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Comic Books > My Thoughts on Wonder Woman... For real!

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message 1: by Nicky (new)

Nicky Wheeler-Nicholson | 13 comments DC has had a hard time updating this character. The best update by far, in my opinion is the TV series starring Lynda Carter. There are also corporate issues because the Marston family--creator William Moulton Marston--still has some control. And yes, I think there are definitely problems in figuring out how to have a super woman who is obviously sexy as well as capable.

message 2: by J.T. (new)

J.T. Bock (jtbock) | 22 comments I find that DC is doing a good job of writing Wonder Woman's character in the animated film versions. I'm really enjoying DC's animated moves about the Justice League and other films that focus on individual storylines. In the latest animated film, Justice League War, I loved Wonder Woman's character in this new telling of how the Justice League formed. She was a strong leader, yet had an endearing human side, as she learned to deal with a world where men are in the majority of leadership positions.

message 3: by Nicky (new)

Nicky Wheeler-Nicholson | 13 comments I haven't seen the animated films so I'll check it out. Thanks!

message 4: by J.T. (new)

J.T. Bock (jtbock) | 22 comments You're welcome! I'm surprised at the adult themes in these movies, which can deal with very dark subjects. I recently enjoyed Justice League War, Justice League: The Flashpoint Paradox, Superman: Unbound, Superman/Batman: Apocalypse, and a Wonder Woman animated film where Wonder Woman is voiced by Keri Russell. All are animated and definitely not just for kids (and some probably aren't appropriate for children younger than 13). You can find most streaming on Amazon Prime or through Netflix. Hope you enjoy!

message 5: by Smoh (new)

Smoh | 2 comments Yes, DC is going an amazing job on it's animated films, I really enjoyed them.
Maybe it's just me, but it still felt like her character is very dependent on all the other characters.

message 6: by [deleted user] (last edited Mar 31, 2014 12:55AM) (new)

Wonder Woman is a disgrace to women.

She can't run straight and her outfit does little to conceal her body. It's like virtual eye candy.

She relies mostly on other characters and her weapon is a rope.

Am I the only one who sees the irony in this? Take a minute to think over what that means.

~ Mrs. Opinionated

Now feel free to harass me for my opinions. :)

message 7: by Martha (new)

Martha Burns | 22 comments Yeah but if she's had a bow and arrow like other Amazons, wouldn't she have had to cut off a boob? Snort.

Yeah, women in geekdom is very much give with one hand, take away with the other.

I play WoW and according to a friend, when the female pandas were introduced, there was outcry that they were too fat. It's a panda. Also WTF male gamers?

message 8: by Valerie (new)

Valerie (darthval) Are you guys talking classic Wonder Woman or referring to the Wonder Woman of the New 52.

I am newer to comics, so my experience with Wonder Woman is limited to the Linda Carter TV show and the storyline from the New 52.

As for the classic show, not a poster child for feminism to be sure. As a child, in that time frame, I wanted to BE Diana. If I revisit as an adult, hmm, I can see the flaws.

Regarding the New 52 version, I LOVE it!. I think Wonder Woman is a fierce, battle trained warrior. Her outfit is still on the skimpy side, but she is depicted with a much more realistic breast size.

message 9: by Ma'Belle (new)

Ma'Belle (linguisticness) | 54 comments Brian Azzarello's New 52 Wonder Woman has, in my opinion, been the best book out of DC's New 52.

The animated movies featuring her, however, have made me gag. I really don't understand why some of you find it to be such a good depiction, but whatever, that's just a matter of opinion.

I've also really enjoyed seeing a few documentaries and historical nonfiction accounts of her creation and evolution as a feminist icon, such as PBS' Independent Lens: Wonder Women!

I really think the new/current version of her, with its heavier reliance on a rich pantheon of gods and goddesses would make a better film/TV series than the earlier canons where she's always yoked to Steve, Supes, et al.

message 10: by Corrina (new)

Corrina Lawson | 22 comments Yes, that Wonder Woman documentary is terrific, as it also covers other superheroines from the past and their influence on the present:

I'd highly recommend the George Perez run on Wonder Woman where he redefined the characters, and most of Phil Jimenez' run and Greg Rucka also did great job with the character. But the story arc that seems definitive to me is Gail Simone's The Circle, which really delves into the mythology of Paradise Island and, well, I think it's a story only a woman could have written.

WW didn't used to be a favorite of mine but now she is because I love how the best stories of the character combine her compassion and her confidence.

message 11: by Martha (new)

Martha Burns | 22 comments The animated movies featuring her, however, have made me gag. I really don't understand why some of..."

