Our Shared Shelf discussion

The Complete Persepolis (Persepolis, #1-4)
This topic is about The Complete Persepolis
413 views
Jun—Persepolis (2016) > Education & Social Class

Comments Showing 1-21 of 21 (21 new)    post a comment »
dateDown arrow    newest »

Maika | 36 comments Dear Shelfers,

I have just finished the book ( and I have enjoyed it), but what jumped out to me during all my read it was Marjane Satrapi's family social class: upper class.

So I was wondering, what was the reality for middle/poor class in Iran and for all immigrants considering education?

Marjane has the chance to study in French School to then go to Europe. She has the chance to have educated parents that gave to her the power of knowledge and political awareness.

We all agree that women emancipation comes from education, but how can we do that, seeing that statistically education level is impacted by social classes?

In France and Basque Country, we have the chance to have public schools and universities but what about other countries (UK and USA for instance)?

Hope I am not offending anyone.

Thanks

Best regards,


message 2: by Henriette (new)

Henriette Terkelsen (henrietteterkelsen) I think this is a great reason to have the possible public school and (free) public education.

In Denmark (where equality is relatively high) we have public school (the quality varies a lot, but generally we have good schools - and the public school in our area is excellent, so even though we have a private school (a so-called "free school" (friskole) that holds a lot of values that I really support) we have chosen to send our kids to the public school).
We also have free education (high school, business school, craftsman schools (is that the term?), College and grad school). Tuition is free AND every one gets SU (statepaid educational support) from they turn 18 (if they are students). For students not living with their parents this amounts to just less than $900 a month.

I really believe that this is a very important reason for our high equality! You don't have to have money (or work a lot, which can make it hard to study if it is hard for you to study) to get an education. Our government is really ruining several parts of our schooling and educational system, though (and just about everything else).


Christine Periña | 67 comments "THE YOUTH IS THE HOPE OF THE NATION." -this is just one of idioms that our Philippine National Hero, Dr. Jose Rizal stated in his works. (I just remember it while I'm reading persepolis) ..

I guess, it is really important that every child should have access to education in order to achieve equality. Here in the Philippines, Education is really important to us because we believe that the youth is our country's hope. In fact, You can receive books, notebooks, pencils, pens, bags, shoes & uniforms ALL FOR FREE in public Grade school and High School (not in college) just if you go to school and study well. So basically, parents don't have reason for them to not send their children in school. Also, childrens don't have any reason to not study because our government provided what they need on school.

I just want to say that education is not a privilege. It is a right that everyone should have. :)


message 4: by Vivian (new) - added it

Vivian Bueno | 1 comments I agree!
I 'm from Brazil, and there is a divergence of views on the state's role offering free and secular education (unfortunately there is even a religious stand in our House of Representatives).
My parents work hard and their opinion is influenced by our very manipulative media, and that is the reality of people here. There is little time to learn and question what is on television and newspapers. My political learning did not come from home or school, is being built gradually. And recently I decided study more about the importance of the role of women in society. I decided not to lower my head to the injustices and daily harassments.
I am very happy to be part of this group.
(Sorry for my poor English. I 'm much better reader and listener.)

:)


message 5: by Sherry (new)

Sherry (directorsherry) | 20 comments Emma wrote: "Christine wrote: "I just want to say that education is not a privilege. It is a right that everyone should have."

I agree! Education should be available to everyone.

I live in the state of Tennessee in the US and the state legislature has just initiated the Tennessee Promise, which gives 2 years of college (Associates Degree) free for all high school graduates in the state to attend tn state colleges and universities. I teach at a community college and work as a mentor for Tennessee Promise students. This is huge for our state that has been 48th in the US for education for some time now.



Diana (secondhandrose) In Australia we have free state schools and fee paying private schools. The quality of state schools vary and our educational outcomes have dropped over the last decade or so. Private school students generally have better outcomes but these schools are very expensive so have an elitist element.
I went to a private girls school but now I am an adult I don't support them and work at a state school. I believe that all students should have the same educational opportunities.
University students here usually take out loans from the government and end up with what is called a HECS (higher education ? scheme) debt. Once they have finished university and are earning about a certain threshold they have to pay back this debt. This puts graduating students at an immediate disadvantage financially. We used to have free tertiary education which came from a progressive left wing government in the 70's.


Frances (francesab) | 39 comments Maika wrote: "Dear Shelfers,

I have just finished the book ( and I have enjoyed it), but what jumped out to me during all my read it was Marjane Satrapi's family social class: upper class.

So I was wondering,..."


Maika-I felt the same way reading Persepolis, and this thread of a certain level of support and privilege is clear in Marjane's life-from her education and standard of living (there is a maid, at least early in the novel) and the fact that she can travel to Europe-her parents travel to Turkey and bring back gifts for her. Also, once they start living the double life of a Western lifestyle behind closed doors, there is clearly access to alcohol, music, western dress, and there does not seem to be any difficulty in paying fines incurred when caught breaking the rules.

