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Closed for the Winter > Am I rude?

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message 1: by Lulu (new)

Lulu | 31 comments ...for wanting to slam a goodreader for glib reviews that compare writing styles to sitcom scripts and contain whiny surface sarcasm (not true, clever, snarky sarcasm - you know, the good kind :))....especially when this person has misspellings in the reviews and gave 4 stars to "The DaVinci Code!!!!"

message 2: by RandomAnthony (new)

RandomAnthony That's a great question. In the brief period when the "I Hate" group (which I've since left) was interesting I thought about posting an "I hate this about goodreads" thread. I don't know. Every now and then I hit the "explore" tab and hit the "reviews of my books" tab, which shows reviews of books that you've also reviewed. I know this sounds snotty, but you see some crazy, thoughtless reviews...but I guess that's just part of the territory, public site and all that. Slam away!

message 3: by Lulu (new)

Lulu | 31 comments Ok - that part about TDC probably was rude. Everyone likes or dislikes books for many many reasons.

But still...

message 4: by Lulu (new)

Lulu | 31 comments Yeah, I'm really liking this group and although I wasn't in the "I Hate" group, from what I've read, it seems to have become pretty negative, even for a group with that very goal! So I don't want to break bad...

And I don't believe in censorship.

It's just that there are some very thoughtful, insightful reviews here, so when I perceive that someone comes across as a complainer instead of a reviewer, it's irritating.

message 5: by Paul (new)

Paul Bryant If you name and shame the review in question, we can all take a peek and report back our findings.

message 6: by Kirk (new)

Kirk | 136 comments Sometimes I think the age of snark has made us too quick on the negative draw---not just here but everywhere in the opinion-sphere. Somebody famous whose name I can't remember (how's that for a paradox?) said it's easy to diss what we dislike but harder to justify the things we do. Not to sound Pollyanna, but one of the great things I've learned from being on goodreads is what attracts folks to books and genres I might not be into. I'm kinda curious what folks get out of vampire romances or Eat, Pray, Love that I'm oblivious too. You kinda want to see that give and take be the overall rule on your own shelves (not to mention your own stuff), but it's as unenforceable as it is unspellable. Informed criticism is the goal, I guess.

message 7: by J (new)

J Now Paul - That would be rude.

message 8: by Lulu (new)

Lulu | 31 comments I deliberately didn't name and shame because I do believe that readers have a right to their opinions and I didn't want to have a goodreads smackdown.

However, the reviewer made a comment about the author's 'ridiculously large family' (it's a memoir) and how tough it was to have to go back 100 pages to figure out who he was talking about, as if the author made up family members (it's a memoir!)to irritate the reader, and how it was written in reverse like a Seinfeld episode because the author starts with the funeral and ends with the heart attach - it's a MEMOIR and he had a heart attacK....

It didn't feel as if the reviewer tried to understand what the author was trying to write. I truly don't care if this person didn't like the book - just make it be about the book and not because he had a large family.

(Also, I've been told that I'm too picky about good spelling and that everyone has typos. Sorry.)

message 9: by Charissa, That's Ms. Obnoxious Twat to You. (new)

Charissa (dakinigrl) | 3620 comments Mod
I vacillate between thinking it's oppressive to have to curtail one's honest reaction to something simply for fear of being rude or hurting some strangers feelings... and thinking I'm kind of a bull in a china shop and there's enough cruelty in the world already and it's just as easy to focus on the positive as the negative.

I have no answer to it. it's a conundrum.

That's one of the things I appreciated about the Haters Club to begin with. It was like permission to have a throw down on stuff that got under your skin. And it seemed initially people were rather good natured about it. But I think there is a fine line between good natured hate fest... and just being an asshole. Anyway... yeah, the situation degraded for sure. I did enjoy a romp in the haters fields though.

message 10: by Jillian (last edited Feb 25, 2008 01:38PM) (new)

Jillian Some people are not as eloquent of writers as others. They are more simple in their style of writing reviews of books. The average book reader on here are not professional writers. They are just speaking their mind as best they can and shouldn't be slammed for it.

message 11: by Sarah (new)

Sarah (songgirl7) Yes, Jillian, that is how I feel. I usually know what I like or didn't like but have a hard time expressing it. So my reviews are very simple. I'm not a professional lit critic and I don't pretend to be.

