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Picture of the Day > June 2017

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message 1: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl

Saint Barbara and Another Female Saint, early 16th century
Anonymous
Oil on panel
9 3/4 x 15 1/2 in. (24.8 x 39.4 cm)
Fine Arts Museums of San Francisco


message 2: by Heather, Moderator (last edited Jun 02, 2017 05:53PM) (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Lobstergirl wrote: "Saint Barbara and Another Female Saint, early 16th century
Anonymous
Oil on panel
9 3/4 x 15 1/2 in. (24.8 x 39.4 cm)
Fine Arts Museums of San Francisco"


Interesting...did the artist not know who that other 'female saint' was? Or was he just focusing on Saint Barbara? Are there any clues, as in attributes that would identify the other saint? Which one is Saint Barbara?


message 3: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments "Saint Barbara is one of the Fourteen Holy Helpers. Her association with the lightning that killed her father has caused her to be invoked against lightning and fire; by association with explosions, she is also the patron of artillery and mining."

"The Fourteen Holy Helpers are a group of saints venerated together in Roman Catholicism because their intercession is believed to be particularly effective, especially against various diseases."

"According to legend, Saint Barbara was a young woman killed by her father Dioscorus, who was then killed by a bolt of lightning. She is the patron of architects, geologists, stonemasons and artillerymen. Because of her renown, the name came into general use in the Christian world in the Middle Ages."

"Saint Barbara is often portrayed with miniature chains and a tower."


Google


message 4: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl

Two Prostitutes, 1906
Georges Rouault (French 1871-1958)
Watercolour with pastel on paper, mounted on canvas
70 x 54.5 cm
National Gallery of Canada, Ottawa


message 5: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl Heather wrote: "did the artist not know who that other 'female saint' was? Or was he just focusing on Saint Barbara?"

The artist knew, the problem is we don't know who the artist was, and there is no accompanying information that "came" with the work. I guess art historians didn't feel like they have enough information to definitively say who the second saint is.

Saint Barbara is the one on the right, identified by the chalice/cup and host she carries, the accoutrements of communion.


message 6: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments There is more attention to the detail on the fabric than anything else in the painting. The face detail is secondary. I am a bit perturbed that the two figures have almost identical faces.


message 7: by Ruth (last edited Jun 03, 2017 06:18PM) (new)

Ruth | 1889 comments Have you noticed that artists often fall into what I call face habit? Leonardo's faces have a certain sameness, as do many others.


message 8: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments Ruth, yes, good nomer. Modigliani comes to mind immediately. I have always liked the opposite in Otto Dix´s work. I believe his work to be greatly underestimated.


message 9: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments Roualt´s work is always distinguished by the black contoriing around his forms and this one is no exception. The expression on the women´s faces is heart rending. His is a major 20th c. painter and a bit underestimated as well.


message 10: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments As for Lesser Ury´s work, I find the lighting contrast to be disconcering and I wish the darks had more detail. I suspect the artist to have depicted the scene too accurately and neglected his role as an artist to give a strong personal interpretation of "reality". The composition is interesting as is the subject matter.


message 11: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments Actually I am most intrigued by the reflections on the floor in the foreground. Am I looking at a pool of water or a highly polished floorboard? Otherwise there is a murky feeling to the piece.


message 12: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Geoffrey wrote: "There is more attention to the detail on the fabric than anything else in the painting. The face detail is secondary. I am a bit perturbed that the two figures have almost identical faces."

Interesting perspective, Geoffrey. I don't see how the two figures have almost identical faces. In what way? One is rounder and a bit chubby, the other seems to have a tall face, and their mouths are a bit different. The look on their faces seem to portray a possibility of them having the same thoughts on some unseen object. Is that what you're talking about?


message 13: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Ruth wrote: "Have you noticed that artists often fall into what I call face habit? Leonardo's faces have a certain sameness, as do many others."

I have never noticed that, Ruth. Now I want to study different works by Leonardo da Vinci just to discover what you are speaking of. Thank you for mentioning that.


message 14: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Luís wrote: "Woman at writing desk
Lesser Ury
Date: 1898

Replying to post #4"


In what way are you replying to post #4, Luis?


message 15: by Heather, Moderator (last edited Jun 04, 2017 07:16AM) (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Geoffrey wrote: "Ruth, yes, good nomer. Modigliani comes to mind immediately. I have always liked the opposite in Otto Dix´s work. I believe his work to be greatly underestimated."

Excellent, Geoffrey! Modigliani was actually the first artist to come to my mind when you mentioned faces being similar among certain artists.


message 16: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Geoffrey wrote: "Roualt´s work is always distinguished by the black contoriing around his forms and this one is no exception. The expression on the women´s faces is heart rending. His is a major 20th c. painter and a bit underestimated as well...."

I would agree with 'underestimated'. I am not a professional art scholar, but I have never even heard of him.


message 17: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Geoffrey wrote: "Actually I am most intrigued by the reflections on the floor in the foreground. Am I looking at a pool of water or a highly polished floorboard? Otherwise there is a murky feeling to the piece."

