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Donald J. Trump
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PUPPET MASTERS AND SECRET OATHS > Is President Trump for the common people? Or has he secretly been installed by the 1% Elite?

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message 1: by James, Group Founder (last edited Jan 29, 2017 05:15PM) (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Nobody really knows much about US President-elect Donald J. Trump despite him being a billionaire and reality TV star.

Am hoping this thread might help us decide whether he's for the common people the 99% and stands against the elite (which seems naive to me) or whether he's secretly been installed by the 1% elite. Please post what you know and have read about that may not be common knowledge.

So to get the ball rolling, here are a few underreported articles the mainstream media didn't really cover during the election...

Trump's grandfather was a pimp and tax evader; his father a member of the KKK - American Herald Tribune http://ahtribune.com/us/2016-election...

The Billionaire Pedophile Who Could Bring Down Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton -- Trump’s supporters have long wondered whether he’d use billionaire sicko Jeffrey Epstein as ammo against the Clintons—until a lurid new lawsuit accused The Donald of raping one of Epstein’s girls himself. http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles...

An Exhaustive List of the Allegations Women Have Made Against Donald Trump http://nymag.com/thecut/2016/10/all-t...

7 Things You Need To Know About Trump And Sex Slave Island http://www.dailywire.com/news/5556/7-...#

Excerpts from article here:

Pesumptive Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump has thrown everything but the kitchen sink at Hillary Clinton when it comes to her husband's escapades. "The kitchen sink," in this case, is Jeffery Epstein's “Sex Slave Island” and President Bill Clinton’s ties to it.

Why wouldn’t Trump use this ammo? The answer is simple: Trump himself has ties to Epstein, the billionaire Democratic donor and convicted pedophile known for having under-age sex slaves on his private plane and what the media calls "Sex Slave Island."

Here are seven connections between Trump and Epstein's sex slave endeavors that you need to know about:

1.Trump himself has said that Epstein is “a lot of fun to be with,” adding that he admired the sex offender's affinity for beautiful women “on the younger side.”

"I've known Jeff for fifteen years. Terrific guy,'' Trump once said about the convicted sex offender. "He's a lot of fun to be with. It is even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side. No doubt about it -- Jeffrey enjoys his social life."

2. Trump was named in Epstein’s “little black book.”

Epstein’s “little black book” was stolen by a former employee in 2004. The book, nicknamed "The Holy Grail" by the employee, revealed the name of Donald Trump and listed “14 phone numbers including emergency numbers, car numbers, and numbers to Trump's security guard and houseman.”

3. Trump has allegedly flown on Epstein’s private plane — a hot spot for under-age sex orgies.

“Mark Epstein, Jeffrey's brother, testified in 2009 that Trump flew on Jeffrey's private jet at least once,” reports VICE News. “Meanwhile, message pads [see below] from Epstein's Palm Beach mansion that were seized by investigators and obtained by VICE News indicate that Trump called Epstein twice in November of 2004.”

Epstein’s private Boeing 727, according to one of his alleged victims, Virginia Roberts, was nicknamed the “Lolita Express.” Roberts recalled “unsavoury” sex orgies on the private plane when she was just 15 years of age with Epstein and his friends.

4. Both Trump and Epstein are named as sex abusers in a case with an under-aged girl.

Radar Online reports that a woman in California, “identified” as Katie Johnson, filed a $100 million lawsuit against Trump on April 26, accusing the real estate mogul of raping her when she was just 13 years old.

Johnson “claims Trump raped her when she was 13-years-old and forced her to engage in sex acts by threatening to harm her and her family,” notes The Independent UK. “She claims the alleged abuse took place over a four-month period at underage sex parties held in New York City in 1994.” Epstein was also named for alleged sexual misconduct and threats.


Trump’s team adamantly denies the accusation, suspecting the claim is possibly a hoax since there is allegedly “no evidence” the plaintiff “actually exists.”

5. Epstein admitted to knowing Trump under oath, and curiously pled the fifth to Trump attending sex parties with underage girls.

