Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (Harry Potter, #1) Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone discussion


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Various organized religion officials/leaders have repeatedly said they don't want us to read Harry Potter. As a Harry Potter fan, what is your opinion in regards to organized religion, and what will you say to them about this?

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message 1: by Shanti (last edited May 15, 2014 06:27AM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Shanti I don't know about other religons, but how can Harry Potter be anti biblical? Harry gives his life for those he loves. " where your treasure is, your heart will be also" is a quote from the sermon on the Mount. I understand that it does have elements of witchcraft, but if you look at the message behind it, Harry Potter is really about love. It is also quite awesome. :)


Mrinal Tomar well I am unsure that how it has hurt religious feelings. just like their are miracle stories in evry religion, even harry potter has them.


message 3: by Anna (last edited May 09, 2014 01:18AM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Anna Which religions? In many religions, there are regional leaders, but they don't represent the religion as a whole. So that's my first point/question.

My opinion: I don't believe it is right to ban/discourage the reading of Harry Potter books. For that matter, no books should be banned. There are certain books out there that I don't want to read. Am I going to stop someone else who wants read them from doing so? Nope. There are probably books I read that they don't like. In a nutshell, let people read what they want. It's not hurting anyone. Unless it's a book on how to kill someone, and then I'd be a little worried and sit farther away from said person. But that's besides the point.

About Harry Potter books specifically: These books are victim to the worldwide trend of nitpicking everything and making huge mountains out of little molehills. Harry Potter books teach values about standing together against evil. By the way, the good triumphs over the evil. Do they make mistakes along the way?
Of course.
But do you know why?
Because ALL HUMAN BEINGS DO AS WELL. There is no one on Earth today that hasn't made a mistake. The Harry Potter books illustrate that making mistakes happens. You learn from them and hopefully don't make them again.
Are the books perfect?
Nope.
Are the characters?
Nope.
Is anyone?
Nope.

~So why the need to ban it?~

"But, Eliza, what about the violence?"

Nothing, compared to the graphic blood and gore that's in the media today. And in no way is it ever glorified by the characters, unless you count the bad guys, but that's only because they're THE BAD GUYS.

"But, what about sex?"

Oh, right, there isn't any.

"But the cussing, Eliza!"

Minimal, and again, nothing compared with the media. And still, no glorification.

It's sad that people feel the need to focus on things like Harry Potter books or other books they deem "offensive". Things. Material things. What we all need to focus on is each other. People are more important than these temporary things. Hopefully, we all will get the hint that people are more important. People are what make the world, the ones who make things happen. Worry about helping them become better people.

Sorry I took up so much space, but after hearing so much about this book-banning for so long, I felt I should say something.


Mrinal Tomar Eliza wrote: "Which religions? In many religions, there are regional leaders, but they don't represent the religion as a whole. So that's my first point/question.

My opinion: I don't believe it is right to ban/..."


correct. 100% correct. these religious leaders are just afraid that people might turn against them as the leaders are a lot evil. disgraceful.


Sarah Books depict real life. There is no such thing as unacceptable subject material, only unrealistically depicted scenes that require too much of a suspension of disbelief. And even then the narration can excuse it.

As for "organized" religion, it is often a tool to control the masses. In the past and even today (in more parts of the world than you think) the leaders have managed to cause various problems and obstruct the course of justice; the Vatican is not only responsible for covering up sexual abuse of children but also has helped smuggle war criminals to Europe after the 1994 Rwandan genocide. That is just the tip of an iceberg; most religious organizations will go to great lengths to persecute those who think or act differently to what they preach is acceptable.

All this for ancient scrolls translated so many times that most of it has lost all meaning. It doesn't surprise me that they would be so afraid of literature that encourages fantasy.


Dana If you belong to a religious group that feels that it has the right to censor what you read, then you should question whether you should belong to that religious group.


message 7: by [deleted user] (new)

Many people have no idea what Harry Potter is really about because of religious people telling them it's wrong. My parents for example wouldn't let me read/watch anything Harry Potter, but when I turned 13 I told my mother that since I want to work in publishing I should know what sells and why Harry Potter is so popular. She agreed and I fell in love with the series. Many people have set ideas that Harry Potter is full of actual witchcraft (which, as a Christian, I don't like), but it's not. Sure there are dark elements, but it's always portrayed as wrong. I'm not going to go into religions, because that's not the point. But there are so many issues that are more important than a children's book series that contains a little magic (what about all those fairy-tales we were told as kids...those contained witches and stuff...why aren't they banned? same difference) and I really thing that religions can use their time better...and stop believing everything they're told and go out and find out for themselves like I did.


