Tierra Encantada Charter School discussion

Things Fall Apart (The African Trilogy, #1)
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Engl. I(6th) > Nwoye

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Tierra Encantada | 76 comments Mod
How has Nwoye begun to "act like a man"? What values does Okonkwo associate with manliness? How does Nwoye relate to these values?


message 2: by Sarai (last edited Sep 20, 2012 07:51PM) (new) - added it

Sarai Cisneros | 27 comments Okonkwo thinks that then values of a man are getting a woman pregnant.
He says "at his age I was already fending myself." He says "Nwoye has to much of his mother in him." But Okonkwo's friend thinks he actually has too much of his grandfather in him. Okonkwo wants Nwoye to be a strong and respected man in the village and have many wife's as him and not like his grandfather. He wants him to have a successful manliness but he considers him weak and a fail.


message 3: by [deleted user] (last edited Sep 20, 2012 09:10PM) (new)

"He wanted Nwoye to grow into a tough young man capable of ruling his father's household when he was dead and gone to join the ancestors. He wanted him to be a prosperous man, having enough in his barn to feed the ancestors with regular sacrifices." This provides evidence that Okonkwo associates manliness with success, fortune and respect if one isn't strong and masculine they are considered weak and a failure. Nwoye began to "act like a man" by spending more time with his father Okonkwo in his obi instead of with his mother, he learned stories about masculine war and bloodshed, he took more time doing masculine tasks like pounding food or splitting wood, he also began talking about women and their foolishness. By talking about women like this okonkwo associates this to future power over women which he was very proud of "That showed that in time he would be able to control his women-folk.No matter how prosperous a man was, if he was unable to rule his women and his children (and especially his women) he was not really a man." Nwoye doesn't really relate to these values so much because almost always he was a weak and lazy disappointment but now he wants to be a like a man and tries to seem and have those values.


Marianne Lara | 26 comments Vanessa wrote: ""He wanted Nwoye to grow into a tough young man capable of ruling his father's household when he was dead and gone to join the ancestors. He wanted him to be a prosperous man, having enough in his ..."

I agree with Vanessa. Nwoye has begun to act manlier in several ways. Especially when Ikemefuna had come into his life, he "improved" in his father's eyes. "Nwoye would feign annoyance and grumble about women and their troubles" page 53 Okonkwo liked that Nwoye did this, it showed he would be able to control women. Okonkwo thought of this as manly, he thinks that even if a man is very succesful, if he cannot handle his woman and his kids, he would not be considered a man. Nwoye knew that to be masculine and violent, would be the right way, so he tried to be that way. He sat with his father as he would tell stories of "violence and bloodshed". Okonkwo wanted Nwoye to be tough young man capable of taking over his father's household. He was pleased to see Nwoye's improvement when Ikemefuna came along. He had always thought of Nwoye as weak and lazy, but he had become better and he wanted to teach him manly things. Okonkwo thinks that one could could never start too early in learning how to prepare yams. He thought that "yam stood for manliness and he could feed his family on yams from one harvrest to another was very manly indeed" page 33. Okonkwo thought of when a man was succesful, had titles, and had repect he wasn't someone to be ashamed of.


Isaiah Armijo | 28 comments Sarai wrote: "Okonkwo thinks that then values of a man are getting a woman pregnant.
He says "at his age I was already fending myself." He says "Nwoye has to much of his mother in him." But Okonkwo's friend thi..."



I have to going to have to disagree with Sarai. Because Okonkwo's values manliness over anything. He sacrifices man joys in life to make sure that he is thought of as manly. Like when Okonkwo is asked not to take part in the murder of Ikemefuna. When Ikemefuna is stabbed he ran towards Okonkwo yelling "my Father, They have killed me!", yet Okonkwo strikes him down to finish him off. He did this to show that he was not weak, even though he was tolled not to take place in Ikemefuna's murder. So the values of okonkwo are just to be a man and not a spineless cowherd that can bark without a weapon. He would very much like is son to be a man and not someone like okonkwo's father. REMINDER: Okonkwos dad was very lazy and had no farm, no yams, and no tittle. Before Ikemefuna died Nwoye was very masculine, and would often help both his mother and his father. On page 32 it says " sometimes Okonkwo gave them [Nwoye and Ikemefuna] a few yams each to prepare. Now that Ikemefuna is dead i think that Nwoye will rebel against his father and become like his Grandfather.


message 6: by Kathryn (new) - added it

Kathryn (kathycat) | 22 comments Isaiah wrote: "Sarai wrote: "Okonkwo thinks that then values of a man are getting a woman pregnant.
He says "at his age I was already fending myself." He says "Nwoye has to much of his mother in him." But Okonkw..."


I agree with Isaiah. The value that Okonkwo associated with manliness was strength above all. He thought that any man that could not fight and rule his household with an iron fist was weak, lazy and okonkwo and not to be considered as a man. When he starts to notice that Nwoye acts very much like his grandfather he starts to try and make Nwoye into a hard working man. He told Nwoye and Ikemefuna "masculine stories of violence and bloodshed" ,page53. Nwoye was proud that his father would tell him these things but "somehow still preferred the stories that his mother used to tell. His father told him that these stories "were for foolish women and children".


message 7: by Kristen (new)

Kristen | 24 comments Marianne wrote: "Vanessa wrote: ""He wanted Nwoye to grow into a tough young man capable of ruling his father's household when he was dead and gone to join the ancestors. He wanted him to be a prosperous man, havin..."

