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A Dance with Dragons (A Song of Ice and Fire, #5)
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Ramsay's Letter (spoiler)

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Luv_trinity | 27 comments Ramsay Bolton's letter to Jon Stark (remember Rob legalize Jon) States that he's false king is dead and that he kill him and his men , which seem to implied that he killed Stannis, and that he capture Mance Rayder. He than go on to demand that Jon send back his bride and Reek. I think the letter might be false. In the letter Ramsay never refer to the false king as Stannis, he just calls him the false king. He demand that Jon send back Theon/Reek,and his false Bride. However if Ramsay truly had capture Stannis and his men, he would have found Reek and false Arya,or discover that Stannis never had them. ...in other words he would not think they were with Jon Stark at the wall.

So does anyone else think what Ramsay Bolton stated in the letter is a lie so he can draw Jon to him so he could kill Jon? Rob made Jon legal and left Winterfall to him. So the only way Ramsay can legally own Winterfall is if Jon was dead.

So do you think Ramsay killed Stannis,or do you believe he is lying to draw Jon out in order to kill him?


Gianluca (gianlucag) | 118 comments I read the sample chapter from The Winds of Winter, and I'm pretty sure I know the answer to your question, but I don't know if I should post it. I mean, wouldn't that be a spoiler?


Lisa Price | 3 comments Post it!! :)


Gianluca (gianlucag) | 118 comments Lisa wrote: "Post it!! :)"

Alright, but *possible spoilers* ahead!
The chapter I mentioned has Theon as PoV character. He is Stannis' prisoner and he's being interrogated by him as he gets ready to face Ramsay's army.
This chapter should prove that Ramsay's letter to Jon is indeed a lie. However, it's also possible that this chapter takes place before Jon's last chapter, and Stannis did say that he intends to send both Theon and false Arya to The Wall. I personally find it unlikely, but it is possible.
I believe that Luv_trinity is right, and Ramsay was just trying to mess with Jon's head, furious after discovering Mance Rayder in Winterfell.


Dantezgirl | 195 comments Q: When did Robb ever make Jon legal? I honestly don't remember that.


Gianluca (gianlucag) | 118 comments Dantezgirl wrote: "Q: When did Robb ever make Jon legal? I honestly don't remember that."

After hearing about Sansa's wedding, and shortly before the Red Wedding, he discussed the matter with his generals and his mother. He says that, if he were to die, Jon should become the rightful King in the North. I don't think he actually legitimized Jon, but he did send Maege Mormont and Galbart Glover to Greywater Watch with a letter containing his plan.


Prin (prncss1121) | 126 comments How could Ramsay know that Jon faked Mance Rayder's death? Would it be possible if the Men of the Night's Watch conspired with Ramsay to kill Snow? At first I thought it was a fake letter from the Black Brothers... But it isn't possible for them to find out who Reek is on their own. Sorry I'm confused :P


Gianluca (gianlucag) | 118 comments Prin wrote: "How could Ramsay know that Jon faked Mance Rayder's death? Would it be possible if the Men of the Night's Watch conspired with Ramsay to kill Snow? At first I thought it was a fake letter from the ..."

He might have tortured Mance Rayder and made him tell all about it!


Prin (prncss1121) | 126 comments Ohhh!!! Okay!


Gianluca (gianlucag) | 118 comments He's pretty good at that kind of stuff, I think...


message 11: by Prin (new) - rated it 5 stars

Prin (prncss1121) | 126 comments "A flayed man has no secrets" :)


Gianluca (gianlucag) | 118 comments Exactly!


message 13: by Ben (new) - rated it 5 stars

Ben | 15 comments i remember robb talking with his mom about legitimizing jon but she thought it was a bad idea and i think it fell through


Dantezgirl | 195 comments *Curtsies* Thanks Johnny


Kenneth Geary (KagedBooks) (kagedbooks) Ben wrote: "i remember robb talking with his mom about legitimizing jon but she thought it was a bad idea and i think it fell through"

Nope he basically told her if i am king let me be king, and sent out the proclamation


Gianluca (gianlucag) | 118 comments Dantezgirl wrote: "*Curtsies* Thanks Johnny"

You're welcome!


message 17: by Ben (new) - rated it 5 stars

Ben | 15 comments Kenneth wrote: "Ben wrote: "i remember robb talking with his mom about legitimizing jon but she thought it was a bad idea and i think it fell through"

Nope he basically told her if i am king let me be king, and s..."


oh yeah sorry my bad


Yannis (johnygs) | 18 comments How can Ramsay(big liar,ok) not be telling the truth?If Stannis is still alive outside Winterfel, Jon would know before reaching it.
It seems the leaked chapter tries to makes people wonder but it's quite clear that it takes place a few days before the letter. We'll get to see the battle too I guess in book 6.


Eyehavenofilter | 764 comments What a great thread... I loved that chapter, that GRRM put out....It won't tide me over till the next book but..... I'll take what I can get


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