Perhaps that was part of the appeal of the islamic revolution for the poor-that they were given an opportunity for equality and some measure of power in their society. Clearly, the revolution targeted schools as a means of controlling the populace, as we see happening today in many other parts of the world.


message 8: by Jon (new)

Jon Austin | 2 comments Diana wrote: "In Australia we have free state schools and fee paying private schools. The quality of state schools vary and our educational outcomes have dropped over the last decade or so. Private school studen..."

Hi Diana – the quality of non-state schools varies quite considerably as well in Australia, with one very elite school in Melbourne currently demonstrating its very poor educational outcomes by asking for a church based decision on how the administration staff should treat parents from a same sex relationship looking to enroll a child! Give me strength!

(btw, the C in HECS stands for Contribution)


Laura Saga (glassesandburnteyelashes) | 4 comments I shared Maika's impression while I was reading Sartrapi's graphic novel: her social class is a key factor in her experience, and the education that her parents' provided her with was outstanding in two senses since she was able to attend the Lycée and they raised her to be a critical individual. It was my second reading of Persepolis, I read it a few years ago in High school, and I am surprised because I do hold the same view on it as I did then: to me, Sartrapi go uses too much on herself. I mean, it feels like an autobiography, a testimony. I think that she should have focused a little more in describingthe situation and its consequences, not only in the consequences for her.


message 10: by Dee (new) - rated it 5 stars

Dee (serendipidee) | 12 comments I live in the US, in Missouri, and worry about this country's education. Although we do have both free/public and paid/private schools, they are not equal. Public schools are often stretched too thin. Teachers in public schools aren't paid enough, and there are too few of them, so students outnumber the teachers at an alarming rate that makes attention and education difficult. Politicians would rather argue about a fear of socialism and government programs than fix the financial issues. In a country this large there is a serious issue of inequality of public schools from town to town.

I grew up as lower-middle class. I had a good school because my mom made sure we didn't live in the scary part of town. That put us in the rich kids' schools and gave us a chance. What if she hadn't moved us there? Would I still love reading? What if they made me go to the religious high school? Would I be overly promiscuous and into drugs as the students there were? I think about that all the time: where would I be if...? What if I'd been an inner-city kid with nothing? Would I be as smart? Would I have pushed myself even harder? Would I have given up?


message 11: by [deleted user] (new)

Emma wrote: "Dee wrote: "I live in the US, in Missouri, and worry about this country's education. Although we do have both free/public and paid/private schools, they are not equal. Public schools are often stre..."
Emma wrote: "Dee wrote: "I live in the US, in Missouri, and worry about this country's education. Although we do have both free/public and paid/private schools, they are not equal. Public schools are often stre..."
It's so so true that the American public school system thrives under a promise of being a free social service. I'm currently studying to be an English and Spanish secondary education teacher (or ESL, not quite sure yet!), and I took a class that talked about this subject. I'll use Spain as a comparison since I studied there for half a year: around 60% of the Spanish education system is private, and you can guess who attends private schools. In the US, private schools are much less common, and so there is a premise of equality. But once we consider how the No Child Left Behind Act (NCLB) affected "tracking" in schools, standardized testing, and a near absolute necessity to attend a university, the system is actually very problematic.
This is why the "cycle of poverty" in the United States is real, and the so-called "American Dream" for hopeful immigrants is becoming less so. Students who start off in a lower socio-economic class are more likely to attend a school in a lower socio-economic neighborhood, which statistically have younger, inexperienced teachers, insufficient funds for textbooks and other vital classroom materials (such as computers), and therefore a poorer education. I was lucky to have attended a upper middle class high school, and have no doubt had I been in a poorer situation I would have had a much tougher time getting to where I am today. Education is extremely important, and it floors me to think that governments use it as a weapon against their own citizens.


message 12: by Simone (last edited Jun 09, 2016 11:01PM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Simone | 85 comments I think you have a point, i do also think about this when i was reading this book. I don't know about other countries but in mine, you can really see the difference in education caused by social class.If you have a lot money then you can go to a better school receive a better education have a greater furture than the students from poor family.There is a chance poor kids can change their life through education,but it's very very rare.Of course government is doing something about it,but i'm not so sure it could change a thing.I want it to,but sometimes you gonna deal with it.


Christine Periña | 67 comments Simone wrote: "I think you have a point, i do also think about this when i was reading this book. I don't know about other countries but in mine, you can really see the difference in education caused by social cl..."

I agree with you! Same thing here in the Philippines, even though our government is doing their best you can't change the fact that if you don't have enough money you can't receive a better education for your childrens future!

Personally, I came in the middle family but my parents decided to send me in Public school because they want me to feel and see how hard the situation of those poor kids who wants to study but they can't because their parents don't have enough money to send them to school. They want me to dream not only for myself but also for those young kids .. And I am so thankful that they made the right choice for sending me in Public school and I don't have regrets on it. Because now that I am in college, I am more motivated to help those kids who are really in need.