Back in 2010, Epstein admitted to “socializing” with Trump, but when a lawyer representing an under-aged victim of Epstein’s asked if he has “ever socialized with Donald Trump in the presence of females under the age of 18,” Epstein curiously pled the Fifth. Per Vice News:

Q: Have you ever had a personal relationship with Donald Trump?
A. What do you mean by "personal relationship," sir?
Q. Have you socialized with him?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Yes?
A. Yes, sir.
Q. Have you ever socialized with Donald Trump in the presence of females under the age of 18?
A: Though I'd like to answer that question, at least today I'm going to have to assert my Fifth, Sixth, and 14th Amendment rights, sir.

6. At least one of Epstein’s underage sex victims was recruited from Trump’s Mar-a-Lago — which he frequented often.

Virginia Roberts, an alleged victim of Epstein’s, "was recruited to perform a massage for Epstein while working as a $9-per-hour locker room attendant at Mar-A-Lago.”

Roberts claims that “Epstein turned her into a ‘sex slave’ and pimped her out to various friends, including England's Prince Andrew. Over the years, the passengers on Epstein's jet, she said, included ‘a whole bunch of other girls, sometimes famous people, sometimes some politicians.'"

7. Trump was subpoenaed in 2009 for his connection to Epstein’s under-age sex slave rings. Trump has denied ever being served.

In 2009, Trump was subpoenaed in a case against Epstein concerning victim Virginia Roberts. Trump's attorney Alan Garten said that the subpoena "never happened."

"There is no debate over what happened," said one of Roberts' attorneys. "I served Mr. Trump with a subpoena for deposition in 2009. He talked to me voluntarily, and consequently we withdrew the subpoena in light of his voluntarily providing information…. I can't imagine there being any dispute of any of this."

Additionally, Garten told VICE News in January that Mr. Trump has "no relationship" with Epstein other than the Democratic donor frequenting Trump's Mar-A-Lago. "A lot of people hung out there, including Jeffrey Epstein," said Garten. "That is the only connection."

According to the evidence, however, the connections with Epstein appear to go a lot deeper than that.

Excerpts end - read full article here: http://www.dailywire.com/news/5556/7-...#


message 2: by Lance, Group Founder (new)

Lance Morcan | 1952 comments We have a group poll running on this at present.
It asks members:
Do you believe the election of President TRUMP will bring about mostly POSITIVE or NEGATIVE changes in America and around the World?

https://www.goodreads.com/poll/show/1...


message 3: by Tammy (new)

Tammy Davis (Portia2012) | 9 comments I think Trump is deplorable is what I believe. He has no empathy or compassion.


My family showed me the article about Sex Slave Island against Hillary but must not have opened it because it listed Donald Trump too.


I think he is a path to our destruction and we should be very observant on what he is doing.


message 4: by Laureen (new)

Laureen (laureenandersonswfcomau) | 477 comments I am not sorry to say I won't be reporting any "articles" about Donald Trump because, if you want to uncover coverups for example, why wasn't the question about Hillary Clinton? Regardless, I am not willing to accept possible propaganda from either side of politics.

For instance James, the article you quote listing the number of women who have made claims against Donald Trump. Why is there no previous record anywhere of these allegations until now? Quite convenient for the Hillary camp as is the assumption that the KKK raising their nasty heads and rubbing their hands together has something to do with Trump being a racist. If you want to uncover
something, why not put your spotlight on Hillary?


message 5: by James, Group Founder (last edited Nov 10, 2016 05:38PM) (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Thank you for confirming you'll be keeping your head in the sand, Laureen :)

Also, for the record, I am neither Left Wing or Right Wing, but apolitical. That's why I have spent years writing in books and posting in this group about the crimes of the Clintons, the Obamas, the Bush family, and all the other sociopaths in power.

But now the spotlight is firmly on Trump and he will be exposed like all the rest. And what you state about all the rape and sexual assault allegations by various women against Donald Trump only coming out during the election is incorrect - many of these allegations have been swirling around Trump for many years or even decades (just as they have around Bill Clinton as well). But it's called "underground knowledge" and not known to the general public...Like many things it seems...

