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Group Reads > War of the Roses: Stormbird

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message 1: by Portia, Novice Mod (new)

Portia | 264 comments Mod
Hi, everyone,

Here is the discussion thread or our book for July, War of the Roses: Stormbird.

Enjoy!


message 2: by Silvia (new)

Silvia | 26 comments Well, Derry Brewer's personality looks pretty interesting to me.


message 3: by happy (new)

happy (happyone) | 142 comments Derry is one of my favorite characters in the book.


message 4: by Portia, Novice Mod (last edited Jul 02, 2016 10:24AM) (new)

Portia | 264 comments Mod
Who is your least favorite? And why? I always like to know that.


message 5: by Ashwise (new)

Ashwise | 12 comments Richard of York. he's so arrogant!


message 6: by Silvia (new)

Silvia | 26 comments Ashwise wrote: "Richard of York. he's so arrogant!"

I agree!


message 7: by Ashwise (new)

Ashwise | 12 comments What is your opinion on how the book starts out with Edward's death?


message 8: by RJay (new)

RJay (plantagenetjunkie) | 100 comments Mod
Portia wrote: "Hi, everyone,

Here is the discussion thread or our book for July, War of the Roses: Stormbird.

Enjoy!"


I'm listening to the book on CD and the voice for Derry is lower-class than that of Suffolk and York. I agree, he's an interesting character ... and by his "roots" I wonder how he became so "close" to Henry VI. Thoughts anyone?


message 9: by RJay (new)

RJay (plantagenetjunkie) | 100 comments Mod
Portia wrote: "Who is your least favorite? And why? I always like to know that."

Much to my surprise, I'm enjoying the portrayal of young Margaret. I didn't know much about how her family or how she was positioned to become queen. Anjou was originally part of Henry II's holdings from his father Geoffrey and where the term Angevins was derived. But that aside, we see Margaret as bullied by her brothers, naive, and experiencing the wider world for the first time. Her delight in those experiences creates empathy for her character in this book, for me. Thoughts anyone?


message 10: by Laurel (new)

Laurel Bradshaw (llawryf) | 2 comments Yes, I liked Margaret, too. Would like to read more about her.


message 11: by happy (new)

happy (happyone) | 142 comments IMO, she is one of the two main characters in the second book.


message 12: by Joy (new)

Joy (thedragonlily) | 45 comments I'm listening to the book on CD and the voice for Derry is lower-class than that of Suffolk and York. I agree, he's an interesting character ... and by his "roots" I wonder how he became so "close" to Henry VI. Thoughts anyone?

Iggulden's notes say that he made up Derry because he thought there must have been someone like him running things behind the scenes. I don't think I agree.


message 13: by RJay (new)

RJay (plantagenetjunkie) | 100 comments Mod
Joy wrote: "I'm listening to the book on CD and the voice for Derry is lower-class than that of Suffolk and York. I agree, he's an interesting character ... and by his "roots" I wonder how he became so "close"..."

I understand the need sometimes to create a character to carry the plot ... but I find it somewhat difficult to understand how Derry made it from lower class (friend of long bowmen) to master manipulator under Henry VI. Seems a really far stretch unless something incredible happened along the way which would need to be explained in order f or me to suspend my disbelief. Considering how everyone who was anyone back then was connected through their noble friends, cousins, marriage alliances, and so on, it seems far fetched that Derry was the king's "right hand" in maneuvering through the thick muck of MA politics.


message 14: by RJay (new)

RJay (plantagenetjunkie) | 100 comments Mod
Joy wrote: "I'm listening to the book on CD and the voice for Derry is lower-class than that of Suffolk and York. I agree, he's an interesting character ... and by his "roots" I wonder how he became so "close"..."

So, Joy, if you don't agree with Iggulden, what do you think was going on with Henry VI? Do you think the Duke of York was as diabolical as he's being made out to be? Any others have thoughts on this?


message 15: by Portia, Novice Mod (new)

Portia | 264 comments Mod
RJay wrote: "Joy wrote: "I'm listening to the book on CD and the voice for Derry is lower-class than that of Suffolk and York. I agree, he's an interesting character ... and by his "roots" I wonder how he becam..."