Tana Lovegood of Dumbledore's Army✞~ Rogers/America I do not get why people always accuse these books of being biblical! They are FICTION it is fake! Same with the Percy Jackson series. It is supposed to be entertaining and help the imagination not convince people to believe!


MaddyLeeReads When I heard and red all these articles about this I started to laugh for some reason. I am a christian in a strict christian family as we all love Harry Potter. People just tend to just look at the magic and not the morals and memorable characters within the story.


MaddyLeeReads Bookworm wrote: "Many people have no idea what Harry Potter is really about because of religious people telling them it's wrong. My parents for example wouldn't let me read/watch anything Harry Potter, but when I t..."

Either that or all these religious organizations hate Harry Potter and wants a reason to ban them.


Moonlight Go over to the list of banned classics. You will find that Harry Potter has lots of company.

http://www.ala.org/bbooks/frequentlyc...

I read 7 of these books for my 10th grade high school English class. It was an all girls conservative Christian school in a very conservative part of the state where I grew up.


Kressel Housman Harry Potter is a banned book in my sons' yeshiva. My oldest read all of them multiple times, my middle read the first two and then became a die-hard Redwall fan, and my youngest read only the first because he doesn't like to go against school rules. Does my rabbi know that I've read it and shared it with my kids? Yes. Does that make me a respected person in the community. Probably not.


Rachel Paige  Hamlin JKR is a christian, she said herself that she doesn't believe in the kind of magic in her books.
I think if the author can say it's just for fun and simply for a good book, we don't need to worked up over it.


message 14: by Brianna (last edited May 09, 2014 06:10PM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Brianna Honestly, I feel sad for those people. Harry Potter is about love, friendship, life and death, courage, and good vs evil. I learned so much from those books and they made me a much better person. Other people can learn great things from these books. Who cares if they use magic? The books are so much more then that. Those people are too narrow-minded to see that and I pity them. They shouldn't ban Harry Potter or denounce them as witchcraft. They shouldn't punish others for their ignorance.


Kressel Housman Rachel wrote: "JKR is a christian, she said herself that she doesn't believe in the kind of magic in her books."

Yes, there's definitely Christian symbolism in there. I'm not Christian, but I understand that the veil is a Christian metaphor. And "King's Cross" station? She conceived of the book while there - a crossover stop to Heaven. That's not Christian?


message 16: by Holly (new)

Holly I am more likely to read a book if it has received the criticism of certain religious leaders/churches.


message 17: by T.E. (new) - rated it 5 stars

T.E. I'm a Catholic, and we are certainly allowed to read Harry Potter. Pretty sure the Pope even came out and said it was clearly a struggle between good and evil and thus nothing nefarious. I enjoy being a Catholic and I see nothing wrong with organized religion. I also don't believe in censorship or banning books. Any sect that tries to ban Harry Potter has obviously misinterpreted the work.


James Hays Some religious leaders don't want anyone to read about Magic. It's sort of like a trigger word with them or something. Somehow the magic in the Bible gets a free pass because they're called Miracles.

There are also those who feel the Potter series is too violent, and yet the Bible is absolutely chock full of violence. How does THAT get a free pass?


Marietje In public libraries they have a rule that if someone wants to object to a book they have to have read the work in its entirety. Most religious people who objected to Harry Potter had not read it and refused to read it. So much for their opinion.


Taliah I think anyone whose faith can be challenged by a children's book cannot call themselves a committed Christian. Anything in life depends on the individual, and how far they let things into their lives. As a Christian, I love Harry Potter... as a book. I never believed in witchcraft and never will, and Harry Potter didn't influence my faith at all. I think if there is place in your heart to allow witchcraft to confuse you, then you haven't let God into your heart as much as you need to.


Grayson Phillips Yes, there is witchcraft involved in the plot. But why can't everyone see that IT IS A FREAKIN' BOOK!!!! There is no way that anyone accepts that as truth. It is just plain ignorant of those leaders. I am thinking that maybe they are just jealous that the series has probably sold more books than the Bible, the Torah, and the Koran combined. Like I said, it is a book. If people feel inspired to then practice witchcraft, they are free to go around waving sticks and muttering Etruscan words. Don't get me wrong, I love Harry Potter. But it is so obviously not true. Even if it was, don't you think the Ministry of Magic would have Obliviated us by now?


message 22: by Somerandom (last edited May 11, 2014 06:10AM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Somerandom These so called "Religious Leaders" make me facepalm. And JKR has even gone so far as apologize on their behalf for their utter stupidity.