"At the length, the truth will out." -Shakespeare


message 6: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments History Tells Us What Will Happen Next With Brexit And Trump http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tobias-...?


message 7: by Lisa (new)

Lisa Norris | 485 comments James wrote: "History Tells Us What Will Happen Next With Brexit And Trump http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tobias-...?"

...what that article said...


message 8: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Lisa wrote: "...what that article said..." ..."

You're worried, Lisa?


message 9: by Laureen (last edited Nov 11, 2016 01:36AM) (new)

Laureen (laureenandersonswfcomau) | 477 comments James wrote: "Thank you for confirming you'll be keeping your head in the sand, Laureen :)

Also, for the record, I am neither Left Wing or Right Wing, but apolitical. That's why I have spent years writing in b..."


The best thing about your reply was the Shakespearean quote. One of my favourites. Actually, I don't think you are as Apolitical as you protest.

I watched an interview with Milo tonight (can't spell his surname) but most people know him. He is a conservative gay guy, very handsome and articulate and what he was saying was exactly what I believe.

The Trumph phenomenon didn't happen by accident. The people who voted for him wanted a change in PC and Washington. Milo says the we have been subjected to identity politics and he doesn't like people being put in little separate boxes. Skin tone boxes, gay boxes, white elite boxes, cultural boxes, native boxes, women boxes, criminal boxes, mental boxes and the list goes on.

Every person, whatever their "box" has a right to a personal opinion without being subjected to ridicule. That is democracy. Everyone's vote is worth anybody else's vote. The people voted for Trump. Suck it up, I say.


message 10: by James, Group Founder (last edited Nov 11, 2016 06:33AM) (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Laureen wrote: "Actually, I don't think you are as Apolitical as you protest... I watched an interview with Milo tonight (can't spell his surname) but most people know him... Milo says the we have been subjected to identity politics and he doesn't like people being put in little separate boxes.... Every person, whatever their "box" has a right to a personal opinion without being subjected to ridicule. That is democracy. Everyone's vote is worth anybody else's vote. The people voted for Trump. Suck it up, I say.
..."


Given I have voted only once in my life (at 18 years old when I was naive) and positively refuse to support the modern political paradigm I believe is elitist and rigged in every way against the common people, given I won't vote for anyone not worth voting for, given I spend equal amounts of time criticizing extreme Left and Far Right politicians, given I have written in my own books that ultra Left (e.g. Communism) and Far Right (e.g. Fascism) amount to the exact same thing, I would think I'm about as apolitical as one can be.

But keep in mind apolitical does not mean politically unaware or unconcerned about social issues our society faces.

The person you refer to as Milo, and say you resonated with his viewpoints expressed in the interview you saw, is one Milo Yiannopoulos a notorious racist and attacker of various minority groups in the UK (despite being gay himself).

Check out this article headlined Call the 'Alt-Right' Movement What It Is: Racist as Hell --http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/...

This article mentions "Milo Yiannopoulos – the same Milo who, in a review of the new Ghostbusters movie, launched an all-out misogynoir attack on actor Leslie Jones that resulted in her being so viciously harassed by Milo and his 750,000 followers that Twitter banned him from the service for life."

I agree with your comment that everyone has the right to personal opinion - but not the part where you say "without being subject to ridicule".

When racism, fascism and other forms of hate politics are on the rise again, when these ideologies have a very clear association with violent crimes and genocides, I would say ridicule of certain people's ill-informed beliefs, especially when utilized by comedians and especially when combined with historical fact, is one of the most powerful ways to make an example of the ill-informed who often inadvertently support ideologies they don't fully understand.

I replied that you have your head buried in the sand after you confirmed you will not be reading any articles that mention all the long-term allegations of rape, sexual assault and other crimes against Trump. I believe that is burying your head in the sand, not because I said those allegations are definitely all true, but that if you're prepared to read up about the various crimes and allegations against Left Wing politicians such as the Clintons and Obama (which I and many others in this group have repeatedly exposed), then it is revealing a personal bias that you are not even prepared to entertain potential crimes of Trump.

