Goodreads Librarians Group discussion

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Policies & Practices > Suggestions for new librarians

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JG (The Introverted Reader) | 462 comments Thanks, Otis!


message 52: by Kathrynn (new)

Kathrynn | 189 comments Otis wrote: "Rivka showed me a trick that helped me find a librarian's edits easier. Separate out one book that has the change you're looking for and look at that librarian log

You shouldn't need to do that. ..."


Very nice. Thank you, Otis. On Sunday, no less.




message 53: by Cait (new)

Cait (tigercait) | 5005 comments Otis wrote: "I just added a toggle to show just the edits for a particular edition."

Sweet! Thanks, Otis!


message 54: by Lisa (new)

Lisa Vegan (LisaVegan) | 2378 comments Wow! Yes, on a Sunday. Thanks, Otis!


message 55: by jenjn79 (new)

jenjn79 | 565 comments Thanks so much, Otis! That's a great option to have!


message 56: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 30551 comments Mod
Cool 2


message 57: by Cyn (new)

Cyn Armistead (technomom) | 159 comments FWIW, I'd be happy to help with the librarian manual, in any format--wikified or otherwise. I was a technical writer, among other things, when I worked outside the home.


message 58: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 30551 comments Mod
Someday - and that day may never come - we'll call upon you to do a service.

;)


message 59: by Lindig (new)

Lindig | 167 comments rivka wrote: "Heh. Those are both already suggested in the welcome email. Enforcing is difficult, to say the least. ;)"
GR says I'm a member of this group but I never got the welcome email. I don't know where the manual is. I don't know what to do now. Can someone point me in the right direction? Thanks. Lindig



message 60: by Ben (new)

Ben Babcock (tachyondecay) | 62 comments You can get to the librarian manual from the help page accessible at the bottom of every page on the site. It's got a wealth of information, so start by reading that.

Then, if you've any other immediate questions, search this group or post a topic. We're happy to help. If you come across something and you're unsure what to do, ask for a second opinion. That's why we're here.

Well that, and also because we all have great hair and dazzling personalities.... You'll be receiving your spa pass by carrier pigeon soon.


message 61: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 30551 comments Mod
Lindig, you are a member of this group. But you never got an email because you never requested to become a librarian.

The Manual is here.


message 62: by Melody (new)

Melody (runningtune) | 9449 comments Lindig, First you have to apply to be a librarian. Here is all the info you need to know about GoodRead's Librarians. http://www.goodreads.com/help/librarian




message 63: by Lindig (new)

Lindig | 167 comments Melody wrote: "Lindig, First you have to apply to be a librarian. Here is all the info you need to know about GoodRead's Librarians. http://www.goodreads.com/help/librarian

"
Thanks, all, for the info. I believe I have now successfully applied. If not, I'll be back.

Lindig




message 64: by Brixton (new)

Brixton | 43 comments After spending four hours tonight (with still more tidying to do!) untangling the scrambled nightmare of 30-some editions of two distinct works with titles in five languages being incorrectly combined all as one book by some over-eager?/unobservant? librarian, fixing many foreign-language editions incorrectly matched to English titles, correcting publication dates, languages, authors, and tranlators of everything written by Knut Hamsun (as well as many titles about him), I believe I have tonight earned the priviledge to be his caretaker-- should that idea ever come into being. ;o)

Oh I dread if someone goes combine-crazy again on everything I re-matched tonight. But I couldn't help wondering who/why would someone make such dramatic changes if they don't even know the author well enough to know 1) that they shouldn't combine everything just because it starts with the letter W; and 2) that everything that starts with W shouldn't be combined with everything not in English.

Would there be any way of displaying librarian change notes off to the side of the edit page, making them "sticky" on the first log page, or requiring change notes to be previewed seperately before continuing to the editing process? (Example: on eBay if you want to post a question to a seller, you have to look at any questions others have asked already before sending your own.) Too clunky? I just suspect the link to the change log is often overlooked/purposely skipped and special notes can quickly get buried under subsequent edits.