Now, I am not saying every Christian/Catholic/Jew (insert religion here) are like these particular people. Far from it.
But these numpties have gone off the deep end as far as I'm concerned.
Firstly they claim it encourages witchcraft. Which is absurd. The witchcraft depicted in Harry Potter amounts to little more than traditional (and most likely completely wrong) stereotypical representations, which in turn is based off centuries of European Folklore. And that is actually ironically highly influenced by Christianity itself. The pointy hats, the weirdness, the ghastly fiends one finds in the world. Practices like Divination, Astrology and tarot reading. That's mostly down to what a lot of earlier Christians actually thought witches did/looked like. Of course their view of witches was far harsher than JKR's for obvious reasons.

I must say though they have given the series a lot of free publicity. lol!

These morons probably haven't even read the books themselves and are most likely the same twits who regard Lord of the Rings as Satanic (even though Tolkien himself was a highly devout Catholic) or decry the Narnia Chronicles as demonic (despite the fact that CS Lewis was a highly regarded Christian Apologist.) They will find evil in whatever they are looking at, because they themselves implant it in everything in their world. And some muggle who has never read the series will take the word of another idiot muggle and the vicious rumors of what Harry Potter contains spreads. It's really quite pitiful to be honest.

Harry Potter itself can take on a very Christian slant, if you choose to interpret it that way. Whether this reflects JKR's own Christianity or just a coincidence, I cannot say.
The themes of sacrifice, love, forgiveness and selflessness are found throughout the entire saga. If those are considered Satanic, well, then Satan must not be such a bad guy!

(Also, there was one moron on that site who equated Yoga with Satanism. Words cannot begin to describe the utter stupidity and sheer ignorance of that statement.)


Somerandom Marietje wrote: "In public libraries they have a rule that if someone wants to object to a book they have to have read the work in its entirety. Most religious people who objected to Harry Potter had not read it an..."

YES! This a million times! It should be a freaking law! And not only that, you must prove that you at least comprehend the text properly, no skim reading. That should be the requirements of anyone even thinking of banning/burning any book whatsoever!


message 24: by Somerandom (last edited May 11, 2014 06:12AM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Somerandom Moonlight wrote: "Go over to the list of banned classics. You will find that Harry Potter has lots of company.

http://www.ala.org/bbooks/frequentlyc...

I read 7 of these books for my 10th grad..."


I thank you kind Sir or Madam, for the reading list!


Gabriela Barisic Another reason to add in my hate list of religion! Weeeeeeee!


angel I disagree with these people because I really don't see their reasons for HP being bad relate directly to the books. There are other (more) violent books. There is no mentioning of religion in the whole series, except Christmas. There is definitely nothing about demons, which makes me wonder how people made a connection to some exorcisms being caused by this series. Finally, these people haven't even read the book. How can they go bashing a series solely based on what others have said about the plot? There is a also a (positive) meaning to HP. HP is about love, courage, etc. It also shows a great story that leaves readers marveling over Rowling's imagination. IMHO, the wizardry just made it all more entrancing. <<--Sorry for the rant, but I really don't understand what is in HP that is getting it banned. There's also probably some errors/misconstructions.


message 27: by Anna (new) - rated it 5 stars

Anna I think it all goes back to fear of the unknown. People fear what they don't understand. It happens not only to books, but to religions. People will say a religion is bad when they haven't taken the time to research it or are going off of hearsay. With the Harry Potter Books, these religious leaders either haven't read them to form their own opinion, or are going off of the hearsay that there are demons in the books and that the books are against religion and contain numerous other awful things. Unfortunate. So unfortunate.


message 28: by Roni (new) - rated it 5 stars

Roni I think it was explained really good in the beginning of "Half Blood Prince", when the two ministers meet. The muggle prime minister can't understand how the magical community can be having so many problems;And both ministers of magic say well the other side has magic too.
It illustrates that people don't need magic to be cruel to each other, to be hateful, to be just awful to each other. That on an equal level (with or without magic) there are good and bad people.
I think that's what people who object to these books need to be shown that the magic is not a big deal when it comes to the true core of the book. The book is basically about people good and bad, and human behavior. The magic is for sensationalism really.
Because even in this world where you think you can fix your problems with the wave of a wand...you can't fix people and who they really are.