I am also intrigued by the reflections on the floor. It seems like they don't belong, or aren't really related to anything else in the painting. What their purpose is is beyond me! Does anyone have an explanation or estimation on this subject?


message 18: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments Roualt is one of those artists whose work is often included in contemporary art history books or of series of artists that art publishers include but doesn´t seem to get much recognigiton by the lay public. Now if it were Chagall, Degas, Picasso not only would lay people recognize their works but immensely enjoy them. Then when you get itnto the 20th c. giants like Andre Breton, Giorgio de Chirico, Grosz, Kirchner,Nevelson-those names usually draw blanks.


I agree Heather. The reflections don´t relate to the rest of the painting and although interesting in themselves, are misplaced. What comes immediate to mind is the wild conjecture that at that time in those circle of colleagues the artist was challenged to do reflections as that was the point of competition among his peers. I have nothing to base that on, but I can´t but wonder how many Renaissance painters texturized their models fabrics as it was the going point of artistic excellence.

Maybe LG or Ed have something to say about this. Have there been times in the history of art that artists judge their peers on the mastery of one or two artistic points?


message 19: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl In the Ury work the reflections are coming off a glass-topped table. The painter is merely painting what he sees in the room. Should he have eliminated the glass-topped table? I think that would make the picture less interesting, not more.


message 20: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl

The Sonata, 1889
Irving Ramsay Wiles (American 1861-1948)
Oil on canvas
44 1/4 x 26 in. (112.4 x 66 cm)
Fine Arts Museums of San Francisco (de Young)


message 21: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Lobstergirl wrote: "The Sonata, 1889
Irving Ramsay Wiles (American 1861-1948)
Oil on canvas
44 1/4 x 26 in. (112.4 x 66 cm)
Fine Arts Museums of San Francisco (de Young)"


I think this painting is delicately feminine. The title The Sonata quite fits the picture.


message 22: by Ying Ying (new)

Ying Ying (yingyingshi) | 75 comments Heather wrote: I think this painting is delicately feminine. The title The Sonata quite fits the picture

I agree; the topic and colors are very feminine. I like this image :-)


message 23: by Judi (new)

Judi (jvaughn) | 59 comments As I was reading down through my email I stopped at Sonata and said to myself, " Isn't that lovely." Then I checked the date when the painting was created and realized that once again I really like paintings produced from 1860 to 1930. Do most people have particular time periods that are their favorites?


message 24: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Judi wrote: "As I was reading down through my email I stopped at Sonata and said to myself, " Isn't that lovely." Then I checked the date when the painting was created and realized that once again I really like..."

That's a great question, Judi! I'm running out the door for work right this moment but while working I will be thinking of my favorite artists and figuring if the majority of them fall into a time period. I'll have to think about this one. Thank you!


message 25: by A (new)

A | 270 comments Lobstergirl wrote: "The Sonata, 1889
Irving Ramsay Wiles (American 1861-1948)
Oil on canvas
44 1/4 x 26 in. (112.4 x 66 cm)
Fine Arts Museums of San Francisco (de Young)"


Love it.


message 26: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl

Two Women (Venus and Berenice), 1929
Carel Willink (Dutch 1900-1983)
Oil on canvas
Dimensions not given
Kröller-Müller Museum, Otterlo, Netherlands


message 27: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments Judi, yes, that is a question I have asked myself as well. I know for sure that my literary interests lie in that time period, ie, 1870-1930. I love Hardy, Elliot, Cather, Wharton, Sinclair, Mann, Dostoyevsky, much more than post WWII literature. The Fauves and Blue Reiters are my favorite movements, so yes, that time period for the arts is my favorite as well. Okeefe, Hartley, Marsden, DeChiricio, Dove and early Pollock. That stretches the time period to about 1950.


message 28: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl

The Sofa, ca. 1894–96
Henri de Toulouse-Lautrec (French 1864–1901)
Oil on cardboard
24 3/4 x 31 7/8 in. (62.9 x 81 cm)
The Met Museum, NYC


message 29: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments Vivid use of pastel colors.


message 30: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments There certainly is a resemblance. The colors are ones that don´t normally dominate in an artist`s palette. The pastelly mauve with the burnt sienna foreground, hmmmm. an unusual color combination. And to see small strands of mauve sprinkled on the Robin egg´s blue of the woman in the background.


message 31: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments There is something unstated between the two women. The look on the woman`s face as she studies her companion´s demeanor gives rise to much speculation. Are they lovers? Ladies in waiting before the men arrive?


message 32: by Ruth (new)

Ruth | 1889 comments I'm sure they're prostitures. A favorite subject of Toulouse-Laurrec.


message 33: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments That´s a given. But additionally there seems to be some special rapport between the two to which the painter is alluding.


message 34: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl They're prostitutes who are lesbians. Toulouse-Lautrec initially went to brothels to sketch and paint the prostitutes, but the lighting wasn't good there and he didn't find the atmosphere conducive to what he needed so he had them come to his studio.