I don't know how much more strongly it needs to be emphasised, but observing what others are doing/have done before jumping in + reminding them to be SURE before making changes should be flashing on the pages in neon pink or something-- no, I'm kidding. Please don't do that. ;o) I'm just at a loss for ideas how to stress these two points to people who are going to make changes regardless of whether they are qualified to do so (for example: if someone doesn't know French, they shouldn't guess which French titles go with the English ones-- you'd think this would be intuitive, but I learned tonight it is not).

Oh well, I'd still give a toe if I could do this all day as a payin' job :o)


JG (The Introverted Reader) | 462 comments You might want to add librarian notes, Brixton. I just looked at his combine page and saw that you haven't. They've got to help some, right? :-) I've added a few to Gabriel Garcia Marquez's combine page. If you need instructions, just let us know. Sorry if you know about these. I just thought I would make sure.


message 66: by Brixton (last edited Jun 13, 2009 06:44PM) (new)

Brixton | 43 comments Hm, I added a note to each of the books that were an issue... you're not seeing them?

A few minutes later: I see the difference between your notes and mine, mine don't show up on the combine page, just the change log. I'm guessing that's the difference between adding a "change comment" and a "libraian comment"? If you'd be so kind, please point me to an informative thread which instructs about the differences in when to use one or the other comment option. And, eh, uh, disregard all of what I wrote above ;o)


message 67: by Ben (new)

Ben Babcock (tachyondecay) | 62 comments The "change comments" are actually new and designed to summarize what you edited.

"Librarian comments" show up when a librarian is editing the same book.

"Librarian notes", what JG recommended adding, will show up on the combine page. There's a link to add a note right above the title field on the book's edit page.


message 68: by Brixton (new)

Brixton | 43 comments I swear that wasn't there last night ;o)

Thanks, I got it worked out!


message 69: by Trin (new)

Trin | 6 comments vicki_girl wrote: "I would like to third (fourth?) the suggestions on
(1) being a member for a certain time period.
(2) only a certain number of edits per day for a certain time period."


*waves* All newly Librarian statused here, and I'd just like to chip in on a few points.

First off, I'm replying to two posts, but I'm not sure yet whether the "email me when people reply" link is directed at the entire thread, or the individual comment, and so am combining my comments within this reply. I have no doubt that SKS can inform me of how the "email reply" feature works though. :)

@(1) Having been a member for a certain amount of time may not always help. Speaking personally, I've been registered on here for, oh, probably well over a year now (maybe even two), but I have actually very very rarely used the site. Luckily, I'm the sort of user who will RTFM when doing things like making edits on a site such as this, however, I realise that not everyone is going to be as sensible as this, and so it's not always going to be guaranteed that length of subscription equates to actual working knowledge of the site.

@(2) Much as this could (possibly) impede the work I joined up as a librarian to do, I'd be happy to be limited in how many edits I can do, and I suspect anyone who complain about such a constraint may possibly not be the 'best' sort of person to be awarded Librarian status.

Of course, if (2) were to be implemented, it would also need to be clarified as to what exactly constitutes a 'counted edit'. E.g. If I'd just edited $book, and then realised that I'd made a typo in my edit and so had to edit that too, would that count as another edit against my 'score', or would editing my own work (say, for example, anything I'd done in the past two hours) not count as an extra edit?


Otis wrote: "Long term, I think we need to move to be more like Wikipedia, with better change logs, ability to follow an article, and arbitration."