I agree with Marianne and Vanessa. Okonkwo associated manliness with success, control, and violence. When Nwoye started acting more masculine Okonkwo was pleased. Okonkwo would invite Nwoye and Ikemefuna "to sit with him in his obi, and told them stories of the land-masculine stories of violence and bloodshed,"(page 53). Nwoye would "feign annoyance and grumble aloud about women and their troubles"(page 52) when one of his father's wives asked him to do a manly task like pounding food. Even though Nwoye preferred "women's stories" he would listen to these violent stories and pretend to like them in order to please Okonkwo.


Saul Saiz | 17 comments Kathryn wrote: "Isaiah wrote: "Sarai wrote: "Okonkwo thinks that then values of a man are getting a woman pregnant.
He says "at his age I was already fending myself." He says "Nwoye has to much of his mother in h..."


I agree with kathryn because she says that the value that okonkowo accosiated with manliness was strengh above all which is very true. He thought that any man that coudnt fight for or rule their household with iron fist was weak and lazy and okonkwo was considered not a man. When he notices that nwoye acts.like his grandfather he try to make hom a hard working man. He tells nwoye and ikemefuna "masculine stories of violence and bloodshed". Nwoye was pround his dad told him these things but thought his mothers stories were better. His dad told those.stories were foolish.


message 9: by Molly (last edited Sep 23, 2012 05:45PM) (new)

Molly Malone | 27 comments Vanessa wrote "He wanted Nwoye to grow into a tough young man capable of ruling his father's household when he was dead and gone to join the ancestors. He wanted him to be a prosperous man, having enough in his barn to feed the ancestors with regular sacrifices." This provides evidence that Okonkwo associates manliness with c if one isn't strong and masculine they are considered weak and a failure."

What Vanessa wrote provides evidence that Okonkwo thought that manliness was associated with ass she says "success, fortune and respect", and to Okonkwo if you were not a manly you where basically a women. Nwoye in the beginning of the book was very lazy, and Okonkwo did not like it one bit. Nwoye stops being lazy and becomes masculine when Ikemefuna is sent to live with Okonkwo and his family. Okonkwo liked Ikemefuna because he was very helpful and did not mind doing the masculine or hard tasks, Nwoye wanted to be more like Ikemefuna and get his fathers respect, so Nwoye started to do more of the masculine (hard) tasks. This statement is represented when Achebe writes "Nothing pleased Nwoye now more than to be sent for by his mother or another of his father's wives to do one of those difficult and masculine tasks in the home," (pg. 52) tasks such as "splitting wood, or pounding food." (pg. 52) To Nwoye Ikemefuna "He was like an elder brother". Okonkwo was very pleased by the changes in Nwoye when Ikemefuna came to live with them and take a positive role in his life.


Benhanna | 27 comments Marianne wrote: "Vanessa wrote: ""He wanted Nwoye to grow into a tough young man capable of ruling his father's household when he was dead and gone to join the ancestors. He wanted him to be a prosperous man, havin..."
I agree with Marianne with how Nwoye has started to sit with his father and listen to him talk about women and bloody war stores with Ikemefuna. I also agree with kathryn about how Okonkwo thinks that manliness is running your home and your women well, and how he think being a man Intel's having tittles "this meeting is for men" Okonkwo said to a man after he contradicted him in a meeting. even though Nwoye is listing to his had stores and pretends to like the them he sill likes his mothers better, and thinks that his fathers are not vary good.


message 11: by Kai (new)

Kai | 33 comments Marianne wrote: "Vanessa wrote: ""He wanted Nwoye to grow into a tough young man capable of ruling his father's household when he was dead and gone to join the ancestors. He wanted him to be a prosperous man, havin..."

I agree with Marianne. When Nwoye started to spend time with Ikemefuna, to Okonkwo, it appeared like Nwoye was becoming a man. Nwoye also started to spend time with Okonkwo in his obi, and listened to his tales of "bloodshed and "violence". He also did manly activities like farming yams and splitting wood
(incomplete)


message 12: by Zane (new) - rated it 4 stars

Zane Flannery | 27 comments Vanessa wrote: ""He wanted Nwoye to grow into a tough young man capable of ruling his father's household when he was dead and gone to join the ancestors. He wanted him to be a prosperous man, having enough in his ..."

I completely agree with vanessa. She covers every thing with a good answer. but she completely misses why Nwoye started to be around his father and stop acting like what is concidered weak or womanly in that culture. He starts to be aroung his father because Ikemufuma loved Okonkwo and his tales of manliness. Nwoye wanted to impress Ike. So Nwoye started to pound food, farm, clear a brush usin a machete and fire, split wood, and clime trees for palm wine. This made Okonkwo happy and proud. Before Ike showed up, Nwoye moped and listened and enjoyed his mother's stories. Nwoye was so unmanly that Okonkwo was afraid that Nwoye would become like his grandfather.


Xavier Benni | 26 comments Nwoye has begun to act like a man when Ikemefuna comes into their lives. Okonkwo sees "manliness" as fearless, pitiless, strong. Nwoye only relates to these values because of Ikemefuna, but before Nwoye is seen by his father as lazy and as showing too many of his grandfather. Okonkwo wants Nwoye to be just like him as said in the book "He wanted Nwoye to grow into a tough young man capable of ruling his father's household when he was dead and gone to join the ancestors."


message 14: by Mona (last edited Oct 14, 2012 03:25PM) (new)

Mona Chavarria | 29 comments Xavier wrote: "Nwoye has begun to act like a man when Ikemefuna comes into their lives. Okonkwo sees "manliness" as fearless, pitiless, strong. Nwoye only relates to these values because of Ikemefuna, but before ..."

i agree with what is xavier said. The only thing I would add is "He thought that one could not begin to early. Yam stood for manliness, and he who can feed his family with yams from one harvest to another was a very great man" PG.33


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