The Mookse and the Gripes discussion
General Non-Book Discussions
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Café Quito: 'pub' thread for general discussions
My dad went through a phase of regifting books to the rest of the family for Christmas. Not new ones either! I got a definitely-second-hand Guy de Maupassant. It was a great idea though -- less waste and we all read some books that had been sitting forgotten on my parents' shelves. He did mess up one year though, and give my sister a book she'd given him two years before!
WndyJW wrote: "My first book of 2021 was a 2 star book! I almost never rate a book 2 stars because I wouldn’t finish a book I didn’t like. I loved The Wake so I bought Beast with m..."Sounds King Lear-ish. Do you think that was the author’s intention?
Sorry it turned out to be a two star for you. Am sure that’s not how you wanted to start your reading year!
One of my aims for 2021 is to rearrange my bookshelves into a more logical order. Any logic would be an improvement. There are approaching 5,000 books in the house now, and although I have removed a few that I do not want to keep, I do love to be able to go back to a book I have read or read another by an author I enjoy.I have a copy of The Alexandria Quartet that I have shipped around the world for 30 years now and still not sat down to read, but I remain optomistic that one day I will.
My wife and I have been debating the best way to order the books, alphabetically, or by country, or just fiction and non fiction, and then I keep adding side projects such as the First World War mix of history, poetry and biography or my collection of art books and monographs. No doubt the debate will continue for the whole year. It is not helped by the fact the books are spread across five rooms, so it is would be hard to keep everything in one category together. Also I like to keep all the Penguin classics, Galley Beggar Press and Fitzcarraldo editions together, which blows the alphabetical out of the water.
Aaaah! This may never be resolved.
What was your first book, Robert? Others here liked Beast, so it must just be me. I think The Wake ruined Beast for me. Good luck creating order in your shelves, Marcus. I have mine by publisher if they come from an indie press; author if it’s a favorite author; by prize-Nobel winners, Booker, Goldsmith; War novels; and the rest by region or country. Nonfiction is grouped by subject and Dharma books have their own bookcase.
Thank you, Vesna. I wish you and all of us a great reading year!
Marcus wrote: "One of my aims for 2021 is to rearrange my bookshelves into a more logical order. Any logic would be an improvement. There are approaching 5,000 books in the house now, and although I have removed ..."Marcus I wish I could pop over to help you with this project. I love arranging books!
Why not do it all? A shelf (or many more) of independent presses grouped together; shelves of subject matter groupings; non fiction shelves; alphabetized general fiction.
WndyJW wrote: "I have mine by publisher if they come from an indie press; author if it’s a favorite author; by prize-Nobel winners, Booker, Goldsmith; War novels; and the rest by region or country. Nonfiction is grouped by subject and Dharma books have their own bookcase ..."Oh I see Wendy went for the do-it-all approach! Nicely done my friend and happy new year.
WndyJW wrote: ". I have mine by publisher if they come from an indie press; author if it’s a favorite author; by prize-Nobel winners, Booker, Goldsmith; War novels; and the rest by region or country. "What happens if the Indie presses win the Booker/Nobel etc?
Ah, the great arranging bookshelves problem! I roughly have mine organised by period - so classical/medieval, early modern/Renaissance, 18-19th century, 20th century. Contemporary fiction tends to be on my Kindle, the odd hard copy just gets tagged on to C20th shelves.
This way you can also group by author, theme or publisher within the period should you choose. I just accept that there may be some spillover between shelves.
It's a fun thing to think about!
Mod
A counter-argument from "The Auctioneer" in David Hayden's Darker with the Lights On (shortlisted for the 2018 RoC - for which a few of us helped judge) Books might well be the worst of the household ephemera: dry husks that, slab by slab rise in great, whispering walls, entombing their owners. The essence of the book is another thing entirely, not the words as such but what lies beneath the words, that is what can set you free. That is why libraries are so important, as long as one does not linger too long in them. If I have to buy a book I give it away immediately after I’ve finished reading
Gumble's Yard wrote: "A counter-argument from "The Auctioneer" in David Hayden's Darker with the Lights On ...If I have to buy a book I give it away immediately after I’ve finished reading"
Yes - exactly. Indeed I just gave away about 30 indie books only yesterday - to you!
Emily wrote: "What happens if the Indie presses win the Booker/Nobel"
Fitzcarraldo translated authors have on the Nobel, twice in last few years (and I rate Fosse as a high chance for 2021/2022 as well)
Mod
Books might well be the worst of the house..."
