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Group Reads > The Quiet Gentleman Group Read December 2015 Chapters 11-22

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message 1: by Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂ , Madam Mod (new)

Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂  | 4182 comments Mod
So how are you liking it so far?


message 2: by Louise (new)

Louise Culmer Howard wrote: "This is my least favorite Heyer "romance". To me her biggest strength is her humor. This had little humor and little romance.

And she had (as she has had in other novels), a high class person get..."


I think it's full of humour. Miss Morville is absolutely hilarious,, almost everything she says is funny. And Gervase's exchanges with his dreadful stepmother are great. The bit at the end where She and Mr Morville are trying to outdo each other with their ancestors is wonderful.


message 3: by Elliot (last edited Dec 04, 2015 08:29AM) (new)

Elliot Jackson | 275 comments I have just re-met Mr. and Mrs. Morville, and I find them delightful, but of course, because GH is Ms. Rah-Rah Aristocracy, they are going to be mere figures of fun - hey, who needs social consciousness when there's a handsome EARL around? Sigh.. ; )


message 4: by HJ (new)

HJ | 948 comments Elliot wrote: "I have just re-met Mr. and Mrs. Morville, and I find them delightful, but of course, because GH is Ms. Rah-Rah Aristocracy, they are going to be mere figures of fun - hey, who needs social consciou..."

It is made clear by GH that the Morvilles are also of aristocratic origin, so this isn't the reason they provide some of the comedy. Their political views were extreme for the time, and they did not actually live what they preached, so they were fair game. Much of the comedy is provided by the (undoubtedly aristocratic) Dowager, who truly is a mere figure of fun.

There certainly is a great deal of humour in this book, yet I forget that when I think of it. I wish GH hadn't tried to make it a romance, because I think it fails at that. It's quite a good mystery.


message 5: by Elliot (last edited Dec 04, 2015 10:38AM) (new)

Elliot Jackson | 275 comments With regard to the Morvilles...it would have been interesting to see them actually portrayed a little more seriously - or at least, their ideas taken a little more seriously. But then GH would have been straying into Elizabeth Gaskell territory, rather than Jane Austen! : )


message 6: by Louise (new)

Louise Culmer Elliot wrote: "I have just re-met Mr. and Mrs. Morville, and I find them delightful, but of course, because GH is Ms. Rah-Rah Aristocracy, they are going to be mere figures of fun - hey, who needs social consciou..."

the Morvilles are quite aristocratic themselves - at the end mr morville and the dowager are busy trying to outdo each other on the poshness of their ancestors.


message 7: by MaryC (new)

MaryC Clawsey | 479 comments HJ wrote: "[The Morvilles'] political views were extreme for the time, and they did not actually live what they preached, so they were fair game." Well, few of us can fully live up to our ideals, but the Morvilles do seem to have instilled some excellent principles in Drusilla, in particular that of seeing one's servants as people with needs of their own and being concerned about them. Her visit to Betty makes a nice contrast with Lady St. Erb's visit to the Bolderwoods--no fanfare or overt condescension, no dressing up for the occasion or traveling with an entourage. And, ironically, Drusilla has more right to the food she takes along than does Lady St. Erb, but Drusilla has to stand up to the housekeeper to do so.


message 8: by Elliot (last edited Dec 04, 2015 12:27PM) (new)

Elliot Jackson | 275 comments Louise wrote: "Elliot wrote: "I have just re-met Mr. and Mrs. Morville, and I find them delightful, but of course, because GH is Ms. Rah-Rah Aristocracy, they are going to be mere figures of fun - hey, who needs ..."

Yeah, I know...more familiar than I care to admit with the phenomenon we used to call (at least in Detroit) "Grosse Pointe Marxists" - just saying it would have been nice to see them not used for class humor in that way, but then we'd have a different book on our hands...and yes, however funny might be the gap between their class backgrounds and their principles, they do seem to have raised a lovely daughter, so there's that.


message 9: by MaryC (new)

MaryC Clawsey | 479 comments At least one person in this group besides me is also in the Norah Lofts group and may be reminded of the landlord in To See A Fine Lady who puts his principles into effect by working in the fields beside his tenants and getting a kick out of being mistaken by strangers for one of them.


message 10: by Abigail (new)

