Madam, want to talk about author Mary Stewart? discussion

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Buddy Reads > MWYT Chapters 12-17

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message 1: by Misfit, Moderator (last edited Jan 01, 2013 07:11AM) (new) - added it

Misfit | 587 comments Ya'll should know the drill by now :)


message 2: by [deleted user] (new)

******SPOILER ALERT*******

Chapter 16. Hannah, you were so right about the "insta-love" thing. A good meal, some brandy, and way too many smokes, and it's all kisses and "I LOVE YOU!"


Hannah (hannahr) | 405 comments Jeannette wrote: "******SPOILER ALERT*******

Chapter 16. Hannah, you were so right about the "insta-love" thing. A good meal, some brandy, and way too many smokes, and it's all kisses and "I LOVE YOU!""


Spoiler****

Yep, that's it. All in all, I've been enjoying this re-read, but that struck me as "off".


message 4: by [deleted user] (new)

*****SPOILER**********

His "I love you!" sure came out of the blue, especially as he had wanted to kill her just a couple of hours earlier. But, now that that is out of the way, we get round two of suspense and mystery, don't we? I hope they get back to Avignon in time!


Willow  | 90 comments Jeannette wrote: "*****SPOILER**********

His "I love you!" sure came out of the blue, especially as he had wanted to kill her just a couple of hours earlier. But, now that that is out of the way, we get round two..."


Yes, I agree! Their love for each other is out of the blue. I'm finding lots of little holes in this story, but I'm enjoying it. :D
I love how she ripped off the distributor-cap to his Bentley. LOL


I also absolute love the way they say 'beastly.' LOL



Here’s a pick of the lovely French town Cavaillon. From the pictures, it doesn’t seem to look much different than when Mary Stewart was there. This little travel guide is wonderful. :D


Hannah (hannahr) | 405 comments Willowfaerie,
Thanks so much for taking the time to posts these lovely photos! It really helps set the mood.


message 7: by [deleted user] (new)

Hannah wrote: "Willowfaerie,
Thanks so much for taking the time to posts these lovely photos! It really helps set the mood."


I agree! You're photos are lovely!

Johnny must have been quite the guy, because girls weren't taught anything about cars back in the 40s and 50s. My mom never even learned how to drive a car.


message 8: by Misfit, Moderator (new) - added it

Misfit | 587 comments Love the photo, thank you for finding it. I have to agree with everyone about the insta-love. As much as I did enjoy the car chasing, it was wearing a bit thin and I'm glad to be moving on to advancing the mystery.

Question - how old is David? I had the impression he was a younger boy, but now I think I read that he's twelve?


message 9: by [deleted user] (new)

I think he is about 12.


message 10: by Misfit, Moderator (new) - added it

Misfit | 587 comments Thank you.


message 11: by [deleted user] (new)

I looked in the book, and Charity's first impression when she meets David is that he is about 13.


message 12: by Willow (last edited Jan 05, 2013 08:13PM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

Willow  | 90 comments Jeannette wrote: "Hannah wrote: "Willowfaerie,
Thanks so much for taking the time to posts these lovely photos! It really helps set the mood."

I agree! You're photos are lovely!

Johnny must have been quite the g..."


I absolutely loved that Charity was a driving ace. She's a strong and clever heroine without losing her femininity. I feel like being feminine is kind of knocked nowadays.


message 13: by Hannah (last edited Mar 19, 2015 10:41AM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

Hannah (hannahr) | 405 comments That's a great point, Willowfaerie. I think alot of modern book heroines are presented as "kick-ass" with a sarcastic mouth. There's not an ounce of grace or femininity to be found in them. I'm not a fan.

