WoTaLong (Wheel of Time Readalong) discussion

Lord of Chaos (The Wheel of Time, #6)
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Lord of Chaos > Jun Week 4: Ch 41 - 55 Spoiler Discussion

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Jade (Bedtime Bookworm) (bedtimebookworm) | 124 comments Mod
Remember these are spoilery discussions - so stay away unless you've finished this section! Also, please keep spoilers to the things we know in this section of the book.

What are your thoughts on this section of Lord of Chaos?

I'll update this post with the chapter summaries once I've read the section! :)

Happy reading!


Scott Flicker | 107 comments Perrin - finally after 800 Pages plus the previous book returns


Scott Flicker | 107 comments Omg 15 sisters, arrogant rand captured. I’ve been waiting for another incredible ending


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Donald Trail | 34 comments Scott wrote: "Omg 15 sisters, arrogant rand captured. I’ve been waiting for another incredible ending"

I remember the battle being absolutely epic! I'm so excited to catch up to you.


Scott Flicker | 107 comments Yes the ending was Epic. The setup was long but necessary.

I guess the next book starts in August so I'll wait till then before starting book 7.


Jade (Bedtime Bookworm) (bedtimebookworm) | 124 comments Mod
I agree Scott - the set up was worth the pay off at the end! It was so brutal too!

Oh and we ARE reading book 7 in July - I was a bit late getting the posts up with the holiday. Sorry for the confusion! :)


Scott Flicker | 107 comments I’ll try and read the next one in July but I’m trying to finish a few other books first.


Antennenwels | 17 comments I'm finally done with number 6. What a gruesome battle! It was almost difficult to read when the Asha'man started killing the Shaido at the end. I have to say, I don't particularly like the Asha'man ...I know they were the reason Rand and company survived, but was there no other way to end the fight? And then Taim... there are so many hints that somethings up with him, that I'm not sure whether he's a red herring, or whether he truly is one of the foresaken, or has something to do with them, or at least has some other, ulterior motive. And how the hell did he find Rand in the first place?
On a different note, the lack of communication between all the "good" factions is so frustrating. Why couldn't Egwene travel to Rand the moment she was Amyrlin and try to make a deal instead of leaving it to the sisters that were sent there weeks ago and therefore had no clue about the newest developments. That way the Shaido or one of the foresaken (or whoever attacked the Aes Sedai in Caemlyn) could never have manipulated them to think Rand was behind it, which in the end led to his flight to and capture in Cairhien.
And if Rand hadn't behaved so secretly all the time, people might have realised a bit quicker that he disappeared, instead of assuming for days that he would be back. I thought it took them awfully long to connect the Aes Sedai having been there and then leaving with Rand's disappearance.

All in all, I very much enjoyed the 6. book and am looking forward to the next one!


Scott Flicker | 107 comments I think the fact that it took awhile to realize rand was kidnapped due to earlier secret actions was an intentional part of the story. Rand’s arrogance etc. I also think the way it was told the Rand was way ahead in time then Perrin at first. So the discovery was made after only a few days but the events happening to rand were several weeks ahead. I’m wondering how the ashamen found him but I guess since rand had really been gone several weeks maybe it’s not to hard to imagine a lot of other stuff was happening. The fact rand and ewgene don’t have some sort of deal is probably the gender conflict theme of Jordan’s world.


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David | 4 comments I'm curious about Arangar and Osangar. I say this as someone who's reading the series for the first time and not started the next book.

From the prologue I get the impression they are Forsaken who have died. Given that Arangar uses Saidin to free Moghedien and seems annoyed about her body in the prologue, I assume that means she's not Lanfear. Rahvin is implied to be lost forever because he died by Balefire (which presumably excludes Belal too). I assume it wouldn't be Asmodean, because he's referred to as a traitor. So that leaves Balthamel, Ishamael, and Aginor. I think it said somewhere that Balthamel made the trollocs, which Osangar claims, so I take it that Arangar is Ishamael or Aginor. Is my logic right?