I feel you in terms of very different reactions to gender tropes. There's a thread here on Pern, which struck me as . . . well, let's just say I didn't have the same positive reactions. I feel like we're in a position with gender tropes that we have to allow a bunch of things or let slide a bunch of things to enjoy anything at all. On closer examination, so much of our depiction of women and gender is just awful (I think here especially of the Scott Pilgrim plot element of curing lesbians). Many women I talked with didn't find it as unbelievably awful as I did though.

And I like Barbie. Here's how that's relevant: for me, she's an icon of what the culture considers femininity and as a girl, playing with her let me feel I was in control of that and could subvert it. I sometimes get the impression our response to certain tropes that would be problematic if you looked at them one way would be less problematic from the perspective of a reader who is in control. If that makes sense. But I still think Scott Pilgrim sucks :)

message 12: by Ma'Belle (new)

Ma'Belle (linguisticness) | 54 comments Thank you for that great additional comment, Martha.

message 13: by Corrina (new)

Corrina Lawson | 22 comments On Pern, some of us who remember the stories fondly read it when we were in our early teens oh, some years back. Like, say, the 1970s. (I iz old.)

So, the world around us at that point colored our perception of the material and even the material itself. At the time, McCaffrey's stories of women taking the lead was progressive, as was even her inclusion of gay relationships. Now, however, some of that is quite dated. Would I love Pern as much if I'd read it just now? I suspect not. But at the time, it gave me a vision of a world where women were valued for their talents, fought for careers/jobs that had real impact, and for equal say in decisions.

I can't convince anyone who doesn't see that in the material for them of its value, of course, and that's absolutely fine. I can only explain why the stories meant so much for me and the context of why that happened.

I suspect it's the same for Wonder Women. The reason Wonder Woman was created wasn't as a male alternative to Superman but as a women of strength and a role model to girls. (Well, among other things.) Over the years, you can see how she changes as society changes--Gloria Steinem grew up seeing WW as a strong, in-charge person. So she put her on the cover of Ms. magazine.

But DC saw her as somewhat problematic and depowered her for a while, going for an Emma Peel-style adventurer because that was hot at the time. Then she eventually was rebooted by George Perez, who emphasized the mythology, the Amazons, and her effect on the world around her. She's had some good runs since but nothing with sustained success because DC keeps rebooting her.

That's the reason she doesn't have a solid secondary cast because, unlike Batman and Superman, people kept thinking they had to improve her. I can't even count how many times Paradise Island has been destroyed or the Amazons turned evil. This, to me, says someone in charge at DC has serious issues with women. (Don't even get me started that she's now Superman's Girlfriend.)

To show you how unique WW is, there's only *one* other Golden Age female character that even has a presence right now at DC that *doesn't* rest her identity on being an offshoot of a male hero and that's Black Canary.

If any of you have seen Winter Soldier and saw what happened at the end of his fight with Captain America, all I can saw is that was very much something WW would do. She's not that tricky, if Marvel can have a talking raccoon and they can make a World War II character who wears the American flag compelling.

message 14: by Martha (new)

Martha Burns | 22 comments Beautiful post!

message 15: by Corrina (new)

Corrina Lawson | 22 comments Awww.. thank you!

message 16: by Ma'Belle (new)

Ma'Belle (linguisticness) | 54 comments Yes, Corrina, thank you for adding your perspective. Whenever I see that word "Pern" in this group's threads I think it must be some sort of slash fanfic.

In WW news, yesterday I tried watching the 2011 Wonder Woman TV pilot, and could barely make it more than 17 minutes in before having to turn it off. It was soooo terrible! Why?! Maybe someone will make a motion comic of Brian Azzarello's Wonder Woman? It seems the only good DCU films are animated anyway (Batman excepted, but even then, the animated films are much better than the live action features).

message 17: by Corrina (new)

Corrina Lawson | 22 comments Warner Bros. views the Wonder Woman film as a sales failure because it didn't immediately sell a zillion copies. Instead, it had a steady stream of sales that make it an overall success.

But it's been decided female-led animated movies don't sell. That's why the recent Supergirl film was marketed as a Superman film. (To be fair, he has a large part. But it's Kara's story.)

message 18: by Kirsten (new)

Kirsten (ringwraith10) | 49 comments I haven't seen any of the Wonder Woman animated films (I'm strangely lacking in knowledge of many DC animations, unfortunately). I would love to see a new live action Wonder Woman film, but I can't really see it being good -- not because there is anything wrong with Wonder Woman herself, but because DC seems to be doing very poorly with any of their movies that are not about Batman. :/

I was just watching Xena the other day and thinking about how similar she is to Wonder Woman (or, at least, who Wonder Woman should be). Wouldn't it be interesting if someone cast Lucy Lawless as Diana...

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