It's a shame modern writers have lost the art of making the heroine strong, competent and intelligent while at the same time being a "lady".


message 14: by [deleted user] (new)

At the risk of sounding very old-fashioned, and NOT wanting to turn back the clock, but, as women became "liberated" they became more like men, including all of the less attractive qualities. Give me a smart, competent woman, who also enjoys being a woman.


message 15: by Misfit, Moderator (new) - added it

Misfit | 587 comments Hannah wrote: "That's a great point, Willowfaerie. I think alot of modern book heroines are presented as "kick-ass" with a sarcastic mouth. There's not an ounce of grace or femininity to be found in them. I'm ..."

I couldn't agree more.


Willow  | 90 comments Hannah wrote: "That's a great point, Willowfaerie. I think alot of modern book heroines are presented as "kick-ass" with a sarcastic mouth. There's not an ounce of grace or femininity to be found in them. I'm ..."

Yes, more and more I’ve noticed femininity is kind of being disregarded as a negative trait, which I don’t think is fair. As you can see in old books, women used to know how to use their femininity to their advantage all the time.


message 17: by [deleted user] (new)

12


Tadiana ✩Night Owl☽ | 1048 comments The meal in Chapter 14 echoes (I think deliberately) the lovers' meal described in John Keats poem, "The Eve of St. Agnes":
And still she slept an azure-lidded sleep,
In blanched linen, smooth, and lavender’d,
While he from forth the closet brought a heap
Of candied apple, quince, and plum, and gourd;
With jellies soother than the creamy curd,
And lucent syrops, tinct with cinnamon;
Manna and dates, in argosy transferr’d
From Fez; and spiced dainties, every one,
From silken Samarcand to cedar’d Lebanon.

These delicates he heap’d with glowing hand
On golden dishes and in baskets bright
Of wreathed silver: sumptuous they stand
In the retired quiet of the night,
Filling the chilly room with perfume light.—-
“And now, my love, my seraph fair, awake!
Thou art my heaven, and I thine eremite:
Open thine eyes, for meek St. Agnes’ sake,
Or I shall drowse beside thee, so my soul doth ache.”
It's a bit of a long poem, but really lovely. "And they are gone: ay, ages long ago / These lovers fled away into the storm."

Full text of the poem is here


message 19: by Hana (last edited Mar 19, 2015 09:38AM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

Hana | 316 comments Great poem and a splendid feast!

I know not everyone bought it, but I rather liked the Chapter 14 (view spoiler) scene--it really did seem as if Charity (view spoiler) Not to mention that the way to this girl's heart is clearly through her stomach. ;) Meanwhile I'm having trouble putting this down. I'll have to read on and then come back for the subtle points, like those lovely quotes at the start of each chapter.


Tadiana ✩Night Owl☽ | 1048 comments I'm not sure why, but I totally buy into the (view spoiler) in this one. I'll have to see if I can figure out why it doesn't bug me in this book.


message 21: by Hana (new) - rated it 4 stars

Hana | 316 comments I agree, Tadiana. I think the dialog and those moment of mutual discovery are very skillfully done. And fear and adrenaline and the aftermath of shaky relief do tend to open people up to emotions. But the David connection is so clearly part of the picture, too--and I really love that.


Tadiana ✩Night Owl☽ | 1048 comments They are both coming off a massive adrenaline rush, aren't they? :D And yes, their mutual love and concern for David, and the sudden realization that the other person is a far better person than you had been thinking. It's very understandable in this case.


Tadiana ✩Night Owl☽ | 1048 comments The Chateau d'If:

description

I thought this looked familiar--it's the prison where the Count of Monte Cristo was held for so many years!


message 24: by Hana (new) - rated it 4 stars

Hana | 316 comments That was fun visiting Chateau d'If again---and moment Charity steps off the boat....!!


Tadiana ✩Night Owl☽ | 1048 comments I'm not sure what it is about that whole cat and mouse game they go through for several chapters, but I absolutely love it. Partly because she's so smart and determined; partly because he's equally determined and seems to have fate on his side.

I kind of want a hot guy to chase me all over the south of France. :)


Jaima | 71 comments Me too!
And I buy the (view spoiler)


message 27: by HJ (new) - rated it 4 stars

HJ | 300 comments Jaima wrote: "Me too!
And I buy the ..."