I have befriended several Holocaust survivors and they have all expressed major concerns about Trump and also about the swing to borderline fascist politics in the UK and Europe. Holocaust survivors, of course, are wiser than most of us having endured the worst case scenarios of where certain political systems lead to...So I tend to listen to such survivors carefully...

Here's a book I'm planning to read. Written in 1980 by a US professor, it was hardly read at the time but now quite a few are suddenly picking it up again...

Friendly Fascism: The New Face of Power in America

Friendly Fascism The New Face of Power in America by Bertram M. Gross

Maybe that book might explain the position we are in now...


message 11: by Lisa (new)

Lisa Norris | 485 comments James wrote: "Lisa wrote: "...what that article said..." ..."

You're worried, Lisa?"


Nah...I mean, what harm can he possibly do? I know people are worried about him sitting next to the nuclear button, but as long as it's not shaped like a ..... we should be OK.


message 12: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Lisa wrote: "Nah...I mean, what harm can he possibly do? I know people are worried about him sitting next to the nuclear button, but as long as it's not shaped like a ..... we should be OK. ..."

Okay good, so you mean as long as The Donald doesn't mistake that button for something else and gets so excited he reverts back to his old mantra "grab 'em by the _____" we can avoid nuclear war?

Well that's good to know!

Then again, what if he reverts back to his factory settings from his Apprentice days and screams out "you're fired!!!!" and those monitoring the nuclear arsenal misunderstand his comment? :)


message 13: by Lisa (new)

Lisa Norris | 485 comments James wrote: "Lisa wrote: "Nah...I mean, what harm can he possibly do? I know people are worried about him sitting next to the nuclear button, but as long as it's not shaped like a ..... we should be OK. ..."

O..."


This is why I'm building an underground bunker in my backyard.....I'm counting on him nuking himself along with everyone else.....I'll select a few chosen ones to join me in the bunker and ones he's fucked up and nuked everyone, I can rule the planet in peace ;)


message 14: by Lisa (new)

Lisa Norris | 485 comments All joking aside...last night I happened to turn the TV on and they were showing Trump with Obama after the debriefing....Obama looked very serious and composed, but when I saw Trump's composure (body language and facial expressions), I became instantly worried...he appeared to me to realize that he was way over his head....there was nothing cocky, confident or narcissistic about his demeanor. He looked genuinely clueless......and the people he has chosen to surround himself with, worry me even more. They basically stand for everything I'm against.......

Republicans have pretty much cleaned the house for democrats.

Oh and the wall....It has to be built...it's something he promised the American people....he has no choice....and so the bigotry was reborn....


message 15: by Jim (new)

Jim (jimliedeka) | 555 comments Laureen wrote: "Every person, whatever their "box" has a right to a personal opinion without being subjected to ridicule."

I agree with the first part of this statement but disagree with the second. Ridicule is free speech and we all merit it at one time or another.


message 16: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments How you feelin' Jim, now your nation has become Trumpland?
I thought you predicted this could never actually happen?
I pretty much thought the same...


message 17: by Laureen (last edited Nov 11, 2016 06:13PM) (new)

Laureen (laureenandersonswfcomau) | 477 comments James wrote: "Laureen wrote: "Actually, I don't think you are as Apolitical as you protest... I watched an interview with Milo tonight (can't spell his surname) but most people know him... Milo says the we have ..."

OK thanks James. What I meant by "ridicule" was hate speech. I don't like what is happening in the US because Trump won. It is sickening that we have to put up with anarchy because the side you believe in didn't win. It is the slide downhill from true democracy that I don't like. I am biased only in the fact that both Socialism and Fascism do not follow any of the rules of democracy.

However, I don't wish to have a bun fight with you James. I support Conservatism over left wing politics and the new progressives because they have a particular barrow to push which is that we must agree with ALL of their proposals or else we are labelled "Regressive" and laughed at. I don't call this free thinking - I call it group think. I am a great believer in free speech but only if it is completely "free" speech and not some happy bonding with a group of like thinks.