Abigail Bok (regency_reader) | 1288 comments I love the idea of Grosse Pointe Marxists! My grandmother was pretty much a Beverly Hills Marxist, so I get it—and the Morvilles feel delightfully familiar to me.


message 11: by Kim (new)

Kim Kaso | 504 comments My husband works @ UC Berkeley in the People's Republic of Berkeley. We are knee deep in activists, demonstrators, and politics. We are passionate about some causes, but still have perspective and a sense of humor about things, which keeps things in balance. ;-)


message 12: by HJ (new)

HJ | 948 comments It was another opportunity for GH to show her research, as all her references to Mary Wollstonecraft, the Godwins, Southeys, and Coleridges were accurate. I'm just surprised that Wordsworth didn't feature as well!


message 13: by MaryC (new)

MaryC Clawsey | 479 comments HJ wrote: "It was another opportunity for GH to show her research, as all her references to Mary Wollstonecraft, the Godwins, Southeys, and Coleridges were accurate. I'm just surprised that Wordsworth didn't ..."

In fact, since GH's Regency novels all take place before or shortly after Waterloo, it's a bit surprising that none of her characters is caught reading a work by a certain favorite of ours who died in 1817.


message 14: by Louise (new)

Louise Culmer MaryC wrote: "HJ wrote: "It was another opportunity for GH to show her research, as all her references to Mary Wollstonecraft, the Godwins, Southeys, and Coleridges were accurate. I'm just surprised that Wordswo..."

I think in Regency Buck there is a scene where the heroine buys a copy of Sense and Sensibility in Hatchards.


message 15: by Margaret (new)

Margaret | 518 comments Jenny in A Civil Contract also alludes to having read it.


message 16: by Tina (new)

Tina | 75 comments This book is full of humour!
I do like Drusilla, she is so down to earth and really comes into her full light in the sick bed scenes. I also like it when Gervase takes on Lady St Erth especially over the epergne.
It is the understated humour I like and one up manship when Mr Morville challenges Lady St Erth over lineage and in between tells Drusilla that she needs Gervase to take her upstairs to rest after the setting of her arm.
And that great line of Mrs Morville
As Cordelia Consett I must deplore the state of the world but as mother she relishes the possibility of a match for Drusilla and how she can boast a little about it. She has the saving grace to see herself quite clearly and to laugh at her own double standards


message 17: by Elliot (new)

Elliot Jackson | 275 comments Tina wrote: "This book is full of humour!
I do like Drusilla, she is so down to earth and really comes into her full light in the sick bed scenes. I also like it when Gervase takes on Lady St Erth especially ov..."


I gotta say I love the Morvilles so much...I'd love to read *their* story... ; )


message 18: by Howard (new)

Howard Brazee Elliot wrote: "Louise wrote: "Elliot wrote: "I have just re-met Mr. and Mrs. Morville, and I find them delightful, but of course, because GH is Ms. Rah-Rah Aristocracy, they are going to be mere figures of fun - ..."

While I mentioned before that I wanted more humor in this book - I will note that after the story was finished, we get the funniest part of the book - with the Morvilles and Lady St Erth.


message 19: by Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂ , Madam Mod (new)

Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂  | 4182 comments Mod
The book is picking up for me now. I'm just about to start Chapter 16.

Martin seems more than spoilt doesn't he? Some of his behaviour is quite unbalanced.


message 20: by Tina (new)

Tina | 75 comments Martin is a spoilt brat who has been indulged by a very stupid mother and obviously by a father who was butter and twisted and a bully.
He looses his temper a lot and does some stupid things.
Keep going with Martin he does begin to show some humility at the end


message 21: by Louise (new)

Louise Culmer Tina wrote: "This book is full of humour!
I do like Drusilla, she is so down to earth and really comes into her full light in the sick bed scenes. I also like it when Gervase takes on Lady St Erth especially ov..."


i am glad you think it's funny - I was beginning to think it was just me!


Andrea AKA Catsos Person (catsosperson) | 1136 comments I've finished.

I loved watching Gervase fall for Drusilla.

I almost missed Drusilla falling for Gervase.


message 23: by MaryC (new)

MaryC Clawsey | 479 comments ☆ Carol ☆ wrote: "The book is picking up for me now. I'm just about to start Chapter 16.

