Question #4: Credentials

[[deleted user]]

At one point, Gilbert states, “I am not convinced that we need officially credentialed novelists… Twelve North American writers have won the Nobel prize in literature since 1901: not one of them had an MFA. Four of them never even got past high school.” Her statement could be applied to other creative professions. Do you agree or disagree with her about the importance of credentials?

[Susan]

I think she has a point in that we (as a society) are quick to pigeon-hole people's talents according to,their degrees. If I am a scientist I must be a nerd. If I am an arts major I must be flighty, etc. Our first degree or diploma is often Influenced by parents, guidance counsellors, etc. What 17 year old really understands themselves. That said, I strongly believe that we all need basic skills in whatever we choose and that bad writing, bad science, bad theatre, bad design can result from a lack of foundational knowledge. Then we need to expose ourselves to all sorts of things (TED talks being a perfect example) to help spark different thinking.

[Susan]

Susan wrote: "I think she has a point in that we (as a society) are quick to pigeon-hole people's talents according to,their degrees. If I am a scientist I must be a nerd. If I am an arts major I must be flighty..."
You make a good point, Susan, about young people not being sure about what they study. They may not get full benefit from their formal education if it's not the right fit.

I'm not sure that Gilbert's statement about the MFA is a fair one. Perhaps the twelve Nobel prize winners did not have an MFA, but some of them might have had undergraduate English degrees. A formal education gives you time to perfect your skills. Doesn't Malcolm Gladwell say you have to do something for 10,000 hours before you become an expert?

On the other hand, I think some people have natural talents - whether that is artistic or writing talent. One of Canada's finest writers, Richard Wagamese, was homeless as a teen and never finished high school. His writing skills are self-taught, and he now teaches others. I'm sure we could find examples on both sides of this argument.

A formal education gives an artist something to fall back on if he can't make a living through his art. The workplace and knowledge economy more and more demand a university or college degree.

I have a son who is studying film production at university. I have to confess that when I read Gilbert's statements about credentials, I started to wonder if I should have just sent him out into the world to start making films! But there's so much about a university education that I value; I just would not consider doing that.

[Maureen]

Susan wrote: "Susan wrote: "I think she has a point in that we (as a society) are quick to pigeon-hole people's talents according to,their degrees. If I am a scientist I must be a nerd. If I am an arts major I m..."

I feel the same way, Susan. We know that experience is a wonderful teacher but I've always believed that education is a way to learn from others' experience and knowledge. Why make mistakes we don't have to! And, of those Nobel prize winners, I would bet that many of them were very well-educated, if not in fine arts, then another discipline.

To make a living in the arts is really tough though and I agree with Gilbert's take on having to work really hard and probably at other jobs.

[Sylvia]

It's a bit confusing with the two Susan's to reference their points-perhaps a surname initial could be included?
Anyway, it seems most people agree there are people with inherent talent-Richard Wagamese-is a perfect example, Susan C.! Some of his work is achingly, enviably beautiful-a truly talented writer.
But most of us seem to agree that one can gain much through study and education. I for one did not know what I could achieve without academic study. It has meant the world to me & I am so grateful that I experienced university as a 'late-bloomer' than not at all. I am discovering a little talent in writing-but would never have come to this point without official learning of how to develop this talent. I am for education all the way!! Susan, your son the filmmaker will not regret his education. I have worked with final year film directors ( as an actor) from Ryerson & they were wonderfully professional in their craft. Best wishes to your son in his career.

[Nancy]

While I've definitely had professors who have greatly assisted me in achieving better research skills and writing and while I think there are more who could do the same yes, is the end goal a degree for degree sake or is it about actually writing about the subject you want to write about? This really is an individual choice.

[Susan]

Sylvia wrote: "It's a bit confusing with the two Susan's to reference their points-perhaps a surname initial could be included?
Anyway, it seems most people agree there are people with inherent talent-Richard Wag..."
Thanks, Sylvia. I can already see how much my son has grown in just one year of study at Ryerson.

I agree too, about inherent talent. But Richard Wagamese would be the first to say that he is self-taught through many years of hard work - many of them spent in libraries. He is also a good testament to the power of curiosity, as he talks about what he learned in libraries by reading about subjects that ignited his curiosity.