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House of Chains (Malazan Book of the Fallen, #4)
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Group Read - House of Chains > HoC - Chapter Eighteen - NO SPOILERS

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message 1: by Lee, High Priest of Shadow (last edited Jun 02, 2013 03:19PM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Lee (kiwifirst) | 1508 comments Mod
Chapter Eighteen Discussion Thread

** FIVE CHAPTER WEEK **


message 2: by David Sven, Mortal Sword..Meow (new) - rated it 5 stars

David Sven (gorro) | 2042 comments Mod
Care of Felisin Elder’s memories we learn a little of the history of the leader of The Crimson Guard that predates the Empire

...a century-old clash between a Royal Untan army and the rebelling House of K’azz D’Avore. A battle that had seen the annihilation of the renegade noble family’s forces and the subjugation of the D’Avore household

Interesting that Felisin sees her sister playing the role of the losing side as she used to do when playing with Ganoes’ toy soldiers.

We also see that the whirlwind has totally usurped the fragment of Kurald Emurlahn it occupies to potentially become its own new warren in the Deck of Dragons

This usurped fragment is a fragment no longer, but whole unto itself. And its power grows. Until one day, soon, it will demand its own place in the Deck of Dragons. As with the House of Chains. A new House, of the Whirlwind.
Fed by the spilled blood of a slain army.



Felisin ponders what will happen when she meets her sister. And that is pretty much all that she cares about. Not the whirlwind goddess or the army of the apocalypse...

We have taken this war. Away from the rebels, away from the Empress and the Malazan Empire. Away, even, from the Whirlwind Goddess herself. We have supplanted, you and I, Tavore, Dryjhna and the Book of the Apocalypse–for our own, private apocalypse. The family’s own blood, and nothing more.


She intends to face down her sister, reveal to her the consequences of her actions and then perhaps allow her to live with those consequences

...when I show myself to you and see the recognition in your eyes — the world, your world, will shift beneath you.
And at that moment, dear sister, you will understand. What has happened. What I have done. And why I have done it.
And then? She did not know. A simple execution was too easy, indeed, a cheat. Punishment belonged to the living, after all.



We get a little discourse on the difference between “hot iron” and “cold iron.”
Generally speaking “hot iron” is passion – while “cold iron” is “heartless pragmatism.” Sha’ik knows her sister is “cold iron.” Has to be after what she did to her sister... and it scares her.

‘Aye, Chosen One. And thus, we must pray that the forge of Tavore’s heart blazes with vengeance.’
‘That she too is hot iron? Why?’
‘For then, we shall not lose.’
Sha’ik’s knees suddenly weakened and she almost staggered.


And after concluding that cold iron beats hot iron most of the time, the best commanders to face Tavore are other “cold iron” commanders – being namely Karsa and Leoman.

‘Who, among us, is cold iron? Is there anyone?’
‘There are two, High Mage. And one of these is capable of both: Toblakai.’
‘And the other?’
‘Leoman of the Flails.’



And Heboric has sanctified his own temple to Treach, creating a space isolated from the whirlwind goddess. When he finds out what Bithidal has done to Felisin he plans to kill the priest.
The bigger question is, why has the whirlwind goddess not told Sha’ik of Felisin the younger’s mutilation. I suspect she approves of Bidithal’s offering.
Sha’ik,, inside Heboric’s temple is freed enough from the whirlwind goddess’ influence to think

‘Felisin Younger! I have not ... not seen her! Days? Weeks? What – where is she!’
Heboric’s motion was feline as he straightened, fluid and precise. ‘The goddess must know, lass—’
‘If she does, she’s not told me!’
‘But why would . . .’
She saw a sudden knowledge in his eyes, and felt her own answering stab of fear.



Meanwhile Bidithal starts to uncover Febryl’s plan to usurp the warren


They wanted the warren ... but why? A question yet to be answered, but find an answer he would, and soon.
In this, he knew, the Chosen One relied upon him, and he would not fail her. In so far as what she expects from me, yes



I like the Epigraph about the killers already being in the house. Very Apt.
Felisin relies on the whirlwind to prevent claw coming in to assassinate her – not realising that Korbolo has eleven assassins already inside ready to kill her. But Korbolo is also afraid that the whirlwind goddess may allow a claw in just to take him out assuming the goddess isn’t to obsessed to notice his plans. Unknown to Korbolo, Kalam is already in the house, along with all those shadowy diamonds with the demons inside, and he’s coming to see him.