Martin seems more than spoilt doesn't he? Some of his behaviour is quite unbalanced."


He reminds me of some of today's teen-age boys who treat their girl friends like property and bully them.


message 24: by HJ (new)

HJ | 948 comments Andrea (Catsos Person) is a Compulsive eBook Hoarder wrote: "I've finished.

I loved watching Gervase fall for Drusilla.

I almost missed Drusilla falling for Gervase."


Most of us find it easier to see Drusilla falling for Gervase! (partly because Heyer makes it explicit.)


message 25: by HJ (new)

HJ | 948 comments MaryC wrote: "☆ Carol ☆ wrote: "The book is picking up for me now. I'm just about to start Chapter 16.

Martin seems more than spoilt doesn't he? Some of his behaviour is quite unbalanced."

He reminds me of some of today's teen-age boys who treat their girl friends like property and bully them...."


I don't think that's fair to Martin. He was truly in love with Marianne and believed that she felt the same way about him. He was overcome by passion once he started kissing her, but he didn't intend to upset her or harm her.


message 26: by Susan in NC (last edited Dec 08, 2015 08:38PM) (new)

Susan in NC (susanncreader) | 3372 comments I've just finished, and also enjoyed watching Gervase and Drusilla fall for each other - and I'm glad Martin may finally be outgrowing his self-centered, bratty behavior...if only Drusilla had a sister to whip him into shape!


message 27: by Tina (new)

Tina | 75 comments And I wonder how Lady St Erth copes with the news about who the real villain is and him being let go to the West Indian property.


Lady St Erth will never accept Drusila as the mistress of the house
Maybe she and Martin wll live together but I don't think the new Martin could stand that


message 28: by HJ (last edited Dec 10, 2015 05:19AM) (new)

HJ | 948 comments Tina wrote: "And I wonder how Lady St Erth copes with the news about who the real villain is and him being let go to the West Indian property.


Lady St Erth will never accept Drusila as the mistress of the hou..."


I doubt if they would tell the Dowager that Theo had tried to kill Gervase. She'd never get her head around it and if she did she'd never keep it secret.

I've wondered about after the wedding, too. I think after quite a short while the Dowager would move out to the Dower House, once they'd found some poor lady to be her companion. She'd think she decided it, but actually it would be Gervase's doing with the agreement of Drusilla. Drusilla would then set about making Stanyon more comfortable, starting with relocating the dining room! Neither she nor Gervase would be troubled by tradition.

I think Martin will find some girl who is hunting mad, marry her, sell one of his properties and buy one closer to the hunt master he prefers, and live there.


message 29: by Louise (new)

Louise Culmer i think Martin should marry Tiffany from The Nonesuch.


message 30: by Susan in NC (last edited Dec 10, 2015 07:32AM) (new)

Susan in NC (susanncreader) | 3372 comments I like HJ's plan - the Dowager mentioned the Dower House at the beginning of the book, time for her to decamp forthwith!

And thanks, Louise, now I won't be able to get that out of my head until I dig through my bookshelves and stacks (or haunt the library) and find The Nonesuch to refresh my memory...I've got a lot reading and re-reading to do to catch up with the encyclopedic memories of this group - I'm impressed just reading the comments!


message 31: by Elliot (last edited Dec 10, 2015 07:34AM) (new)

Elliot Jackson | 275 comments Oh, Louise...I LOVE that. They would totally deserve each other! (Altho' I don't see how it's going to happen, unless he's suddenly made a Marquis...)


Andrea AKA Catsos Person (catsosperson) | 1136 comments Martin and Tiffany deserve each other!


message 33: by Susan in NC (new)

Susan in NC (susanncreader) | 3372 comments I just looked up The Nonesuch and realized I'd forgotten all about the Annnoying Tiffany, to me it is forever Waldo and Ancilla's story - now that I remember her, I wonder, is it fair to impose her on the new Martin? You all know the plots and characters by heart, surely there is some horsey, level-headed, well-bred enough young lady who could survive the gauntlet of the Dowager's impeccable standards to win and woo her precious son? Tall order, I agree...


message 34: by Elliot (new)

Elliot Jackson | 275 comments Susan wrote: "I just looked up The Nonesuch and realized I'd forgotten all about the Annnoying Tiffany, to me it is forever Waldo and Ancilla's story - now that I remember her, I wonder, is it fair to impose her..."

