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Discipleship > Are you a Sabbath law keeper? Really?

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message 1: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Exodus 31:14 - "Ye shall KEEP the SABBATH therefore; for IT IS HOLY unto you: EVERY ONE that defileth it SHALL SURELY BE PUT TO DEATH ..."

Observations:
* Keep the Sabbath
* It is Holy
* Put to DEATH EVERY ONE who violates the Sabbath

How is your Sabbath Keeping? Do you keep ALL the Sabbath Law... or just the parts you like ?


message 2: by Steve (new)

Steve | 113 comments Sooo... you’re Jewish?


message 3: by Steve (new)

Steve | 113 comments I’ll message you my address so you can righteously stone me...


message 4: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Steve wrote: "Sooo... you’re Jewish?"

NOPE! Perhaps you should READ what I posted.


message 5: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Steve wrote: "I’ll message you my address so you can righteously stone me..."

NO NEED! Jesus paid the penalty for sin.


message 6: by Steve (new)

Steve | 113 comments Quick question. Do you eat unclean animals?


message 7: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Steve wrote: "Quick question. Do you eat unclean animals?"

Yes and no. All things are clean by the Word and prayer...

1 Timothy 4:4-5

4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:

5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.


message 8: by Steve (new)

Steve | 113 comments Romans 14

1Accept other believers who are weak in faith, and don’t argue with them about what they think is right or wrong. 2For instance, one person believes it’s all right to eat anything. But another believer with a sensitive conscience will eat only vegetables. 3Those who feel free to eat anything must not look down on those who don’t. And those who don’t eat certain foods must not condemn those who do, for God has accepted them. 4Who are you to condemn someone else’s servants? Their own master will judge whether they stand or fall. And with the Lord’s help, they will stand and receive his approval.

5In the same way, some think one day is more holy than another day, while others think every day is alike. You should each be fully convinced that whichever day you choose is acceptable. 6Those who worship the Lord on a special day do it to honor him. Those who eat any kind of food do so to honor the Lord, since they give thanks to God before eating. And those who refuse to eat certain foods also want to please the Lord and give thanks to God. 7For we don’t live for ourselves or die for ourselves. 8If we live, it’s to honor the Lord. And if we die, it’s to honor the Lord. So whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord. 9Christ died and rose again for this very purpose—to be Lord both of the living and of the dead.


message 9: by Lauren (new)

Lauren Salisbury | 10 comments Robert, do you keep the Biblical Sabbath, then? Otherwise, I don't understand the premise of your original question.


message 10: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Lauren wrote: "Robert, do you keep the Biblical Sabbath, then? Otherwise, I don't understand the premise of your original question."

Hi Lauren,

I have interacted with many people who claimthat we MUST keep the Sabbath... yet in the same verse that they often use... it tells us that Sabbath violators must be put to death.

My point is they are hypocrites... claiming you must keep the first part of the verse... while NOT keeping the second part.


message 11: by Rod (new)

Rod Horncastle What does the New Testament say about Gentiles keeping the Sabbath?


message 12: by Steve (new)

Steve | 113 comments Zip


message 13: by Robert (last edited May 02, 2018 09:27AM) (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Rod wrote: "What does the New Testament say about Gentiles keeping the Sabbath?"

Nothing... here is the very last time in the Bible that the Greek word for Sabbath day is used...
_______________________

Colossians 2:16-17

16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day .

17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality , however, is found in Christ .
_______________________

Sabbath = SHADOW (a foreshadowing)

Jesus = THE REALITY (the fulfillment)


message 14: by Chad (new)

Chad (chadjohnson) | 62 comments Robert wrote: "Rod wrote: "What does the New Testament say about Gentiles keeping the Sabbath?"

Nothing... here is the very last time in the Bible that the Greek word for Sabbath day is used...
_________________..."


What is your point Robert? Why did you ask this question?

How is your Sabbath Keeping? Do you keep ALL the Sabbath Law... or just the parts you like ?

Do you get some satisfaction out of making a vague post about Jewish law and then calling all those who practice a day of rest hypocrites because they don't kill people who do not practice sabbath keeping?

Why use leading questions? A leading question is a question that prompts or encourages the desired answer or a type of question that implies or contains its own answer. It's a common device used in persuasion. They are rhetorical in the sense that the implied answers can be an attempt to shape or determine a response.

Based on how this thread played out, it is clear that you posted a controversial view, asked a leading question to prompt a specific response, so that you could then respond by calling people who practice rest on the sabbath hypocrites and then proceed to tell them why they are hypocrites using your interpretation of Colossians 2:16-17.

Once again Robert, I find myself in agreement with your stance on this topic, however, I find your approach unhelpful and unloving.


message 15: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Chad wrote: "Once again Robert, I find myself in agreement with your stance on this topic, however, I find your approach unhelpful and unloving__..."

