Goodreads Librarians Group discussion

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Book Issues > Can I resolve this myself? If so, how?

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message 1: by Steve (last edited Oct 13, 2017 10:07AM) (new)

Steve This book: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2...
is a duplicate of this book: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2...

And this book: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2...
is a duplicate of this book but with a DIFFERENT COVER: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2...
(Author name is displayed differently too???)

Thanks!


message 2: by Cassandra (last edited Oct 13, 2017 10:14AM) (new)

Cassandra (cassanj) | 4919 comments Steve wrote: "This book: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2...
is a duplicate of this book: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/249..."


Those are all valid editions; note the designation as Kindle, ebook, pbk. Cover images frequently differ between editions, or are changed as they are re-released. It appears the author's name appears differently on the various records, which is probably why they haven't been combined.

Generally, an author's name should be entered as it appears on the book cover, or as it appeared on the original published edition. Exceptions are made for middle initials and middle names, which allows for disambiguating author names.

This part of the librarian's manual on combining- https://www.goodreads.com/help/show/2...- as well as other parts of the manual may be worth your time to read.


message 3: by Steve (new)

Steve Doesn't this fall under "Different formats of the book (hardcover, paperback, audio)." which should be combined?


message 4: by Steve (new)

Steve BTW, note this attached addition: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2...


message 5: by Cassandra (new)

Cassandra (cassanj) | 4919 comments Steve wrote: "Doesn't this fall under "Different formats of the book (hardcover, paperback, audio)." which should be combined?"

Yes, it does, but in order for them to be combined they must have a common author name first.


message 6: by Steve (new)

Steve Ahhh, I see now. Thanks for the help!


message 7: by Cassandra (new)

Cassandra (cassanj) | 4919 comments Steve wrote: "Ahhh, I see now. Thanks for the help!"

Sure! I'm going to see if I can get the author names straightened out, look at the publication dates and see if I can figure out which author name should be primary so that I can combine them.


message 8: by Steve (new)

Steve I already combined them by changing the author names, combing, then changing the names back. Maybe there is a better way to do it so go for it! Thanks again :)


message 9: by Cassandra (new)

Cassandra (cassanj) | 4919 comments Steve wrote: "I already combined them by changing the author names, combing, then changing the names back. Maybe there is a better way to do it so go for it! Thanks again :)"

I will look at them, and post back here to let you know what I've done (if I've changed anything) so that you can see. At the very least, we need to look at author names on the book covers, and correct punctuation within the author name.


message 10: by lethe (last edited Oct 13, 2017 10:48AM) (new)

lethe | 13731 comments Steve wrote: "I already combined them by changing the author names, combing, then changing the names back. Maybe there is a better way to do it so go for it! Thanks again :)"

That is certainly not the right way. The primary author should always be the same on all editions, otherwise it can cause strange results in the database (f.e. the same editions showing up twice or more in an author's book list, etc.).

See https://www.goodreads.com/help/show/4...
"Different editions of a book not having the same primary author can cause quite a few distinct problems. Please keep the primary author for all editions of a work the same."


message 11: by Cassandra (last edited Oct 13, 2017 12:13PM) (new)

Cassandra (cassanj) | 4919 comments lethe wrote: "That is certainly not the right way. The primary author should always be the same on all editions, otherwise it can cause strange results in the database (f.e. the same editions showing up twice or more in an author's book list, etc.)."

Steve wrote: "I already combined them by changing the author names, combing, then changing the names back. Maybe there is a better way to do it so go for it! Thanks again :)"

lethe is correct; primary author names need to remain the same on all editions, and any author with an initial needs proper punctuation inserted. Please have a look through the librarian manual lethe linked to in message #10, it will be very helpful to you.

That said, I've cleaned up all the books, including correcting titles so they are formatted correctly per GR guidelines, and author name is entered as it appears on cover images.

https://www.goodreads.com/series/2172...


message 12: by Steve (new)

Steve You've just removed all the subtitles and additionally removed the Series Name and Book Number from the name which I spent 30 minutes doing...

I used an example such as this: https://www.goodreads.com/series/4379...


message 13: by Cassandra (last edited Oct 13, 2017 12:37PM) (new)

Cassandra (cassanj) | 4919 comments Steve wrote: "You've just removed all the subtitles and additionally removed the Series Name and Book Number from the name which I spent 30 minutes doing...

I used an example such as this: https://www.goodreads..."


My apologies. The titles are so long, and were not corrected to GR standards when you inserted the series information; I didn't notice they were there as I was correcting every single title in the series for punctuation/capitalization. I just deleted the entire title to re-enter it properly.

I believe the titles to be correct as they are now, and have added the series information back into the title field.

https://www.goodreads.com/series/2172...


message 14: by Steve (new)

Steve Still missing the subtitles part


message 15: by lethe (new)

lethe | 13731 comments Which subtitles are you referring to?


message 16: by Empress (new)

Empress (the_empress) I think he may be looking at the combine page and confusing the work title with the edition title.


message 17: by Steve (new)

Steve Well for instance the full title of "Balada: When My Eyes are Weighed with Sleep, I Quench the Evening Candle's Glow (Balada: A Symphony of Eternity #1)"(https://www.goodreads.com/book/edit/2...) should be "Balada: When My Eyes are Weighed with Sleep, I Quench the Evening Candle's Glow: When War Rages Across the Universe, Which Side Are You On? (Balada: A Symphony of Eternity #1)"

That's all been deleted now.


message 18: by lethe (new)

lethe | 13731 comments Looking at the cover, I don't think that last part is a subtitle. It looks more like a blurb.


message 19: by Cassandra (new)

Cassandra (cassanj) | 4919 comments lethe wrote: "Looking at the cover, I don't think that last part is a subtitle. It looks more like a blurb."