While I'm not Geek enough to know exactly how much work this would entail, I do think it is a VERY GOOD idea. That said, I also agree that such a Wikifying may need to be locked down to the more knowledgeable users so as to prevent even more chaos being caused by the "think they know it all"s propagating further misinformation.


message 70: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 30551 comments Mod
Welcome! :)

Trin wrote: "I'm the sort of user who will RTFM when doing things like making edits on a site such as this"

BLESS you. (I should finish updating the manual, huh? ;) )


message 71: by Trin (last edited Jul 06, 2009 06:29PM) (new)

Trin | 6 comments What can I say, I was Internet-raised by Geeks. <g>

I'm sorry though; I didn't mean to create even more work for you just by saying hello (it's a good manual though). ;)

ETA: And I've just realised something that answers one of the questions I asked.

"You are following this discussion (instant) edit"

At least I know now it's the entire thread I'm following. :)


message 72: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 30551 comments Mod
Trin wrote: "I didn't mean to create even more work for you"

You didn't. :) I was hoping to get to it yesterday, and wasn't able to. It's been on my I-hope-to-have-time-soon list for a while now.


message 73: by Mel (new)

Mel (Lefty4) | 7 comments I am new here and I have a question or it could be a suggestion-Is there an area that newbie librarians like myself can go to in order to get the correct info for people.


message 74: by Paula (last edited Jul 07, 2009 10:06AM) (new)

Paula (Paulaan) | 7016 comments Mel - What do you mean by "for people" do you mean the Authors?

There is a thread here started by rivka with helpful links for librarians

http://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/1...

There is also the Librarians manual which can be accessed when you edit a book.

Otherwise - googlebooks, Worldcat and the authors websites are places to look for information


message 75: by Salvatrice (new)

Salvatrice Lisa wrote:
For members who want to make just a few changes, they can come into the librarians group and request that librarians make those changes..."


It might be helpful to have an easy to find link such as "contact a librarian" (or something) on the home page for this...that definitely would have prevented me from applying for librarian status. I didn't realize joining/visiting the group to find someone willing to make the changes was even an option until now. I read the manual, and these threads---it's a huge time commitment when all I really wanted to do was give some information about one book!


message 76: by Carolyn (new)

Carolyn (seeford) | 579 comments That's a good point Salvatrice - can you post it on the Feedback thread for others to chime in on? I like the idea, personally. =)


message 77: by Salvatrice (new)

Salvatrice Carolyn wrote: "That's a good point Salvatrice - can you post it on the Feedback thread for others to chime in on? I like the idea, personally. =)"

will do. thanks.


message 78: by Shelleyrae (new)

Shelleyrae at Book'd Out | 31 comments I would like to suggest that increasing the amount of books from 50 to something like 500 or even higher before being able to apply as a librarian would be helpful if GR is concerned about librarian commitment.
While it would not be foolproof of course I think those who then decided to apply as librarians (and without any offense intended to those who have less) would be more likely to care about book information accuracy, demonstrate some commitment to and familiarity with GR since it would take a reasonable amount of time to create a list that size, perhaps would be more likely to come across books that have not yet been catalogued and would likely weed out those who just like the status.

Having said that I have only just applied, largely because I often find Australian published books (as I am Australian) are not catalogued and while I used to just not worry I have come to rely on GR to help me keep track of what i have read so I would like to add these books and others I come across :)



message 79: by Keishua (new)

Keishua | 4 comments I am not sure it matters how many books a person has read. The ability to edit has very little to do with how much you have read or even what you read.
That said, I think that there needs to be stricter ropes on the edits that people make. Maybe, there could be a group of librarians that approve certain types of changes(like combining). So maybe, those large changes would have to be approved by the respected panel(who would have to show competency in this area) before they become public. That may be a lot of work-to find a competency rubric for the panels( I was thinking all large changes could be divided into some sort of area and assigned a panel), to actually proof the edits and approve them.
In addition, there could be an outlet for those who disagree with the panels decision. Just some thoughts.





message 80: by Rose (new)

Rose | 5 comments I hear what everyone is saying about the new librarians who cause chaos, but at the same time I do think there are probably a lot of people like me who are doing useful work, maybe not much per person, but enough to make a difference en masse - but who would be put off by very lengthy qualification procedures or having to post every little typo they want fixing in this group for someone else to handle.