Thanks for your judgmental opinion.


message 16: by Robert (last edited May 02, 2018 10:43AM) (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Below this line is "my interpretation" of Colossians 2:16-17...
_______________________

Colossians 2:16-17

16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day .

17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality , however, is found in Christ .


message 17: by Chad (new)

Chad (chadjohnson) | 62 comments Robert wrote: "Chad wrote: "Once again Robert, I find myself in agreement with your stance on this topic, however, I find your approach unhelpful and unloving__..."

Thanks for your judgmental opinion."


1 Timothy 5:20
20 As for those who persist in sin, rebuke them in the presence of all, so that the rest may stand in fear.


message 18: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Chad wrote: "1 Timothy 5:20
20 As for those who persist in sin, rebuke them in the presence of all, so that the rest may stand in fear. ..."


My response: Sorry that you think QUOTING the BIBLE is sin.
______________________

1 Corinthians 4:3 - "But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you ..."


message 19: by Chad (new)

Chad (chadjohnson) | 62 comments Robert wrote: "Chad wrote: "1 Timothy 5:20
20 As for those who persist in sin, rebuke them in the presence of all, so that the rest may stand in fear. ..."

My response: Sorry that you think QUOTING the BIBLE is..."


Do you really want to go down this road again?

Please show me where I said quoting the Bible was a sin... Your approach... your approach... your approach... your approach. How you deliver the message you are trying to deliver. The way you use words that are hurtful instead of words that are kind. They way you ask leading questions to get a specific response just so you can rebuke people. Your approach. Your approach. Your approach is what I am calling out as sinful. Let me see if I can be more clear... quoting scripture is NOT sinful. Metaphorically beating people with your Bible instead of loving them is.


message 20: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Chad wrote: "Do you really want to go down this road again?..."

My response: YOU are the one who jumped into a conversation that you had no desire to join, beyond ad hominem attacking me.


message 21: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
The topic at hand is whether those who mandate that all must keep the Sabbath, actually keep it themselves.

If this topic does not interest you... kindly refrain from joining.


message 22: by Chad (new)

Chad (chadjohnson) | 62 comments Robert wrote: "Chad wrote: "Do you really want to go down this road again?..."

My response: YOU are the one who jumped into a conversation that you had no desire to join, beyond ad hominem attacking me."


Just keeping it real Robert. You still haven't answered my original question. Why start a post with a leading question?


message 23: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Chad wrote: "Just keeping it real Robert. You still haven't answered my original question. Why start a post with a leading question? ..."

Because I take the warnings from God's Word very seriously... I always " keep it real ".

To answer your questions... here is why...
______________________

Jude 1:3-4

3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.

4 For there are certain men crept in unawares , who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men , turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ .


message 24: by Chad (new)

Chad (chadjohnson) | 62 comments Robert wrote: "The topic at hand is whether those who mandate that all must keep the Sabbath, actually keep it themselves.

If this topic does not interest you... kindly refrain from joining."


Oh... it does interest me Robert... but I'm also interested in how you started the conversation with leading questions that would trap people who observe the sabbath.

Why not just ask, "Do you keep the Sabbath? Why? I'm curious to learn why Christians today keep the Sabbath?"

I'm guessing we actually agree on the topic, which we do more often than not, no matter the topic, because we both hold the Bible in high regard. Once again, I believe your approach is hurtful and unloving and therefore sinful.

Here's my thoughts on the Sabbath...

The Sabbath was given to Israel, not the church. The Sabbath is Saturday, not Sunday, and has never been changed. But the Sabbath is part of the Old Testament Law, and Christians are free from the bondage of the Law (Galatians 4:1-26; Romans 6:14). Sabbath keeping is not required of the Christian—be it Saturday or Sunday. The first day of the week, Sunday, the Lord's Day (Revelation 1:10) celebrates the New Creation, with Christ as our resurrected Head. We are not obligated to follow the Mosaic Sabbath—resting, but are now free to follow the risen Christ—serving. The Apostle Paul said that each individual Christian should decide whether to observe a Sabbath rest, “One man considers one day more sacred than another; another man considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind” (Romans 14:5). We are to worship God every day, not just on Saturday or Sunday.


message 25: by Chad (new)

Chad (chadjohnson) | 62 comments Robert wrote: "To answer your questions... here is why... Jude 1:3-4"

Nice try... but that makes no sense. I see no justification for leading questions in that verse.


message 26: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Chad wrote: "Why not just ask, "Do you keep the Sabbath? Why? I'm curious to learn why Christians today keep the Sabbath?"..."

I already know the answer.
_________________________

Chad wrote: "Once again, I believe your approach is hurtful and unloving and therefore sinful...."

My response: This is YOUR opinion... NOT God's.


message 27: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Chad wrote: "Robert wrote: "To answer your questions... here is why... Jude 1:3-4"

Nice try... but that makes no sense. I see no justification for leading questions in that verse."


Thanks for your OPINION...

