristenelle]

I read this! I'm super late to the party, but I wanted to see what all the fuss was about. :) I'm not sure if I'm going to try to complete the challenge, but I'm at least going to read the next one.

My interest was especially piqued after I read a review by someone who felt that it was super traumatic and full of torture and rape, but it seemed like you all mostly liked it well enough. I feel like it wasn't that bad. I did think it was weird that Cordelia was immediately flirting with her captor. That was problematic. But I also feel like I can kind of let it slide considering when it was written and the fact that the tone of the book was very light.

I feel like I would have really enjoyed this as a teenager. It felt a bit juvenile and not terribly subtle. But I enjoyed it and had no problem getting through it.

I LOVED the synthetic uteruses and the fact that they were delivered to the rapist fathers. That was bad ass.

[Kateblue, 2nd star to the right and straight on til morning]

See, Kristen, I would not have said Cordelia was flirting with Aral--or are you talking about someone other than Aral.

This was her very first novel. Definitely try Barrayar, which is a continuation or Shards, and is definitely better written (IMHO)

After I got done reading Shards, I thought it was pretty good, but I did not understand why my coworker friend Tom loved these books so much. Then I read Barrayar, and the rest, as they say, is history. (If I had 5 books to be on a desert island with, this would be probably #4, with others in this series above it)

[Kristenelle]

Kateblue wrote: "See, Kristen, I would not have said Cordelia was flirting with Aral--or are you talking about someone other than Aral.

This was her very first novel. Definitely try Barrayar, which is a continuat..."

Yeah, I felt like Aral and Cordelia were definitely bantering right off the bat.

I'm excited that the others are even better!

[Lee at ReadWriteWish]

I guess you'd say that Aral and Cordelia were attracted to each other right off the bat. And that was the entire conflict. They come from places that were sworn enemies and yet they felt attraction and, soon, respect and friendship. I wouldn't call it flirting with a captor as some sort of weird weak sexist act. Cordelia is never a weak female!

PS this and Barrayar remain my favourite of the books (thus far) and I feel very protective of them. LOL

[Kateblue, 2nd star to the right and straight on til morning]

How far along are you, Lee?

[Lee at ReadWriteWish]

Borders of Infinity is my next. I need to start it. I've gotten a little behind.

And, yes, I know, most people tell me the best are still to come. LOL

[Art, Stay home, stay safe.]

Glad to say that I'm actively attacking this challenge now. I finished the Shards last night and must say that even though it doesn't come close to the other series we've read, it wad still very enjoyable to read.

It is packed with different themes, which is always welcome in scifi, but the writing itself wasn't great. Looking forward to reading the rest!

Some memorable quotes:

Suffering bastard."
"I thought you saw meaning in that sort of thing," said Vorkosigan.
"In the abstract. Most days it's just stumbling around in the dark with the rest of creation, smashing into things and wondering why it hurts."

* * *

Ges Vorrutyer? He was just a little villain. An old-fashioned craftsman, making crimes one-off. The really unforgivable acts are committed by calm men in beautiful green silk rooms, who deal death wholesale, by the shipload, without lust, or anger, or desire, or any redeeming emotion to excuse them but cold fear of some pretended future. But the crimes they hope to prevent in that future are imaginary. The ones they commit in the present—they are real." His voice fell, as he spoke, so that by the end he was almost whispering.

* * *

"So this word of honor business—you believe he never breaks it?"
"Well . . ."
"He does, then."
"I have seen him do so. But the cost was huge."
"He breaks it for a price, then."
"Not for a price. At a cost."
"I fail to see the distinction."
"A price is something you get. A cost is something you lose. He lost—much, at Escobar."


Both the protagonists are very interesting to follow and easy to root for. It is unfortunate how some of the scenes got ruined by being slightly too convenient, but it's not that big of a deal.

[Kateblue, 2nd star to the right and straight on til morning]

Art, it's her first book. They get better. Much better.

[Joe]

welcome to the challenge, Art! Looking forward to hear your insights!

Things being too convenient happens kinda alot in the first few books. Happily, that's the biggest fault.

[Caitlin]

way behind but just finished this one a few days ago, i really enjoyed it but i was expecting it to be more related to falling free which i had read first. i think in time ill see it link back together as i read more of the series. i like that these books are fairly easy, quick enjoyable reads and i really like the world she is building.

[Art, Stay home, stay safe.]

Caitlin wrote: "way behind but just finished this one a few days ago, i really enjoyed it but i was expecting it to be more related to falling free which i had read first. i think in time ill see it link back toge..."

I'm no expert, you have to wait for others to weigh in. But as far as I remember Falling Free is a prequel she wrote years later. Ithink it is a prequel only in terms of the universe time lines. I only know because she spoke about it in a epilogue.

Shards is her first novel which I also enjoyed, since it was pretty easy to read and follow. Good luck with the next one, I felt it was a little less scifi-y but still a good adventure.

[Antti]

Yes, Falling Free doesn't really connect to the rest of the books. There are some references to quaddies is some books, but that's about it.

[Rebecca]

Necroposting here since someone here said something that inspired me to try this series. I did like this first book but wasn't incredibly impressed. I liked the characters but I felt like I couldn't follow where the story was going. I also found the attraction between the MCs understandable at the beginning but the idea that she would marry him so quickly was unconvincing. Every part of the Beta Colony part was uncomfortable, I felt so bad for Cordelia. Off to start Barrayar!

[Joe]

Rebecca wrote: "Necroposting here since someone here said something that inspired me to try this series. I did like this first book but wasn't incredibly impressed. I liked the characters but I felt like I couldn'..."

Fun to see someone else reading the series... The definitely get better as they go... this one was enough to show the potential, but definitely isn't as good as they get later...the 1st two books are essentially prequels, after all.

[Oleksandr, a.k.a. Acorn]

Rebecca wrote: "Necroposting here since someone here said something that inspired me to try this series.."

This series unlike many others gets better with every next volume

[Allan]

Rebecca wrote: "Necroposting here since someone here said something that inspired me to try this series. ..."

Barrayar was written later, and is excellent. The Warrior's Apprentice, the following book, is weaker, earlier in her career. But after that, the writing and plotting get continually better. I would say that, looking at the books you read, you will really enjoy this series.

[Kateblue, 2nd star to the right and straight on til morning]

What they said!

[Kalin]

While it might be objectively weaker, I have fond memories of Warrior's Apprentice as the first full Miles antics book in the series. I also agree, things really take off with Barrayar. Shards, while fun, was a bit of a mess.

[Kateblue, 2nd star to the right and straight on til morning]

I was uncertain about the series after "shards" and asked the guy who recommended them. He said "Just keep reading."

The bad things about shards, to me were 1) the pacing was off (beginning trudge across the tundra was too long), and 2) instalove, which I never really believe. Neither are a problem for Bujold again