I've been a librarian for ages and I really only use my Powers, Such As They Are to fix obvious mistakes in books I come across, or combine obvious instances of the same book, or add cover images.

I only joined this group today because I wanted to see how I should handle aliases, as it was annoying me that they were done inconsistently in the various books I have on my shelves by Saki, aka HH Munro (I never quite found out what to do, so I ended up just leaving it).

You might want to check out how Distributed Proofreaders allow people access to the first level of proofreading - read the guidance & an interactive quiz, then someone keeps an eye on your first efforts to make sure you're doing it okay, and lets you know if not.


message 81: by Carolyn (new)

Carolyn (seeford) | 579 comments Rose wrote: "I only joined this group today because I wanted to see how I should handle aliases, as it was annoying me that they were done inconsistently in the various books I have on my shelves by Saki, aka HH Munro (I never quite found out what to do, so I ended up just leaving it)."

Rose, for aliases, until the softward fix is complete (they are working on it, but it's a difficulty fix), the consensus was to keep each author independently listed, but adding a line to the description with a link to the other author's name.

Here's the most recent post on the topic:

"message 34: by Phil 02/23/2009 04:46AM

So what's the current policy? I've just fixed up a book by "K.E. Mills" which is a pseudonym used by "Karen Miller" (I had to remove the reference to the latter to combine two editions which were listed one under each name). Do I add "Karen Miller" as a co-author, role=pseudonym, or do I edit the entry for "K.E. Mills" or what?

-----------
message 35: by rivka, Volunteer Mod 02/23/2009 06:48AM

None of the above. Otis has asked that we not use the roles ability to add in a pseudonym's real name. I would suggest editing K.E. Mills' bio to mention that it is a pseudonym for Karen Miller (with a link), and add the converse to Karen Miller's bio.

Then we wait for the long-awaited aka feature."




message 82: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 30551 comments Mod
Actually, Otis said later than that (in the same thread, I think), that it was ok to add the author's other name as a secondary author. Preferably without "pseudonym" or the like.


message 83: by Carolyn (new)

Carolyn (seeford) | 579 comments rivka wrote: "Actually, Otis said later than that (in the same thread, I think), that it was ok to add the author's other name as a secondary author. Preferably without "pseudonym" or the like."

Ah, didn't scroll down far enough I see. Thanks for the info rivka!


message 84: by Donna (new)

Donna (donnaweyer) | 44 comments Hurray!! Thanks!


message 85: by Laura (new)

Laura | 106 comments A question to the super librarians: I was checking the work by Honoré de Balzac and I found that his "Comédie Humaine" is grouped altogether. May I separate them and put some order on this mess? For more details, please look at: http://www.goodreads.com/book/combine...
Thanks.


message 86: by Cait (new)

Cait (tigercait) | 5005 comments Laura wrote: "A question to the super librarians: I was checking the work by Honoré de Balzac and I found that his "Comédie Humaine" is grouped altogether. May I separate them and put some order on this mess?"

Oh, please do! That would be fantastic.


message 87: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (last edited Dec 06, 2009 10:27AM) (new)

rivka | 30551 comments Mod
Check out the Sisyphean List thread in the View-Only folder.

And welcome!


message 88: by Unclebill (new)

Unclebill | 2 comments ok, take the Parragon Publishing list. It appears from the publishers website and from the worldcat that thats all there is and there aint no more.

What is the Parragon Publishing list in the Sisyphean list needing?


message 89: by Lisa (new)

Lisa Vegan (LisaVegan) | 2378 comments Unclebill, All the items on that list either need proper authors or need to be NABed, usually they need authors. Sometimes there are no real authors and it can't be done, but we usually find corrected information for the majority of items.


message 90: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 30551 comments Mod
As Lisa said, most of those books shouldn't have Parragon Publishing as their author -- that's a publisher, and should only be listed as an author if there is no known author. Which may be true for some on the list, but likely not most and certainly not all.