message 12: by Meels (new)

Meels (Amelia) I'm sure mine are probably rubbish at least half of the time, but what the hell, I just let it rip! If you went off on me because my review sucked, I'd just unfriend you so you didn't have to read my crap reviews anymore and then go on about my day! But, that's just me...this other person, whoever they are, might really get hurt by it. A good natured debate over the merits of the review, well now, that might be fun!

message 13: by Paul (new)

Paul Bryant Donald, it was my fault for being just a leetle bit too provocative!

message 14: by Charissa, That's Ms. Obnoxious Twat to You. (new)

Charissa (dakinigrl) | 3620 comments Mod

message 15: by Lulu (new)

Lulu | 31 comments So I'm guessing that, yes - most of you think I'm rude! :)

I don't post reviews if I can't be articulate about the book, and I won't slam the reviewer.

Mea culpas all around.


message 16: by RandomAnthony (last edited Feb 26, 2008 04:58AM) (new)

RandomAnthony I wouldn't say I think you're rude, Lulu. I think you were pissed off. And I wouldn't trust a person who didn't get pissed off now and then.

edit: Except for the Dalai Lama. If he got pissed off I would be worried.

message 17: by Shelly (new)

Shelly I think your confusing rudeness with snobbery. You got upset because their amateur review didn't conform to what you expect or want from a negative review (as if there are rules here) and then went behind their back and said "psst. hey. do you guys think I'm rude because I think this person's review sucks? I don't want to name and shame--but they said this and that and can you believe it?"
When all you had to do was comment on their review in the first place.

message 18: by Thorton (new)

Thorton I would have to agree with Shelly on the snobbery.

message 19: by RandomAnthony (new)

RandomAnthony I don't know. I didn't think Lulu was esp. harsh here...I think she was just expressing some frustration because the review sucked...I don't see how you avoid that sometimes. Lulu seemed like she was venting. I get that.

message 20: by Charissa, That's Ms. Obnoxious Twat to You. (new)

Charissa (dakinigrl) | 3620 comments Mod
Personally I fucking hated the Da Vinci Code and I don't care who is offended by that. It was hack writing and a stolen core idea. And anyone who rates it with 5 stars I view with thinly veiled suspicion. Am I a snob? God I hope so. I've worked pretty hard to become this insufferably intolerant. I would hope it at least shows a little.

Lulu... wear it as a badge of pride. As a friend of mine says... "Of course I'm better than everyone else... aren't you?" Heh.

message 21: by Meels (new)

Meels (Amelia) No, I guess I have a snobby side as well, because I force myself not to comment whenever I see people endlessly discussing the Harry Potter books. Not on the merit of the writing itself, or the general enjoyment of the story (I enjoyed the Eragon books, but that may have been just because there was a dragon in it...and I have been berated plenty already, so deep breaths everyone!). I mean the endless threads about Dumbledore (sp) being gay or who aught to marry who when they grow up...the characters...hello...are we spending far too much time in the fantasy genre people? I could comment, and I often want to comment. But then I think, “Do I really want to discuss it with these people?” Why should I care if they spend their days mulling over whether or not Harry is a homo? Don't let it get to you Lulu, just unfriend the illiterate ass and move on! Oh, wait...was it me? Oh, no, if it was DC, I didn't read that...whew! Carry on!

message 22: by Shelly (new)

Shelly i'm not suggesting she doesn't have the right to hate the da vinci code, or harry potter, or whatever. or even that she should be hesitant to do so, or not have a space to vent about it.

what annoyed her to begin with was not that this person disliked a particular book, but that they expressed their dislike in a way that she doesn't approve of.

well, so what? if it bugs you that bad then have the balls to comment on their review--tell them why you disagree or whatever. start a conversation about it.

she asked "am i rude b/c...."
and I'm just saying "no, you're a snob b/c..."

message 23: by [deleted user] (new)

i'm the lonely hater who still likes the haters club but the art thread and then this caught my eye
sometimes i write crap
sometimes i think i write sublime witty intelligent informative jewels
you may still think it's crap
i read dc
but i wouldn't review it or read a review on it
i spend all together too much time here but i got a lot of time on my hands right now
i've got plenty of books to read
but i still like lookin at your stuff
read and write on
it's not all good and when i feel like hatin i uh hate
does it matter?