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Donald Trail | 34 comments David wrote: "I'm curious about Arangar and Osangar. I say this as someone who's reading the series for the first time and not started the next book.
From the prologue I get the impression they are Forsaken who..."


I believe that Aginor created the Trollocs. I believe that he is Osan Gar, and I have no idea where the Dark One put him. If I remember correctly he is virtually useless in combat despite being able to hold a lot of Saidin. He was a genetic researcher who hated ethical restrictions.

I think you are correct that Balthamel is likely Halima.


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David | 4 comments Donald wrote: "David wrote: "I'm curious about Arangar and Osangar. I say this as someone who's reading the series for the first time and not started the next book.
From the prologue I get the impression they are..."


OK, thanks, that's helpful to know.


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Donald Trail | 34 comments Antennenwels wrote: "I'm finally done with number 6. What a gruesome battle! It was almost difficult to read when the Asha'man started killing the Shaido at the end. I have to say, I don't particularly like the Asha'ma..."

The way Robert Jordan writes battle scenes is not like other fantasy writers. He often skips the epic or heroic parts and draws you into the loss of people. I noticed this in the last book at the battle of Cairhein. He skipped what should have been an epic fight scene between Couladin and Matt, instead focusing on the death of many Maiden's of the Spear.

I didn't understand this when I was a kid on the first read. Jordan fought in Vietnam and this reread I can clearly see parallels between the Asha'man and advanced military technology like Napalm. I believe this battle was supposed to leave the reader queasy feeling. We are supposed to feel sad at the loss of life. To feel angry at greedy people like Sevannah and cold callous killers like Mazrim Taim.


Antennenwels | 17 comments I agree that there's hardly anything heroic in the battles in later books (at least up to 8 which I have read so far), and in general I think the novels emphasise the horror of war and also how it forces people to become the worst version of themselves. I think Perrins struggle with choosing the axe or the hammer also mirrors this. Interesting thought that this might have to do with Jordans past, but I can very well imagine it.

I would say though, that showing the horrors of war is quite common in more recent fantasy. A song of ice and fire has a very strong message that war is bad for everyone involved, and similarly the Witcher series doesn't glorify violence. I think the big difference with those "newer" stories (including WoT) is that the line between good and evil is less clear. It was easier in Lord of the Rings to have the heroes kill hordes of orks without remorse (and in a way the trollocs and shadowspawn still serve the same purpose in WoT), but it get's more nuanced and difficult when humans fight humans, with both sides convinced that they are doing the right thing, or sometimes even with people being forced to fight to survive against their will.

And yes, I think we're definitely supposed to feel angry at or repulsed by people like Sevannah and Mazrim...and it works for me.


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Aaron Anderson | 2 comments Joining this book club/read along late in the game, but the cover art of Lord of Chaos on the softback left me confused with the actual ending since it shows Rand standing over a Red Ais Sendai sister (who I thought was going to Galina as I got further along in the story) with maybe a drahgkar or perhaps a dragon flying in the sky in the background, which neither of these elements are mentioned in the ending. I guess the flying beast is just supposed to be symbolic of Rand being the Dragon Reborn? And maybe the scene portrayed of him standing over the Red Sister is supposed to be symbolic of his victory over the Tower’s embassy who tried to capture him? It would make more sense if the person wasn’t wearing a red ajah shawl/cloak but instead was portrayed as one of the Salidar embassy’s Ais Sedai since, at the very end, Rand forces them to kneel and proclaim fealty to him. But this isn’t what is portrayed on the cover! So... I don’t know! I can accept that the cover art isn’t necessarily meant to depict an exact scene from the book in every detail but instead is meant to be more symbolic, but in this case the dragon/drahgkar really throws it off I think since there’s no mention of either during the ending.

Great ending though! Really enjoyed LoC, and it leaves me wanting more.


Scott Flicker | 107 comments My impression of the cover is they grabbed a cover from an old romance novel. At least the male who I assume is Rand. The picture character looks way older than the 19 or 20 Rand is supposed to be IMHO.


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