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The Cafe - Open Discussion > How a Liberal Christian is born

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message 1: by Lee (new)

Lee Harmon (DubiousDisciple) | 2112 comments In my observation, liberal Christians all seem to follow the same route to enlightenment. At least among my generation, I'm not aware of a single liberal Christian who didn't start out as conservative, or at least with a conservative upbringing.

In time, however, the sheer weight of evidence against the Bible being a historical record causes the person to finally accept the truth. This results in two things: 1) a curiosity about the Bible's origins and intended meanings, since the Bible had become a big part of the person's life, and 2) a hole in the soul where life once had unquestioned purpose.

These two circumstances work together to produce an expected result. My own curiosity was intense; my library on the topic of the Bible would stack about 45 feet high, of which I devoured every word. And in so doing, I began to appreciate just what an extraordinary person and what extraordinary teachings the historical Jesus truly espoused.

That not only satisfies the curiosity but fills the hole-in-the-soul with new purpose. But learning about Jesus as he truly lived and taught has the natural affect of turning one POLITICALLY liberal as well...at least in America, where the conservative party is so far to the right that they would be unrecognizable in any other developed country.

In time, the compassion Jesus taught begins to prove itself as the best way to live. Old ways of thinking about people seem foreign.

This is my story as well; I've become not only a liberal Christian but liberal in my political views. When my family wonders how I could have fallen into the nest of Democrats, I just blink and point to Jesus.


message 2: by Rod (new)

Rod Horncastle Which Jesus do you point to?
The Jesus of the Biblical account?
The Jesus of the Old Testament?
The Jesus who walked on water and argued with Satan?
The Jesus who ignored his Mother and Family and made His pact with those who follow HIM?
The Jesus who got killed for declaring himself GOD?
The Jesus who gets his own eternal Kingdom that is not of this world?
The Jesus who died and rose again physically?
The Jesus who said "I am the Only way."?
The Jesus who knew where to find money in a fish?
The Jesus who spoke of Noah and Adam as historical accounts?
The Jesus who died to pay the Godly Just price of sin?
The Jesus who was born of a virgin?
The Jesus who was visited by those who followed a star and came to worship him?
The Jesus who raised Lazarus from the dead?


Lee, YOUR Jesus didn't do any of those things - according to you *and your liberal policies.

And now you claim to believe you have a soul? How non-liberal of you.


message 3: by Rod (new)

Rod Horncastle Lee boasting:
" my library on the topic of the Bible would stack about 45 feet high"

You assume that means something truthful? I could have 45 feet of Marvel comics. That doesn't mean i become a liberal and discount the Jesus of the Bible (or believe in Iron Man and Thor).

You haven't ever proven any enlightenment Lee - just a hatred for the Jesus OF THE BIBLE. Your liberal Jesus is good for nothing.

Just for conversation: tell me ONE THING your liberal Jesus has officially done - and how you KNOW that to be a fact... and how this makes him a Guru with the best way to live. As opposed to the Biblical Jesus and how HE says to live.


message 4: by Rod (new)

Rod Horncastle This comment is the funniest:
" the sheer weight of evidence against the Bible being a historical record causes the person to finally accept the truth. "

You so easily believe and embrace Man's evidence against GOD. Based on weight of course. Yet you so desperately boast of clinging to a Jesus who is NOT divine. Satan is beyond proud of his children - he probably has a small tear in his eye from your liberal claims.

YES, this Satan:
Genesis
Now the serpent was more crafty than any other beast of the field that the LORD God had made. He said to the woman, “Did God actually say, ‘You shall not eat of any tree in the garden’?

Revelation 12:9
The great dragon was hurled down--that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.

Job 1:9
"Does Job fear God for nothing?" Satan replied.

Matthew 4:10
Jesus said to him, "Away from me, Satan! For it is written: 'Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.'"

Matthew 25:41
"Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

2 Corinthians 11:3
But I am afraid that just as Eve was deceived by the serpent's cunning, your minds may somehow be led astray from your sincere and pure devotion to Christ.


message 5: by John (new)

John Hanscom | 276 comments "... I'm not aware of a single liberal Christian who didn't start out as conservative, or at least with a conservative upbringing." I detest the term "liberal," as this is a political rather than religious term. However, accepting it in the spirit I believe it was meant, you have now met one, and I became a Christian by reading the Bible and trying to apply it, especially sections such as "the Sermon on the Mount."


message 6: by Lee (new)

Lee Harmon (DubiousDisciple) | 2112 comments :) Glad to know one, John!

I don't mind the phrase "Liberal Christian" because I do indeed lean liberal politically as well, but I can understand your POV.


message 7: by Lee (last edited Feb 27, 2016 10:15AM) (new)

Lee Harmon (DubiousDisciple) | 2112 comments Rod, the Jesus I'm interested in is the one who lived on this earth. Could you add that to your list, please?


message 8: by Rod (new)

Rod Horncastle So, Lee's hard-earned Theological, Historical, and Scientific evaluation has resulted in:

The Jesus who lived on this Earth.

