Doctor Who: The Library of Carsus discussion

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message 1: by Travis (new)

Travis (travishiltz) | 1297 comments Well, not perfect, but pretty damn close.

A dozen plot threads tied up, a couple left untied and a few Moffatt deliberately unraveled, just to mess with people.

Capaldi was brilliant and while there were a few bits of fanfic that I wish he'd had the strength to leave alone, the good really out weighed the bad.

and how gorgeous was that console room?

Really interested to see where we go from here and who our next cute girl from now (because you know that's what the next companion will be) will be like.


message 2: by Jadetyger (new)

Jadetyger Sevea | 70 comments I wasn't as thrilled with this one as I was with Heaven Sent. It seemed a mishmash of boxes that Moffat wanted to tick off before he ends his tenure as showrunner.

And I wish he'd left Clara alone. I thought her death was just fine as it was. Ah, well. It wasn't a bad episode, just uninspiring for me. ::shrug::


message 3: by Lori S. (new)

Lori S. (fuzzipueo) | 593 comments Mod
My reaction is pretty mixed up and I think I need to see it again (and again) to really clarify what I think. Things I liked: the delegations greeting the Doctor, the way the guards dropped their guns, the Cloisters, the fact that the Doctor has forced the TLs to come outside of their walls, among other things.

I rolled my eyes at the way Moffat just...can't...let...go... of a character. Not too sure what all the hybrid stuff was about, though I was glad they referenced the TVM (is that the fanfic stuff you're referring to Trevor?) and the Diner TARDIS - everything, plus the kitchen! Soufflés for everyone!


message 4: by Travis (new)

Travis (travishiltz) | 1297 comments Yes, Clara has had three leaving scenes, and died three times and yet, she's still here...traveling the universe with Moffatt's other poor judgement Mary Sue character...that part did not impress me...though she did get a pretty cool Tardis.

Not a perfect story, but since I was pretty skeptical that he could pull it off and was still pretty happy by the ending, and Capaldi was so good, that I will forgive a few bits of 'oh, aren't I clever' from Mr. Moffatt.


message 5: by Jack (new)

Jack Bowden | 29 comments Pretty huge letdown, what was he thinking playing bait and switch with Gallifrey of all things? It's almost insulting


message 6: by Travis (new)

Travis (travishiltz) | 1297 comments Jack wrote: "Pretty huge letdown, what was he thinking playing bait and switch with Gallifrey of all things? It's almost insulting"

Probably figured it worked out pretty good for him in 'Invasion of time'.

Or he might be desperate, not thinking straight and pissed off because he spent 4 billion years punching a diamond...


message 7: by Jack (new)

Jack Bowden | 29 comments I meant Moffat not the Doctor haha


message 8: by Travis (new)

Travis (travishiltz) | 1297 comments In that case I agree a bit more that the hybrid turning out to be a huge red herring, so he could do another cosmic 'Can this relationship be saved?' story, was annoying, but there was enough cool stuff, and Clara is gone (and this time he means it...really...) that I let the annoying stuff slide.

I mean, come on, how pretty was that console room?
I could have forgiven a lot after seeing that.


message 9: by Jack (new)

Jack Bowden | 29 comments The console room was a nice touch but the episode went down the drain as soon as the extraction chamber came in. Would it have been too much to ask to just let Clara have her death in FtR and have an episode centred around Gallifrey after TEN YEARS of build up?


message 10: by Lori S. (new)

Lori S. (fuzzipueo) | 593 comments Mod
We're talking about Moffat. He avoids doing good stuff like the plague.


message 11: by Jack (new)

Jack Bowden | 29 comments Did you miss last week's, then?


message 12: by Lori S. (last edited Dec 08, 2015 07:36AM) (new)

Lori S. (fuzzipueo) | 593 comments Mod
Jack wrote: "Did you miss last week's, then?"

Which one, Heaven Sent or Hell Bent?

Heaven Sent was, to borrow a term from a friend who also watched it, bor-ing. While I appreciated the acting and some of the plot, I really, really, do not like psychological spirals of that sort. They drive me nuts.

Hell Bent was better in a lot of ways, but after the rest of this series, even the stories I was not too fond of, it too, left something to be desired. As Jadetyger says, it felt like Moffat had several boxes to tick off and that's what he did. As for the rest of it, I point out my comment above.

Though really I was referring to the conversation in general. Moffat likes to undermine things, or he does it unintentionally by going overboard. I can't quite decide ... :0)


message 13: by Travis (new)

Travis (travishiltz) | 1297 comments Critical as I can be on Moffatt, there is a ton of good stuff to be had.

