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Outlander
Archive 08-19 GR Discussions
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"Outlander" by Diana Gabaldon with Reading Schedule, Fall/Winter Chunky Read
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Whoops! I totally missed that! Yes, let's break that section up and push everything back. I will edit my original post!
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My all time fav book! I have read it twice, I have to tell you that I was given this book to read. When I read the synopsis I said I wouldn't be interested in it, it's not my thing. So if you are like me and maybe on the fence, I highly recommend it. I hope you enjoy!
Dear Chicks on Lit friends,I read Outlander in one weekend right after the series on Starz began. All I will say is that Diana Galbadon draws you into this improbable, highly romantic/sci-fi story in such a way that you can't put it down.
Loved this book and will comment more on the story when you all have a chance to read it.
Enjoy!!!
OH I've been waiting for a possibility to read that book and now I have motivation to do it :) Will follow the guideline you proposed. My boyfriend is Scottish and I haven't read a single book with a Scottish theme yet! :)
I've read, listened and watched on TV. Reading is the best and I'm happy to have an excuse to read it again.
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Outlander is one of the few books that I have wanted to reread. Excited to hear other readers thoughts on this. On the first read I still had little ones at home so I would get a page or two in when I had a moment. Now I have it all to myself :)
I'm going to have to remember to come by this page for the discussions! I'm currently on book 3 of this series. I had a slow start with the beginning of Outlander but now I love the series!
Wonderful! Maybe now I can actually read it now that the sections will be broken down for motivation!
Spending lots of time in CCU w dad looking forward to this!
I was thinking up of picking this book for reading soon, so I could read in a group, and use it for one of my challenges, where I need to read book over 400 pages. I'll have to borrow the book from the library, and the lending time is around 1 month. Taking 3 months to read one fiction book is definitely too long.
If it helps - it's $4.99 on Amazon Kindle, and you can read it in your browser if you don't have an reader or smart phone. And I will tell you, she is wordy!
I have a friend who loves this series but I was never sure I would like it. I think I'll try it & see how it goes. thanks for the pick -- especially since I've been trying to find another book to read.
I'm getting the price of 7$. :( I'll think about it, since my challenge ends in December.
I'm so glad so many people are interested in reading this with us! I hope we have great discussion. Remember - reading begins tomorrow! :-)
To those that are new to Outlander, I've heard that some have trouble getting started in the book. Agreed, the first chapter and a half are kind of slow and tedious. It gets better after that.
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@Kama - really? $7 on Amazon for Kindle version? I thought maybe my price was bc I am Amazon Prime member, but I signed out and still see the $4.99 price. Are you in the U.S.? Barnes & Noble price is $6.99, but Amazon still shows $4.99. Bummer if it's not the same for everyone. Sorry.
I live in Poland. This book http://www.amazon.com/Outlander-Cross... is $7. Do you see that one below $5? In B&N the same book is $6.99 for me.
Thanks for confirmation. It looks like they have different prices for different countries. That sucks. :/
I'm new to the Outlander series, after having watched the Starz television production. I just finished reading the 3rd book, and have to say that this series is fantastic! If you haven't read the series before, I hope that you all love it as much as I have - the first book is my favorite :) Happy reading!!
Sheila, this has been on my TBR list for years too. Glad to hear from Maureen that the first chapter & a half are slow because I started it once and set it aside. I haven't watched the series but have always heard people rave about these books!
I'll have to dig through my totes and find my copy so I can join in!
I haven't found the first chapters to be slow. There is a lot of detail to pay attention to but it makes it exciting. I think I am really going to like settling down at night with this one. I started last night pretty late. I didn't get very far but I should today.
I have borrowed the Polish versiin from library. I'll need to read it in a month... But I'll probably make some notes.
Finally ready to start discussion! I apologize for the delay - I was hoping to have this post up sooner, but I just finished this week's section a little bit ago. What is everyone's first impressions?