message 29: by Anna (last edited May 12, 2014 01:14AM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Anna Beautiful explanation, Roni. That is exactly the point of the Harry Potter Books. :)


message 30: by Koleen (last edited May 12, 2014 05:39PM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Koleen Hansen May 12, 20014

to whom may concern:
the whole harry potter Various organized religion officials/leaders have repeatedly said they don't want us to read Harry Potter. As a Harry Potter fan, I am fan of history I know all to well
its all about fear and control. it always been that way since the begin of time. and its just a another thing they cant understand so they fear it. but they cant understand it must be evil. but I am not saying right to ban any book but or use fear and control. and I am bashing any not religion because they have there own believe and that fine.
I am just give information about the human fear of the unknown I am completely against book banning. but I do understand fear, control, they go hand in hand.

best regard.


message 31: by Anna (new) - rated it 5 stars

Anna Very true. Fear and control do go hand in hand. Those who give in to fear are easily controlled. Look at Communist countries.


message 32: by C.R. (new) - rated it 5 stars

C.R. Coming from a Christian girl who was forbidden from reading Harry Potter and who grew up thinking it was of the devil, I believe that Harry Potter is amazing. I have seen both sides. I grew up believing that if I read Harry Potter I would go to Hell. And then I finally read it last year, sneaking them home in my backpack from a friend. My parents found the books and nearly went crazy. And then I proceeded to tell them that Harry Potter was not what they thought it was. I'm not going to go running around shouting the killing curse with a stick because I know it's real. The problem is the people who do think it's real and the people that only see the bad. There is always bad in the world, I mean religious leaders believe that there is sin. And what I love about Harry Potter is it visibly shows the sin and the darkness. But it also shows the love and the light.

So am I angry that I got in trouble? Do I regret reading Harry Potter? Not at all, I am now officially a Potterhead and as I've told my parents. You can't stop me from being one.


Ellen Seltz I think you should choose your religious group/leader based on your belief system and the group's faithfulness to it and overall spiritual/emotional health.

And I think you should choose your reading matter based on what makes your life richer and more joyful.

If those 2 things are in conflict, the book is not the problem, it is just showing you the problem.


message 34: by Jay (new) - rated it 4 stars

Jay Clark Back when I attended the Mormon Church regularly, just about every Mormon I knew that liked to read had read or was reading Harry Potter. It is a non-issue to Mormons.


message 35: by Chris (new) - added it

Chris I am vehemently anti-theist, with a special loathing reserved for Christianity. I am appalled at the ignorance, racism, homophobia, sexism, refusal to acknowledge science and fact, the forcing of their beliefs down other peoples' throats, the persecution of atheists, pagans, people who lean leftist in politics....religion is disgusting to me and only serves to spread evil and hatred and ignorance.

As for how I feel what they think of Harry Potter, they can get stuffed for all I care. Their whining and moaning isn't going to stop me, and millions of other sane people from enjoying what they want to enjoy in peace.


message 36: by Jay (last edited May 13, 2014 12:21AM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

Jay Clark And yet most of the advances we have made in Western society are owed, directly or indirectly, to Christianity. As the bastard child of Judaism, Christianity lit upon the world-changing concept of freedom of conscience. It was okay to keep your peace and not confess your faith. Peter denied the Christ three times and lived to preach another day. Of course, Napoleon Bonaparte nudged Christianity forward by conquering Spain in 1808 and ending the Spanish Inquisition. Who is to say such nudges are not divine?

The human path of progress is messy. Religion attempts to tidy up the smelly, vomitous mess that is the human condition but cannot escape the duality of our nature. Humans are by nature creators and destroyers, builders and wreckers. Religion simply tries to manage us into the preconceived best we can be, but always fails because of our humanity.

The pinheads who condemn Harry Potter are the same folks who think Bryan Fischer is swell, would not vote for fellow conservative Mitt Romney because "Mormons are not real Christians" and yet think nothing of cheating their neighbors to make an "honest" buck. (Bryan Fischer wants to send Michael Sam to an ex-gay camp instead of Rams Football camp.) Snake oil salesmen and Evangelical preachers, however, do keep a lot of potentially harmful people off the streets and in church at least twice a week (Sundays and Wednesday evenings).


message 37: by Chris (new) - added it

Chris Jay D. wrote: "And yet most of the advances we have made in Western society are owed, directly or indirectly, to Christianity. As the bastard child of Judaism, Christianity lit upon the world-changing concept of ..."

ah, typical apologist excusing their vile behavior. Spin it however you want, your little cult is still a hate filled cesspool...and I think its downright adorable you went to all this trouble to try and make excuses for it.