Regarding Milo - I concede, I know nothing about him but I liked what he was saying during the interview I saw. I am happy to bow to your greater knowledge on that one.


message 18: by Jim (new)

Jim (jimliedeka) | 555 comments I was in shock when I looked at the news Wednesday morning. I really couldn't believe so many of my fellow Americans could condone all that blatant racism, sexism, etc. by actually electing him.

Now that it's had time to sink in, I realize that we will probably survive this like we survived W. Unless he unilaterally decides to nuke Iran or something, then we're all fucked.

The worst part of this is probably what happens to our supreme court. Even with Republican control of congress, Trump is not going to be able to eradicate the ACA or the right for people to marry whom they want. While some on the left are still in the whining and crying phase, the grownups are already organizing and girding their loins.


message 19: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Thanks for sharing those observations, Jim.
It does seem hard to gauge how dangerous this situation is for the world.
My gut tells me it's a pretty volatile situ, but admittedly it's just a feeling...


message 20: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Let the fascism begin...

Donald Trump May Select an Architect of Bush’s Torture Program to Run CIA https://theintercept.com/2016/11/11/t...

Article excerpt:

"Donald Trump may select Jose Rodriguez, one of the primary architects of the George W. Bush torture program, to run the Central Intelligence Agency, according to a law firm with close ties to Trump.

"Rodriguez, the former director of the National Clandestine Service, helped developed the CIA black sites, secret prisons operated in foreign countries where interrogators used a range of torture tactics, including the use of “waterboarding,” the simulated drowning technique once used by the Khmer Rouge and Nazi agents to glean information from detainees."


message 21: by David (new)

David Elkin | 452 comments I am not sure I would have worded it this way but he does have a checkered past:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jose_Ro...


message 22: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Nice to see the first British politician Trump has met since winning the election is none other than Far, Far, Farrrr Right racist scumbag Nigel Farage of UKIP infamy...

Let the fascism continue :)

Donald Trump’s Meeting with Nigel Farage Leaves Britain’s Leaders Red-Faced http://time.com/4569416/donald-trump-...

Excerpt:
"The meeting also raises questions about which other foreign politicians might be welcomed into the Trump White House ahead of their elected leaders. Trump’s election was welcomed warmly by populist leaders across the Continent, including the French leader of the National Front, Marine Le Pen, who is seeking the country’s presidency next year."


message 23: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Another few books that might be worth reading on Trumperica:

Understanding the F-Word: American Fascism and the Politics of Illusion

Understanding the F-Word American Fascism and the Politics of Illusion by David McGowan

Right-Wing Populism in America: Too Close for Comfort

Right-Wing Populism in America Too Close for Comfort by Chip Berlet

The synopsis of Right-Wing Populism in America mentions "the potent combination of anti-elitist rhetoric, conspiracy theories, and ethnic scapegoating that has fueled many political movements from the colonial period to the present day."

The present day including and especially November 8, 2016, me thinks...


message 24: by David (last edited Nov 15, 2016 08:30AM) (new)

David Elkin | 452 comments All I can think of is good old Willy Shakespeare.

Tomorrow, and tomorrow, and tomorrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day
To the last syllable of recorded time,
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
Life’s but a walking shadow, a poor player
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage
And then is heard no more. It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.


message 25: by Jim (new)

Jim (jimliedeka) | 555 comments Check out the first minute of this, Bill Hicks explains the US presidency.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ytv15...


message 26: by David (new)

David Elkin | 452 comments a little raw but funny


message 27: by Tony (new)

Tony Sunderland | 215 comments Another mushroom conspiracy? The ghost of Jungian synchronicity is following me every where. Thanks for the link Jim...


message 28: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments No, Trump, We Can’t Just Get Along http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/23/opi...


message 29: by David (new)

David Elkin | 452 comments time to start caring a sign saying "The end is near"?


message 30: by Buddhahacker (new)

Buddhahacker James wrote: "Nobody really knows much about US President-elect Donald J. Trump despite him being a billionaire and reality TV star.