Interesting that you mention David Hayden, as his is one of an impressive set of blurb quotes on the book I am reading now, The Snow Ball. I picked it up because one of the Iris Murdochs I read before Christmas was dedicated to Brophy, and when the blurb quoters also include Isabel Waidner and the introduction is by Eley Williams it was too intriguing for me to resist.
Somebody should tell Faber that adding "A Christmas Romance" to the GoodReads title of a literary novella which references Mozart will put off more readers than it draws in - this wording does not appear anywhere on or in the physical book, and the book is set at New Year not Christmas.
Cross over books are tricky. I just decide what matters more to me: the award or the press or the author and do it that way.I love the idea of books piled up. Your place sounds very inviting, Hugh.
To Paul’s point, I gave my granddaughter an ARC The Mercies by Kiran Millwood Hargave for Christmas Eve and yesterday gave her The Deathless Girls by same author with a really lovely YA cover. I asked her if she wanted The Mercies with the nicer cover so the books would look good together, she merrily replied that she doesn’t care what the books look like and she keeps them in a cupboard anyway. I cringed and almost insisted that she let me get her the nicer looking cover, but decided it’s her choice. Her sister chooses editions by the cover and likes for them to look nice together. Both are readers, one loves books, one just wants to read.
Cross over books are tricky. I just decide what matters more to me: the award or the press or the author and do it that way.I love the idea of books piled up. Your place sounds very inviting, Hugh.
To Paul’s point, I gave my granddaughter an ARC of The Mercies by Kiran Millwood Hargave for Christmas Eve and yesterday gave her a copy of The Deathless Girls by the same author and asked if she would like me to get her the hardcover The Mercies with the lovely cover so they look nice together. She merrily replied that she didn’t care what the books look like and she keeps them in a cupboard anyway. I cringed and almost insisted that she let me get her the nicer edition, but decided it was her decision. Her sister likes nice editions. Both readers, one loves books, one just loves reading. I wish they had covers like this when I was young.
WndyJW wrote: "one loves books, one just wants to read"Yes, interesting distinction. Like you, I love books as material objects as well as for their contents - I have been known to buy a second copy of a book I already own just because I've fallen in love with the new cover - this is usually in the case of classics where Penguin/Oxford have brought out a new edition. Then the old edition gets relegated to the throwaway pile i.e. books to read in the bath or to take away on holiday (remember that?). Please tell me I'm not the only one!
I've only bought second copies of books I already own for a new translation. I have more often bought books I have read before due to:
a) needing a re-read for a trilogy say and having given away/sold the earlier volumes (most recently Fosse)
b) forgetting I had read it - which was actually why I started keeping a list of books read a la Goodreads.
Roman Clodia wrote: "I have been known to buy a second copy of a book I already own just because I've fallen in love with the new cover "Please tell me I'm not the only one!
..."
No chance of that!
I have several multiple copies - books I really love, where I might have a signed copy, a tatty reading copy and some special edition like an illustrated version of a Folio edition. Alternative translations and sets also give me the occasional multiple copy. I have a complete set of all the novels of Agatha Christie, but I also have twenty or so first editions of them.
Problems arise when my hoarding tendencies come into conflict with my wife's strong OCD.
I have four copies of Beowulf for the different translations, three copies of Alice in Wonderland for the different notes/illustrations and two hotly-contested copies of Tess of the d'Urbervilles (husband and I disagree on which is the nicer cover).I do like books as physical objects but if I disliked the book that counts for more and I generally get rid of it however beautiful it is.
I sometimes buy multiple formats of my favorite books: Kindle to read (and for the search feature), Audible when I'm on the go or just in the mood to listen, and a print version to share and/or keep in my bookcase.
If I buy ARCS or signed editions from a used booksellers then I always buy the book new so the author and publisher get paid. I have a few translations of The Odyssey (yet still have not read the whole book,) copies of Ali Smith’s quartet to read and copies of Spring, Summer and Winter signed that I won’t open, and collectible Bring Up the Bodies and The Mirror and the Light. Signed 1st/1st Autumn and the collectible Fourth Estate edition of Wolf Hall are now my Holy Grails, if the Holy Grail was located, but just very expensive. And some books that I bought because nyrb reprinted them. If Patrick White and Saramago were reissued in hardback I would buy all of them.
WndyJW wrote: "What was your first book, Robert? Others here liked Beast, so it must just be me. I think The Wake ruined Beast for me. Good luck creating order in your shelves, Marcus. I have mine by publisher ..."
Just saw this now - It was Ricahrd Osman's Thursday Murder Club - it's ok but nothing out of the ordinary. However Clare Chambers Small Pleasures was very good and I'm now reading Mordew.
