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World & Current Events > Trump Taking US Towards European Immigration Model

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message 1: by Michael (new)

Michael Fattorosi | 477 comments "The Trump administration is considering a plan to weed out would-be immigrants who are likely to require public assistance, as well as to deport — when possible — immigrants already living in the United States who depend on taxpayer help, according to a draft executive order obtained by The Washington Post."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/...

Schengen Visa requirements -

http://www.schengenvisainfo.com/schen...

Thoughts ?


Tara Woods Turner | 2063 comments Hypocrisy at its finest. And this from a country that doesn't even care for its wounded veterans.


message 3: by Michael (new)

Michael Fattorosi | 477 comments I think thats kinda the point. He wants to stop taking care of illegals and even those that are here legally but dependent on assistance and start redirecting those funds and benefits to Americans.


message 4: by Matthew (last edited Feb 01, 2017 09:59PM) (new)

Matthew Williams (houseofwilliams) That would assume that he is actually sincere in his approach, when it seems like he is simply signing an order because he's forced to put his money where his campaign mouth was. And those promises were a very clear appeal to xenophobia and selfishness, so why anyone would try to rationalize them is beyond me.

And it seems very obviously based on entirely prejudicial notions about immigrants, illegal and otherwise. As I argued in anther thread, the economic benefits of the 11 million illegals in the US far outweigh any drain on services. Also, illegals are hardly being "taken care of" by the US government, considering the revenue they bring and the way in which they exploited.

As for the people using services, where is the evidence they are using them disproportionately or unfairly? And what indications are there that Trump has any plan to use these services to benefit anyone?


message 5: by Michael (new)

Michael Fattorosi | 477 comments Lucky for you your PM is a more caring individual...

He's offering to take all of the US banned refugees - perhaps you can send a couple of emails and see if he will take the deported illegal aliens as well...

God Bless Canada... lol

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/t...


message 6: by Matthew (last edited Feb 01, 2017 10:55PM) (new)

Matthew Williams (houseofwilliams) Yes, lucky for us we still have a government that wasn't elected based on the promise of building a wall at our border, targeting immigrants and pulling out of every economic treaty we have in place. And we'll avoid all the repercussions currently engulfing the US, such as chaos at its airports and border crossings, visa holders being stuck abroad, visa holders dying aboard, widespread alienation with other countries, citizens being blocked or deported because of their religion, and the harm its already causing to medical services and scientific collaboration.

Here's some light reading on what this man has caused in his first week. Read through it and tell me if you still think there's any logic to it.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/...
https://www.wsj.com/articles/donald-t...
https://www.newscientist.com/article/...
https://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...


message 7: by Michael (new)

Michael Fattorosi | 477 comments I will take the US over Canada no matter who's President.

We will have Trump for 4 years, but Canada will still be Canada...


message 8: by Bernard (new)

Bernard Boley (bernard_boley) | 126 comments Michael wrote: "I will take the US over Canada no matter who's President.

We will have Trump for 4 years, but Canada will still be Canada..."


And what does that mean?


message 9: by Nik (new)

Nik Krasno | 12916 comments Guys, currently the world generally is far from being open for visiting, working and immigration. Very far. Unless there is a bilateral agreement between the countries, one usually needs visa to travel and produce various docs to substantiate financial status and purpose of visit. I remember waiting quite some time for Australian visa for example.
Immigration is also limited everywhere, usually to cases of family unions and stuff like that. There are countries offering immigration, like Canada and Australia, but they are all subject to a very meticulous criteria of age, knowledge of English, required professions and so on. Some countries 'sell' citizenship - offering to invest from few hundred K to over a million in biz or property and come claim residency/citizenship.
Working abroad legally always necessitates employment permits.

Refugees is a different story and they are supposed to be given assistance, but their turning into residents and immigrants is not a granted.

The world is not wide open to anyone to live and work wherever one wants.

Btw, fences, mining fields at frontiers is still a widespread thing...

Doesn't look like the entire thing is being reshuffled so far, but rather we are looking at more stringent procedures and rules..


message 10: by J.J. (new)

J.J. Mainor | 2093 comments It is worth noting that Canada with a population a little more than 10% of the US is a whiter nation than the US. From what I can tell (and this is from Wikipedia in case you're one that instantly discounts them as a "source) Canada is more than 80% white while the US is only 63% (or 73% including white Hispanics) and decline steadily.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demogra...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_an...