Hey, ALL is fair in love and war...those two would get up to some GREAT love and warfare! But Tiffany might be too much of a social climber, unless they met when she was a little older and a bit more disillusioned...even, dare I say, chastened? Worked for Martin to make him nicer...


message 35: by Susan in NC (new)

Susan in NC (susanncreader) | 3372 comments Hah, good points!


message 36: by HJ (new)

HJ | 948 comments I don't think Martin deserves Tiffany. I do feel he's been somewhat demonised!

I'm going to try to think of "some horsey, level-headed, well-bred enough young lady who could survive the gauntlet of the Dowager's impeccable standards to win and woo her precious son", as Susan suggests.


message 37: by Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂ , Madam Mod (new)

Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂  | 4182 comments Mod
I think Georgette Heyer shows us there will be a new improved Martin. Helping manage the estate will give him something to do.

Not that there is any sign of it in the book, but I think he needs a touch of "town bronze." ie to see a bit more of the world.


Andrea AKA Catsos Person (catsosperson) | 1136 comments I also thought Martin needed "town bronze" as


message 39: by MaryC (new)

MaryC Clawsey | 479 comments I wouldn't wish Tiffany on anyone!


Tadiana ✩Night Owl☽ | 361 comments MaryC wrote: "I wouldn't wish Tiffany on anyone!"

THIS.


message 41: by Tina (new)

Tina | 75 comments No I agree Tiffany is awful and I don't honk she will ever get better but I tho I Martin will.

Tiffany will marry some rogue who will do her out of all of her fortune and leave her to have tantrums in an empty room
Goodness I am almost sorry for her


message 42: by MaryC (new)

MaryC Clawsey | 479 comments I suppose Tiffany may meet some kindly but not too bright peer who finds her enchanting and indulges her every whim, even if it's with her money.


message 43: by Louise (new)

Louise Culmer i think Martin would be good at dealing with Tifanny's tantrums. Spoilt himself, he will not be cowed by them and be able to overrule her.


message 44: by Susan in NC (new)

Susan in NC (susanncreader) | 3372 comments Like Rhett Butler and Scarlett O'Hara - "Frankly, my dear..."


message 45: by Elliot (new)

Elliot Jackson | 275 comments Susan wrote: "Like Rhett Butler and Scarlett O'Hara - "Frankly, my dear...""

Yeah, see? WORK with me here, people...Martin and Tiffany! ; )


message 46: by Kim (new)

Kim Kaso | 504 comments Finished. Read it years ago, started reading GH in JR high and never really stopped. Am always rereading her, but do not think I've read this one since I read it the first time. It was not a favorite, but I found myself thoroughly enjoying it this time around. Even her second and third tier books are so much better than many others best efforts, she is a refuge from the darkness of the world, even when murder (roll of the rs) is being attempted.


message 47: by Susan in NC (last edited Dec 12, 2015 07:48AM) (new)

Susan in NC (susanncreader) | 3372 comments Thank you Kim, you put it beautifully - that's exactly how I feel about her books.


Tadiana ✩Night Owl☽ | 361 comments Elliot wrote: "Susan wrote: "Like Rhett Butler and Scarlett O'Hara - "Frankly, my dear...""

Yeah, see? WORK with me here, people...Martin and Tiffany! ; )"


I'm starting to come around -- Martin might actually be the right kind of guy to force Tiffany to turn into an actual human being. ;)


message 49: by Susan in NC (new)

Susan in NC (susanncreader) | 3372 comments You guys are killing me here - I've got Nonesuch on my re-read stack but I may have to read it NOW and reacquaint myself with this demon child while Martin is still fresh in my mind! I tend to remember all the good feelings I get from the romantic leads of the book and disregard the obnoxious other characters (unless they are truly brilliant and different and really add to the conflict/resolution of the story, like Jenny's father in "A Civil Contract.") I wanted to strangle and hug him, often at the same time...amazing!


message 50: by Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂ , Madam Mod (new)

Carol She's So Novel꧁꧂  | 4182 comments Mod
Kim wrote: "Finished. Read it years ago, started reading GH in JR high and never really stopped. Am always rereading her, but do not think I've read this one since I read it the first time. It was not a favori..."

Yes, well put. GH has always been my comfort food!


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