message 24: by Seizure Romero (new)

Seizure Romero | 116 comments Lulu, you're not rude at all for "wanting to slam a goodreader for glib reviews..." (italics added). You're only rude if you actually do it, and even then it doesn't have to be rude if done in the form of respectful debate. There's a quote to the tune of "Your right to be heard doesn't include the right to be taken seriously." The best and worst thing about the internet is now anyone with a connection can voice an opinion heard around the world. Unfortunately, it doesn't have to be a well-reasoned, intelligent, logical or grammatically correct opinion. The good part is that we have the right (and sometimes the responsibility) to dismiss these opinions; hell, we can, and often do, make fun of them. The problems start, in my opinion, when people start taking themselves (and everyone else) too seriously. I wrote a snarky, mean and dismissive review of Dan Brown's Digital Fortress. My friend thought it was hilarious and I probably offended someone, somewhere, and I really don't care. They don't like my review? Great. So completely their problem. We discriminate, we critique; that's what this site is about. We don't have to agree.

I could go on and bore all of us, but instead I will simply quote the amazing Charissa: "Am I a snob? God I hope so. I've worked pretty hard to become this insufferably intolerant. I would hope it at least shows a little."

message 25: by Sarah (new)

Sarah (songgirl7) I'm a total snob and I love Harry Potter and I love Amy. Heh.

message 26: by J (new)

J I agree the line is drawn between wanting to and actually doing it. And even then it's not necessarily rude if you are truly trying to edify. I guess I'm more likely to think what a shame they completely missed the point of the book and go on since I've many times completely missed the point myself. Unfortunately I'm also less likely to write a review knowing how much more qualified the rest of you are to do so.

message 27: by Meels (new)

Meels (Amelia) Don't misunderstand; I'm not saying that I don't like Harry Potter. I've watched most of the films, but have never read any of the books. I don't dislike it at all. I just think it is pathetic in the extreme the threads that get started about the Harry Potter books in particular. I mean have you ever seen a thread about The Secret Garden debating whether Mary grew up to marry her cousin Colin or Dickon, or if perhaps Fagin in Oliver Twist is really a pedophile and that is why he liked to keep all of those little boys around? There are those who like HP, then there are the HP People...I am the former and my snobbery is rankled by the latter.

message 28: by Lulu (new)

Lulu | 31 comments Whew...and THIS is why I love Goodreads. Because some people think I'm rude, some people think I'm not, some people think I'm a snob (although that wasn't my question but thank you for putting me in my place, Shelly - I stand corrected) and some people think that being a book snob is a great thing - and I happen to be one of them.

I do think that spelling counts. And grammar counts -hell, starting this sentence with And would drive any English grammar teacher around the bend so I'm breaking my own rule. Sure, typos happen, but what happened to standards? And again, for god's sake, take on the content of the book to review, not the author's family size!

I guess in the end, I was really asking whether it was worth the effort to debate the reviewer over the review - when it turned out to be sooo much more fun to debate it here without ever touching the reviewer. :)

And thanks to all who were irritated with me - you actually made my point when you asked why I didn't just take the reviewer on with my point of view. There was no POV to debate!

'Nuff said. Let's go find some Voodoo doughtnuts.

message 29: by Jillian (new)

Jillian WTF are voodoo donuts?

message 30: by Sarah (new)

Sarah (songgirl7) Amy, you should read them.

message 31: by Seizure Romero (new)

Seizure Romero | 116 comments Jillian: see the Food! thread.

message 32: by J (new)

J Thank God it's called Goodreads and not Goodwriting. They'd have never let me in the door. Now pass me one of those freaky doughnuts.

message 33: by Shelly (new)

Shelly Lulu- I think you meant doughnuts, not doughtnuts?
Typos happen!

message 34: by Charissa, That's Ms. Obnoxious Twat to You. (new)

Charissa (dakinigrl) | 3620 comments Mod
Romero... ::::blows kisses:::: you're sweet.

message 35: by Lulu (new)

Lulu | 31 comments Shelly - sooooo great that you were able to skewer me with my own typos sword! :)!

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