-I'm glad that I was forewarned that the beginning would be slow as I really did not like the first 2 chapters, but after that it was smooth sailing!
- I don't really care for Frank and I found him to be boring. I don't think him and Claire have very much in common. (Maybe I'm making excuses for why they shouldn't be together? lol).
I know some people have taken issue with the fact that Claire is married in present day, but goes on to have sex with another man in the time-traveled past. What does everyone think about the blossoming relationship between Claire and Jamie?
- I did not read the full Goodreads summary of the book before starting, so I wasn't sure what was to happen, but I knew other readers were displeased with the infidelity aspect. That being said, I thought perhaps Captain Randall was going to be her lover in the 1700s and I just thought oh my god, that is TOO weird. And I was immediately drawn to Jamie. And like I said, I don't care much for Frank. So I, personally, am excited to see where this relationship goes!! (I'm totally 'shipping Claire and Jamie, so after going back to read the full Goodreads synopsis, I'm glad that a love relationship is in-fact in progress!! Yay!)
Laugh Out Loud moment: when Claire thinks "If I were a horse, I'd let him ride me anywhere." LOL!
I will say, I'm a bit surprised with how flexible she is being with things. I would probably be freaking out, and yet she is just going with the flow.
One thing I was really thinking about is whether present-day time is continuing or on pause. Claire thought about Frank being worried if she hadn't returned soon, and yet she has been in the 1700s for over 24 hours so far. I'm curious to see how Gabaldon addresses this; I'm curious if the standard "butterfly effect" will apply. I'm sure her development of time-travel will be immaculately detailed, as she has been very detailed thus far. Her world-building is astounding and has really pulled me in.
Something I think will be interesting to discuss either as we proceed or at the end is how this book compares to other time-travel books.
What do you think of Claire?
-I think she's great! I love her straight-forward, no-BS manner. And the fact that she has experience as a nurse, but refuses to fully align with stereotypical female gender roles.
Concluding thoughts of the first section:
-At first, I thought Claire should be trying harder to go back to present time.. but after the mild intimacy with Jamie, I'm like.. nahhhh, just stay in the 1700s and see what happens!
-What of this MacKenzie guy?! Her story was pretty solid but he wasn't fully buying it.. And what would happen if someone found her out? They are already suspicious of her as it is..
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I don't think Claire and Frank's marriage was that strong, as they had been apart for a good part of it, so her feelings for Jamie are probably normal, though again, she just seems to take all of this too much in stride!
She did have some things to to say and a few choice words when she she was kidnapped I think Frank is boring for Claire and is really and intellectual but yet I think at times where she seems to be attracted to him.
I am guessing that Jamie is join going be a sexual awakening of some kind for Claire.
I love the book I couldn't put the book down for the first section. Will be picking it up tonight to start the next.
It's not that the first chapters were slow, they were painfully obvious. You could bet every damn information given before her trip would be obviously used up later on.There is not much psychological building up of the character. And sure, she takes everything so damn well, nothing is shaking her up (more visible later on).
It's an interesting book, but good only for a pastime. Nothing worth serious attention is there, and it is not going to be a classic.
My interpretation is that Claire didn't like her present-day life too much, so the time-travel is a nice escape from reality. I've started the next section of reading, but am a bit behind due to the holidays. We hosted Thanksgiving for the first time this year! :-) But I am hoping to be caught up on readings and post more discussion questions this evening.
I am just finishing up the next section. I think chapter 8 at the beginning as to why Claire might be taking things well. After all she is still doing nursing which seems to be very rewarding to for her. How did it all go for your Thanksgiving Kasey?
Thanksgiving went very well, thanks in part to my helpful husband! Everything came out on time, not burnt, and we had plenty of leftovers. It was very nice! I want to apologize for falling behind in my discussion leader duties. I have finally finished this section of reading and am ready to post some questions!
What do you think of Jamie now?!