Right then, now go on and toddle off to your Klan meeting or Westboro Baptist rally like the rest of your filthy kind tend to do.


message 38: by Drew (new) - rated it 3 stars

Drew Chris wrote: "Jay D. wrote: "And yet most of the advances we have made in Western society are owed, directly or indirectly, to Christianity. As the bastard child of Judaism, Christianity lit upon the world-chang..."

Wow. You do realize that not every person that practices Christianity or any other organized religion is a crazy racist and/or hate-spreading freak right? It is very possible to believe in a higher power and still accept advances in science, spread love and acceptance, and also not force others to believe in your belief system. By flaming against an entire group of people, you are essentially persecuting the very same folks that you are persecuted by. To lump every human that believes in a higher power together as a "hate filled cesspool" is pretty ignorant. I don't think Jay was excusing any vile behavior. His post can be summed up to say Christianity has good along with bad just like every other thing in this world.


message 39: by Anfenwick (new)

Anfenwick Kressel wrote: "And "King's Cross" station? She conceived of the book while there - a crossover stop to Heaven. That's not Christian?..."

I think probably not. It's a great big station in London. All the mainline trains from London to the north run from there. Since 'everyone' in Britain ends up passing through it, it seems a pretty standard place to conceive a book. Neither it, nor the area around it are traditionally associated with virtue of any kind (except easy). The name itself means 'King's crossroads'. A British king. No crucifixes involved.

As for the main question, my view is that Christian groups who take a literal view of the Bible are in a difficult position with respect to fantasy fiction. They have a big stake in having people understand what they read as literally true. If kids are exposed obviously allegorical or fantastical material they may develop critical skills, then take them to the Bible. Alternatively, some have bought so heavily into the idea that what is written is true that they read books about witchcraft and think it's real (or they already believe in it). That seems to be the case of a lot of the critics in the article.

My answer to them: magic doesn't exist, witchcraft doesn't work, the occult is a fiction. Relax. You will not be turned into frogs.


message 40: by Anfenwick (new)

Anfenwick Chris wrote: "Right then, now go on and toddle off to your Klan meeting or Westboro Baptist rally like the rest of your filthy kind tend to do...."

You may be vehemently anti-theist, Chris, but since JayD apparently shares your disapproval of Westboro/Fischer, that seems a bit unnecessary. I suspect you misread his last paragraph actually.


Michelle People enjoy criticizing what they do not understand. I guarantee most of them have never read the books. Just bring up Lord of the Rings and you have made your point.

I can also see how people compare it biblically...the book's main character "sacrifices" himself. It's easy to make the comparison.

...and BTW-because I have to put my two cents in-I am a Christian and agree that a majority of Christians do not practice what they preach. Acceptance, love, compassion, mercy, forgiveness...

A lot of them are judgemental, superficial, hypocritical, hateful and self righteous.

It's embarrassing and makes the rest of us Christians look bad. I understand that it's easy to lump us all together into a group labeled "crazy"...but we are not all the radical type.

It's hurtful to assume so... :(

And to finish off...I love Harry Potter for entertainment and sentimental reasons ;)


message 42: by Will (new) - rated it 4 stars

Will Kenny wrote: "Various organized religion officials/leaders have repeatedly said they don't want us to read Harry Potter. As a Harry Potter fan, what is your opinion in regards to organized religion, and what wil..."

Name three


message 43: by Anna (new) - rated it 5 stars

Anna It's mostly localized leaders that don't make statements for churches as a whole. Unfortunately, it is these leaders that give whichever religion they associate themselves with a bad name.

Blaming religions for the bad behaviors of some of its members is like blaming one's family when a son or daughter robs a bank.


message 44: by Jay (new) - rated it 4 stars

Jay Clark Chris wrote: "Jay D. wrote: "And yet most of the advances we have made in Western society are owed, directly or indirectly, to Christianity. As the bastard child of Judaism, Christianity lit upon the world-chang..."

I hope you do better at picking lottery numbers than you do in "pinning down" people's thought processes. You only show yourself incapable of courteous conversation by hurling so many accusatory remarks at once.

All people are flawed, and the absence of religion does not automatically create a better human being. Your hateful comebacks are sufficient self-evidence of that. There is no one position on any issue that is always and forever 100% correct. People are not wired that way. Your position just puts you on the opposite of the same coin as both the Klan and the Westboro Baptists Church, spewing raw emotion without reason in place of good conversation for the sake of connecting with other humans. So, go save the whales and not the people as you appear bent to do.


message 45: by Somerandom (last edited May 14, 2014 07:07AM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Somerandom Chris wrote: "Jay D. wrote: "And yet most of the advances we have made in Western society are owed, directly or indirectly, to Christianity. As the bastard child of Judaism, Christianity lit upon the world-chang..."