I'm sure the Canadians will dispute/correct this, but from our side of the border, we tend to hear about the divide between the French and the English as if it was as divisive as any racial disagreements we may have here in the US...Montreal's secession vote some years back didn't help this perception.


message 11: by Matthew (last edited Feb 02, 2017 08:15AM) (new)

Matthew Williams (houseofwilliams) Michael wrote: "I will take the US over Canada no matter who's President.

We will have Trump for 4 years, but Canada will still be Canada..."


"Canada will still be Canada"? Is that supposed to mean something? Or is that just your way of saying "I support America, I don't care what the facts are"? Either way, if that's actually the mentality you have, then you deserve to be in the US under Trump right now.

Of course, you're right. Trump or no Trump, Canada will still be a nation with a statistically higher standard of living, far more people living above the poverty line, and where people are twice as likely to achieve the "American Dream" than anyone in America.


message 12: by Matthew (last edited Feb 02, 2017 08:15AM) (new)

Matthew Williams (houseofwilliams) J.J. wrote: "It is worth noting that Canada with a population a little more than 10% of the US is a whiter nation than the US. From what I can tell (and this is from Wikipedia in case you're one that instantly ..."

That's Quebec cessation vote, not Montreal's. Montreal is a city, Quebec is a province (and a city, I know, confusing!)


message 13: by Bernard (last edited Feb 02, 2017 09:29AM) (new)

Bernard Boley (bernard_boley) | 126 comments J.J. wrote: "It is worth noting that Canada with a population a little more than 10% of the US is a whiter nation than the US. From what I can tell (and this is from Wikipedia in case you're one that instantly ..."

I'm from Canada and I won't challenge the census data you provided. The current situation probably didn't change that much since the 2011 reference year for Canada.

Now as to why the population is whiter, I'll try my best in explaining why,

We must remember that Canada was a British colony until 1865 and continued using it's policies in many domains, immigration being one of them. These policies were quite restricted contrary to those of the USA and expressed an open preference towards immigrants from Europe. For example, at the time of construction of the transcontinental railroad and the western Canada gold rushes, there were so many Chinese coming in that the parliament passed the Chinese Immigration Act containing an important head tax to limit their entry while giving pieces of land and material for the construction of homes to European immigrants. Similar pieces of legislation were passed to restrict immigration from India.

With the industrial revolution going in the UK since the middle of the 19th century, a serious negative impact on job creation could be observed which also helped increase the immigration rates as the Eastern Europeans fleeing tyrannic monarchs and the Irish famine also did. The combination of governmental financial aid and Canadian restricted policies resulted in many migratory waves. However, they didn't bring in as much immigrants as what we saw in the USA. Let's say that our rather cold climate didn't help either.

As for the divide between French and English, things have changed a lot during the past fifty years even if we experienced a series of violent incidents caused the radicals of the Quebec Liberation Front (FLQ) in the sixties. What caused these changes was that Quebec went through what we call the 'Quiet revolution' which also began in the sixties. Serious investments made by the government of Quebec in the education domain and in the starting of businesses by Quebeckers improved the social and economic status of French Canadians. Before that, better paid jobs were offered to anglophones most of the time. Bombardier, the French Canadian owned company, is just one of the success stories I could give you as an example of the improvement of our situation. I don't think we can say we still have this ethnic issue going on between French and English now compared to the situation that existed decades ago. The negative response to the many separation referendums held in Quebec tends to indicate that we learned to look for a better way to solve the problem.

Oh! BTW, I forgot to mention I'm a French Canadian (who spent his childhood in the USA and now live in Mexico).


message 14: by M.L. (last edited Feb 02, 2017 09:46AM) (new)

M.L. Trump doesn't like the idea of 'public assistance'? That's rich.

Trump: pays no taxes; declared bankruptcy 4 times; screws people that invest with him; settled $25M lawsuit against Trump University (oxymoron if there ever was), $5M+ ordered to pay because he would not let people cancel membership in his something or other; encouraged people to default on mortgage loan. Hmm, if it sounds like a big leech on society . . . it probably is.


message 15: by Matthew (last edited Feb 02, 2017 10:29AM) (new)

Matthew Williams (houseofwilliams) M.L. Roberts wrote: "Trump doesn't like the idea of 'public assistance'? That's rich.

Trump: pays no taxes; declared bankruptcy 4 times; screws people that invest with him; settled $25M lawsuit against Trump Universit..."


Quite right. So any speculation as to whether or not he'll take the resources saved from depriving immigrants of social assistance and use them to benefit Americans, would seem pretty baseless. Its no different than Brexit voters taking it on faith that money not paid into the EU would see those funds used to bolster social assistance, only to find out that was just a political promise.


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