He kinda fell on his appeal factor for me this section. He is charming and good-looking, has a sense of humor, courteous towards others, and is strong.. Okay, fine. But he sleeps around and that is a big turn off for me. He has a kid with Lettia that is passed as Colum's improbable son. Eeesh.
Also side note: I think in reading this book, I've come to the conclusion that in contrast to the majority- I think I actually am a fan of insta-love.. Or perhaps I am impatient because the book synopsis promises a love story and I'm just thinking... where is this love story??? Sigh. And this is why I hate reading the description of a book, because I go into it wanting the story to be delivered and I don't like waiting. And let's be honest - 2 sections in, and Claire and Jamie aren't even really flirting.
Okay, so anyway - Jamie is probably going to be a well-rounded character with admirable characteristics mixed in with the flaws.. and while I really don't like his flaws, I can appreciate the fact that Gabaldon is not making the love-object an idolized and unrealistic god-like man.
This section definitely gives more credence to Claire's concern with returning to present time. I think her having a purpose of being basically the doctor for the castle has definitely given her sustenance, but it looks as though that is wearing thin. I wish I knew what her thoughts were - that piece seems underdeveloped.. Okay, so she is planning this escape.. but why??? Because outwardly, she is still taking things in complete stride.
What do you think of the sexual assault scenes? What purpose do these scenes serve?
So there was one with Captain Randalls in the first section.. And then the scene in this section with MacKenzie clan-men. I really don't even know what to think. Perhaps these scenes are meant to demonstrate male domination and sense of entitlement of this time period. How does that compare to gender roles now?
One scene that stands out the most from this section for me is the scene of the kid whose ear was nailed to the pillory. OMG. This made me cringe. I think this highlights a major difference of punishment for crimes. It also made me wonder if people in today's society would steal if they knew the would possibly have their ear nailed to a pillory... Hmm..
Another thing that I just cannot let go is the customs. Have any of you ever traveled abroad? Or even to other parts of the country? I live in Ohio and even going south to Georgia has noticeable differences in customs. People in GA say "yes ma'am" and pop is "soda" there. And I've been out of country as well and those differences are compounded x10 for little things. So what gets me is... how does Claire fit in with this time period?!? lol! Maybe I'm being nit-picky (am I being nit-picky???), but it drives me bonkers. I cannot imagine going back 200+ years and being able to talk appropriately or conduct myself accordingly. I think Gabaldon has addressed this by discussing how Claire didn't know how to eat her food at the one dinner so she did what everyone else did, or how she referred to something as "stainless steel" and no one knew what she meant.. But in my mind, I would think she would be doing more than that, so much so that it was glaringly obvious that she is an outside. While I think other characters are suspicious of her, I don't think they are overly worried.
Now about the witchcraft. I love this piece, I'm intrigued by it, and I think Gabaldon did an excellent job of researching this aspect of history (but I really know nothing of it, so maybe she has me fooled lol). I'm wondering how big of a piece this plays later on, but I would say probably a decent bit. My favorite part was when Geillis talks about taking blue heart-shaped flowers to abort a pregnancy. I just found this really interesting - probably because I underestimate how civilized people were during this time, so the fact that they knew about menstruation and preventing/aborting pregnancies fascinates me.
What parts have stood out to you?.
Sorry for such a long post. I hope everyone doesn't mind my ramblings. I had way more thoughts about this book than I realized! lol :-) I'm looking forward to hearing everyone's input!!
Art is intended to give pleasure. Literature is the all-pervasive Art form. It is delicate, and only potential artists can handle it properly to produce an artistic effect that gives pleasure to the reader. A story line is not enough.
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Jamie is not impressing me yet. He is not a guy I see Claire falling for. Like you mention, the sleeping around is a big turn off. Claire even catches him in the closet with that teen, and doesn't even bat an eye. Why would she fall for this guy?
I also am totally annoyed at how well Claire is fitting in here. Her language should be a total glaring standout, did nobody notice how her clothes were made. Her mannerisms, etc. She should seem like an alien to them, yet they are pretty much accepting her. Unrealistic.