That's exactly what I thought.


message 20: by Steve (new)

Steve Ellie [The Empress] wrote: "I think he may be looking at the combine page and confusing the work title with the edition title."

That is definitely not the case. View the photo of the cover of the book and compare it to Amazon's entry. The full title (with subtitle) is completely removed. Perhaps someone can view a change history (I cannot) but all of this information was deleted.


message 21: by Empress (last edited Oct 13, 2017 01:14PM) (new)

Empress (the_empress) I'm sorry but you wrong. The title was edited to conform to the Goodreads standards, which is what you as a librarian should be adhering to.

The correct title for you example is Balada: When My Eyes are Weighed with Sleep, I Quench the Evening Candle's Glow (Balada: A Symphony of Eternity #1) which is exactly what it is.

Many books have short description on their covers. Those should not be added in the title field. Doing so is against GR policy.


message 22: by Cassandra (last edited Oct 13, 2017 01:16PM) (new)

Cassandra (cassanj) | 4919 comments Steve wrote: "That is definitely not the case. View the photo of the cover of the book and compare it to Amazon's entry. Perhaps someone can view a change history (I cannot) but all of this information was deleted. "

And the Amazon entry is fine for Amazon; there are different standards for Goodreads titles. A book that is listed differently on another site has no bearing on the correct way to enter it on Goodreads.

And as a librarian, you can certainly view the change log for the book.


message 23: by lethe (new)

lethe | 13731 comments Eh. Amazon is hardly the standard for cataloguing books. Do you really think the title should look like this?

BALADA: When my eyes are weighed with sleep I quench the evening candle's glow (1st book in the BALADA series): When war rages across the universe, which ... you on? (BALADA: A Symphony of Eternity)

Goodreads has its own rules and I would strongly advise you to read the Librarian Manual before doing any edits.

Also, Cassandra had said she would have a look at the books, "and post back here to let you know what I've done (if I've changed anything) so that you can see." If you then start editing anyway, you have no reason to complain that some of your edits were changed (i.e. corrected).


message 24: by [deleted user] (last edited Oct 13, 2017 01:27PM) (new)

Look at this book: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2...
Title is one word and doesn't include the additional wording. It's as it should be, not Corsair: There's a Whole New Kind of Piracy in Space!


message 25: by Steve (new)

Steve lethe wrote: "Eh. Amazon is hardly the standard for cataloguing books. Do you really think the title should look like this?

BALADA: When my eyes are weighed with sleep I quench the evening candle's glow (1st bo..."


I edited all of this BEFORE Cassandra made any changes. I asked a simple questions about merges and then everything I did was deleted.

If you look in the history, you can see the titles were set as I've suggested. For this book this would have been:
"BALADA: When My Eyes are Weighed with Sleep, I Quench the Evening Candle's Glow: When War Rages Across the Universe, Which Side Are You On? (Balada: A Symphony of Eternity #1)" which I think is correct.


message 26: by lethe (last edited Oct 13, 2017 01:29PM) (new)

lethe | 13731 comments And we tell you it is not correct. First, Balada should not be in all-caps, and second, When War Rages Across the Universe, Which Side Are You On? is not part of the subtitle.

You're a new librarian; these were complicated books to start with, with the differing author names and difficult titles and series name.


message 27: by Cassandra (last edited Oct 13, 2017 01:28PM) (new)

Cassandra (cassanj) | 4919 comments Steve wrote: "I edited all of this BEFORE Cassandra made any changes. I asked a simple questions about merges and then everything I did was deleted.

If you look in the history, you can see the titles were set as I've suggested. For this book this would have been:
"BALADA: When My Eyes are Weighed with Sleep, I Quench the Evening Candle's Glow: When War Rages Across the Universe, Which Side Are You On? (Balada: A Symphony of Eternity #1)" which I think is correct."


If you weren't sure what you were doing was correct, the proper thing to do was to ask here, which you did. We're now telling you the changes you made were not correct, and I spent a lot of time cleaning up this series (which was set up correctly).

We're trying to be helpful; I'm sorry you disagree with what we're saying, but we don't make the rules, Goodreads does.


message 28: by Steve (new)

Steve I conveniently have the e-book and emailed the author at their listed address on the last page of the book. (You can download it for free from Amazon if you wish). He said the following:

https://i.imgur.com/uOU1Xmw.png

"Both are, the second half of the first title is the front cover subtitle, but go with the second for simplicity"

So according to the author it IS the subtitle. Should it be added?


message 29: by lethe (new)

lethe | 13731 comments First, the author said to go with the second one for simplicity, and second, Goodreads has its own rules and they are not always the same as what authors have in mind.

What the author calls 'front-cover subtitle' = a blurb in my opinion. It certainly suggests it is not used on the title page.


message 30: by Cassandra (new)

Cassandra (cassanj) | 4919 comments lethe wrote: "First, the author said to go with the second one for simplicity, and second, Goodreads has its own rules and they are not always the same as what authors have in mind.

What the author calls 'front..."


I agree.


message 31: by Empress (new)

Empress (the_empress) lethe wrote: "What the author calls 'front-cover subtitle' = a blurb in my opinion. It certainly suggests it is not used on the title page. "

Me too. It's certainly is a catch-frase kind of blurb.


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