Unknown to Korbolo and co, Bidithal has already infiltrated their group with his new army of child shadow warriors – one of them, Scillara, in one of Korbolo’s many beds with just a piece of sheeting between her and his conversations.


Sha’ik is also very well informed as to Febryl and Kamist intention to use Shadow (through Bidithal) to usurp the whirlwind goddess somehow. I’m not sure how exactly they intend to use Shadow but it appears it will be used to penetrate the Whirlwind’s warren.

Have you ever sought to pass through that wall, Febryl?...

...One would need to be desert-born, or possess powerful sorcery to defy that. Or very deep shadows ...’



BUSTED!!!


message 3: by Lee, High Priest of Shadow (new) - rated it 5 stars

Lee (kiwifirst) | 1508 comments Mod
Interesting that Felisin sees her sister playing the role of the losing side as she used to do when playing with Ganoes’ toy soldiers.


I think that really shows that Tavore is being underestimated. If she was playing with tactics used by Ultor and D'Avore at aged 9, she could have had considerable training in some of the greatest tactical minds in history.

Felisin ponders what will happen when she meets her sister. And that is pretty much all that she cares about. Not the whirlwind goddess or the army of the apocalypse...

So I really felt this was significant, but then a few pages later I couldn't work out how it could be true when I read this:

Sha’ik,, inside Heboric’s temple is freed enough from the whirlwind goddess’ influence to think

As she goes into his tent she becomes Felisin and all her pain and history come rushing back. Yet above she is thinking like Felisin, so i don't believe that the above thoughts are truely Felisins. I think the Goddess is using that hatred to her own devices as it meets her requirements, that being the destruction of the invading armies. I think the distinction between whose thoughts they are is important.


message 4: by David Sven, Mortal Sword..Meow (new) - rated it 5 stars

David Sven (gorro) | 2042 comments Mod
Thats a good point Lee. If the Whirlwind goddess can look into the hearts of most Felisin's enemies, then it makes sense that she is also aware of her Chosen one's thoughts.


Lori And since Felisin's main obsession is the rage against her sister the Whirlwind feeds off that rage.


Silvio Curtis | 403 comments My take is that the Whirlwind doesn't impose anything on Sha'ik/Felisin's mind, but chooses to suppress some of her feelings and encourage others. Rage against Tavore was one of Felisin's emotions from before her rebirth, but the Whirlwind is making it her only emotion - firstly because it's rage, and rage is what the Whirlwind deals in, and secondly because Tavore is the Whirlwind's enemy too. She doesn't want Sha'ik wasting attention on caring for Felisin Younger. She also doesn't want her to waste her attention on rage against irrelevant targets like Beneth.


message 7: by David Sven, Mortal Sword..Meow (new) - rated it 5 stars

David Sven (gorro) | 2042 comments Mod
@Silvio - I think that's a good way of looking at it.


Lori Yes indeed!


message 9: by Rob, Quick Ben (new) - rated it 4 stars

Rob (robzak) | 1054 comments Mod
So Heboric is sneaking back to his new temple, and he sneaks by some little girl killing rhizan. Or so he thinks, she apparently spots him..and is another of Bidithal spies?

At least I assume so based on her saying that great new catch phrase: "Do you remember the Dark?"


message 10: by David Sven, Mortal Sword..Meow (new) - rated it 5 stars

David Sven (gorro) | 2042 comments Mod
Rob wrote: "Or so he thinks, she apparently spots him..and is another of Bidithal spies?"

Yes


Sumant | 272 comments I think the godess knows the felsin the younger was incapacitated by Bidithal but she is playing a larger game and knows that she will need Bidithal when malazans do show up.


message 12: by DangerBin (last edited Mar 20, 2017 03:43PM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

DangerBin | 64 comments Heboric uses the Jedi mind trick on Felisin in the new temple and sends her out with an "it's all good".

Corabb is unkillable! He's the Malazan Teela Brown.

Felsin younger is a bit Alia Atreides, huh?

And young Tavore played her own version of the Kobayashi Maru.

I may have tendencies of nerd...


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