And why is she not completely obsessing about how to get back to the stone circle to try to pass back through the stones to present time. She knows that is where whatever happened happened. Why is she so comfortable to take her time figuring things out? Was her life that unhappy? It almost seems like she is in a dream, where she is just going with whatever is happening, and not seeing it as being anything that strange.
I am enjoying your postings Kasey. I feel the same about Jamie and changed my mind about him since the first section. I am glad he isn't perfect though. Sheila that is a good questions about how she is fitting in. Are Scottish people pretty friendly and accepting? If so it might make more sense.
I think she has been caught several times now trying to escape and Jamie keep telling her the danger among the Highlands so I wonder if that has anything to do with it?
Kasey maybe all the attempted sexual assault will show us Jamie's gallantry but then again he is in the closet with that teen of course maybe there is an explanation coming? I doubt Claire will be happy to hear about it though.
He has a kid with Lettia that is passed as Colum's improbable son. Well, you know, just saying, that there is something like "rumour" and not necessarily you should believe everything which is written.
Sheila, exactly. WHY would she fall for this guy??? I'm assuming this is developed in the next section.. *fingers crossed*. I wouldn't mind some romance. Did you all see that the newest book in this series won Goodreads Choice Award for the Romance genre?? I also had the impression that she was dreaming or something.. Hmm.
I'm hoping all of these things will be answered throughout the rest of the book, like how she is able to blend in so well and why she is so content with going with the flow.
Even though Jamie has warned her of the danger of the Highlands, I don't think she is too concerned with it. And her current plans to escape have not been planned very well.
Rebecca - so maybe Jamie is being contrasted against the predators because he is the hero and not the perpetrator of sexual assault?? But he is a bit perverse to be having sexual relations with a teenager... How old is he supposed to be?? I don't recall..
As for Colum's son.. LOL. I just thought Gabaldon made it clear that Colum is highly unlikely to father his son. But true that Jamie is only rumored to be the father - perhaps he is not. I guess it seems more likely, and certainly implied, due to his sexual promiscuity. Like, at this point, I wouldn't put it past him. But perhaps the father of Colum's child is actually another MacKenzie clan member.
What do you think of Jamie now?!I cannot answer this one, as I have read 6 of her books, so I know Jamie quite well, but I think you will not be disappointed by him.
What do you think of the sexual assault scenes? What purpose do these scenes serve?
I think the sexual assault scenes served to show how dangerous life was for women in this time period. They truly could not go anywhere without being escorted by someone very trustworthy, and that is one reason why Claire has such a difficult time making her way back to the standing stones. How can she possibly get there by herself, and who could she possibly trust enough to escort her there?
To those that are bothered by the differences in customs, and that fact that Claire should stick out like a sore thumb... I remember that this bothered me a great deal when reading the book the first time. Some of this is covered by the fact that she is English, and surrounded by Scots, mostly women, and women did not get to travel much during that time. But it still seems like there would still be so many things she would say and do that would be considered very odd.
Now about the witchcraft.
The witchcraft made me very nervous and I wanted Claire to be very cautious not to get involved with that.
What parts have stood out to you?.
What really intrigued me was the lack of freedom that people had to move about and do what they want. Everything depended on who knew you. You had to be a well-known person in a community to get along, and so much of your safety depended on your community. Women especially were at the mercy of others. You had to have introductions every where you went. Claire was very lucky to have found a group that was willing to take her in and that at least somewhat accepted her.
What I've really enjoyed is Gabaldon's writing. She's very wordy, and sometimes we are impatient to get to the next part in the story, but she does such a good job of describing everything, that you feel like you are actually there. It seems like she does not neglect a thing. We are treated to the sights, sounds, and smells of daily life in the Scottish Highlands in the mid-17th Century (would that properly be called the 18th Century?).