Roman Clodia wrote: "WndyJW wrote: "one loves books, one just wants to read"Yes, interesting distinction. Like you, I love books as material objects as well as for their contents - I have been known to buy a second c..."
I never buy multiple formats but I do have the tendency of giving a book away and then buying another copy because I have the urge to read it.
As for my Holy Grails, I have a signed copy first hardback edition of Mark Haddon's The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Nighttime, an Arc of Murakami's Killing Commendatore and some black editions of Galley Beggar Press Books - My copy of Mordew signed by the author.
Richard Osman is something of a national institution here The book is I think the third best selling hardback of all time. It sold 135k copies in the week before Christmas for example
Paul wrote: "I've only bought second copies of books I already own for a new translation. I have more often bought books I have read before due to:
a) needing a re-read for a trilogy say and having given awa..."
Glad to see that someone besides me joined GR to keep an "already read this even if I don't remember it" list! I've also regretted having given a book away too soon - another group is reading Golden Hill and I wanted to review parts of it only to realize I'd already given it away. Having said that, with >130 boxes of hardcover books of my father's in storage I'd still recommend giving books away rather than keeping them.
Mod
Gumble's Yard wrote: "Richard Osman is something of a national institution here The book is I think the third best selling hardback of all time. It sold 135k copies in the week before Christmas for example"
I had an inkling that he's popular because my Instagram post got quite a few likes and some comments saying I didn't 'get' the novel. I still don't think it's very good. Too much Deus ex Machina and superfluous characters.
I know about him via britpop group Suede - he's their bassist's brother. Apparently this the more left route way of knowing about him.
Its a popular novel rather than a literary one - and I think its more the bassist of Suede is his brother (he is waaaaaaaaaaaaaay more famous)
Gumble's Yard wrote: "Its a popular novel rather than a literary one - and I think its more the bassist of Suede is his brother (he is waaaaaaaaaaaaaay more famous)"Yesssss
As in Richard Osman is more famous
Gumble's Yard wrote: "As in Richard Osman is more famous"Oh - ah well - times change
Surely that's pointless if he didn't like his brother's book. (Joke lost on anyone who doesn't know who Richard Osman is)
Joke lost on me. When you say Richard Osman is very popular here, do you mean in England or your family? I hate when I buy duplicate books, I have a nice annotated illustrated The Histories of Herodotus because I bought a copy for my dad, then a few years later bought it for him again.
Now I have a list of books I have by an author I like, for instance James McBride, in my Book Wish List in my phone so I don’t stand in the bookstore trying to remember which books I already have.
I was adding Pulitzer Prize tab to books on my GR shelves and realized how many of them I have given away. I was both proud of myself and annoyed that I’d not kept them.
I love your dad’s gift idea, Emily. It’s personal and practical.
Was the US the only country to have a bloody insurrection today? I know we try to stay clear of politics, but I think this is more historical than political since nobody supports storming a building, vandalizing offices, and terrorizing elected officials, especially since police officers were injured and young woman shot and killed.The events of the last month will be read about, studied, researched for PhD thesis, movies made, and books written for decades.
WndyJW wrote: "Joke lost on me. When you say Richard Osman is very popular here, do you mean in England or your family? ."The country - his book is the biggest seller here as GY mentioned above Obama's bio, the latest Dan Brown etc.
I've barely heard of him but I think he is famous for a TV show called Pointless. You have to guess the most obscure correct answer to a question. They ask the same question to a 100 other people in a survey and the fewer other people who got the same answer the better.
I think a real example once was 'name an author who won the Booker Prize'. Hilary Mantel would be a bad answer as lots of people would guess that, Ruth Prawer Jhabvala might be a very good one. But say Philip Roth or JK Rowling would be very bad answers as they are wrong.
WndyJW wrote: "Was the US the only country to have a bloody insurrection today? I know we try to stay clear of politics, but I think this is more historical than political since nobody supports storming a buildin..."Yes, I don't unfortunately think the US can be regarded as a functioning liberal democracy at this point.
WndyJW wrote: "Was the US the only country to have a bloody insurrection today? I know we try to stay clear of politics, but I think this is more historical than political"Those pictures are indeed shocking (although a not unsurprising response to some of the incitation that has been going on).