My understanding is that this sort of thing happens in genre literature. My example is Richard Sharpe, created by Bernard Cornwell. My understanding is that the Duke of Wellington did not believe in soldiers crossing the line from enlisted to officer, but Cornwell had him promote Sharpe for the sake of the series. And remember, without that license, we wouldn't have Sean Bean.


message 16: by RJay (new)

RJay (plantagenetjunkie) | 100 comments Mod
More comments on Stormbird: I've now finished the book. I was really surprised that so much of the build to climax was about the Cade Rebellion. Really? England lost all of Anjou, Maine & Normandy and the big scene is Cade's forces looting London? And many major players were missing or had very minor roles ... both Beaufort uncles? Where was the Duke of Bedford? Duke of Buckingham? Why would Cardinal Beaufort team up on York's side? He was a Lancastrian. Sorry, this book just doesn't add up for me.
What do others think?


message 17: by Joy (new)

Joy (thedragonlily) | 45 comments I have but haven't yet read Iggulden's whole series about Caesar, and I'm hoping it's closer to history than STORMBIRD.


message 18: by Silvia (new)

Silvia | 26 comments RJay wrote: "More comments on Stormbird: I've now finished the book. I was really surprised that so much of the build to climax was about the Cade Rebellion. Really? England lost all of Anjou, Maine & Normandy ..."

I don't mind historical novels not being much accurate. Indeed I've read lots of historical novels that stray from reality one way or another, but I liked them nonetheless! As a matter of fact, if I want a truthful account of the events I prefer reading history.


message 19: by happy (new)

happy (happyone) | 142 comments As long as the author explains where he/she deviated from accepted history and that deviation is minor I don't mind. In fact that will often cause me to do my own research on the subject.

I think Iggulden has come a long way in that reguard. His Roman series played way to fast and loose with the historical record.


message 20: by RJay (new)

RJay (plantagenetjunkie) | 100 comments Mod
Great perspectives, Silvia & Happy, thanks for sharing.
For plot purposes sometimes it is necessary to deviate, it's certainly often easier to create a good read.

In the past, I know I've read many historical fictions novels and enjoyed them without realizing that the authors have changed history. So, I can see your points.


message 21: by RJay (new)

RJay (plantagenetjunkie) | 100 comments Mod
Concerning this book, why do you think Iggulden chose to have Cardinal Beaufort side with York?


message 22: by happy (new)

happy (happyone) | 142 comments I really don't have any idea - must have been for plot reasons.

my thoughts for anyone interested

https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...


message 23: by RJay (new)

RJay (plantagenetjunkie) | 100 comments Mod
happy wrote: "I really don't have any idea - must have been for plot reasons.

my thoughts for anyone interested

https://www.goodreads.com/review/show..."


Thanks for sharing your post. Enjoyed reading your review.


message 24: by happy (new)

happy (happyone) | 142 comments Thank you


message 25: by happy (last edited Jul 29, 2016 05:05PM) (new)

happy (happyone) | 142 comments Mrs. Happy just brought

Bloodline (Wars of the Roses, #3) by Conn Iggulden (No 3 in the series)

home from the library. It goes onto the stack, probably about 3 reads down.


message 26: by happy (last edited Aug 25, 2016 04:14PM) (new)

happy (happyone) | 142 comments I starting Bloodline tonight.


message 27: by happy (new)

happy (happyone) | 142 comments I'm about half way through - good read. It starts in the aftermath of Wakefield - the prolouge is an envokative scene where the heads of Richard - Duke of York, his son Edmund and the Earl of Salsibury - Richard Neville are impales over the south gate of York.


message 28: by happy (new)

happy (happyone) | 142 comments If anyone is interested, I got around to typing up my thoughts on #3 in the series,
Bloodline

https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

Good read! It's every bit as good as Stormbird. I would give it 4.25 stars, so I rounded down.


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