This was supposed to come right after "The Sonata" to show the echo of pink and blue coloring and some similarities in titling, but I got the order messed up.


message 35: by Deborah (new)

Deborah Ideiosepius | 136 comments Thank you for the 2nd of June image! I had never heard of Georges Rouault and I am fascinated by the fauvists. hello google my friend...


message 36: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments Thank you LG. That was exactly my surmise. I didn´t want to say the obvious as it would have appeared presumptuous.


message 37: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments I get called out often enough for being that.


message 38: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Lobstergirl wrote: "In the Ury work the reflections are coming off a glass-topped table. The painter is merely painting what he sees in the room. Should he have eliminated the glass-topped table? I think that would ma..."

I'm a few days late to thanking you, LG for the explanation of the reflection in the post #8 by Lesser Ury. I would never have guessed a table top but now that you ask if he should have left it out of the painting, I think not. It does add a sort of...texture in a way. The additional colors also compliment the painting as a whole.


message 39: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments wow, I need to catch up with the group! You're all awesome!


message 40: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Judi wrote: "As I was reading down through my email I stopped at Sonata and said to myself, " Isn't that lovely." Then I checked the date when the painting was created and realized that once again I really like..."

Judi I am finally getting to answer your contemplative question. I'm not as familiar with the years in which certain movements were ascribed. But I like Surrealism (1920's-1960's), Romanticism (1800's-1850's) and Fauvism (1900 - 1908) I had to Google the dates. I think those are the times in which most of my favorite artists were recognized.

I have a question: Since Fauvism was such a short time-period and my taste goes to 1908 (Fauvism) then jumps to 1920's (Surrealism), was there a different movement during those few missing years?


message 41: by Lobstergirl (last edited Jun 07, 2017 10:35PM) (new)

Lobstergirl

The Misses Muriel and Consuelo Vanderbilt, 1913
Giovanni Boldini (Italian 1842-1931)
Oil on canvas
88 1/4 x 47 1/4 (224.2 x 120 cm)
Fine Arts Museums of San Francisco

For some reason even though the same size the image is quite blurry. You can see it with far more clarity here
http://art.famsf.org/giovanni-boldini...


message 42: by Judi (new)

Judi (jvaughn) | 59 comments I really like it, and am glad that we don't have to wear that fashion style!


message 43: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Judi wrote: "I really like it, and am glad that we don't have to wear that fashion style!"

I would wear it! Beautiful painting, also.


message 44: by Judi (new)

Judi (jvaughn) | 59 comments Heather wrote: "Judi wrote: "I really like it, and am glad that we don't have to wear that fashion style!"

I would wear it! Beautiful painting, also."


Well the black dress isn't so bad...:-)


message 45: by Heather, Moderator (last edited Jun 08, 2017 07:58PM) (new)

Heather | 8272 comments I see another 'theme' in Lobstergirl's posts. It's nice that she groups and posts certain paintings that are not only interesting, but in some way they relate.

Since I have opened up the idea in the past that if anyone wants their own folder, I would create it for them and they can do as they please! Well, in this instance, I see this folder as Lobstergirl's baby. I like the way she is running it, and she really has been dedicated in the past to this folder. Though she took a break for awhile (and I was horrible at taking her place!), she's back! Thank you LG!

I want to turn this folder over to you. It's all yours!


message 46: by Geoffrey (new)

Geoffrey Aronson (geaaronson) | 930 comments Yes, there was a movement immediately prior to Surrealism, started by DiChirico. Metaphysical Painting, or as it is known in its original Italian name, Pitura Metafisica was the harbinger of Surrealism. DiChirico was admitted to Andre Breton´s circle, the latter being the high priest of the Surrealist Movement, but like so many other artists, left the group in disgust with its leader. I don´t believe DC considered himself to be a Surrealist but a Metaphysical Artist, but many in the group considered him to be one of them. Certainly his work has a strong subconscious quality to it. DC influenced a whole generation of Italian and German artists, Carra, Morandi, Pisis, Savinio, and even to some extent, Magritte and Max Ernst


message 47: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl Thanks, Heather.


message 48: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl Ruth wrote: "Have you noticed that artists often fall into what I call face habit? Leonardo's faces have a certain sameness, as do many others."

Yes, I have noticed that too.


message 49: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Judi wrote: "I really like it, and am glad that we don't have to wear that fashion style!"

Heather wrote: "I would wear it! Beautiful painting, also."

Judi wrote: "Well the black dress isn't so bad...:-)"


That's funny, Judi. I have no idea how old you are and you have no reason to announce it. But my taste can be rebellious sometimes and I like to be 'different'. And I'm 43 years old, so should know better! (okay, now everyone knows). So in this case, I prefer the blue dress and love the bands in their hair. I don't think I would even wear the black one.


message 50: by Heather, Moderator (new)

Heather | 8272 comments Lobstergirl wrote: "Thanks, Heather."

You're welcome Lobstergirl. You're doing great!


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