Really good analysis! (view spoiler)


message 28: by Hana (new) - rated it 4 stars

Hana | 316 comments Jaima and HJ I love your assessments. And just to underline how quick-thinking Charity was and how she had internalized Johnny's knowledge here is a picture of an ignition system distributor with a link to a discussion of ignition systems to those with interesting tastes. I'm not sure which little screw (view spoiler)



http://auto.howstuffworks.com/ignitio...


Tadiana ✩Night Owl☽ | 1048 comments I'd love to know (view spoiler). I love your diagram, Hana--do you think that's accurate for the way engines worked 60+ years ago? :)


Peggy (dandelion_cottage) | 50 comments I agree with both Jaima and HJ on what makes the story believable. And Hana, what Charity did with the car reminds me of that scene close to the end of The Sound of Music--"Reverend Mother, I have sinned." :)


message 31: by Hana (new) - rated it 4 stars

Hana | 316 comments Enlighten me, Peggy. It has been a gazillion years since I've watched the Sound of Music.


message 32: by Tadiana ✩Night Owl☽, Moderator (last edited Mar 24, 2015 02:16PM) (new) - rated it 5 stars

Tadiana ✩Night Owl☽ | 1048 comments Peggy wrote: "I agree with both Jaima and HJ on what makes the story believable. And Hana, what Charity did with the car reminds me of that scene close to the end of The Sound of Music--"Reverend Mother, I have ..."

I love that scene! The Nazis were searching for the Von Trapp family at the convent (which is where they were actually hiding). The family takes off in their car and when the Nazis jump into their cars to chase them, their cars won't start. While they're trying to figure out what's wrong, two of the nuns off to the side say to the Mother Abbess:

Sister Margaretta: Reverend Mother, I have sinned.
Sister Berthe: I, too, Reverend Mother.
Reverend Mother: What is this sin, my children?

description


Jaima | 71 comments I'd forgotten all about that scene! Now o need to watch that movie again


message 34: by Hana (last edited Mar 25, 2015 05:17AM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

Hana | 316 comments Jaima wrote: "I'd forgotten all about that scene! Now o need to watch that movie again" Me too, Jaima!

Tadiana, I'm pretty sure that picture is of an old-fashioned distributor. Many new cars don't even have distributors, but use a computerized engine control unit to time and generate ignition sparks. The article from How Stuff Works is terrific and has these nifty gifs illustrate everything.


message 35: by HJ (new) - rated it 4 stars

HJ | 300 comments Yes, just how would we quickly disable a car these days? You can't open the bonnets/hoods without access to the inside of the car, and if you could what would you do?


message 36: by Hana (new) - rated it 4 stars

Hana | 316 comments Going back to internal combustion engine diagram, I think the good sisters are holding an ignition coil with the wire that connects it to the distributor.

That would do the trick too and the car wouldn't start but it would be easy to spot, whereas loosening the screw at C above would probably keep the rotor from turning at the right speed which would make the cylinders misfire or not fire at all and it would take longer to figure out because it's all covered up with the distributor cap.

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/ignitio...


message 37: by Hana (new) - rated it 4 stars

Hana | 316 comments It's a good point, HJ. It sometimes bothers me that I haven't a clue how a lot of things work now, whereas you used to be able to figure out function from form--a satisfying intellectual effort.


debbicat *made of stardust* (cr8zycat) | 425 comments deleted user wrote: "*****SPOILER**********

His "I love you!" sure came out of the blue, especially as he had wanted to kill her just a couple of hours earlier. But, now that that is out of the way, we get round two o..."


OMG! It did!!!! Come out of nowhere. I was like, seriously???


message 39: by Karlyne (new)

Karlyne Landrum | 1107 comments debbie~cr8zycat ^_^ wrote: "deleted user wrote: "*****SPOILER**********

His "I love you!" sure came out of the blue, especially as he had wanted to kill her just a couple of hours earlier. But, now that that is out of the wa..."