Yes, he's a bit too clever for his own good,he can drift into a fan fiction-ish mind set and his need to one up Russell on the 'special girl as companion' trope gets on my nerves, but when he gets it right, he gives us near perfect moments.

I think a co-producer to help tone him down would be nice, but I have so far enjoyed the ride.


CaptKirk42 Classic Whovian (klandersen) | 180 comments Over all I liked it. Not sure which of the final two episodes I liked better "Heaven Sent" or "Hell Bent"? Aren't the titles sort of reversed in relation to their content?

Re: Heaven Sent: AKA: The Doctor Only. I liked the concept of the storyline. When I first heard they were going to have a "Doctor solo" episode I wasn't too sure what I thought of it. It was well done. Some have said it was boring, but I didn't think so. I was a little disappointed in the wraith-like baddie in it but other than that liked it.

RE: Hell Bent: There was a lot of it that had me on the edge of my seat giggling like a teenage fan-girl, just for the record I'm a middle-aged male. I wasn't literally giggling but I was enjoying the episode immensely. I agree in part about the fate of Clara, actually I'd rather she hadn't faced the raven just yet. Thought she had done that way back in "Name of the Doctor" when she got splintered into the Doctor's Time-Stream. Which apparently somehow got unsplintered, but that is another debate.

I loved the dialogue in many scenes especially the Doctor with Rassilon and in the scene with the General when he asks "Which Regeneration"? "Good luck" *blam*

AS to a new companion I really hope they at least have a companion from some era other than the current contemporary era. Go back some or maybe into the future. With companions from the distant past you have the element of them not knowing or trusting the Doctor's advanced technology, and needing to be told what somethings are. For a companion from the future you have the opposite where they are slightly bored by the Doctor's outdated tech. I've said before an alien companion would be nice. A humanoid companion makes the makeup and costuming easier, but having another race makes things more interesting. Also I tend to prefer when the Doctor has two companions. You get to spread around the obligatory "Could you explain that to me Doctor" dialogue. Having 3 or more companions just crowds the TARDIS too much and makes giving each companion an equal share of the adventure and dialogue more challenging.


CaptKirk42 Classic Whovian (klandersen) | 180 comments Lori S. wrote: "My reaction is pretty mixed up and I think I need to see it again (and again) to really clarify what I think. Things I liked: the delegations greeting the Doctor, the way the guards dropped their g..."


TVM? Not sure what that is a reference to?


message 16: by Lori S. (new)

Lori S. (fuzzipueo) | 593 comments Mod
CaptKirk42 Classic Whovian wrote: "TVM? Not sure what is that a refernce to?"

Doctor Who: The [TV] Movie (aka The Enemy Within) 1996


message 17: by Travis (new)

Travis (travishiltz) | 1297 comments CaptKirk42 Classic Whovian wrote: "Over all I liked it. Not sure which of the final two episodes I liked better "Heaven Sent" or "Hell Bent"? Aren't the titles sort of reversed in relation to their content?

Re: Heaven Sent: AKA: Th..."


I would be thrilled if the next companion was not a cute girl from now.
A bachelor Tardis crew would be great.


But, my money in the betting pool is another special girl.


message 18: by Lori S. (new)

Lori S. (fuzzipueo) | 593 comments Mod
Travis wrote: "CaptKirk42 Classic Whovian wrote: "Over all I liked it. Not sure which of the final two episodes I liked better "Heaven Sent" or "Hell Bent"? Aren't the titles sort of reversed in relation to their..."

Sadly, I agree with you. An all male crew would be cool, however, Moffat is incapable of thinking outside of the pretty girl box. Rory aside, he just doesn't seem able to write male companions.


message 19: by Travis (new)

Travis (travishiltz) | 1297 comments Lori S. wrote: "Travis wrote: "CaptKirk42 Classic Whovian wrote: "Over all I liked it. Not sure which of the final two episodes I liked better "Heaven Sent" or "Hell Bent"? Aren't the titles sort of reversed in re..."

Not just Moffatt, new Who is very much a no boys allowed Tardis.
Rory had the longest stay of any guy and they killed him three times.

Both Jack and Mickey only lasted three episodes before getting the boot.

My hopes aren't high, but I'm hoping Moffatt has gotten all his special girl ideas out of his system and will try something new.

Or at least a spin-off where Clara, Me, River and Missy team up to form a league of women that are smarter and better than you...or something, I'm still working on the name.


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