I think we might started to get some thoughts in chapter 11 maybe as to why she is comfortable. I am curious to hear what others think. I have to say Maureen that I thought it would be to wordy for me but I really love that she did and I really think its amazing. I am happy I am just starting this series.Does anyone know how long it took her to write this book? I can't imagine. TEDIOUS work maybe? Also I have the CD with the anniversary version and wondered if anyone else had listened to it? I also wondered if its an overall cd for the book or if it relates to certain sections in the book????
Hmm - not sure about a CD with the anniversary version, but I also listened to the book from audible - narrated by Davina Porter, and I must say she does an exquisite job of reading this book. It is a treat for your ears to listen to her Scottish brogue and English accents. Gabaldon's phrases become a lovely lilt in her voice. You can tell she really enjoys the writing and the story, and listening to her version of the tale will really enhance your reading enjoyment. Plus you'll learn how to pronounce Laoghaire (sounds to me like Lira)! ;)I just looked it up on Amazon, and the kindle version of the book is now $2.99, and the audible version is $3.99. I highly recommend the audible experience.
Maureen - thank you for giving me hope for Jamie!! Also - that is an excellent point about the safety of women in this time.
I just finished chapter 11 and, without giving away spoilers, I will just say that Claire at least briefly addresses the whole time-difference customs thing and fitting in. So that has appeased me on this matter, for now.
Another great point about people's lack of freedom during this time period! Claire IS super lucky that a group has embraced her.
I also agree that while I'm impatient for the story to unfold, I'm very satisfied with Gabaldon's world-building and descriptions.
I want to make sure I am following the story correctly... Why is Jamie an outlaw? I don't think I am really following this piece very well. BRIEF SPOILER ALERT involving this section's reading chapters 11-16:
So this is my understanding. Jamie did something and was taken to Fort William. He escaped into France for a while, was with some "broken men" in Scotland, and then someone hit him with an ax. Then Dougal came to get him and then shortly after is when they happened upon Claire? I realize this is a super shortened version, but I just want to make sure I'm not missing anything. There are a lot of details to take in and keep straight!
Thanks in advance to whoever refreshes my memory and offers clarification! I will be posting more discussion questions for this section this evening. :-)
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Thanks Sheila for confirming! I still am confused about why Jamie is an outlaw.. or have we not found out all the details about that yet?
Okay, so discussion question time! Except, I really don't even know where to start.. Oh my.
So I guess I will start with Jamie. Oh, Jamie. It turns out that he is a virgin and therefore unable to be the father of Colum's son!!!! Whoops! Or at least he claims to have been a virgin. My perspective on him has taken yet another 180 turn. The best way I can think to describe my feelings towards him is to say I'm now a fangirl. When he does something considerate for Claire, I get excited and fangirl so hard. I suppose it is his knack for saying and doing charming things, his dedication to customs and values, his ideals about treating a woman with respect. So I'm a total hypocrite right now. I feel like this section is almost a completely different character than the man-whore-aka-Jamie from the previous section. Hmmmm.. So, can he be both? IS he both? Have your perceptions of Jamie changed? And what do you make of his character now?
Okay, so color me confused for more of this section than I realized. How and/or why did Dougal take Claire to Captain Randall? And OMG that guy is a jerk! This whole part is confusing to me. Is it meant to be part of a bigger plot line for Dougal's manipulative ways?..
First, I found his story of what happened to Jamie at Fort William to be absolutely horrifying. And I don't fully understand why he told Claire all that stuff - to convince her to marry Jamie, to demonstrate Jamie's character.. in order to prevent Jamie from ever leading the MacKenzie clan. Okay, I guess I can buy into that, but it seems really really calculated and makes me think there is more to it than that, although I don't know what that might be. Also - why would Dougal even care to try to keep Claire from Captain Randall's punishments??? That is baffling to me.