YES, we have reduced him to Gandhi. (without the weird sexual issues) unless you embrace gnostic writings. Liberals seem to love those for some historical/critical reasons.
Please continue with the NEXT FACT about this liberal Jesus. OR is that the end of the road?


message 9: by John (new)

John Hanscom | 276 comments Please do not lump all "liberals" together. You have never met me. How dare you tell me what I do and do not love?


message 10: by Robert (new)

Robert Core | 1864 comments This is so typical of liberal groupthink. "I am humanistic. I don't want to be judged for what I deem human biological behavior. I'm an inveterate do-gooder, but only if I can link the cause to the culture. I can't say "No" when necessary and drugs have taken away my backbone. All that's left is to be compassionate to fellow losers and justify my sin. Let's hijack Jesus and make him our figurehead by distorting his teachings so we'll have some shred of self-esteem."


message 11: by Lee (new)

Lee Harmon (DubiousDisciple) | 2112 comments Compare it to conservative groupthink: "Oh, praise Jeeeezus for our new presidential elect, Trump is finally gonna put all the Mexicans and Muslims and women and blacks and poor people and Pope-followers in their place. I hope he goes to work on anybody with a high-school education next."


message 12: by Robert (new)

Robert Core | 1864 comments Lee - I see you don't disavow the groupthink moniker. So, for all your supposed intellect and insight you merely end up following the herd after all. I, on the other hand, think for myself in all matters. My politics are a matter of pragmatism for what works best for the country. What benefits the silent majority should prevail over the never-ending wants of whiny, unproductive minorities. When someone contributes something to society other than rhetoric, then I'll take notice. With regards to Jesus - he either is what he says he is in toto or he is just another historical spike. Therefore, he's either worthy of praise and worship or just another titular head for the mob to line up behind and hurl slogans. Obviously, you've chosen the latter as his identity. Why don't you get in line behind Karl Marx? His bleatings seem far nearer the worldview of the liberal fringe you're now in lockstep with than your malleable version of Jesus. Don't worry about your image though, Lee, Rod and I never figured you for a free-thinker anyway; only a marionette sent out by the agnostic puppetmasters to troll on Christian Boards.


message 13: by Lee (new)

Lee Harmon (DubiousDisciple) | 2112 comments oh, I thought we were merely throwing about absurd generalities for the pure enjoyment of being silly, the sort of paint-you-into-a-box prejudices shared by dimwitted souls among the uneducated masses.


message 14: by Robert (new)

Robert Core | 1864 comments Lee - we've enjoyed gamesmanship over the years at every level - thanks for engaging in both the silly and the serious. One thing I never imagined was Donald Trump to the left of you. However, because he loves the uneducated masses and somehow managed NOT to attain any wisdom at an Ivy League school, he joins Barrack Obama as one of the densest people on the planet.


message 15: by Rod (last edited Mar 02, 2016 12:57PM) (new)

Rod Horncastle I think Trump exists simply to force the masses over the fence into the liberal camp.

The smart people will have moved out of America. (please come to Canada - then we can fight our baby-aborting/senor Euthanizing, Pot selling, welfare supporting, business destroying Liberal Prime Minister.)

Hmmm... sounds a lot like America.


message 16: by Lee (new)

Lee Harmon (DubiousDisciple) | 2112 comments "move to Canada" searches on Google spiked last night after Trump dominated the primaries.


message 17: by Rod (new)

Rod Horncastle I've heard a fair bit about that.

WE don't need no more liberals. And don't worry: once Trump is in - all the liberals will buddy up with him and he'll probably meet in the middle anyway. For the right price.

What happened to Ben Carson?


message 18: by Robert (new)

Robert Core | 1864 comments Maybe if Ben rented a flamethrower??????


message 19: by Lee (new)

Lee Harmon (DubiousDisciple) | 2112 comments Rod, Trump isn't a liberal. The only candidate we have that might lean a little to the left is Bernie Sanders.


message 20: by Rod (new)

Rod Horncastle Of course Trump isn't a liberal. Politics doesn't really care. It's about winning and playing with power.

For the same reasons liberals really don't care about Racial issues - it's just a card they hold up to get their chance at power.
Most people just want a job (*or security), a beer, and some kids to babysit them when they are old.


message 21: by Lee (new)

Lee Harmon (DubiousDisciple) | 2112 comments lol Rod, seriously, you just make up the goofiest stuff as you go along to insult the people you consider opponents. Which is pretty much everybody. What a way to live.


message 22: by Rod (new)

Rod Horncastle I agree, it is a strange way to live. Probably not healthy at times. I seldom insult specific people - often it's more their ideas and worldviews.

But Truth is everything to me. I will challenge the Matrix if it means losing comfort and security. (Keanu Reeves said something like that.)


message 23: by Robert (new)

Robert Core | 1864 comments Well, I insult certain people and pretty regularly. Anyone with any talent at all in ANY field will attract hangers on. Many of them are liberal leaches without roots or ambition trying to sponge anyway they can. If applicable, I try to change their life's direction towards the Master (which NEVER works) so I just insult them till they go away!


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