Sorry you find fault with my quoting the Word of God.


message 28: by Chad (new)

Chad (chadjohnson) | 62 comments Robert wrote: "Chad wrote: "Why not just ask, "Do you keep the Sabbath? Why? I'm curious to learn why Christians today keep the Sabbath?"..."

I already know the answer.
_________________________

Chad wrote: "Once again, I believe your approach is hurtful and unloving and therefore sinful...."

My response: This is YOUR opinion... NOT God's."


Wow... not only are you a mind reader of humans... but you also know what God's opinion is... Wow.

So... your saying God approves of your hurtful and unloving approach?


message 29: by Chad (new)

Chad (chadjohnson) | 62 comments Robert wrote: "Chad wrote: "Robert wrote: "To answer your questions... here is why... Jude 1:3-4"

Nice try... but that makes no sense. I see no justification for leading questions in that verse."

Thanks for you..."


There you go again... putting words in my mouth. I DID NOT find fault with you quoting scripture! Just trying to understand how Jude 1:3-4 has anything to do with justifying your starting a post with a leading question. Please explain.


message 30: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Chad wrote: "Wow... not only are you a mind reader of humans... but you also know what God's opinion is... Wow...."
_______________

1 Corinthians 2:16 - "For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? but we have the mind of Christ ."


message 31: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Chad wrote: "So... your saying God approves of your hurtful and unloving approach?..."

I am saying that my approach is no different than many Biblical people who were confronting damnable heresies.

Are you saying that your judgment supersedes the Bible examples?


message 32: by Chad (new)

Chad (chadjohnson) | 62 comments Robert wrote: "Chad wrote: "Wow... not only are you a mind reader of humans... but you also know what God's opinion is... Wow...."
_______________

1 Corinthians 2:16 - "For who hath known the mind of the Lord, t..."


Okay... Okay... You have proven your point. Let's just agree that use are using scripture to justify your sin.

Moving on... I posted my response to this topic in message 24... any thoughts on that?


message 33: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Chad wrote: "Okay... Okay... You have proven your point. Let's just agree that use are using scripture to justify your sin...."

NOPE! I quoted Scripture in response to YOUR opinion.


message 34: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Chad wrote: "Moving on... I posted my response to this topic in message 24... any thoughts on that? ..."

My response: Sorry, I had prepared a response but decided not to send it. In general I agree with much of what you posted in message 24.

However, I believe that Jesus is my Sabbath rest ... the day of the week was just a foreshadowing of the reality... Jesus, the fulfillment.
__________________

Colossians 2:16-17

16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day .

17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality , however, is found in Christ .


message 35: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Chad wrote: "Once again... my words fall on deaf ears....."

TRUTH - Chad's post - quote: Wow... not only are you a mind reader of humans... but you also know what God's opinion is... Wow.

TRUTH - My response - quote: 1 Corinthians 2:16 - "For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? but we have the mind of Christ ."

TRUTH - Chad's post - quote: Okay... Okay... You have proven your point. Let's just agree that use are using scripture to justify your sin.

TRUTH - My response - quote: NOPE! I quoted Scripture in response to YOUR opinion."


message 36: by Chad (new)

Chad (chadjohnson) | 62 comments Robert wrote: "Chad wrote: "Okay... Okay... You have proven your point. Let's just agree that use are using scripture to justify your sin...."

NOPE! I quoted Scripture in response to YOUR opinion."


Once again... my words fall on def ears...




message 37: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
True, nobody has time for opinions... when the Word of God is available!


message 38: by Chad (new)

Chad (chadjohnson) | 62 comments Robert wrote: "Chad wrote: "Once again... my words fall on deaf ears....."

TRUTH - Chad's post - quote: Wow... not only are you a mind reader of humans... but you also know what God's opinion is... Wow.

TRUTH ..."


Robert, as a fellow brother in Christ. I love you... but man... you make it hard. But I don't think Christ ever said loving people was going to be easy. But really, Robert, I look forward to the day when we are standing before Jesus, side by side, and no longer have to squabble over trivial matters and can spend our time worshiping the God of the Universe in His eternal kingdom!


message 39: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
If someone is interested in discussing whether those who mandate that everyone keep the Sabbath Law... yet they themselves do not keep the Sabbath Law...

Please post comments that add to the discussion thread.


message 40: by Robert (new)

Robert Dallmann (robert_dallmann) | 1794 comments Mod
Chad wrote: "and no longer have to squabble over trivial matters...."

Below is what some "Christians" believe regarding the Sabbath... do you REALLY consider this to be trivial?

(Note: this is a direct quote from one group's statement of faith.)
_____________________________

THE MARK OF THE BEAST

The religious observance of the first day of the week, known today as Sunday, is the Pagan counterfeit of seventh-day Sabbath observance. Sunday has been promoted by the papacy as a mark of her authority. When Sunday observance is enforced by United States civil law it becomes the end-time mark of the beast.


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