The Readers Review: Literature from 1714 to 1910 discussion
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The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn
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The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn - Ch 1 - 10
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Rosemarie wrote: "Persons attempting to find a motive in this narrative will be prosecuted; persons attempting to find a moral in it will be banished; persons attempting to find a plot in it will be shot.."That certainly puts a damper on any possibility of a serious discussion of the book!
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Rosemarie wrote: "We will just have to take our chances, won't we?"Point and counterpoint, or whatever the appropriate fencing terms are! [g}
Rosemarie wrote: "Persons attempting to find a motive in this narrative will be prosecuted; persons attempting to find a moral in it will be banished; persons attempting to find a plot in it will be shot."We just can't help seeing patterns, can we? Even were there aren't any. So this is hopeless advice, for readers. Some writers however might profit by putting it over their desks ...
There is also an interesting progression in the quote: a moral is worse than a motive, but looking for a plot calls for the ultimate punishment. For me it's not the order that would come intuitively.
It's interesting too that the worst punishment is aimed at the literary critic.
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To me, the notice seems to mean to just enjoy the book as it unfolds. We can certainly think about what we are reading, of course.
I ask myself why the author put the notice there-before the actual book begins.
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Edit: I saw on another site that the book was banned in earlier years because of how rebellious Huck is. I suppose parents/teachers didn't exactly want to idealize Huck's life on the run.
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Another one: http://www.nytimes.com/1995/07/25/nyr...
Long quote from the second article:
"In response to Mrs. Giordano's plea for help, David Bradley, a black writer and English professor at Temple University, said: "This book is a problem. It is a dangerous thing. It is a bomb. And you don't want someone disarming a bomb who is not comfortable in that situation."
Still, Mr. Bradley, the day's featured speaker and a staunch admirer of "Huckleberry Finn," urged teachers not to recoil from the challenge of teaching the book and said that it was a pivotal work from which all black and white American literature followed, a notion that some literary critics might contest.
Speaking to a predominantly white audience, Mr. Bradley's address was something of a pep talk, encouraging the educators not to be intimidated by the "n-word."
"The word is nigger," he said. "It is spelled N-I-G-G-E-R. In these days, it can be a horrible fighting word in the wrong mouth and with the wrong inflection."
"It is important to recognize that in 1885, it did not mean the same thing," he added. "What was Twain supposed to do, call them African-Americans?"
But how does one teach it?
"It has to be taught in context," he said. "It's dangerous if it's not taught in context.""
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Mark Twain’s tongue spent so much time in his cheek that I am wondering: Did he perhaps intend to get readers thinking about motive, moral, and plot right at the start? Once you’re told not to think about something, it’s hard to stop thinking about it.On the other hand, maybe he simply realized that he was stepping on what the modern cliché calls the third rail of American politics and was feeling a little apprehensive about doing that.
Abigail wrote: "On the other hand, maybe he simply realized that he was stepping on what the modern cliché calls the third rail of American politics and was feeling a little apprehensive about doing that...."I have usually read those lines as a bit of preemptive self-defense, a bit of pleading the Fifth Amendment even before accused! But I like your thoughts in your first paragraph, Abigail. Especially if one entangles them with Wendel's comments @5 on the escalation of seriousness -- which order did Twain really intend?
Rosemarie wrote: "This book has been on banned book lists in the past. Is there anything in the first ten chapters that might explain the reason the book was banned?"I just started the book, so I am only 4 chapters into the book, but I really doubt the word "nigger" is the only cause for a negative reaction against the book. Because of the use of dialect any other word might sound artificial for the time and situation. What I do see are offensive statements, one after another against established conventions and beliefs.
He tries to soften the offences or justify himself by claiming to stretch the truth a bit at the beginning of chapter 1. He also make the claim that people have a tendency to reject what they do not understand, using the widow's example of using snuff, but frowning on smoking.
One of the early offences are Huck's reaction to hell and heaven. Huck prefers hell to heaven!
There is a lot of superstition in these chapters. They seem to rule Huck Finn's life. The same can be said about the slave Jim.
The band of robbers that the boys formed and sealed by a oath is hardly the example parents would want for their children.
The widow has set out to civilize Huck Finn, and part of that includes learning to pray. Huck Finn reports back that it is not working.
Mark Twain is telling this in an amusing way, but underneath, there is also a scorn, which readers could not fail to pick up on.
Rosemarie wrote: "Persons attempting to find a motive in this narrative will be prosecuted; persons attempting to find a moral in it will be banished; persons attempting to find a plot in it will be shot."This statement makes me want to know what Mark Twain's world view is! All writing has a purpose or at least I hope so, so now I am going to be on the lookout for what Mark Twain so explicitly forbids.