Am hoping this thread might help us decide whether he's for the ..."


Well I guess I am going to drop from this group. It's ashame that partisan politics with its distorted lies and innuendos has even invaded here. Good bye.


message 31: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Buddhahacker wrote: "Well I guess I am going to drop from this group. It's ashame that partisan politics with its distorted lies and innuendos has even invaded here. Good bye...."

Buddhahacker obviously didn't see all the discussion threads criticizing and divulging all the crimes of Obama, Hillary, Bill and other Democrats/Liberals. Or maybe Buddha believes Trump is the savior :)

Non-partisan is the only way to go.


message 32: by Peter (new)

Peter Mcloughlin Trump is neither. He didn't get the popular vote, in fact, he is down by two million against Clinton. He is not a puppet, he is a corrupt populist demagogue who managed to pull off getting at the levers of power to our detriment. Reading a lot about the Weimar Republic I have been thinking a lot about how republics end. I think Donald Trump is a harbinger of the death of our republic.


message 33: by Lee (new)

Lee | 26 comments I'm struggling to see how a struggling blue collar or low wage worker would find that a billionaire businessman would care or have any understanding of the difficulties they face.


message 34: by James, Group Founder (last edited Nov 27, 2016 05:27AM) (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Lee wrote: "I'm struggling to see how a struggling blue collar or low wage worker would find that a billionaire businessman would care or have any understanding of the difficulties they face."

Ditto.
But not to say a billionaire couldn't have such concerns for the masses. However, Trump has no track record as a humanitarian or a supporter of society's underdogs.
I sense belief in Trump is more due to the fact that our standards have become so low... voters have become so desperate they'd believe in any old fool in lieu of an honorable politician.


message 35: by David (new)

David Elkin | 452 comments James-couldn't agree more. Great quote from Lincoln:

“Elections belong to the people. It's their decision. If they decide to turn their back on the fire and burn their behinds, then they will just have to sit on their blisters.”
― Abraham Lincoln


message 36: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Those blisters might be pretty painful when we all have to suffer thru the upcoming Trump administration, mate...


message 37: by Jim (new)

Jim (jimliedeka) | 555 comments People in red states are already worrying about losing Medicare benefits. I have to wonder what they thought they were voting for.


message 38: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Build that wall! Build that wall! Build that wall! :)


message 39: by Tony (new)

Tony Sunderland | 215 comments I think we may be looking at this from the wrong angle, The American people have treasured one thing above all others about their country - Freedom. A dynasty of Bushes and Clintons may not have been in any way acceptable to the heart land. No one else to vote for and the free world gets Trump as its leader.

The Democratic party should be held accountable for putting her as their preferred candidate. At least many republicans are openly against Trump. All we hear from the elitist left is how the world has gone to crap. What next, Michelle Obama as the next candidate because she has experience ? Hail Caesar !


message 40: by David (new)

David Elkin | 452 comments Julius led to Augustus Tony - let's be careful out there


message 41: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments A US-based Holocaust survivor sent me this which I think interrelates:

Recent months have seen a surge in explicit and self-congratulatory racism, xenophobia and hate speech -- including blatant anti-Semitism, as well as attacks on Hispanics, Muslims, African-Americans, women, the LGBTQ community, and other targeted groups. Journalists, too, have been threatened. Places of worship have been defaced with graffiti intended to intimidate and arouse fear. White supremacist groups have become emboldened.

As Holocaust survivors, scholars, educators and institutions, we are alarmed by these trends. History teaches us that intolerance, unchecked, can lead to the erosion of democracy and human rights. We denounce racism and the politics of fear that supports it. We stand in solidarity with all vulnerable groups. As Elie Wiesel declared, “I swore never to be silent whenever and wherever human beings endure suffering and humiliation. We must always take sides.”

Therefore, we call upon all government officials as well as all civic and religious leaders to forcefully and explicitly condemn the rise in hate speech and any other attacks on our democratic principles.

We also call upon journalists to refuse to provide a platform for hateful groups and thus normalize their agenda. And we applaud the majority of journalists who have continued to pursue their profession with distinction, despite the abuse that many of them have endured.