For each book, if you go through one at a time, checking Amazon, Google Books, WorldCat, and if those are unhelpful, other sites, you can often find a real author.


message 91: by Unclebill (new)

Unclebill | 2 comments I've been reading numerous postings about NABing (not a book-ing) and I've come to the conclusion that there is just no consensus here about almost anything, especially about cook books.

That is not a bad thing, its just that there is nobody with the final say, and most things are finally evaluated on a case-by-case basis.

We all love our books, calendars, stickers, pamphlets, sticky notes, scraps of paper, loose bindings containing the drivels of one-time-writers posted by the author themselves - undistributed because the government confiscated and classified the document as insane and dangerous to anyone who reads it.

So, in my free time I'll press on and be careful and diligent not to NAB or delete too much with out due research.


message 92: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 30551 comments Mod
Cookbooks?!? None of those should be NAB'd.


message 93: by Lisa (last edited Dec 06, 2009 01:47PM) (new)

Lisa Vegan (LisaVegan) | 2378 comments NABs are things such as calendars, street maps (a la AAA), dumpbins, floor displays, board games, card decks, dolls, toys, note pads, note cards, etc.

Cookbooks are books, as Rivka said. As far I I know there's never been any disagreement about those!


message 94: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl Be careful with "dolls" though - there are bound books of paper dolls (Tom Tierney is a popular author) that many people like; they have minimal text (often just an introduction at the beginning and the rest is simply paper dolls) but they should be considered books, at least as far as I'm concerned.


message 95: by Lisa (new)

Lisa Vegan (LisaVegan) | 2378 comments Lobstergirl, True. I'm talking about dolls that you can hug, and that don't come with a book.


message 96: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl Kill those dolls.


message 97: by Steven (new)

Steven (yam655) | 26 comments Okay, first off: I don't particularly favor stronger limits for new Libraries. Why? I started using the site about two days ago, yesterday I applied for Librarian status after I ran in to a second issue with books I have read. (I have a fondness for good meta-information.) I read the manual (which is a bit short), and I've consulted more knowledgeable folks when I've had issues.

I've mostly modified P.G. Wodehouse books. There were a bunch of recent editions pulled from Amazon which had "P.^G." instead of "P.G.". I fixed the author and merged them in to the other editions.

One of the editions of an anthology contained different stories than included in most of the editions. While I may have inadvertently combined it initially, (I can not say for certain that I did not), I split it out and added both a Librarian's Comment as well as a note in the description that it contains different stories than most editions with a similar title.

What I would like to see is finer grained Librarian permissions, with mock-up trials that need to be completed before a particular permission was enabled.

Why finer-grained permissions? If someone is only interested in adding photos to their books, they shouldn't need to have access to changing other things. If they have the access, they may be tempted to make a "minor" change to something they're unfamiliar with at some point.

Why a mock-up trial? Part of the difficulty in using any interface is getting used to it, and not just reading about it. If they could be tested on whether they recognize certain errors, and whether they actually fix issues versus creating new issues (particularly issues documented as having a "right" solution) it should be a great help.

Along with this, if a person makes too much work for other Librarians it would be great if the system could suspend their privs until they redo the trial successfully.


message 98: by daisy (new)

daisy | 2 comments Hi all! :)
I’m new here and I have a question. I am adding a Chinese edition of the book The Dream of the Red Chamber (Hong Lou Meng). I understand that data should be entered in the same language as the edition; but in the case of Chinese, should I enter the actual Chinese character (e.g. 紅樓夢) or the Chinese pronunciation (e.g. Hong Lou Meng) as seen in a few other cases?



This Is Not The Michael You're Looking For | 949 comments I think you should enter it in the Chinese characters; make sure you combine it with the English version; it might help to leave a librarian note with the English name as well.


message 100: by daisy (new)

daisy | 2 comments Personally I prefer Chinese characters too. Thank you!


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