Whoa there mate. Not every single Christian supports the KKK. In fact the vast majority are absolutely disgusted by that vile organization. And the Westboro Baptist Church has no official ties to anyone. No Baptist Church or organization has recognized them as legitimate. They're pretty much a pariah even amongst the hardcore (and sometimes xenophobic) Evangelical movements.

Many people (myself included) believe in God and trust in knowledge of Science. They're not mutually exclusive, you know?

Not every Christian or religious person is against Science, gay rights or is a racist/antisemitic etc. Religion encompasses all sorts of different people, from different walks of life and with a myriad of differing opinions and personalities.

Now you can call someone out (regardless of religious affiliation) if they're being a judgmental bigoted asshole.

But don't be so quick to paint people so broadly next time. Because that just makes YOU the judgmental bigoted asshole.


Pricilla Gutierrez Taliah wrote: "I think anyone whose faith can be challenged by a children's book cannot call themselves a committed Christian. Anything in life depends on the individual, and how far they let things into their li..."

My thoughts exactly!


message 47: by J (new) - rated it 5 stars

J I'm a Roman Catholic, and a lot of people in my parish read Harry Potter, including me. I honestly have no idea why some people get so worked up about it. Not everything you read in a book is real. Elves, dwarves, and hobbits are not real, as are fauns, talking animals and dryads, but the Lord of the Rings and the Chronicles of Narnia are in our parish library. (And Gandalf is a wizard!) As far as I can tell, the reason Harry Potter is thought of as "evil" is that people think that their little kids will get caught up in evil witchcraft disguised as something "fun and whimsical". If kids are as stupid to believe that the world of Harry Potter is real, I have very little confidence that they have the intelligence to actually read. People who have this view also appear to have never read the books. I used to have this same opinion about Harry Potter, but I read the books and everything changed.


message 48: by Jay (new) - rated it 4 stars

Jay Clark Chris wrote: "ah, typical apologist excusing their vile behavior. Spin it however you want, your little cult is still a hate filled cesspool...and I think its downright adorable you went to all this trouble to try and make excuses for it..."

My "little cult" not only has Harry Potter in general circulation through the Brigham Young University Library system, it also does so in more than a dozen languages.

[http://search.lib.byu.edu/byu/harry+p...]

As I said before, your efforts to silence my viewpoint with ridicule only made you look ridiculous. And sadly, your actual position and mine are off only by the fact that I accept both faith and a lack of faith as valid viewpoints. You are not so generous, once again making you the better candidate for the Klan than me. You might want to brush up on your goose step.


message 49: by Jay (last edited May 14, 2014 07:36PM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

Jay Clark Chris wrote: "I am vehemently anti-theist, with a special loathing reserved for Christianity. I am appalled at the ignorance, racism, homophobia, sexism, refusal to acknowledge science and fact, the forcing of t..."

You make being equally bigoted seem almost like a virtue. All the anti-Mormon propaganda over Prop 8 had zero effect on Mormon Church leadership. What really stuck it to them was the fact that their overreach on the issue caused more than 1/3 of California Mormons to stop attending and to take their generous tithes and offerings with them. And try as it might, the Mormon Church has not been able to get disaffected California Mormons to come back. On the up side, I do not know of a single LGBTQ person being excommunicated from the Mormon Church since they stepped on a landmine of their own making that is Prop 8.

From my perspective, God is helping them to find a better way by letting them make so grand a blunder and then have to live with the consequences.


message 50: by Jay (last edited May 14, 2014 10:56PM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

Jay Clark Sarah wrote: "This post so made me LOL. I grew up in an extremely? conservative church and church run school (3rd grade through high school!) as soon as HP came out we heard many lectures about witchcraft the de..."

And frankly some practicing Wiccans are actually better people than some self-described Christians. Faith or its absence does not define the value of a person; it only sheds light on their own values. We all care the capacity to create and to destroy.

Harry Potter is pretty tame fair compared to some of the books I read as a child. I read both the Graduate (5th grade) and the Godfather (9th grade) long before I was old enough to see either. Of course, The Godfather only became a film when I was a senior in high school and it was my first ever solo viewing (sans parents) of an R-rated movie.


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