Finally, we call upon every citizen to be vigilant, to not be afraid, and to speak out!


message 42: by Peter (last edited Nov 28, 2016 09:28AM) (new)

Peter Mcloughlin James wrote: "A US-based Holocaust survivor sent me this which I think interrelates:

Recent months have seen a surge in explicit and self-congratulatory racism, xenophobia and hate speech -- including blatant a..."


Unfortunately, the Republicans in the government either tacitly agree with those racist sentiments or don't care to challenge people in their constituency with those sentiments. Any kind of resistance to this onslaught will have to come from people and parties (democrats) that are currently out of power. This is gonna be a rough few years ahead for good people.


message 43: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments But I just don't understand how this can be happening, Peter...It defies all logic and feels like we just time travelled back to the mid-20th Century...

We as a society, seem to have transcended these views decades ago by and large...And so some groups were really so desperate to get into power they would actually partner with fascists and neo-Nazis who stand against their own values and beliefs?? They partnered with the devil (so to speak) and now these modern-day fascists are involved in the power structure to a degree?

Or do you think such hatred toward minorities was a much more mainstream aspect to the masses than any of us realized? And that it was merely suppressed for decades but never actually was erased in the masses? And so now that aspects of the media and certain politicians are blaming various non-white or minority groups again, the masses are revealing their true thoughts again?

I mean seriously...what the hell is going on??????


message 44: by David (new)

David Elkin | 452 comments I believe that the phrase "It could never happen here" has lulled the US voters into believing the following:

A. It can't be really that bad
B. I don't need to vote
C. Don't make waves-it can't happen here
D. Somebody will fix it
E. Maybe it won't be so bad
F. Sometimes you need change - no matter what

Sadly, I feel we have gotten so complacent that the bread and circus plans of the Romans are working on us. In the US, it was holiday shopping that got the news.


message 45: by Jim (new)

Jim (jimliedeka) | 555 comments For a long time, racist views were not expressed publicly. I don't think that means racism didn't exist. As a white person, I have been in the position to hear racist remarks. Mostly I would hear them in blue collar settings. People with those views had the good taste to only express them when they thought like minded people were around.

Now that the Republicans, and Trump in particular, have normalized that sort of speech, we are hearing a lot more of it. I still believe that virulent racism is on it's way out. In a few decades, white people will be the biggest minority in the US but will probably hang on to a disproportionate amount of power for a while. Eventually that will change, too. I think we are witnessing the last hurrah of this sort of stuff.


message 46: by Peter (new)

Peter Mcloughlin I think honestly that liberal democracy needs a civic mindedness that we have lost. When that happens such places devolve into thuggish authoritarian regimes. It has been a growing rot in our system and a polarization mostly on the right since Nixon's southern strategy was the modus operandi of the republicans since the 70s. This may be the fate of all republics. I heard somewhere that not one republic has lasted as long as three hundred years. The civic-mindedness and shared values needed degenerate over time.


message 47: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments Peter wrote: " This may be the fate of all republics. I heard somewhere that not one republic has lasted as long as three hundred years. The civic-mindedness and shared values needed degenerate over time. ..."

But surely this can't be the end??
(People probably said that as Rome was crumbling!)


message 48: by James, Group Founder (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments David wrote: "A. It can't be really that bad
B. I don't need to vote
C. Don't make waves-it can't happen here
D. Somebody will fix it
E. Maybe it won't be so bad
F. Sometimes you need change - no matter what..."


Great list of reasons, Dave.
I believe especially F...seems like most despise Trump but just reasoned that "any form of change is better than nothing"...


message 49: by James, Group Founder (last edited Dec 01, 2016 11:11PM) (new)

James Morcan | 7197 comments I just had to run this article as it's cautionary, yet nuanced and realistic in my opinion

Should we even go there? Historians on comparing fascism to Trumpism https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2...


message 50: by David (new)

David Elkin | 452 comments Great article and great find James. Read what Churchill had to say in 1935.


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