As an aside the reason that Osman and his book is so popular (as I understand it only two fiction hardbacks - both Harry Potters - have ever sold more copies in the UK) is that he (and the book and the TV shows he has produced as well as featured in) appear to be thoroughly decent and largely apolitical. - which I think appeals to people in the current climate
As awful as yesterday’s events were, I feel proud of our Congress and Senate who for a few hours did not know if there were bombs in the building or if they would be shot, who had a traumatic afternoon, got right back to work and finished what they were there to do, which was to certify the election and at 4:30am they did. The attempted insurrection didn’t work, so I would say U.S. Democracy won the bloody, shocking day. Our Democracy stands, wounded, but it held.We don’t have to get into who is to blame or what should happen now, that is political, but that was a day for the history books and everyone I know was glued to the tv and social media all evening.
I’m surprised I’ve never heard of Richard Osman. I would think any light hearted show featuring good people, like Detectorists for example, would be very popular now.
The closest equivalent I can think of to the events this week is the 23-F incident in Spain in 1981, when soldiers entered the Congress of Deputies to disrupt the vote to elect a prime minister, and attempt a coup.That became the topic of a wonderful novel-without-fiction by Javier Cercas, The Anatomy of a Moment: Thirty-Five Minutes in History and Imagination (in Anne McLean's translation). Highly recommended - and ultimately it proved a moment of healing for Spain - so worth reading.
The book was inspired by the Borges quote (as a rendered by Cercas, in McLean's translation ): "every destiny, however long and complicated, essentially boils down to a single moment -- the moment a man knows, once and for all, who he is."
Paul wrote: "The closest equivalent I can think of to the events this week is the 23-F incident in Spain in 1981, when soldiers entered the Congress of Deputies to disrupt the vote to elect a prime minister, an..."Fujimori's 1992 autocoup also comes to mind. However, he was more competent than Trump and was able to pull it off.
For what it's worth, I don't think we are out of the woods. I've been worried for quite a while about the state of our democracy, and the events of this week only amplify my concerns.
That is an apt quote, I think. For many Republicans it seems the moment they had to admit to themselves who they had been enabling was when Trump refused to call in National Guard and refused to make a statement to diffuse the riot. A few Republicans said enough is enough after being traumatized themselves.More and more frightening details are coming out, but I won’t take any of them seriously until the dust settles and more than one news agency comes to the same conclusions. The funniest “news” story is that the Olive Garden revoked Fox’s Sean Hannity’s pasta for life card.
I have said before that I can follow the line right back to my 6x great-grandfather who fought with a Massachusetts unit in the America Revolution, stopping 4 generations on the way at the grandfather who fought with the Union in the US Civil War and I wondered what they would say if they could see the events of the last few months, the last 4 years actually, and I think they would say that it doesn’t surprise them, that Democracy is not guaranteed, it takes eternal vigilance (I think I stole that line from Thomas Jefferson,) and that when few citizens educate themselves about local, state, and national issues, study the candidates, engage with elected representatives by phone calls and letter writing, and of course exercise their right to vote, any Democracy can slide into an autocracy.
I hope lessons have been learned and things improve moving forward. A lot more young people were engaged and voted, mostly because of the gun control issue and many because of LGBTQ issues, black Americans came out in great numbers than they did in 2016 and especially in Georgia (thank you, Stacy Abrams!) which changed the majority in the Senate, and a few mothers who lost children to gun violence won Congressional seats over anti-gun control incumbents. That gives me hope.
I agree we aren’t out of the woods, Debra, but the lesson I see is that we should never feel we are out of the woods. It’s scary that a few key people could have changed everything- Attorney General Bill Barr and Senate Majority leader Mitch McConnell did a few right things at the 11th hour that stopped the election from being given to Trump, which would have meant a stolen election.
And now social media platforms have seen that all the chatter about insurrection, revolution, firing squads and other accounts fomenting violence must be taken seriously and have shut down accounts that don’t comply with their rules.
What became most apparent over the last 4 yrs is that the US Constitution is a set of laws, but a lot of how govt is conducted is dependent on norms and elected officials with ethics. Anything that depends on the honor and character of human beings is iffy. My poor 7 yr old grandson had to listen to me explain LOTR in terms of absolute power and it’s corrupting influence if the person holding power isn’t a fundamentally good person. That might be he wanted to go home earlier than usual now that I think about it.
Not sure this is the place, but I have a question about reviews. Some months ago I read a book in another language, and just recently reread it in the English translation. For some reason my review doesn't come up to "edit" on the book page (I can edit it by going and finding the original one, but if I choose to review the English version I understand I'll be creating a whole new review, when I'd rather just add a sentence or two). Does anyone know why this happens or if it's normal?
Mod
Yeah they both show 12 editions and on the English version it does say I'm reading it for the second time, I just can't see my original review.Anyway, not super important, just a bit odd.
The Mookse and the Gripes
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That's the spirit, Wendy! Wishing you a great reading year.