Lori wrote: "I suppose it's been banned/censored in recent years because of the n-word. There has been discussion as to whether or not it is appropriate for children/teens to read the book because of that. "That, certainly. But also, I think, because of -- well, there may be some mild spoilers in making other points, so I won't here, but there are, I think, other things that have made the book unacceptable to adults and parents over the years (and what is found objectionable also changes over the years -- the n word wasn't an issue early on, other issues were, but today it's probably the most significant objection.
I hesitate to say this, because I may be inviting what I celebrate the absence of, but I'm glad that Goodreads doesn't impose trigger warnings on any of the books under discussion on the site. Some -- perhaps many -- of the books discussed on GR do generate trigger warnings when they're included in the curricula of some colleges or universities. Huck Finn is certainly one such.
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Rosemarie wrote: "Brit, you brought up Jim's belief in superstition and Twain exaggerates Jim's belief in them in the early chapters. But one of Jim's sayings proves to be very useful once both are on the island. Wh..."Among the "silly" superstitions there are also observations that are presented in the story as superstitions or signs. For example, birds flying low is an indication of rain. As we saw rain did come.
Another interesting and I think useful superstition is the one about hairy arms and chest promising riches. It's usefulness lay in the hope it gives through poverty.
The superstition I think you Rosemary was thinking of is the one about the rattlesnake and the danger of touching. Also, Jim was of the conviction that the mate would come encircling it's dead mate, so Huck Finn placing the killed rattlesnake at the end of Jim's bed was no joke. The mate came and bit Jim. Fortunately, Jim knew how to deal with the bite and the venom. I think Huck Finn may have learned a lesson.
Rosemarie wrote: "And--why did Huck and Jim run away?"We know Huck Finn ran away from his father and the enslavement he endured with him. This entailed danger of starving to death if the father was gone too many days and regular beatings. Huck Finn does not seem to mind going with little, but freedom meant all to him. He bristles at loosing freedom by both his father and the widdow.
From Jim's explanation of why he ran away, it seems to be possibility of being sold down the river to (New) Orleans. Evidentially, Jim knew he was ok with his present owner, but not with the unknown of new masters.
I find Huck Finn's reaction to the run-away Jim interesting. He seems to accept slavery as the status quo and do not question it. He does not really want to be associated with abolitionists because of what it will do to his social status and reputation! But he accepts Jim as a friend and is not going to betray him, no matter what.
It also seems that Huck Finn does not use the word "nigger" when talking about or to Jim. I have not carefully checked, so I may be mistaken, but it seems he is Jim to Huck Finn.
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Regarding the "objectionable language," as we say in school, it's a teachable moment. It's a way to bring in the history of the time period. Plus, I always tells my students that if we ban every book that has something objectionable in it, we wouldn't have many books left to read from time periods before the year 2000. And even some after the year 2000. So, I really stress when we have these type of issues, to learn from it and then move on to the other themes/parts of the novel.I haven't read Huck Finn in so long, but between Tom Sawyer and Huck Finn, Tom Sawyer was my favorite book. But in reading Huck Finn now, I find that I really like his character. Such blunt honesty - the good, the bad, the ugly, he just says what he thinks.
And while I'm always someone who believes in schooling (I'm smiling as I write this), I like that he values his freedom so much. I wonder if the human race would be better off if there were more people like Huck who enjoyed the simple things in life rather than constantly striving for more. Maybe not. We need to evolve and progress and try at least to make the world a better place and understand the world. But Huck's idea of freedom has an appealing side.
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I agree with your views on teachable moments in the classroom and in the family. Young people are exposed to much more questionable languages and extreme opinions whenever they watch TV, use social media and in their day to day life.
It is important to discuss controversial issues and read controversial books.
After 10 chapters, I am really enjoying the book, which I have never read before.
Mark Twain begins his novel with the above notice. What does this tell us about the book we are going to start reading?
In the first ten chapters we meet many characters: Huck, Tom, the widow Douglas, Miss Watson, Huck's father, and Jim.
What are some of the differences between Tom and Huck?
Here is a quote from chapter 3, regarding the Widow Douglas and Miss Watson:
I judged I could see that there was two Providences, and a poor chap would stand considerable show with the widow's Providence, but if Miss Watson's got him there warn't no help for him anymore.
How is this relevant to Huck's situation?
How would you describe Huck's relationship with his father?
We meet Jim very early on in the book. How is he portrayed at the beginning of the book? Does the depiction of his character change in the first ten chapters?
This book has been on banned book lists in the past. Is there anything in the first ten chapters that might explain the reason the book was banned?