Ashleigh Hyatt (achyatt) | 18 comments Kayla wrote: "Emma wrote: "Dee wrote: "I live in the US, in Missouri, and worry about this country's education. Although we do have both free/public and paid/private schools, they are not equal. Public schools a..."


I agree with both Emma and Dee on the public school system in America. Not only are poorer children going to more poorly funded schools, they generally come from families who do not value education. So, when children who are from these type of families and are then themselves unmotivated to get an education, I believe teachers find it even harder to motivate these students considering the teachers are not getting support from their families/parents. So, not only are teachers working against students they are working against the whole family system at times. I think one of the reasons Marjane reads and is intelligent is not just because she values education but her entire family does as well which is evident throughout the book.


Lindsay | 1 comments That is a true issue we face in the US. I grew up in an area with some of the best schools in the state, and I was lucky enough to get a fantastic education in public school. However, now that I am in college, I have noticed that some people (who come from places around the country) had much poorer education quality because their public school system wasn't as good."

I live in central Texas and I went from being the one who tutored some of my friends in math in high school to having to take a remedial math course when I first entered college. The quality of education does make such a difference based on location.

My friend sent her daughter to a neighboring school district for fifth grade. Her daughter has dyslexia and that school was such a struggle for her. She fought for every C and B that she brought home, but she was learning. At the end of the year, the school district decided not to allow her to continue as a transfer student. This was partially because of the learning disability. They stated they didn't realize she had it when the transfer was applied for and probably wouldn't have taken her because it was taking resources away from their own special needs students. When she returned to our district for sixth grade, she back slid so much. She was happy because suddenly she was making As and school was "easier," but she wasn't learning in the same way or at the same rate.


message 16: by Effie (new) - added it

Effie | 6 comments Maika wrote: "Dear Shelfers,

I have just finished the book ( and I have enjoyed it), but what jumped out to me during all my read it was Marjane Satrapi's family social class: upper class.

So I was wondering,..."

I am from Iran, in Iran we have public/state school, highschool and university and some of the best universities are state ones. Girls attend to school just like boys and can get higher education and degree from university. there are certain degree that girls can not do such as becoming a judge which it is said it is based on Islamic law(I don't know if it is right or not) also on the other hand there are specialities that boys can not do such as gynaecologist. It is interestingly in recent years of Iran number of female university student/graduate has exceeded male students.


message 17: by Effie (new) - added it

Effie | 6 comments Laura wrote: "I shared Maika's impression while I was reading Sartrapi's graphic novel: her social class is a key factor in her experience, and the education that her parents' provided her with was outstanding i..."
To me it is an autobiography; more a narrative style or story telling, She uses her life story as a mean to history of Iran in recent years.


message 18: by Aglaea (last edited Jul 23, 2016 04:57AM) (new) - added it

Aglaea | 987 comments Education is free here, even universities. I think anything else is a strange decision for a society make, unless they on purpose want to keep certain layers of society 'in their place' without having a genuine chance of ever creating a better life for themselves and their loved ones.

A person close to me travels to the US for work from time to time, and frequently gets to hear offensive statements from conservatives there that Finland is 'socialist', but if it means there is less poverty, barely no homeless, medical procedures that don't cause bankruptcy, much less crime due to poverty and drug abuse and god knows what else, then I say sure bring it on. Besides, we're not socialist but have many socialdemocratic values, which are far to the left of even democrats in the US, so whatever. I like how safe it is here. Sure, we pay taxes, but for whom is the system again? Healthy, educated individuals are good for society as a whole.


message 19: by Ana (new)

Ana | 1 comments Yes, education should be for everyone, but when talking about a kid having the opportunity to go to school whatever his social class is, I'm not just saying he should be able to get a free education, with free books and school supplies, but good teachers.

I believe it all starts there, having good teachers is the key to a high level education either in private or public schools. In Mexico this has been a problem for several years now, teachers who havn't finished primary school are giving classes in high schools! The goverment prefers to keep people missinformed about what happens and is happening in our country right now so giving students a poor education is their easy escape to keep people quiet.

It's a shame that we're living in the 21st century and a quality education isn't still available for everyone, and those in the power are not willing to change this.


Gayle Kimball (gaylekimball) I agree that the Nordic countries provide the best model of humanitarianism plus private enterprise, as Bernie Sanders recognizes. Others can learn a lot as from the excellent Finnish education system, one of the best in the world--shown in Michael Moore's most recent documentary "Where Should We Invade Next." A Finnish grad student who I know from my global youth ms. research said educ. cuts are underway though. What do you know about that?


message 21: by Aglaea (new) - added it

Aglaea | 987 comments Ana wrote: "I'm not just saying he should be able to get a free education, with free books and school supplies, but good teachers."

Well, that depends on education, because teachers need education to become teachers. Here they have to have higher education to even be allowed a permanent position anywhere. And since higher education (not books etc. but the tuition itself) is free, teachers can become good at what they do.


back to top