As for this wedding!! OH MY. As Claire said, maybe Jamie didn't want to marry her. And I really can't figure out why he did. He clearly had many other young and lovely prospects. Hmm. I guess they both weren't really left with many options but WOW. And she was still wearing Frank's wedding band... I would think that a wedding band from the 1940s would stick out, but I guess not..
Laugh Out Loud moment: when Claire says "I can't marry you! I don't even know your last name!" - LOL - and cue Carrie Underwood song.... lol
What are the odds that Claire marries Frank AND Jamie in the same church?!
What of the expectation that they consummate their marriage? I figure it's typical of the times. I just can't get over how laid back Claire is about the whole thing.
While in the marriage chamber, Claire and Jamie talk about how "respect has maybe room for secrets but not lies." What do you think - is this true? And what do you think Jamie's secrets are?? I personally have no clue.
What about Claire's thoughts of infatuation in which she equates it with "brief intense affairs"?
I feel like she is trying to rationalize her relationship with Jamie, although I believe her attraction is stronger than she is willing to admit and will last longer than just an affair. I mean, there are several books after this one! lol
Closing thoughts:
This is like a guilty pleasure thing for me, seeing Claire and Jamie's relationship develop. But I really am torn. I don't know what I would do if I were in her situation.
At this point in time, I really don't see Claire ever making it back to present-day. Her plans are not very well thought out, and there seems to be an obstacle around every corner because so many other characters are pushing their own agendas. She needs to outsmart and out-plan them. And she seems a little too content in this realm. While she mentions escaping and getting back to present-day, I don't think her actions demonstrate that this is really a priority for her. I feel like if it were, she would be thinking about it nonstop.
I still enjoy Gabaldon's world building but some of the passages have become daunting for me. Especially in regards to Jamie's story.. first we hear bits and pieces from him, then more bits and pieces from Dougal, and then even more from Jamie again.. but so many bits and pieces are left out or Jamie says he can't share that right now etc etc etc. It's a lot to hold on to and I find I'm highlighting and bookmarking lots of things so I can put the puzzle together if/when I finally have all the pieces. But in the meantime... YUCK. I don't like it.
I'm sorry this post is all over the place. This is basically how this section has made me feel - all over the place! lol So many crazy things happening and lots of details to process. Please share thoughts and feel free to ask more questions!! :-)
Mod
For me I didn't understand the part when there was an intruder at the door and she was scared and found out it was Jamie but his reason did make sense to me??I am kind of over the Sassenach thing. Can the man call her Claire anytime for me.
Their relationship is still new and very confusing. They have there long talks and I still feel like I haven't learned anything.
I know Claire is lying about the sex how could it be good for her, come on really???
"The best way I can think to describe my feelings towards him is to say I'm now a fangirl. When he does something considerate for Claire, I get excited and fangirl so hard". I feel the same Kasey.
This is the reading schedule that I propose:
November 16th - start reading. Read through chapter 5.
November 23rd - discuss chapters 1-5. Read through chapter 10.
November 30th - discuss chapters 6-10. Read through chapter 16.
December 7th - discuss chapters 11-16. Read through chapter 23.
December 14th - discuss chapters 17-23. Read through chapter 25.
December 21st - discuss chapters 24-25. Read through chapter 33.
December 28th - discuss chapters 26-33. Read through chapter 37.
January 4th - discuss chapters 34-37. Read through chapter 41.
January 11th - discuss entire book.
**I have broken it up into the 6 sections of the book, each averages around 100 pages. I broke the last section into 2 parts since it is around busy holiday time. If anyone would like to make suggestions to alter the reading schedule, please let me know! Again, this is my first time reading Outlander so I'm unsure if it matters if we read each individual section before discussing. We can always break each section into smaller parts and extend the read time if this makes more sense for everyone.
**Also, I read on my Nook, so what is 100 pages on my Nook may actually be more or less in a physical copy. Please let me know if this is the case and we can make necessary changes! I don't want to deter anyone from reading due to the reading amount. I'm excited to discuss this book with everyone! :-)