I read this for the first time so long ago that I don't remember being surprised at all! It just seemed so fore-ordained that I rolled with it, without even noticing that I was rolling. By the way, whereabouts is his declaration? (I knew I should be re-reading with you!)


debbicat *made of stardust* (cr8zycat) | 425 comments I wish you were reading with me! I'll look back at my book and find the page number and or chapter and you can chime in. I'd love to be actually buddy reading this one. I'm on ch 17 currently. Might read after work today. It's a nice sunny day here. Reading outside with a cuppa sounds divine. ESP with a MS!


debbicat *made of stardust* (cr8zycat) | 425 comments Oh wait. I'm on ch 21. I'll look at that thread later on. Getting intense!!


message 42: by Karlyne (new)

Karlyne Landrum | 1107 comments debbie~cr8zycat ^_^ wrote: "I wish you were reading with me! I'll look back at my book and find the page number and or chapter and you can chime in. I'd love to be actually buddy reading this one. I'm on ch 17 currently. Migh..."

It snowed again this morning... Just a bit, but still, we won't be seeing bare ground at this rate until forever. Sigh.


message 43: by Katy (new)

Katy (kathy_h) | 118 comments Karlyne wrote: "...It snowed again this morning... Just a bit, but still, we won't be seeing bare ground at this rate until forever. Sigh. . ..."

Yes so true!


Bobbie | 180 comments Reading this thread, now I wish I was reading along with this one. I can't remember this one too well so I need to find a time to read it again very soon. So much to read, so little time.


message 45: by Karlyne (new)

Karlyne Landrum | 1107 comments Bobbie wrote: "Reading this thread, now I wish I was reading along with this one. I can't remember this one too well so I need to find a time to read it again very soon. So much to read, so little time."

True!


message 46: by Bobbie (last edited Mar 13, 2017 08:31AM) (new) - rated it 4 stars

Bobbie | 180 comments Okay, so I just had to go back and read this after reading these comments last month. Wish I had read it with the rest of you.
As for the (view spoiler) I think that is the reason I did not like this one as much as some of MS's others. I did remember that part so was expecting it but did not like it any better this time.

This is not to say that I am not enjoying it or didn't enjoy it last time. I am very hooked into it and can hardly put it down. But that one aspect does bug me a lot.


Lesley Burgess Schultz (lgschultz) | 29 comments Here’s what I find problematic. Richard hurries into a marriage with Loraine and look how that turned out! Yet is already in love with Charity within a few days of meeting her? Somehow I think he would be much less trusting than that!


message 48: by Sara (new) - rated it 5 stars

Sara (phantomswife) | 104 comments I had exactly that same thought, Lesley. Insta-love seems to be Richard's MO. However, she makes a point of saying, when he takes her off the ramp from the ride to the Chateau d'If, that fate has a hand in this and she cannot escape him. I really read it as a psychic connection that they simply could not ignore. Even wanting to think the worst of each other, somehow they couldn't. Otherwise, she would have been too afraid to fall asleep with him in the hotel room earlier. Something basically told her he was not really someone to fear.

I loved the discussion in Chapter 17 about the rules holding and the references to MacBeth. I couldn't help thinking of Sherlock Holmes, "Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth."

We know for sure that there is something going on that needs to be made sense of. Why take David? She doesn't love him, it isn't to protect him, she doesn't want Richard to find her, what does she have to gain from having him? And what made her need to kill Tony? In short, what was she after when she married Richard. Does it have to do with his antiques trade?


Tadiana ✩Night Owl☽ | 1048 comments Jaima has some good arguments for the insta-love in comment 26 above, at least from a literary point of view. :)


message 50: by Sara (new) - rated it 5 stars

Sara (phantomswife) | 104 comments Yes, Tadiana, Jaima made some very good points.


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